Rocco Schiavone
Member
It's from the movie No Retreat No Surrender.
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Hellblade 2 runs at 30 fps with dynamic resolution on both Xbox Series S and Series X according to GamePro (there are no graphics modes)
- Thread starter Thick Thighs Save Lives
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Ps5 had 8k ON THE BOX. They all lie.
Bojji
Member
MisterXDTV
Member
PS5 never mentioned 8K rendering resolution, output resolution is another story
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
this is a good thing. I was watching DF's Remnant 2 video and was just blown away by the visuals along with DF themselves, only to scroll down and watch the entire comment section be about 720p. No one cared that the 30 fps mode was close to 1440p. They all honed in on 720p.
So fuck em. These guys want to write off games based on 720p then so be it. Ship one mode. Make sure it runs smooth and stand by it. If you want 60 fps stop eating avacado toast, stop wasting money on only fan whores, stop buying vbucks on fortnite, stop buying $15 beers for sluts in clubs, and buy a PC.
Just the entitlement of gamers nowadays after buying cheap $399-499 consoles is insane. Imagine writing off MGS3 Snake Eater, Resident Evil 4, GTA3, Vice City and San Andreas because they were 30 fps. Nah, we had common sense back then. You get what you pay for.
So fuck em. These guys want to write off games based on 720p then so be it. Ship one mode. Make sure it runs smooth and stand by it. If you want 60 fps stop eating avacado toast, stop wasting money on only fan whores, stop buying vbucks on fortnite, stop buying $15 beers for sluts in clubs, and buy a PC.
Just the entitlement of gamers nowadays after buying cheap $399-499 consoles is insane. Imagine writing off MGS3 Snake Eater, Resident Evil 4, GTA3, Vice City and San Andreas because they were 30 fps. Nah, we had common sense back then. You get what you pay for.
James Sawyer Ford
Gold Member
It’s not a “good thing” when there’s no reason a 60fps mode couldn’t exist
Larivel
Member
thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Member
Yep; that dude trying to get away comparing single-threaded Series CPU perf vs dual-threaded PS5 CPU perf.
Not to mention, Sony made various customizations to their Zen 2 design, various changes I suspect Microsoft didn't make. That's on top of PS5's CPU having a lot of performance freed up from I/O data management due to its I/O subsystem (the Series consoles have to rely on the CPU for a lot more of the I/O data management because they take a different approach).
Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
This whole post kinda goes out the window when you realize the game is running on Series S.
Topher
Gold Member
How is it "entitlement" when Microsoft themselves claimed 60fps would be "standard" and yet they do not apply that "standard" to their own games? Just a bad take all around.
"120 fps Support: With support for up to 120 fps, Xbox Series X allows developers to exceed standard 60 fps output in favor of heightened realism or fast-paced action."
What You Can Expect From the Next Generation of Gaming - Xbox Wire
The future of gaming has never been more inspiring. Creativity in games is flourishing. New services empower you to discover more games—and bring you closer to the games and creators and streamers you love. The cloud creates a massive opportunity to stream console-quality games and play with the...
news.xbox.com
"From a technical standpoint, this will manifest as world-class visuals in 4K at 60FPS, with possibility of up to 120FPS, including support for Variable Refresh Rate (VRR), and 8K capability."
Power Your Dreams with Xbox Series X, Available Holiday 2020 - Xbox Wire
Xbox Game Studios unveils Senua’s Saga: Hellblade II, a new chapter in the award-winning Hellblade story from Ninja Theory For eighteen years and three console generations, the Xbox community has shown us the power both games and fun can have on all of us. As we enter a new generation of gaming...
news.xbox.com
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Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
Also, I take offense to that. I do all of that and still bought a PC.
MisterXDTV
Member
That's what I meant. We are talking first party games here. It's one thing if a third party doesn't respect "the standard"
If your OWN games don't, that's a completely different situation!
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MisterXDTV
Member
Timestamped here: official video
Here again
news.xbox.com
The team knew they needed to build a next generation console that could run games in 4K at 60 fps with no compromises for developers. They also challenged themselves to deliver a level of performance once thought impossible on console, including support for up to 120 fps for the most demanding and competitive games.
They even put it on the SPECS Table:
Here again
Xbox Series X: A Closer Look at the Technology Powering the Next Generation - Xbox Wire
A few months ago, we revealed Xbox Series X, our fastest, most powerful console ever, designed for a console generation that has you, the player, at its center. When it is released this holiday season, Xbox Series X will set a new bar for performance, speed and compatibility, all while allowing...
news.xbox.com
The team knew they needed to build a next generation console that could run games in 4K at 60 fps with no compromises for developers. They also challenged themselves to deliver a level of performance once thought impossible on console, including support for up to 120 fps for the most demanding and competitive games.
They even put it on the SPECS Table:
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Getting games to run at 60 fps on series x requires downgrades to resolutions. downgrades to the tune of 720p. thats why i brought up remnant 2. stunning looking environment, but all everyone looked at was 720p.
thats what wouldve happened with HB2 had the devs made the decision to go with two modes. more bitching about 720p in 2024 and no one wouldve talked about the visual fidelity they have achieved here.
good decision.
Alan Wake 2 was created by a Studio 2x the size of Hellblade 2. Horizon and Ratched by Studios that are almost quadruple or more the 80 developers who made Hellblade 2.
Not to mention that all of these studios use their own graphics engines with which they have years of experience, while NT has had to wait to have a moderately optimized UE5 version because it is not even on consoles at this point.
I don't think everything is he "coping" but both of you ignoring different aspects as it favors the desired narrative.
Ps.I am clear that if in subsequent patches H2 receives a patch with a 60fps mod (as PlagueTale 2 did, for example) we will not see a thread with more than 2 pages of discussion. Well, I correct myself, it will be a thread of dozens of pages if for 60fps the resolution is 720p or less....
I think the same as you do. If a Studio does not see itself capable of offering a performance mode that can be a real option compared to quality mode.... it is better not to offer it or do it when you can offer something decent.
This requirement that has been implemented so that every game has to offer a performance mode has gotten out of hand. If the bet is to launch the best visual section within the capabilities of the Studio, 30fps should be the basis for development. An extra mode for later updates.
As you say, it is easy to expect where the discussion would have gone if a 60fps mode at ~720p and not locked had been announced..... Of course this would not be celebrating the existence of that mode
So clear that if a 60fps mode with graphic cuts is announced in a few months, we will not see a thread of more than 2 pages celebrating its arrival. Better a multi-page thread with "the graphic cuts are too many, 30fps mode for me"
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digoutyoursoul
Member
Timestamped here: official video
Here again
Xbox Series X: A Closer Look at the Technology Powering the Next Generation - Xbox Wire
A few months ago, we revealed Xbox Series X, our fastest, most powerful console ever, designed for a console generation that has you, the player, at its center. When it is released this holiday season, Xbox Series X will set a new bar for performance, speed and compatibility, all while allowing...
The team knew they needed to build a next generation console that could run games in 4K at 60 fps with no compromises for developers. They also challenged themselves to deliver a level of performance once thought impossible on console, including support for up to 120 fps for the most demanding and competitive games.
They even put it on the SPECS Table:
Hold off on any future launch purchases of new consoles. You will soon see the bullshit evaporated.
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MisterXDTV
Member
I don't expect everything to turn out true, but if the console maker says they target 4K/60 and then FIRST PARTY games come out at 1440p/30, it's a borderline scam......
That's the point
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Topher
Gold Member
Not offering a choice gives people just as much reason to bitch as 720p. That's not a good decision, imo.
thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Member
The visual fidelity in Hellblade 2 isn't heads and shoulders over other games already out, IMHO. On a technical level I'd say HFW: Burning Shores is at least as dense if not more dense, and it's doing a lot more calculations on screen and BTS to boot.
What carries a lot of Hellblade 2's visual fidelity is the art direction, which is excellent. But the visual impact isn't nearly as potent now as it was in 2019 or 2020, when the game was first revealed. Too many amazing-looking games have released between this game's reveal and release for it to sit on that pedestal.
Still though, it's a very good-looking game. Just that there are other games at least just as good-looking that also have more going on, and can somehow provide more performance options Day 1. Make it make sense.
Why's it my problem Remedy's 2x larger than Ninja Theory? Didn't Ninja Theory expand in size over the course of Hellbalde 2 development? Wasn't Hellblade 1 able to be a visual marvel for its time on a super-small budget and even smaller team size?
Aren't Ninja Theory owned by Microsoft, the $3 trillion company? Why couldn't Microsoft have expanded the studio larger, or have members from other studios on slow cycles help out with Hellblade 2 development to do more for the game?
They were initially making the game on UE4 and UE5 allows easy up-porting of UE4 code. Pretty sure UE5 shares a lot of the same functionality as UE4.
NT didn't have to "wait" for UE5; the engine isn't the limiting factor here. I don't even think HB2 is using RT, and they didn't "need" features like Lumen given the scope of the game. Wasn't the 2019 trailer made in UE4? You telling me NT couldn't find a way to get the visual fidelity they have now, with UE4, and saved themselves some time plus provide more performance options Day 1?
Don't feel like I'm ignoring anything on my end; I'm just wondering how someone can claim "this is the price for a current-gen game looking the way it should look", when there are already other current-gen games that look as good as HB2, and those games also provide more performance options?
I don't care if the team sizes differ, because it's not like Ninja Theory are a straggling upstart. They're owned by one of the biggest companies in the entire world and HB2 dev has been done completely under Microsoft's ownership. It's not like they were developing it as a multiplat initially then had to scrap a version to focus on Xbox & PC midway through development.
The only real excuse I could see for the lack of performance options and other limitations with the game, is if "other versions" were introduced in the dev cycle late. And I'm not talking about PC...
Ps.I am clear that if in subsequent patches H2 receives a patch with a 60fps mod (as PlagueTale 2 did, for example) we will not see a thread with more than 2 pages of discussion. Well, I correct myself, it will be a thread of dozens of pages if for 60fps the resolution is 720p or less....
Personally I don't care if they have to drop the resolution to increase the framerate because that should be expected. Just as long as it isn't an unacceptably low resolution internally, that also results in a low upscaled resolution or muddy visuals when upscaled.
Which IMO means Series X version should always have a higher resolution regardless, even if the framerates are also increasing.
Nydius
Member
The biggest copium huffers in this (and every other 30fps) thread are the ones saying "30FPS is fine!"
Four years ago everyone was hyped that the next gen consoles would leave behind the checkerboard 4K, 30FPS constraints of last gen. The single biggest talking point about next gen consoles was that we'd finally achieve native 4K/60 regularly. Both Sony and Microsoft heavily marketed this fact, but especially Microsoft as
Topher
has adequately quoted. Not even four years since they've been out and we're right back to the same dynamic resolution scaling, checkerboard, 30fps shit from the "pro" upgrades of last gen.
In no world is "30fps is fine". I'd expect the 30fps debate when GTA6 comes out because that will be very late in this console lifecycle. But people justifying games being limited to 30fps with dynamic resolutions less than 3.5 years (because this isn't the first) after retail launch of these boxes? Miss me with that nonsense.
Four years ago everyone was hyped that the next gen consoles would leave behind the checkerboard 4K, 30FPS constraints of last gen. The single biggest talking point about next gen consoles was that we'd finally achieve native 4K/60 regularly. Both Sony and Microsoft heavily marketed this fact, but especially Microsoft as
Topher
has adequately quoted. Not even four years since they've been out and we're right back to the same dynamic resolution scaling, checkerboard, 30fps shit from the "pro" upgrades of last gen.In no world is "30fps is fine". I'd expect the 30fps debate when GTA6 comes out because that will be very late in this console lifecycle. But people justifying games being limited to 30fps with dynamic resolutions less than 3.5 years (because this isn't the first) after retail launch of these boxes? Miss me with that nonsense.
ResilientBanana
Member
Threads like this makes gaming in general undesirable. Why all the hate on a great developer with an amazing history? They're literally pushing one of the major consoles to it's limits and that's good. The game looks amazing and has a ton of technology driving it and gamers should be striving more towards that. Sure 30FPS isn't ideal, but it's not a fast paced game. It's heavily story driven.
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MisterXDTV
Member
I would say a 40 fps/120hz mode is 2x better than 30fps on an OLED screen
James Sawyer Ford
Gold Member
Why are options a bad thing?
Some people are 60fps or bust. I’m not one of them but they’d rather have a blurrier 60fps game.
It shouldn’t be difficult to provide that
I’m guessing XSS parity strikes again
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Senua
Gold Member
30fps is shite, but it shows the devs are pushing the machine to the limits. On PC you can have both the insane fidelity at a decent framerate
James Sawyer Ford
Gold Member
No it shows the devs are lazy or restricted by stupid MS policies
Senua
Gold Member
If you believe that UE5 is not being a limitation or a burden here, it is simply because you are completely unaware of the reality of the developments in UE5.
You have a lot of Studios stating their difficulties in moving their projects from UE4 to UE5. To the point that many gave up the attempt.
Only now are games being released on UE5 and the vast majority lack a lot of its features because even today most are not adequately optimized to work on a console.
Then, of course it is not your problem that NT only has 1/2 or 1/4 as many developers as the Studios you mentioned..... but it is not taking into account that very important situation when evaluating the capabilities of a Studio to offer a greater number of playable options.
Not every Studio has the same priorities and neither do they work under the same premises. NT would have preferred to work based on its possibilities and perhaps a 60fps mode was second priority or they simply did not have something prepared that meets a standard or is decent for launch day.
Of course, you can't blame the Studios for the stupid words of the PR clown on duty promising impossible things.
Fredrik
Member
Yeah it is what it is. Goes both ways, more negativity from those who can’t be in on the fun, more positivity from those who can. It’s psychology I guess.
skit_data
Member
I honestly had no issues with 30fps until I got an OLED, it's honestly an unwanted side effect that I wasn't prepared for. Using black frame insertion it looked a little bit better but the flickering and darker screen is too much of a downside.
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Maybe the devs read your posts enjoying playing in 30fps in FFXVI, Rebirth and TLOU remaster?
Mr Moose
Member
Those games have options for 60fps, though.
Maybe the devs read your posts enjoying playing in 30fps in FFXVI, Rebirth and TLOU remaster?
nosoynadie22
Gold Member
then they release starfield at 1290p/30fps with fallout 4 graphics and hellblade 2 at 30fps with possibly the same resolution as starfield with black bands and only one enemy on screenXbox Series X: A Closer Look at the Technology Powering the Next Generation - Xbox Wire
A few months ago, we revealed Xbox Series X, our fastest, most powerful console ever, designed for a console generation that has you, the player, at its center. When it is released this holiday season, Xbox Series X will set a new bar for performance, speed and compatibility, all while allowing...
The team knew they needed to build a next generation console that could run games in 4K at 60 fps with no compromises for developers. They also challenged themselves to deliver a level of performance once thought impossible on console, including support for up to 120 fps for the most demanding and competitive games.
They even put it on the SPECS Table:
For sure. But 30fps clearly isn’t a deal breaker for most on console.
And certainly not for James over there.
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nosoynadie22
Gold Member
Maybe Hellblade 2 runs 1080p on Series X and that's why they can't afford to lower its resolution any further.
Mr Moose
Member
Yup, for me it's fine as long as it feels decent to play.
I played Final Fantasy XVI at 30fps, it was fine.
I played Witcher 3 at 30fps (PS5 update) and it was horrible.
proandrad
Member
Developers need to learn to work within the hardware limits. If you have a game running at 4k30 and you need to drop the resolution to 720p to get to 60, then there is something wrong with your game engine.
Senua
Gold Member
Like hell this is gonna be running at 4k internally though
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
yes, there are some games that run at native 4k 30 fps and drop to 720p, but most of these next gen only games like Alan wake 2, Avatar, Star Wars jedi survivor, and other UE5 games run around 1440p. sometimes dropping to 1296p. you cant expect them to run at 1080p 60 fps when they are barely running at 30 fps with just 50% more pixels.
This game is already using black bars to reduce the GPU load. its effectively a 1620p game. no where close to native 4k. wouldnt be surprised if they are using some kind of upscaling tech to even get there. They could probably offer a 60 fps mode downgrading visual settings but thats clearly going against the creative intent so why bother. this is a good decision.
eNT1TY
Member
I'm of the sentiment that this shit would have been impressive as a launch title but now it is just high polished gamepass fodder. At least it is a bit more visually unique than all the samey UE5 fare out there reusing public assets from a store. From the previews this seems more Until Dawn than The Order as far as interactivity and gameplay is concerned. I mean i knew what NT was about but was hoping for a complete overhaul of the previous game's formula instead of the expected Insomniac tier iterative approach.
Edit: meant to put on IGN preview thread, apologies.
Edit: meant to put on IGN preview thread, apologies.
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thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Member
Honest question: how is Hellblade 2 pushing the Series X to its limits?
I'm not asking this because I think it's a bad looking game; in fact I think it's one of the best-looking games out there (or will be) by the time it launches. But it's also among company with quite a few other games that are at least as good-looking and are doing a lot more in terms of logic, physics, AI and game systems plus NPC interactions etc. more than Hellblade 2 will ever do.
So what is Hellblade 2 doing that's pushing Series X to its limits? Are you really trying to say the Series X is tapped out barely four years into the console generation with a game that's on-par visually with certain games released 3 or even 4 years ago for the other platform (PS5) that were also more ambitious in scope to boot AND offered performance options for 60 FPS?
That doesn't sound very good at all IMO. I also don't buy that excuse.
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
Probably 720p on the S as well. What a shit show. Good thing I have a PC like a proper human.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Hell, I played 16, Rebirth, AW2 all in their respective 30 FPS modes. Their 60 FPS modes were all afterthought with various issues that made it feel like a compromised experience.