MCH2024
Member
Not really it lowers RAM/VRAM use across the board. Try it out. It literally doesn't load most of windows.
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Forza horizon 6 : Another disaster for 8Gb GPUs
- Thread starter seb85
- Start date
Shadowstar39
Member
Wait that image was showing 127fps with 8gb and that is bad how? Sure 16gb would be better but at what cost? They are shafting everyone with ram and nvidia is leading the charge with the ai bullshit.
That being said, an inexpensive 8gb card is better than what many had to deal with in 2021 when no cards were being sold.
Its also not that bad for people like me on 1080p.
If you have an 8gb card you shouldn't be using 4k resolution anyway. I am still using 1080p monitor and my 3060ti from 2021 is still maxing everything I play. If new stuff comes out (like maybe this) that doesn't well do what we have been doing since the dawn of gpus.... cut out some features. Turn off ray tracing, shadow resolution, lower draw distance. In the past I would of said turn down AF, and AA, but that makes little difference anymore. Worse case scenario lower your resoltution and use dlss.
I had a 386sx in 1992 with a 1mb svga video card and would play doom in a smaller window for better fps. I had a top of the line card in 2000 with a voodoo 5 5500 and still wasn't getting 60fps in everything, quake 3 was notorious for this. I had a 8800gtx in 2007 and it still didn't run Crysis at max. This is how it is. Only difference is people got spoiled with having max everything, back in the day it was you lower settings and play what you can. You were lucky to get 60fps, now people bitch about not getting 200 fps, lol, the horror.
Edit: I am not saying nvidia and amd arne't being greedy cunts, like with the rest of the tech industry and governments, they all are with bullshit ai and not regulating ram companies.
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Bojji
Member
I don't have anything against people that are stuck on old GPUs like 6600XT, 3070 or 3060Ti, they have to compromise their settings to achieve playable results. That's how I was rolling on GTX770 in 2014 (until I upgraded to R9 290).
But to advice someone to buy NEW GPU and from day 1 - turn off settings, reduce texture resolution, shadows etc. I can't accept that, that's a very bad behavior, trying to gaslight people that 8GB cards are "fine". New consoles are around the corner and what will happen when they launch? VRAM requirements will go up...
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squidilix
Member
5070Ti 14GB? wtf
MCH2024
Member
It's AMDUB. HUB Speaclizes in unintelligible whining.
To HUB it's a scandal if there is a game that runs better on 16GB than 8GB. If 1080p isn't enough, they increase it to 1440p. If 8GB holds with RT, they use PT. It doesn't matter if the game runs great.
God forbid you lower textures down a settings or 2.
It stems from a sense of entitlement; HUB pie in the sky position was that 8GB GPUs should be 150$ or below and 12GB should be 300$. It's basically the equivalent of someone reviewing an iPhone 18 Pro Max and saying this should be 500$.
MCH2024
Member
Oh no, imagine turning down textures.
You should feel sad for RDNA2/3 owners. They got scammed. Bought DOA stuff on launch.
Bojji
Member
Except... they can play with textures maxed out and use RT in games where 3070 shits itself when it's turned on. What games can't RDNA2/3 GPUs play right now in decent settings? Even RT mandatory titles like IJ and Doom DA run better on them than on 8GB Ampere cards thanks to more VRAM. And official FSR4.1 support is also comming.
Many games look like crap with low texture presets and this setting costs 0 FPS, as long as you have enough video memory.
winjer
Gold Member
The OS, Xbox UI and maybe some apps in the background also use vram. So it's 14Gb left for the game to use.
phant0m
Member
Holy shit, I run it on Bazzite/linux and my
I posted this in the OT thread but oh well.
It's a 5800X3D and 5070ti in extreme RT with DLSS performance.
Also - the machine is in Xbox mode.
System memory usage is half yours. VRAM about the same.
Same cpu, 7900XT
squidilix
Member
I run some AI stuff on my PC and at least Windows 11 (21H2 here) with browser using 1GB of VRAM or less. Pushing more and I can use 15.5GB of VRAM for some training.
There is either an optimization problem from the game, or he have 50 tabs open in the browser with 10 videos running in the background with a dual monitor setup, or he have a faulty 5070Ti. If is indeed on in Xbox mode but are missing more than 2 GB of VRAM... then this mode is a scam.
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winjer
Gold Member
That is not my PC.
squidilix
Member
fixed, mb
MCH2024
Member
Featuring: Forspoken before they fixed it. Also a game with fake RT.Except... they can play with textures maxed out and use RT in games where 3070 shits itself when it's turned on. What games can't RDNA2/3 GPUs play right now in decent settings? Even RT mandatory titles like IJ and Doom DA run better on them than on 8GB Ampere cards thanks to more VRAM. And official FSR4.1 support is also comming.
Many games look like crap with low texture presets and this setting costs 0 FPS, as long as you have enough video memory.
Meanwhile no 3070 owner would run it like this, because they'd run DLSS P mode. While 6800 owner has to run it native for equivalent IQ.
It's precisely this HUB viewer nonsense that gave Nvidia 93% share
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ReasonBeing
Member
IN HORIZON 6, YOU MUST OPTIMIZE YOUR SETTINGS FOR YOUR HARDWARE CAPABILITIES!!! IT'S A DISASTER!!!
AGRacing
Member
Yeah I'm not sure … I think it's probably used/allocated
But obviously not the same situation with system RAM.
Bojji
Member
I played Forspoken on 3070 and it looked like shit (like picture above), DLSS didn't help. They fixed it long time after that.
And many other games have similar problems.
MCH2024
Member
yea it's a shit game that's shittly optimized.
You get that often with AMD sponsored games.
Quasicat
Member
Since it didn't come out for the Xbox One, I need to wait until it hits PS5.8GB VRAM
Why not play on an Xbox One instead?
MCH2024
Member
No it's not. This completely misunderstands how Nvidia works and GPU market dynamics.
GeForce Margin is Law: Nvidia does not change their margin across the lineup. One SKU can subsidize another (thanks 5090 buyers), but overall the Nvidia GeForce margin does not move. This is because Nvidia is a premium brand that commands premium margins. They need the money for R&D.
And Given Nvidia applies that holy margin to VRAM, it means that whatever card you think should have more VRAM would cost more with more VRAM. Thus advocating for more VRAM and advocating for higher prices are one and the same. Furthermore, it means that high memory prices cause high memory SKUs to raise in price. C'est la vie.
And notice how the same people who complain about low VRAM are also the ones cheering that same obsolescence. They are on the frontlines of defending shitty ports like MHW, TLOU P1, etc. Because they are looking for validation and for material to bash Nvidia with.
This is why I am strongly against obsoleting 8GB GPUs. Because that would raise the entry level GPU prices north of 329$. 9GB is about perfect for 2027/2028 entry level.
Dude, 8gb vram is more than fine for FH6.
You can get average framerate around 70fps at 1440p/DLSSQ/custom Ultra setting with high RTGI.
It's just hardware unboxed with the same fear mongering about 8gb vram like always.
squallbr
Member
Cause XONE has no 8GB for games, just 5GB8GB VRAM
Why not play on an Xbox One instead?
Yes poor nvidia they should downgrade all cards to 8GB after all 12gb is high end according to you......
SoloCamo
Member
Stop embarrassing yourself man. There is absolutely one setting that makes a huge visual difference and I will not lower it, it's textures. My RDNA2 6900XT never had a problem and my current RX9070 doesn't either. Just like my 128mb GF4 ti4200 didn't back when people said 64mb was plenty.
And for people saying you couldn't afford more than 8gb...sorry the majority of you stuck with Nvidia because of popularity when the AMD equivalent was not only cheaper but offered quite a bit more vram at a cheaper price no less. 8gb cards are an insult.
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MCH2024
Member
Yea. Congrats man on justifying your purchase.
Just know you're in the 5% minority. And don't project to a wider market you're out of touch with.
Oh the tragedy of using high textures instead of ultra. Let's buy a card with outdated features and worse driver support instead.
Even Turing has better image quality than RDNA2. Since it can run DLSS 4.5 "better than native". You still don't have a good upscaler till 2027 with RDNA2. And even then it will be slower and worse than even DLSS 4.0.
The only meaningful use of more VRAM is raytracing/path tracing. And RDNA2 can't do either well. It's a meme card and a value trap for a reason.
Otoh, 9070 is ok, though widely regarded as inferior to 5070 by most consumers.
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MCH2024
Member
Yea it is high end. I am not so out of touch as to think 629$ GPUs aren't high end.
16GB GPUs (excluding budget brands) start close to 999$. that's enthusiast tier.
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You're not stupid for having an 8GB card but nvidia were greedy to skimp on the VRAM yet charge so much for those 8GB cards when both Intel and AMD were offering 12GB+ cards for cheaper.
The Intel B580 was like the cheapest card on the planet and even that had 12GB VRAM. 12GB is not high end.
Is this the part where you pretend AMD cards don't exist due to how awesome nvidia is?
MCH2024
Member
It's a shit card. They lost money on it. 3060 had 12GB too. Doesn't mean it was ever high end. Even though 8G 3070 Ti obviously was high end.
It's more that what determines high end or not isn't the VRAM. But the card. And 5070 is high end, 5070 Ti and up is enthusiast, etc.
They are budget brands; their entire philosophy is selling you significantly worse hardware with more commodities at a lower price. It's a (failed) market share acquisition strategy.
Nvidia has 93% share. To most of the market yea AMD doesn't exist.
But even if you consider RDNA4. Buying from the budget brands (Radeon or Arc) has a different set of trade offs. 5070 vs 9070 (XT) could be argued wither way depending on your priorities.
But since most people don't feel comfortable spending >600$ on a budget brand, they go RTX 5070. VRAM just isn't as important as people make it out to be.
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But you just said "12GB is high end". Now they're shit cards? You were obviously trying to say 12GB becomes too expensive and is reserved for high end cards when it clearly isn't. You get 12GB on low end cards. 8GB 3070ti is not "high end" either but I digress.
people are saying the same thing with these 8GB cards anyway. That they're shit cards where it tends to struggle on certain games, especially at 1440p+. To the point where sometimes those cards you call "shit cards" look/perform in the same ballpark or even better (much better 1% lows/less stutter) due to the gimped VRAM amount on those 'high end' cards.
You calling them "budget brands" just tells me you're trying to justify the insane nvidia markup. 'Brand' has nothing to do with this.
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MCH2024
Member
12GB is just a very appropriate amount of VRAM for current high end. And it's the current amount of VRAM on most High End dGPUs sold today.
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MCH2024
Member
Calling them gimped stems from a gross sense of entitlement. Please limit that to AMDUB YT Comment section and to their discord.
The VRAM issues are mostly badly made games and AMDUB farming clicks and rage bait.
What normal people do is that they take this game. They start with the highest settings and then they go down until they find ones that work great on their GPU. In this game, bringing geometry and textures to high is sufficient for that.
But AMDUB does the opposite. He deliberately looks for settings combinations that exceed his VRAM capacity. He then finds the minimum settings level he needs to exceed his VRAM buffer.
VRAM is enough for 1080p? Use 1440p
VRAM is enough for High Textures? Use Ultra or 4K Texture Pack
VRAM is enough for Raster? Use RT
Cherrypick and prominently feature the (badly optimized) games with VRAM issues. Never re-cover them after they get fixed. And always center the blame on Nvidia rather than developers even when the port is obviously broken. (TLOU P1)
Even when the developers here implemented amazing memory management that avoids stutters and pop-in, it's insufficient unless they can also provide full performance parity between 8/16GBs. It's a "disaster" for 8GB owners to play this game at 1080p RT High at 100fps.
This comes from someone who is so out of touch that he doesn't understand just how popular Nvidia's AI features like DLSS SR and FG are. He doesn't understand how popular and impactful RT/PT are. The guy is making Turing expose videos in 2026 even though Turing is the best aged GPU architecture in history. While RDNA1 was defacto abandoned by AMD almost immediately.
Every card one thinks should have more VRAM will cost more if it had more VRAM. You already can get 12/16GB Nvidia dGPUs.
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dgrdsv
Member
Another HUB self confirmation bias video.
Isn't it hilarious when Steve goes something like "8GB isn't enough for FH6 in 2026, and we've been saying it for years!"
Well doh in 2026 it isn't enough, now, in this one game, which means that you've been saying stupid shit for years, Steve. Cheers.
Also the amount of VRAM a game is allocating is almost always connected to the amount of VRAM it sees as available.
Which means that any shots showing how some game allocates 15GBs on a 16GB GPU doesn't mean anything for how this game would work on a 12 or even 8GB GPU as the engine will use a different allocation algo for these GPUs.
Isn't it hilarious when Steve goes something like "8GB isn't enough for FH6 in 2026, and we've been saying it for years!"
Well doh in 2026 it isn't enough, now, in this one game, which means that you've been saying stupid shit for years, Steve. Cheers.
The game sees the amount of VRAM available which means that ~2GBs are taken by something else, usually some browser or Discord or something (it's weird to see that much being taken in "Xbox mode" though).
Also the amount of VRAM a game is allocating is almost always connected to the amount of VRAM it sees as available.
Which means that any shots showing how some game allocates 15GBs on a 16GB GPU doesn't mean anything for how this game would work on a 12 or even 8GB GPU as the engine will use a different allocation algo for these GPUs.
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It's not a gross sense of entitlement. They're gimped when the exact same GPU with more RAM runs at 60+fps while the 8GB card runs the same settings at <30fps. Gimped just means it's been functionally impaired and it has. That silicon could do far better if it wasn't gimped by the low RAM.
This is just deflecting from the issue. You can't just call all games that these 8GB cards struggle with "bad games" when it's the low VRAM causing the issues. The VRAM specs are in some ways lower than 5 year old consoles even. These VRAM issues will only get worse as time goes on. In these tests it doesn't matter if you go from highest settings down or lowest settings up. It's just highlighting the difference between 8GB and 16GB on the same GPU.
At this point you've called everybody who has highlighted the issue with the low VRAM shills/ragebaiters, Hardware Unboxed, Gamers Nexus, you name it. Daniel Owen covered this as objectively as possible too:
And said he would not recommend buying a 8GB card at all. Even mentions the pricing issue and it being expensive (even for 2025!). Even calls it a 'disaster' which you have an issue with others saying.
You keep saying putting more VRAM would increase the price. Of course it would but Nvidia is expensive already and AMD and Intel offered more VRAM often for cheaper. Nvidia could competitively offer more but the issue is that people like you constantly make excuses for them, it's made it so they don't have to. Others are not out of touch to see the popularity of nvidia but they don't make excuses for them.
If you move this issue to the Series S we already had a similar situation. Where you had low RAM issues. Where the price of it wasn't that different from a DE PS5 with 16GB. People tried to blame "bad games/developers" for Series S issues but people ultimately came round when the popularity of xbox dropped. You're just too deep into nvidia to see that 8GB is an issue now (I have an nvidia card btw before you get the wrong idea).
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Bojji
Member
I already said earlier, I have no problems with people stuck with 8GB GPUs. I have been in this situation as well (with 8800GS, GTX770 and 3070), you have to be creative to make new games playable and keep them not looking like total garbage at the same time.
But people defending NEW GPUs that come in this configuration?! Insanity, and others (non tech oriented people) might read it and think that 5060Ti 8GB is a good GPU... And high memory prices excuse is very new. This wasn't the case in 2020, 2022 and early 2025...
Nvidia was always very deliberately limiting the amount of memory on their cards (outside of Pascal), planned obsolescence. AMD is no better with 9060XT 8GB, they are copying nvidia strategy to fool customers here (in 7xxx gen they at least used "XT" letters for the GPU with more memory).
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BlownUpRich
Member
I think you can only blame yourself if you ever pair an 8GB GPU with Forza Horizon 6.
asdasdasdbb
Member
Like I said, that's how they are hitting the price points.
Bojji
Member
Nvidia (for years) was setting their prices - however they liked, with almost zero competition from AMD.
4060 was using dirt cheap GDDR6 and nvidia priced it - 299$, 5060 is using expensive GDDR7 and MSRP... 299$.
3060 was using 12 (!) GB of GDDR6 and it was just 30$ more expensive.
SoloCamo
Member
I am in the minority only because most gamers just go, "ohhh shiny Nvidia card, AMD sucks, bad drivers or something, must buy Nvidia"
If I buy a brand new card and I'm already having to lower textures immediately what does that say about the card in upcoming titles?
And who on earth considers the 5070 superior to the 9070? It's slower in raster, has less vram and even in RT title's up to 1440p it's only 4% behind the 5070. At 4k the 9070 is 10% faster with RT on (at time of launch reviews of the 9070 so i'd imagine the lead has likely grown). And the fact that AMD has less driver overhead so people like me on "weak" cpu's like a 11900k are not bottlenecking the gpu nearly as much in cpu bound areas.
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MCH2024
Member
You can buy the high VRAM version or you can lower settings.
The 5060 Ti 8GB delivers a monstrous amount of performance at a relatively cheap price thanks to 8GB. Around 15-20% faster than the PS5 Pro, but with a PS6-level feature set. An absolute steal at $379.
If you must have 12GB, go buy the 12GB B580. But 95% of people don't want to do that. Do you want to know why? Because it's not Nvidia.
The major misunderstanding people have about PC is not understanding that consumers don't want high VRAM GPUs. They want high VRAM Nvidia GPUs.
AMD and their influencers (MLID, Kepler, AMDUB, etc.) have complained in the past about the phenomenon of buyers who view Radeon as a tool for getting cheaper Nvidia.
It's not a deflection. The major issues with 8GB games are concentrated in bad PS5 ports that eventually get patched. That doesn't mean that games can't take advantage of more than 8GB GPUs. But practically all games can be and are made to provide a great experience on 8GB GPUs.
Even this game runs absolutely great on 8GB. Having more than 8GB here costs you going from ultra to high on textures and geometry. Is that worth preferring a hypothetical 5050 12GB over the 5060 Ti 8GB? Absolutely not, in my opinion. 60% raster >> slightly higher texture quality.
The major contention here is that the PS5 has slightly more VRAM than 8GB in many titles. Thus, exact PS5 settings would push you over the VRAM buffer, which requires creating a system of memory management. If the system is implemented well, we can 8GB PC surpass PS5. But if not, it could create problems.
TLOU Part I had worse textures at launch on PC with 8GB than on the 256MB VRAM PS3. That's not an 8GB VRAM issue; it's an issue of a comically broken streaming system they tried to copy-paste from PS5 onto PC.
There is also the fact that Windows itself is terrible and uses hundreds of MBs of VRAM it doesn't need to use.
The actual solution here is 9GB 96-bit GPUs. Nvidia
wants to do this but knows they will get burned at the stake by AMDUB, GN, etc. So they can't do it.
Thus, the VRAM whining complex is just making things worse. Imagine someone who reviews every iPhone and whose entire argument is that the iPhone 18 Pro Max should be $499, citing some Chinese Pico phone as proof. Is that a serious reviewer?
VRAM now is $10/GB, and once you apply Nvidia's margin, that's $18/GB. Apply AIB/Distributor/Retailer margin, and we are at $20/GB on the MSRP.
5050 12GB? $289 + 4 * $20 = $369
5070 18GB? $629 + 6 * $20 = $749
Now would AMDUB review a $369 RTX 5050 12GB positively? What about A $749 RTX 5070 18GB? Of course not. He'd burn them at the stake.
He complained the 4060 Ti 8GB should be $299. So Nvidia made the RTX 5060, which is exactly what he asked for at $299. Except now it needs to be $150 or less at 8GB, or have 12GB at $299. Does it matter that GDDR7 3GB was still sampling and not in mass production when the 5060 launched? Of course not.
All these takes are variations of either:
1. Nvidia has to have no margin. Why do they have margin?
2. Not understanding that memory's Moore's Law is facing similar challenges to the logic one.
AMD people always assume that the 93% of the market now buying Nvidia are behaving irrationally.
It can't possibly be because the RDNA2/3 Windows driver is 12% slower than the open-source Mesa Linux driver. It cannot possibly be because AMD has de facto put those cards in maintenance mode long ago. It cannot possibly be because Turing and Ampere buyers loved having the lifetime of their GPU extended by getting DLSS SR and multiple software updates that retroactively upgraded their cards (4.0, 4.5).
It cannot possibly be because Nvidia architectures are forward-looking, and thus AMD doesn't have an upscaler that can reach the image quality of Nvidia running 4.5 in performance mode.
And when they get FSR4 INT8 unofficially, they get stuck having to spend 12.2ms on N22 doing a 1080p to 2160p. Because AMD didn't think gamers needed tensor cores until Nvidia proved that they do.
No, it's because 93% of GPU buyers are dumbasses who don't know what's good for them.
The reality is that consumers are hyper-rational. They understand at this point that the high VRAM on AMD GPUs is bait. It's why they demand that an AMD GPU be 15-30% cheaper than the raster equivalent at Nvidia. It's also why they don't care when AMD offers lots of VRAM.
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Bojji
Member
You can buy the high VRAM version or you can lower settings.
5060 Ti 8GB delivers a monstrous amount of performance at a relatively cheap price thanks to 8GB. Around 15-20% Faster than PS5 Pro, But with a PS6 level feature set. An absolute steal at 379$.
If you want must have 12GB, go buy 12GB B580. But 95% of people don't want to do that. Do you want to know why?
The major misunderstanding of PC here that people have is not understanding that consumers don't want high VRAM GPUs. They want high VRAM Nvidia GPUs.
AMD and their influencers (MLID, Kepler, AMDUB, etc) have complained in the past about the phenomenon of buyers who view Radeon as a tool for getting cheaper Nvidia.
It's not a deflection. The major issues of 8GB games are concentrated in bad ports that eventually get patched. That doesn't mean that games can't take advantage of >8GB GPUs. But that practically all games can be made and are made to provide a great experience on 8GB GPUs.
The major contention here is that PS5 has slightly more VRAM than 8GB in many titles. Thus exact PS5 settings would push you over the VRAM buffer. Which requires creating a system of memory management. If the system is implemented well we can see 8GB PC surpass PS5.
TLOU P1 had worse textures on launch PC than on 8GB than the 256MB VRAM PS3. That's not a PC issue, it's an issue of a comically broken streaming system they tried to copy paste from PS5 onto PC. There is also that windows itself is terrible and uses hundreds of MBs of VRAM it doesn't need to use.
The actual solution here is 9GB 96b GPUs. Nvidia wants to do this but they know that they will get burned at the stakes by AMDUB, GN, etc for it. So they can't do it.
Thus the VRAM whining complex is just making things worse. Imagine someone that reviews every iPhone and his entire argument is that the iPhone 18 Pro Max should be 499$. Citing some Chinese Pico phone as proof. Is that a serious reviewer?
Again, this is just trying to price out people from gaming with extra steps.
VRAM now is 10$/GB, and once you Apply Nvidia's margin, that's 18$/GB. Apply AIB/Distribtor/Reatiler margin? We are are 20$/GB on the MSRP.
5050 now is 289$ (subsidized by patriotic 5090 buyers).
5050 12GB? 289+4*20 = 369$
5070 18GB? 629+6*20 = 749$
Now would AMDUB Shell 369$ RTX 5050 12GB? 749$ RTX 5070? Off course not. He'd burn it at the stake.
He complained 4060 Ti 8GB should be 299$. So Nvidia made RTX 5060 which is exactly what he asked for at 299$. Except now it needs to be 150$ or less at 8GB or have 12GB at 299$. Does it matter that GDDR7 3GB was still sampling and not in mass production when 5060 launched? Off course not.
All these takes are variations of either:
1. Nvidia has to have no margin. Why do they have margin?
2. Not understanding that Memory's moore's law is facing similar challenges to the logic one.
AMD people always assume that 93% of the market now buying Nvidia are behaving irrationally.
It can't possibly be because RDNA2/3 Windows driver is 12% slower than the open source Mesa Linux driver. It cannot possibly be because AMD has defacto put those cards in maintaininance mode long ago. It cannot possibly be because Turing and Ampere buyers loved having the lifetime of their GPU extended by getting DLSS SR and multiple software updates that retroactively upgraded their cards (4.0, 4.5).
It cannot possibly be because Nvidia architectures are forward looking and thus they don't have an upscaler to use that can reach the image quality of Nvidia running 4.5 in performance mode.
And when they get FSR4 INT8 unofficially, they get stuck having to spend 12.2ms on N22 doing 1080p => 2160p upscale from 1080 to 4K. Because AMD didn't think Gamers didn't need tensor cores until Nvidia proved that they do.
No, it's because they are dumbasses.
The reality is that consumers are hyper rational. They understand at this point that the high VRAM on AMD GPUs is bait. It's why they demand an AMD GPU be 15-30% cheaper than the raster equivalent at Nvidia. It's also why they don't care when AMD offers lots of VRAM.
5060ti 8GB - monster GPU that beats PS5 Pro but you have to use PS4 textures and turn RT off
Bojji
Member
You can buy 8GB GPU and be happy with it, just don't complain about "unoptimized games".