460k is disaterous. There is literally no way to spin it otherwise.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
NPD December 2012 Sales Results [Up2: Xbox 360, All Nintendo Hardware, NSMB Wii U]
- Thread starter Nirolak
- Start date
460k is disaterous. There is literally no way to spin it otherwise.
Baki
Member
Nintendo:
I honestly think the WiiU is a lost cause without some sort of 'Wii-Fit' style craz - and even then, its clear that due to certain design decisions, they look to be left behind by third parties again. Basically, they should focus on profitability and ride out this generation.
The Nintendo 3DS looks like its posting respectable numbers, especially due to the xmas promotions. If they can sustain these levels and continue to deliver software, this system will be quite successful. Next year looks to be especially promising with Pokemon X & Y and numerous other high profile releases. It will reach numbers between GBA and DS.
Sony:
Its clear that they prioritised profitability, I mean, who increases the price and releases a cheaper looking system. :lol: hahahaha The PS3 dropping in December is a surprise but the low numbers should have been anticipated due to their terrible pricing structure in the US (where conversely, SCEE had amazing PS3 bundles). In the very least, they should have increased the value of the PS3 with standard bundles for all PS3s (pack in a wonderbook or some old games). I anticipate the PS3 will continue to decline in 2013 unless SCEA cuts the price, a $199 price is long overdue. Ideally, I think the spring would be a good timeslot to coincide with software such as The Last of Us and God of War. But I expect that Sony will wait till fall. Sony can continue selling the PS3 in the US after the PS4 inception and hopefully position it as a family console as they continue to provide great services like PS+ (maybe even provide subscription plans to families where the PS3 costs $49 on a 2 year contract etc..)
The Vita needs to be a phone, even if they drop the price, the system is screwed. In an era where individuals can buy tablets for $199, Sony needs to avoid this race to the bottom by focusing on a smartphone market where they could compete in effectively while still maintaining profitability. Honestly, an Android Vita phone is long overdue. PlayStation Mobile is a good start though.
Microsoft: 8th Holiday with amazing sales. Very impressive showing by MS, which really pumped life back into the system during 2010. The Xbox 720 will launch well next year providing they don't fuck up. hahah
I honestly think the WiiU is a lost cause without some sort of 'Wii-Fit' style craz - and even then, its clear that due to certain design decisions, they look to be left behind by third parties again. Basically, they should focus on profitability and ride out this generation.
The Nintendo 3DS looks like its posting respectable numbers, especially due to the xmas promotions. If they can sustain these levels and continue to deliver software, this system will be quite successful. Next year looks to be especially promising with Pokemon X & Y and numerous other high profile releases. It will reach numbers between GBA and DS.
Sony:
Its clear that they prioritised profitability, I mean, who increases the price and releases a cheaper looking system. :lol: hahahaha The PS3 dropping in December is a surprise but the low numbers should have been anticipated due to their terrible pricing structure in the US (where conversely, SCEE had amazing PS3 bundles). In the very least, they should have increased the value of the PS3 with standard bundles for all PS3s (pack in a wonderbook or some old games). I anticipate the PS3 will continue to decline in 2013 unless SCEA cuts the price, a $199 price is long overdue. Ideally, I think the spring would be a good timeslot to coincide with software such as The Last of Us and God of War. But I expect that Sony will wait till fall. Sony can continue selling the PS3 in the US after the PS4 inception and hopefully position it as a family console as they continue to provide great services like PS+ (maybe even provide subscription plans to families where the PS3 costs $49 on a 2 year contract etc..)
The Vita needs to be a phone, even if they drop the price, the system is screwed. In an era where individuals can buy tablets for $199, Sony needs to avoid this race to the bottom by focusing on a smartphone market where they could compete in effectively while still maintaining profitability. Honestly, an Android Vita phone is long overdue. PlayStation Mobile is a good start though.
Microsoft: 8th Holiday with amazing sales. Very impressive showing by MS, which really pumped life back into the system during 2010. The Xbox 720 will launch well next year providing they don't fuck up. hahah
OmegaTreeFish
Banned
Neither are most consoles. Its totally irrelevant.
Also the few people that have claimed the vita needs to be a phone, I just cant agree with. Its not the fact its not a phone that is stopping sales.
lunchwithyuzo
Banned
Wii U was supply constrained for November also. It's pretty much the same exact situation as PS3, neither had meaningful supply constraints after launch week.
yup. npd software numbers will be useless this time next year for platform dick measuring contests amongst fanatics. I'm guessing concurrent player numbers will replace them.
AndrewDean84xX
Banned
Except you know great games are on the way, games that will sell a shit ton of consoles, like Mario Kart, for example.
They do not have access to internal numbers, eg. Valve, PSN, XLBA, etc. They are estimates only.
specialguy
Banned
Doesn't seem like a viable course of action if Wii U sales are already this bad.
Imagine how they will be when PS4/720 hit. Third party support is already weak, it will go to nonexistent, as likely will sales.
Think, if Wii U does half/one third 360 going forward as it did this month, we have sub 100k months coming up...
Word of mouth has been pretty positive for the WiiU version of NG3. Better than what the reviews indicate. I'm sure they are out there, but i haven't seen anyone post here or on MiiVerse that says they regret buying it. The forthcoming DLC for it looks awesome too.
CosmicQueso
Member
2.6 for the year, what the Wii did in 2006. Which is pretty low to begin with. Plus, the Wii had Sports in 100% of boxes, still attached much higher than the Wii U. Digital plays into this surely, but it's an unknown just how much. Regardless, retail support may wane if things stay as they are. No sense in having 8 linear feet of display space for a platform doing these kinds of numbers. (I adore my Wii U by the way, haven't turned on any other console since I bought it)
Well I don't know about that, but it sure is going to make forecasting new products and assessing the value of devs and pubs a hell of a lot harder, as well as for Greenlighting new games that's for sure. Which is all these figures are for, really.
yankeehater
Member
There is more DLC coming?
NemesisPrime
Banned
Nintendo should have forked out a lot of cash for Minecraft U TBH. That would have worked for xmas.
Baconsammy
Banned
Microsoft put a ring on that.
I think disastrous is too strong. The vita is disastrous. WiiU is under-performing...
People must have thought the 360 was a disaster at the time...
Nintendo will be fine.
OmegaTreeFish
Banned
Nah. The WiiU is disastrous. Vita is a flaming wreck.
lunchwithyuzo
Banned
Yes, it's not quite APOCALYPTIC SCENARIO, but it's still very dissapointing.
The software is worse though, although it seems like the ports generally did a bit better in December at least.
KillerMan91
Member
Makes MS not releasing software shipments even worse. I really wonder why they don't release them.
yankeehater
Member
There were tons of posts about how MS was doomed and once the PS3 comes out the 360 will be totally dead. I have no doubt that the WiiU will end up selling great.
Monty Mole
Member
360 was massively supply-constrained at launch, so definitely not a fair comparison.
Here in the UK, I really struggled to get my 360 in 2005 despite ordering literally a few days after E3. GAME didn't have enough consoles to fulfill my order. MS barely shipped any consoles.
Narpas Sword0
Member
No it wasn't. There were stacks of them at retailers by me, it was available on Target.com and Walmart.com and Gamestop.com, and it was not getting gouged on eBay
People were waiting on line at 6am for them well into January
I wonder how many posters in this thread were old enough to buy their own shit in 2005 and 2006.
lunchwithyuzo
Banned
360 was a disaster at the time, though it at least had some 3rd party stuff doing really well (COD2, Madden) and it had "supply constraints" to dull the negative outlook. Microsoft definitely wasn't prepared for launch though.
There were supply constraints launch week, it was confirmed repeatedly by both Nintendo and analysts doing channel checks. Nintendo kept supplies moving though, which is why it managed to do 400k+ it's first week.
Everyone in the US in 2012 who wanted a Wii U got one eventually this year. Just as everyone in the US in 2006 who wanted a PS3 got one eventually that year.
we did. I'm sure you can go back and read the NPD thread. It was a supply disaster though
PS3 just crossed 77 million worldwide. A system considered a disaster by all accounts early on.
WiiU doesn't match the runaway success of the Wii but does very respectable numbers given its rather high price tag. Where's the problem here? Nintendo will be able to sell WiiU for a long time. They're not going anywhere. They're not even going third party. Chill out.
The world is a different place today too. There's a lot more entertainment options available to people. IMO, no console can hit Wii-like numbers unless someone is committed to having a similar ground breaking control method next to a super low price. Microsoft and Sony will have similar issues later this year or whenever they move to new machines.
WiiU doesn't match the runaway success of the Wii but does very respectable numbers given its rather high price tag. Where's the problem here? Nintendo will be able to sell WiiU for a long time. They're not going anywhere. They're not even going third party. Chill out.
The world is a different place today too. There's a lot more entertainment options available to people. IMO, no console can hit Wii-like numbers unless someone is committed to having a similar ground breaking control method next to a super low price. Microsoft and Sony will have similar issues later this year or whenever they move to new machines.
Psychotext
Member
They didn't come off the high of the Wii though. The high was a long, long time ago. They came off the stagnant wasteland of the Wii.
Baki
Member
Well with a price-drop - some high volume games like Mario Kart etc.. They could have a fairly profitable but low volume console business. Although to be honest, at this point in time, its hard to make any solid predictions because of so many uncertainties (PS4/720). However, what is clear, the fundamental business model they are using is broken. The product is flawed at a fundamental level and unlike the 3DS, they won't get the software support they need to bounce back (even with drastic price drops).
Baconsammy
Banned
Sony never alienated core gamers and third party developers. Nintendo is going into the Wii U begging for the support of both and at the same time wishing their new console would become a fad ala the Wii. The situation isn't remotely the same.
Clay Davis
Member
those posts were facing the reality of the situation (at the time). the ps3 wa, quite rightly expected to be a sales beast after how well the ps2 did and how dominant of a position sony were in.
the two aren't really comparable.
WiiU saved. Just wait for X game.
BTW did the gamecube have all these great games?
Wait... what? Sony sure as hell alienated everyone with $599 and a crappy lineup of games!
Wow... talk about revisionist history, man.
It isn't. And even if it was, There's a huge difference between "460k is disasterous" and "less than a million is disasterous". People should be ashamed to make such posts when they're clearly clueless about the subject.
Also, the way you guys try to be so final with your doomed posts is kind of entertaining. "Literally no way to spin it otherwise." Gimme a break.
77 millions are all hardcore gamers huh?
Also if selling 100 million and having a good run for 4 to 5 years is a fad than nintendo probably wishes that another fad comes
Petrae
Member
Aside from the 3DS avenue of a price cut within the first six months (which would be costly to Nintendo in several ways), how does this "get fixed"?
Perhaps more games will do the trick, but Nintendo moves on its own clock with these. They purportedly exist, but are under lock & key, as if Nintendo is fearing that everyone is going to steal its ideas.
Perhaps a better marketing campaign is employed, with more media visibility and TV time. Maybe Nintendo actually tells the public what WiiU is, rather than quick cuts between users enjoying themselves and a few snippets of game footage. In-store tournaments, like in Nintendo Land, for example, could be a vehicle.
I'd like to see Nintendo "fix this", honestly. I think there are options and ideas, but I don't know that these options work. With new consoles (allegedly) months away and with a fair segment of the former Wii market having allegedly gone elsewhere (mobile, for example), the challenge is considerable.
Yes, because they wanted to focus elsewhere, not that it's right but their focus is now on WiiU. I think they will do something. Besides, they were good with support with the Wii through 2010, 2011 is when it went downhill. I don't consider that a long,long time ago.
electroplankton
Banned
GC came from a period where Mario was not so popular as it is now. And Nintendo has more valuable brands.
You know, the other thing about 360 sales is you really have to wonder what percentage of them are people who bought a second (or third, or fourth) machine due to mechanical failure. So many gamers talk about getting the latest model and ditching their old one. There must be at least 10% (likely higher) of their sold through number that is people replacing broken 360s.
Sho_Nuff82
Member
77 million was at best a bad estimate, at worst an outright fabrication. There's no way Sony's ww shipments went up yoy with sales down in Japan and US.
Edit 1; the Vita as a phone is really already addressed by Sony Ericsson's 2013 smartphone lineup. SCE missed that train.
Edit 2: if you propose that a substantial portion of 360 sales is repeat customers, you simultaneously propose historic software attach rates for the hardware. Most people return rrod consoles for free -only message board enthusiasts go out and buy 3 or 4 versions of the same tech.
Edit 1; the Vita as a phone is really already addressed by Sony Ericsson's 2013 smartphone lineup. SCE missed that train.
Edit 2: if you propose that a substantial portion of 360 sales is repeat customers, you simultaneously propose historic software attach rates for the hardware. Most people return rrod consoles for free -only message board enthusiasts go out and buy 3 or 4 versions of the same tech.
Oh wow, really? We're really going with the RROD shit again ... your 10% is nothing but mere speculation and a complete guess plucked out of thin air.
JoshuaJSlone
Member
You're right; looks like I started from April 2011 instead of January.
What high price tag it has a model that is 300 dollars cheaper than the PS3. Its high end model is 50 dollars cheaper than the top end 360 SKU. Its basic sku is the same price as the PS2. It has standard console pricing. Pricing is not the issue. Marketing and having no real market are the issue. Core gamers already played all the Wii U 3rd party games on one of the HD twins. Worse yet some of those ports are inferior and cost more than the HD twins. And casuals have not fallen in love with the gimmick tablet controller like they did the Wii Mote. I don't see who this will sell to except the hard core nintendo fan once the big guns like zelda come out. I smell a gamecube situation were only hardcore nintendo fans own the thing.
RukusProvider
Banned
Sony had goodwil and brand power built up due to the PS2 success in the traditional gaming community.
They were also willing to lose billions to gain relevancy.
Nintendo's brand power with the Wii was the built on the back of casuals, not the traditional gaming community.
The traditonal gaming community is firmly tied to the 360/ps3 and eagerly waiting their successors. Nintendo has not done well enough to draw them away.
The WiiU NEEDS to resonate with the casuals for it to be successful in the west. That's their only shot.
pr0cs
Member
Lots of people do, until the next financial thread that should clear it up and lots of 'huh, I thought it hit 77 mill not 74!'
460k is dissapoimting but far from disasterous. It would be disastrous if we could already say that no matter what nintendo does wiiu will be a virtual boy level failure but thats not the case. It is however going to be tough for nintendo to reach wii numbers. They need to hit it hard this year (like in 2007)
Baconsammy
Banned
599 made it easy for people that craved one to wait for a price drop. It hurt them for sure in that it turned a lot of people towards the 360. Sony also didn't release the PS3 with specs on par with consoles released many years prior at a time when other console makers were readying much more powerful consoles. That's how you alienate core gamers. But I'm specifically referring to the Wii. It alienated core gamers. If you want to suggest that's untrue, then how do you explain Nintendo's stated effort to win them back? Surely if Nintendo accepts this, you can.
Of course Nintendo is wishing they hit on another fad. It's the way you make your console a hit if you don't have third party or core gamer support. Without it you have the Gamecube. A good console, regardless of poor sales.
This is dumb. But if you want to go that route, then it paints a much better picture for Microsoft since it would mean their game attach rate is about double what it currently is. That would put them light years ahead of the competition.
The PS3 was also launched at the height of Sony's popularity. Unlike the Wii U