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Aounuma (& Miyamoto) talk about past zeldas(MM and WW) and what to expect from TP
- Thread starter SantaC
- Start date
OOT > Majora's Mask
Majora was really cool, but it lacked the all around quality of OOT. The Snowhead and Great Bay dungeons were amazing, the swamp dungeon was good, and the canyon dungeon I grew tired of. The bossfights were unimpressive compared to OOT, especially the finale. That's the meat of the game right there. Plus completing the bomber's notebook without a guide required too much time standing around doing nothing.
Majora was really cool, but it lacked the all around quality of OOT. The Snowhead and Great Bay dungeons were amazing, the swamp dungeon was good, and the canyon dungeon I grew tired of. The bossfights were unimpressive compared to OOT, especially the finale. That's the meat of the game right there. Plus completing the bomber's notebook without a guide required too much time standing around doing nothing.
It would be fine with me if it's made longer due to there being more dungeons.Wyzdom said:
But if it's made longer because of having to spend a bunch of time just to go from point A to point B on the overworld, or doing fetch quests to advance the story, then that's no good.
When broken down, I'd agree Ocarina of Time is probably the better game. It's much longer, more polished, more direct, has more dungeons and all with a much less daunting learning curve. But Majora's Mask is just so... daring. In terms of narrative, in terms of aesthetic, in terms of mechanics, in terms of world design. OoT is pretty much just the culmination of all past Zeldas brought painstakingly into 3D. MM is a different beast all together, in a way becoming more than just the sum of it's parts. Under close criticism it might not rank as the better game, but overall I feel I can safely say it's by far the better experience. It fact, I'd say it's likely the best experience to ever come out of Nintendo and arguably one of the best to come out of videogames entirely.
Version 3.0
Member
Great post, SantaCruzer, thanks!
Like many others said, my anticipation for this game just increased exponentially--again! And I didn't think that was possible after I got to try it at E3 (my first time!)
Like many others said, my anticipation for this game just increased exponentially--again! And I didn't think that was possible after I got to try it at E3 (my first time!)
radioheadrule83
Banned
Just because there isn't any good news in here for Wind Waker fans aside from them recognising its sole faults...
Aonuma states in this months Games TM (magazine that competes directly with Edge in the UK) that cel shaded Link has not been abandoned, and that he'd like to reuse Link in that form. He says that Wind Waker was still popular even though this new game looks to be received even more warmly going by its reception at prior E3s.
Amen to that.
For me Link to the Past is still the game with the greatest moments. It really heated up from the Priest dying in the sanctuary, drawing the master sword and racing to save Zelda to realise... OH SHIT! 8 More dungeons! Hell yes? Huge expansive overworld, with an alternate dimension/version that you really need to explore in depth? Hell yes. Great score? Yes. Great ending? Yes. It's just awesome.
Aonuma states in this months Games TM (magazine that competes directly with Edge in the UK) that cel shaded Link has not been abandoned, and that he'd like to reuse Link in that form. He says that Wind Waker was still popular even though this new game looks to be received even more warmly going by its reception at prior E3s.
Lindsay said:
Amen to that.
For me Link to the Past is still the game with the greatest moments. It really heated up from the Priest dying in the sanctuary, drawing the master sword and racing to save Zelda to realise... OH SHIT! 8 More dungeons! Hell yes? Huge expansive overworld, with an alternate dimension/version that you really need to explore in depth? Hell yes. Great score? Yes. Great ending? Yes. It's just awesome.
I think you're over reacting.Lindsay said:
One of the great things about zelda is it can be a 10-15 hour game if you just go from dungeon to dungeon and do no exploring whatsoever. Hell, you can go sub 10 hours on all of them. Mike 'TSA' Damiani has completed A Link to the Past in under 100 minutes and you can also beat Majora's Mask in six in-game days (three of which are the opening deku scrub sequence). Even Ocarina of Time has been beaten in just over five hours.
However, you can spend much more time playing each of the zeldas, simply exploring for the hell of it. Especially in the 3D zeldas. I know that I spent at least fifty hours playing MM, OoT, and WW each the first time, and I didn't 100% complete any of them the first time through.
If you're worried about Twilight Princess being too long, don't worry.
Version 3.0
Member
About Majora's Mask:
I remember telling my brother while playing MM that I felt it was the better game (vs. OoT). The time system was so involving once you started to figure out how things work, and the morphing identities gave the game so many original gameplay opportunities. After finishing it, I changed my vote, mostly because of the lack of dungeons and resulting overabundance of heart pieces, which led to side quest overdose. The "main game" suffered because of the focus on side quests.
But I admire MM's originality, and the team's courage in taking that direction. It reminds me a lot of Link's Adventure, and I really respect Nintendo for not making a cookie-cutter sequel for the console just to rake in sales, on both occasions--and now again with Twilight Princess.
I remember telling my brother while playing MM that I felt it was the better game (vs. OoT). The time system was so involving once you started to figure out how things work, and the morphing identities gave the game so many original gameplay opportunities. After finishing it, I changed my vote, mostly because of the lack of dungeons and resulting overabundance of heart pieces, which led to side quest overdose. The "main game" suffered because of the focus on side quests.
But I admire MM's originality, and the team's courage in taking that direction. It reminds me a lot of Link's Adventure, and I really respect Nintendo for not making a cookie-cutter sequel for the console just to rake in sales, on both occasions--and now again with Twilight Princess.
Operations
Member
Wow, those quotes are so great I thought at first they had to be fake. If they're actually addressing WW's flaws then TP will no doubt become an awesome gaming experience.
Lindsay said:
Nintendo has been moving the console Zeldas into a more RPG/adventure direction ever since Ocarina of Time. Most of this is because they want to compete with the Final Fantasys and Dragon Quests to establish Zelda as one of the definitive blockbusters in the video game industry. And for the most part they've succeeded.
I say bring it on. There's always the handheld Zeldas for that quickie gameplay.
Im surprised a developer actually admitted his mistakes/flaws in a game and from a japanese developer no less!
I must say that this is just good news all around, my feeling on the situation is that you can play a wolf only in certain parts and when you clear the area your are transformed back into Link. I don't think you can transform at will.
I think this game will be awesome but judging from past sellers on gamecube Im hoping that this game becomes the best seller for the system. I think that would show Nintendo that people DON"T want smaller simplier games and two that this would acknowledge that the mass gaming population is older than they think.
I must say that this is just good news all around, my feeling on the situation is that you can play a wolf only in certain parts and when you clear the area your are transformed back into Link. I don't think you can transform at will.
I think this game will be awesome but judging from past sellers on gamecube Im hoping that this game becomes the best seller for the system. I think that would show Nintendo that people DON"T want smaller simplier games and two that this would acknowledge that the mass gaming population is older than they think.
Lindsay said:
I've read your other post after this one, but to be fair, Zelda is really an action/ADVENTURE, so I think the length will be very satisfying for fans of adventure games. I will be very surprised if every single dungeon in the new game is necessary to trek through, I know most will be, but there will likely be a few that are there just to pick up an interesting extra item, or as part of a sidequest or something like that.
The overworld is something else: I really doubt it will have that much to do in itself. I'm sure it will have a healthy dose of secrets, like most Zeldas, but it would probably get old getting on and off Epona (?) over and over and over, so they will likely be spread out. That should work fine, if the new overworld is as large as they claim it to be.
In short, I believe only the most cynical and jaded gamer will find anything significant to gripe about from Twilight Princess.
great comments indeed, though.. I'm still worried for the difficulty, TWW's "difficulty" spoiled my TWW experience in a degree, yes it was THAT easy. (boss fights not to mention, are those supposed to be bosses to be scared of? you could beat them in your first try, that's not what I call a boss fight)
D
Deleted member 1235
Unconfirmed Member
what an amazingly honest quote. I thought WW was awesome as well and the triforce thing didn't bother me quite as much as it did others, this new one sounds pretty sweet.
TheTurtleTitan
Member
See, this is why games need to be delayed sometimes. Ocarina of Time was initially scheduled for Christmas '97 (yeah right) and ended up being delayed an entire year! But look, OoT turned out to be lengthy and polished, with no 'dud' moments like the Triforce search.
Jonnyboy117
Member
In past interviews, these two guys have said that the decision to focus the game on an older Link preceded the decision to make the game more realistic. They actually had several character designs for an older link, including cel-shaded ones and who knows what else, but the one that seemed to fit best was the realistic one. So they built the rest of the game around that realistic character design.
Now I'd be extremely interested to learn more about the history of the twilight character and environment designs and how they decided to mix realistic and cel-shaded styles together.
Now I'd be extremely interested to learn more about the history of the twilight character and environment designs and how they decided to mix realistic and cel-shaded styles together.
AndoCalrissian
Member
I welcome a longer time with the game, but I would hope that the extra hours are spent in optional side quests, rather than lengthening an adventure that may not need it.
radioheadrule83
Banned
It won't take 60 hours to play through anyway :|
It's not like you're going to be running about levelling up or something.
It's not like you're going to be running about levelling up or something.
I stopped believing what developers have to say about game length especially from Nintendo. When a developer talks about game length they assume that the person playing it is a 5 year old who has never played games before. I remember when a nintendo rep said starfox adventures was 80 hours long too....needless to say that wasn't exactly accurate.
Im predicting roughly 20-30 hours which is usually the case with most zelda games.
Im predicting roughly 20-30 hours which is usually the case with most zelda games.
bob_arctor
Tough_Smooth
On a semi-related note, I just got this last night:
Now, it's time to do some heavy lifting.
Now, it's time to do some heavy lifting.
UltraMarioMan
Member
I do not want them to alter the difficulty in the Zelda series. Unless they let you pick from Easy, Normal, or Hard when you start.
I'm glad Aonuma is adding story to Miyamoto's feeling because its what Zelda has lacked for so long. But it has to be done right, and it can't lose what Miyamoto made it in the first place, which is that unique feeling of adventure and exploration.
I'm worried that Zelda is becoming too formulaic in these modern times, its now about numbers of dungeons, villages, maps and stories, what the puzzles and gameplay elements are like, how are the traditions upheld etc etc. But it should be more about discovery and keeping its focus on a sense of adventure.
Kind of like LOTR, or an adventure anime like One Piece, these things are about a goal, and the struggles and adventures you have on your way. The places you see, the people who you interact with, who you help and who help you, and the people who try to stop you.
Dungeons shouldn't always be about finding all the elements and hidden treasures and then beating the boss. As intricate as any dungeon can be, this does get old. Why is it that the places I have most fun in recent Zeldas is the village? Because thats where the discovery is.
Dungeons should be about getting through this treacherous place in whatever way you can, the whole concept of dungeon itself is becoming stale. Think LOTR again, they go under the mountain and want to sneak through, but they are forced into a huge battle and have to run away. This kind of scenario could be just as entertaining as any previous dungeon. The concept of going into this temple/dungeon to collect an item or do a goal and coming back out is too old now. Forced into it, forced to get to the other side, occasional collecting and traditional dungeon - mix it up Aonuma!!
I'm worried that Zelda is becoming too formulaic in these modern times, its now about numbers of dungeons, villages, maps and stories, what the puzzles and gameplay elements are like, how are the traditions upheld etc etc. But it should be more about discovery and keeping its focus on a sense of adventure.
Kind of like LOTR, or an adventure anime like One Piece, these things are about a goal, and the struggles and adventures you have on your way. The places you see, the people who you interact with, who you help and who help you, and the people who try to stop you.
Dungeons shouldn't always be about finding all the elements and hidden treasures and then beating the boss. As intricate as any dungeon can be, this does get old. Why is it that the places I have most fun in recent Zeldas is the village? Because thats where the discovery is.
Dungeons should be about getting through this treacherous place in whatever way you can, the whole concept of dungeon itself is becoming stale. Think LOTR again, they go under the mountain and want to sneak through, but they are forced into a huge battle and have to run away. This kind of scenario could be just as entertaining as any previous dungeon. The concept of going into this temple/dungeon to collect an item or do a goal and coming back out is too old now. Forced into it, forced to get to the other side, occasional collecting and traditional dungeon - mix it up Aonuma!!
Link
The Autumn Wind
Of course it'd be a good thing. The Zelda series has gotten stupidly easy over the last few games. It's time for a return to form.lo zaffo said:
Suck it up. It's people like you that have caused a great majority of games to become a pastime for pussies. I was able to beat the original Zelda when I was 6, and I'll bet most people here did the same. The industy needs to stop coddling the audience.
Even if Nintendo wants to include a difficulty slider, that's fine, but I'm sick of geting through Zelda games without being in danger of dying even once.
TheTurtleTitan
Member
Well, in the demo, it looks like Nintendo is going back to a quarter-heart per hit. Hopefully that was just for E3 though. I was also in no threat of dying once in Wind Waker (even on my first play).Link said:
They should stagger damage in Zelda games.
Like, let's same the game has you collection 10 magical somethings (or 3 of this and 7 of that, whatever.) For every 2 or 3 somethings you get, ALL damage should be weighted UP. So, if an enemy would do a quarter heart of damage in the beginning, he'd do half a heart after 2 or 3 magical somethings are found, 3/4 after 4 or 6, etc.
And if you can't keep your HC count growing by exploring thoroughly... too f-cking bad.
Like, let's same the game has you collection 10 magical somethings (or 3 of this and 7 of that, whatever.) For every 2 or 3 somethings you get, ALL damage should be weighted UP. So, if an enemy would do a quarter heart of damage in the beginning, he'd do half a heart after 2 or 3 magical somethings are found, 3/4 after 4 or 6, etc.
And if you can't keep your HC count growing by exploring thoroughly... too f-cking bad.
I really hope EAD is putting some thought on the dungeons. I don't want 10 dungeons and nothing very creative about them. I'd rather have 4 huge dungeons and they're all innovating. Can't really judge from one dungeon shown at E3, but the forest-like temple didn't really look all that hot, puzzle-wise. Also, I hope most boss fights are rehashes from previous Zelda games, like in Wind Waker.
Agent Icebeezy
Welcome beautful toddler, Madison Elizabeth, to the horde!
Link said:
This is correct, just like I'm tired of hearing people whine about F-Zero. It's not that hard, you just aren't as good a gamer as you though you were.
Shikamaru Ninja
任天å ã® å¿è
How exactly would a complex puzzle make sense in a e3 demo. Of course it is muted so you can have a quick run through and get some idea of the game.