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[takriel]

I don't even know who to blame anymore. American voters are straight up dumb as shit and I have zero clue on how to reach them.

It's easy to point at Democratic leadership but it's also profoundly mindblowing how little people do their own research and instead have to be swayed by messaging for the most basic of facts

It's definitely the voters.

 

[Polioliolio]

Remember when Hilary called some Trump supporters deplorable? She was on the right track. It's the lousy voters and I have no idea how we get out of this situation.

Republicans are fully transparent about their evil agenda, and voters don't see it or just don't even care. Somebody heeelp!

 

[FStubbs]

Rrrriiigghhtttt.

Dems doing what Dems do best.

And Republicans like Steve King keep winning. People aren't dumb. The only logical conclusion is people are evil.

Why did the blue south become the red south?

 

[SolarPowered]

They need a clear vision and a story that exites people. A big problem and a clear way of how they're going to solve it. I feel like we keep getting lost in the confusing times we live in and everything turns into making sure every demographic is checked off the inclusivity list when the real problem is that there are forces and systems so large that they're actually driving a lot of our issues around race, sexuality, the environment, the economy, and our division. Inclusivity is SO important, but I think the Democrats are failing to see the biggest strings that already unite all of us.

Sanders was able to touch on this by essentially creating an entire platform around "The richest of the rich are responsible for these problems and I'm going to help you fight back." And look at how he took off (whatever you think of him) with a message that simple.

Get your story straight, get some fresh, young voices, and do the work of politics by getting down in the muck and having hard conversations with people.

I'll probably always vote Democrat and I know plenty of conservatives who seem to agree with me on pretty much every issue aside from one or two after I have a plain conversation with them. People want what you have to offer. You just have to show them.

Howard Dean seems to be the only oldschool Democrat who gets this. Personally I think Pelosi should at the very least be grooming potential successors behind the scenes if she isn't already. I've seen her on television and heard her speak, but I had no clue she was 77 years old until today. The democratic party is being run by fossils and that wouldn't be so bad if it didn't feel like they were desperately holding on to power no matter how much younger or farther left democrats try to climb that ladder and bring in fresh ideas.

 

[Shig]

As I've said elewhere, elections are popularity contests. Chart nearly every race's outcome, and the clear results are that the candidate with the strongest personality won.

Ossoff had zero personality. The end.

And yeah, sorry, but Pelosi's brand is tainted as badly as Hilary's was. She's pretty much a perfect composite of qualities that any Republican immediately and vehemently hates on principle. Yes, they'll go after her replacement too, but I sincerely doubt they'll be nearly so effective a boogeyman.

 

[teruterubozu]

It's definitely the voters.

More like, what voters? It goes beyond just messaging or getting people to "research".
The majority of people just don't give a fuck.

 

[Kthulhu]

There is no clear cut answer to take away from it all. The Candidate that ran would be best described as a Blue Dog. Yet somehow the Hard left think its a sign that its time for Hard Left candidate because a Blue Dog was competitive. A Hard Left Candidate would have been blown out. Blue Dog and Hard Left are not even close to similar

The blue dogs will only betray us in the end.

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

This shit keeps getting crazier

Rrrriiigghhtttt.

Dems doing what Dems do best.

You voted for Trump tho

 

[Hex]

Republicans unite as one. Democrats always turn and blame each other. Never change.

This.
Republicans know how to circle the wagons, like it or hate it.
Democrats always fall back on excuses and blame.

 

[Mango Positive]

Why are so many fingers being pointed after losses in seats that were vacated in the first place because they were considered safe by the GOP

The big show needs a narrative!

 

[Pai Pai Master]

Idiots. Republicans badmouth Pelosi enough and Democrats turn on her. This guy sounds like the fucking blue dog democrats who basically ruined everything by turning on Obama because it was popular with Republicans to hate him.

 

[UberTag]

America fell into the trap of having news outlets spinning fake news without any oversight to punish them for lying.

The citizens need to punish these news outlets for spinning fake news and lying because your government and your competing media clearly aren't invested in doing so.
And they're not impacted by how you vote on election day, so you're going to need to come up with a more creative approach on how to punish these propaganda peddlers.

 

[SolarPowered]

There is no clear cut answer to take away from it all. The Candidate that ran would be best described as a Blue Dog. Yet somehow the Hard left think its a sign that its time for Hard Left candidate because a Blue Dog was competitive. A Hard Left Candidate would have been blown out. Blue Dog and Hard Left are not even close to similar

When I hear blue dog I think more Manchin and Lieberman than Ossoff, but maybe I'm not following things closely enough.

 

[LosDaddie]

There's nothing surprising about Dems losing a safe seat for the GOP.

Only those in their own echo chamber were surprised.

 

[MsKrisp]

I don't really understand why there's so much hate for Pelosi. Are there any valid reasons for it? I keep hearing that she's terrible and needs to go, but I never hear any justifications.

 

[Lifeline]

Agree with major leadership changes. Solve this problem before the midterms.

 

[Shig]

Idiots. Republicans badmouth Pelosi enough and Democrats turn on her. This guy sounds like the fucking blue dog democrats who basically ruined everything by turning on Obama because it was popular with Republicans to hate him.

I'm curious what inspires this confidence in Pelosi. I'm struggling to recall ever seeing any interview or speech from her that struck me as particularly well-articulated, inspirational, or insightful. Her observations and debate are mostly a stream of humdrum partisan snipes, which may play well to her immediate constituency, but actively push away the opposition and many fence-sitters.

She's in the same boat as Hilary's, she's good at fundraising behind the scenes, but she ain't exactly inspiring passion in the electorate. Dems need great communicators and warm personalities to push their platform effectively; Obama and Bill had that in spades. Hilary and Pelosi don't.

 

[Steel]

I don't really understand why there's so much hate for Pelosi. Are there any valid reasons for it? I keep hearing that she's terrible and needs to go, but I never hear any justifications.

She has been built up as a super villain by the GOP over the years, and she is not particularly charismatic(At all, Hillary was a better speaker than her and speaking wasn't Hillary's strong-suit). The dems would be served in a PR sense with new blood(And should continually change leadership overtime to not allow GOP narratives to fester). Harry Reid had similiar problems to a lesser extent, it's good they got him replaced but Pelosi should be gone too.

 

[TheExecutive]

Why are so many fingers being pointed after losses in seats that were vacated in the first place because they were considered safe by the GOP

This. I guess dems are supposed to win every fricking election from here on out no matter the voting population.

 

[gcubed]

She has been built up as a super villain by the GOP over the years, and she is not particularly charismatic(At all, Hillary was a better speaker than her and speaking wasn't Hillary's strong-suit). The dems would be served in a PR sense with new blood. Harry Reid had similiar problems to a lesser extent, it's good they got him replaced but Pelosi should be gone too.

So basically... Anyone effective gets demonized by the right so we should change leadership because of reasons.

 

[jaekeem]

They need a clear vision and a story that exites people. A big problem and a clear way of how they're going to solve it. I feel like we keep getting lost in the confusing times we live in and everything turns into making sure every demographic is checked off the inclusivity list when the real problem is that there are forces and systems so large that they're actually driving a lot of our issues around race, sexuality, the environment, the economy, and our division. Inclusivity is SO important, but I think the Democrats are failing to see the biggest strings that already unite all of us.

Sanders was able to touch on this by essentially creating an entire platform around "The richest of the rich are responsible for these problems and I'm going to help you fight back." And look at how he took off (whatever you think of him) with a message that simple.

Get your story straight, get some fresh, young voices, and do the work of politics by getting down in the muck and having hard conversations with people.

I'll probably always vote Democrat and I know plenty of conservatives who seem to agree with me on pretty much every issue aside from one or two after I have a plain conversation with them. People want what you have to offer. You just have to show them.

Yup.

I think it's an identity problem (which is probably partly, but not necessarily, the fault of the leadership).

And I don't mean left v. right identity. I mean in how we are actually going to reach these working class, predominantly white voters emotionally, and how we're going to get classic democrat voting blocs to turn out.

Republicans are so damn good at the messaging, despite how insane some of their underlying beliefs are.

Dems need to stop getting caught up in the policy positions, and how they're seemingly 100x better than what the Republicans are pumping out. No shit. Elections aren't about substance. They're about how you can make voters feel; hope, charisma, and optimism.

I didn't support Bernie, but he was 100% on the right track with his economic populism angle. I don't think the Dems need to go further left or more to the center, but they need to turn that shit into a marketable and sellable story, and to run candidates that can genuinely sell it (no more resume battles. no more wooden candidates with decades of GOP baggage on them. just fucking win).

 

[jaekeem]

RE Pelosi and the rest of the Democrat leadership

isn't them getting their asses whupped so badly in Congress multiple times during Obama's tenure and the results of last November enough to indicate that they're clearly doing something wrong?

Why should anyone need to affirmatively show why an elected candidate is bad? The real question is wtf have they done that makes them worth voting for

 

[zelas]

This. I guess dems are supposed to win every fricking election from here on out no matter the voting population.

"They will if you just tell them about the wonders of socialism!"

 

[Wolfgunblood Garopa]

Republicans unite as one. Democrats always turn and blame each other. Never change.

Democrats more likely come from a background of law, public policy, community organization, economic policy.

Republicans more likely come from a background of cognitive science. They are marketers. They go through the gauntlet of think tanks and are much better at framing debates and utilizing cognitive techniques. There is the kind of party machinery there that Democrats naturally just don't align with.

 

[Lightning_Roller]

Democrats right now aren't filling me with much hope. Especially with this blame game nonsense. Come on, Dems!!! Get your shit together!!!!

 

[MsKrisp]

She has been built up as a super villain by the GOP over the years, and she is not particularly charismatic(At all, Hillary was a better speaker than her and speaking wasn't Hillary's strong-suit). The dems would be served in a PR sense with new blood(And should continually change leadership overtime to not allow GOP narratives to fester). Harry Reid had similiar problems to a lesser extent, it's good they got him replaced but Pelosi should be gone too.

Ah, okay that's fair.

 

[Steel]

So basically... Anyone effective gets demonized by the right so we should change leadership because of reasons.

Pretty clear that effectiveness(not that I'd say Pelosi is particularly effective keeping dems in office or otherwise) and experience has little bearing in how people vote. Basically, leadership needs to have actor-level charisma, whatever else is behind them is irrelevant. Put some young person with a silver tongue in the position and have the older folks lead them.

Put the dem's equivalent of Paul Ryan in charge. Ryan is a useless idiotic fuck but he gives a good outward face to the Republicans charisma-wise and energizes the base.

 

[Krombopulos_Michael]

Democrats need more passion both in their candidates, and their leadership. Passion is why Bernie did so well. People could plainly see he cared about the middle and lower classes and that inspired others to get involved politically who otherwise wouldn't have.

 

[Dude Abides]

I wonder how Dems managed to have huge wins in 2006 and 2008 with Demon Witch Pelosi as the House leader?

🤔

 

[jaekeem]

I wonder how Dems managed to have huge wins in 2006 and 2008 with Demon Witch Pelosi as the House leader?

Almost like the financial crisis and two wars made Republican incumbency massively unpopular

 

[Rubenov]

This was my thought as well. It was a long shot in those races.

The problem is Trump is gloating, having victory rallies... so the perception is that the Dems were utterly defeated. And perception is what matters in terms of influencing the public.

 

[Dude Abides]

Almost like the financial crisis and two wars made Republican incumbency massively unpopular

Huh. Almost like outside factors matter more than the head of the house caucus.

 

[jaekeem]

Huh. Almost like outside factors matter more than the head of the house caucus.

Both matter.

I'm just not convinced by you making an argument based solely on 1) a period where outside factors made republican incumbents go through hell 2) things that happened 9 years ago, at a minimum.

 

[gcubed]

Pretty clear that effectiveness(not that I'd say Pelosi is particularly effective keeping dems in office or otherwise) and experience has little bearing in how people vote. Basically, leadership needs to have actor-level charisma, whatever else is behind them is irrelevant. Put some young person with a silver tongue in the position and have the older folks lead them.

Put the dem's equivalent of Paul Ryan in charge. Ryan is a useless idiotic fuck but he gives a good outward face to the Republicans charisma-wise and energizes the base.

I'm not sure it's her job to keep people elected? It's her job to keep the caucus in line, which she has been very good at in the house.

 

[Cipherr]

Why are so many fingers being pointed after losses in seats that were vacated in the first place because they were considered safe by the GOP

Because Democrats.

 

[Dude Abides]

Both matter.

I'm just not convinced by you making an argument based solely on 1) a period where outside factors made republican incumbents go through hell 2) things that happened 9 years ago, at a minimum.

I'm not convinced that we should get rid of someone who's very effective at uniting the a House caucus just because reasons.

 

[ModBot]

rehash of existing dems in disarray thread. http://m.neogaf.com/showthread.php?t=1395405