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DF: The Matrix Awakens: Demo vs UHD Blu-ray Movie, Series S Cutbacks, SSD Speed Tests

Shmunter

Member
I just watched the Ktg demo/ analysis video, i must admit there are some very noticeable differences going on between the two consoles versions of the game.

I would have thought that the Xbox version of it would have been pretty much perfect as they had one of Microsoft's premier studios, the coalition i think, helping out on the demo.

They are a top-tier studio, so I was really surprised to see so much pop in on the big building as i thought that would have been something they would have been able to address immediately.

There are noticeable differences in image quality and reflections in his video too.

I am not tech-savvy enough to know the reasons behind it but i do find it rather perplexing there is not parity at least as the xbox is meant to be on paper the more powerful machine.
Fredrik Fredrik discovered the black no detail objects behind glass are a bug needing the demo to be played from the on rails intro to mitigate. But we’re not sure if the other differences clear up also.
 
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Darsxx82

Member
I just watched the Ktg demo/ analysis video, i must admit there are some very noticeable differences going on between the two consoles versions of the game.

I would have thought that the Xbox version of it would have been pretty much perfect as they had one of Microsoft's premier studios, the coalition i think, helping out on the demo.

They are a top-tier studio, so I was really surprised to see so much pop in on the big building as i thought that would have been something they would have been able to address immediately.

There are noticeable differences in image quality and reflections in his video too.

I am not tech-savvy enough to know the reasons behind it but i do find it rather perplexing there is not parity at least as the xbox is meant to be on paper the more powerful machine.
Everything that video shows is the result of a bug. You have the proof some page behind.

The bug is solved simply by restarting the demo from the chase part and fixes all the mentioned aspects:

-Black noise in building interior objects.
-Popping of these when you move the camera away
-Reflection flickering.

And it is the reason that it was doubted if KTG was using the XSS version as DF did not mention those differences and some people here with the XSX version did not see them.

Anyone can check each one of them . Looking at KTG history, I wonder if he knew about that bug and created the video to create misinformation.

P.S. The Coalition only was in charge of the port and optimization of the demo in XSeries. It is clear that, with the experience of the first demo specific for PS5, the small team at Epic surely had an easier time working with Sony console that also benefited from the work of The Coalition.
 
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Both systems came out days within each other with the same CPU and GPU made by the same manufacturer. There was never going to be significant differences between the platforms especially when 3rd parties prefer parity.

Big thing is the XSS doing a fantastic job on this demo when many declared if it would be canceled soon after releasing, predicted its complete failure, and even stated the X1X and PS4 Pro were more powerful. To see it running this demo with raytracing for only $300 is quite impressive. And it's only one year into the generation. Devs will only get more familiar with the hardware going forward.

The XSS isn't a premium system though.
 
Makes it even more impressive.

I'm actually more impressed with the XSX and the PS5 versions of the demo. They have extra stuff in them which could be important for future titles.

But I was asking if you were expecting big differences between the premium systems. The XSS wasn't part of the conversation because it doesn't compete with them in terms of performance.
 
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MonarchJT

Banned
Fredrik Fredrik discovered the black no detail objects behind glass are a bug needing the demo to be played from the on rails intro to mitigate. But we’re not sure if the other differences clear up also.
everything in the video is generated by the same bug.....ktg is a Sony fanboy and continuing to talk about his videos is an insult to intelligence. And it's the same reason you were told not to take it into consideration from the start
 
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DarkMage619

Report me if I continue to console war
I'm actually more impressed with the XSX and the PS5 versions of the demo. They have extra stuff in them which could be important for future titles.

But I was asking if you were expecting big differences between the premium systems. The XSS wasn't part of the conversation because it doesn't compete with them in terms of performance.
I answered that question right from the beginning.

Both systems came out within days each other with the same CPU, GPU and made by the same manufacturer. There was never going to be significant differences between the platforms especially when 3rd parties prefer parity.

I'd expect if you are buying the top of the line console you'd get top end performance. The XSS was part of the conversation of the thread since the demo is running on all three systems. With some people questioning if the XSS would even be able to compete with the X1X or PS4 Pro that system' performance I find more impressive.
 

Panajev2001a

GAF's Pleasant Genius
To see it running this demo with raytracing for only $300 is quite impressive.
It is impressive yes. Yet what you can achieve when you add only $99 more is apparently superfluous/not worth taking a look at (at least you stopped with the $299 vs $400 very perceptually misleading price comparisons).

And it's only one year into the generation. Devs will only get more familiar with the hardware going forward.
They will also get familiar with the XSX more and flex its compute advantage at 1080p (not just more CU’s but higher clocked ones and a higher clocked GPU period including other common elements like geometry engine, triangle setup / rasteriser units, etc…). At some point hitting on things were resolution scaling will drag you down a lot and differences in RAM will too (or the XSX version will have to be designed around the XSS one and scaled up which would also not be ideal).
 

sinnergy

Member
Both systems came out days within each other with the same CPU and GPU made by the same manufacturer. There was never going to be significant differences between the platforms especially when 3rd parties prefer parity.

Big thing is the XSS doing a fantastic job on this demo when many declared if it would be canceled soon after releasing, predicted its complete failure, and even stated the X1X and PS4 Pro were more powerful. To see it running this demo with raytracing for only $300 is quite impressive. And it's only one year into the generation. Devs will only get more familiar with the hardware going forward.
GAF predicted Switch failure . …
 

DarkMage619

Report me if I continue to console war
It is impressive yes. Yet what you can achieve when you add only $99 more is apparently superfluous/not worth taking a look at (at least you stopped with the $299 vs $400 very perceptually misleading price comparisons).
I'm pretty sure the price of the XSS was accurate so not sure what you are getting at. I've been very direct that I think the $400 console option is not only not readily available but also a pretty poor value overall seeing how you are forced to purchase all of your digital games from one sole source. The $100 you 'save' is almost immediately lost as soon as you buy one premium game. For the same $400 budget on the XSS you can actually get games or a service or both. This of course has nothing to do with the discussion of the Matrix demo though so I'd save it for a thread that is actually about the value proposition of the various platforms.

They will also get familiar with the XSX more and flex its compute advantage at 1080p (not just more CU’s but higher clocked ones and a higher clocked GPU period including other common elements like geometry engine, triangle setup / rasteriser units, etc…). At some point hitting on things were resolution scaling will drag you down a lot and differences in RAM will too (or the XSX version will have to be designed around the XSS one and scaled up which would also not be ideal).
Not sure why developers would be targeting 1080p on the 4K console. Aside from that the memory saving features like SFS and VA haven't been used on the Series console yet. There is a reason those features were included on the consoles. I highly doubt any developer will code a game around 1080p textures and try and upscale them to higher resolutions. The results would look pretty poor. I'm certain MS' engineers and developers are more than willing to assist any studio in getting the maximum performance out of their systems. The Coalition already assisted Epic here and their efforts even helped the PS5 version too. MS knows what they are doing.

GAF predicted Switch failure . …
Exactly. I'd trust MS when it comes to the Series consoles and what is possible on them over some GAFers who in most cases don't own an Xbox at all.
 

Panajev2001a

GAF's Pleasant Genius
I'm pretty sure the price of the XSS was accurate so not sure what you are getting at.
All the times where it was quoted as XSS $299 vs PS5 DE $400 (perceptual $2xx vs $4xxx trick), but let’s pretend it never happened till the next time it never happened again eh ;)?

I've been very direct that I think the $400 console option is not only not readily available but also a pretty poor value overall seeing how you are forced to purchase all of your digital games from one sole source. The $100 you 'save' is almost immediately lost as soon as you buy one premium game. For the same $400 budget on the XSS you can actually get games or a service or both. This of course has nothing to do with the discussion of the Matrix demo though so I'd save it for a thread that is actually about the value proposition of the various platforms.

“Value proposition of HW+games has nothing to do with this discussion, so I will spend an entire paragraph arguing it”. Interesting choice (wrong conclusions still IMHO, but interesting) ;).

If the performance of this demo is even more impressive because of the HW price (I.e.: a chance to plug the XSS) then it stands to reason the much higher quality you get for $99 more would impress you a lot to… curiously it does not…
 
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MonarchJT

Banned
It is impressive yes. Yet what you can achieve when you add only $99 more is apparently superfluous/not worth taking a look at (at least you stopped with the $299 vs $400 very perceptually misleading price comparisons).


They will also get familiar with the XSX more and flex its compute advantage at 1080p (not just more CU’s but higher clocked ones and a higher clocked GPU period including other common elements like geometry engine, triangle setup / rasteriser units, etc…). At some point hitting on things were resolution scaling will drag you down a lot and differences in RAM will too (or the XSX version will have to be designed around the XSS one and scaled up which would also not be ideal).
the hardware cost itself doesn't mean much...the 299 euro (269 during this holiday in Italy) was made with the added gamepass value in mind....look is very simple you need something like 500 euro to take home a PS5 with no disc and a ps5 digital version of one (1) of their top first party game .....with 270 euro you take home halo infinite ..forza horizon 5, Flight Sim, psychonauts 2, fifa etc etc and all the other hundreds of games. Cmon now basically the half to have lots more.
 
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Riky

My little VRR pleasure pearl goes vrrrooommm.
everything in the video is generated by the same bug.....ktg is a Sony fanboy and continuing to talk about his videos is an insult to intelligence. And it's the same reason you were told not to take it into consideration from the start

Should be a banned source after this.

Good to see XSS doing something not actually possible on last gen consoles with this demo, show MS were right to ditch One X and build a new entry point console with a next gen feature set.
 

Shmunter

Member
everything in the video is generated by the same bug.....ktg is a Sony fanboy and continuing to talk about his videos is an insult to intelligence. And it's the same reason you were told not to take it into consideration from the start
Considering others saw the issues and it took investigation by members here on what is going on I think you need to appreciate that not everyone was aware of this prior - including ktg.

His video was very useful to instigate the investigation and subsequent findings. Where as you would have buried your head in the sand proclaiming all is well despite having it in front of your eyes - Fanboy did you say. (Spiderman pointing.gif)

Where is the conclusion all issues are remedied by running the demo from the beginning? - I missed it.
 
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Darsxx82

Member
Where is the conclusion all issues are remedied by running the demo from the beginning? - I missed it.
The conclusion comes with the certainty from testing personally each and every one of the situations shown in the KTG video in XSX and proving that they do not exist. It is as simple as checking it out for yourself and appreciating that both the black noise on indoor objets in buildings, popping of these when move the camera away and the flickering of reflections are part of the same bug.

I would make a video but it is a lot of work just to "convince" to certain people. Maybe Fredrik Fredrik can make a new video showing all the others.

P.S. Nobody can know / test if he knew about the bug before making the video. But we do appreciate that, even though he already knows that it is a bug, he has not made any statement or new video confirming it and that says everything about what his interest is.

Knowing his history and obsession against Xbox, no one should have any doubt that he has already tested this bug and has spent several hours checking if what is shown in his video is solved by restarting the demo. That, of course, if we all accept that he did not know previously🤔😏
 

MonarchJT

Banned
Considering others saw the issues and it took investigation by members here on what is going on I think you need to appreciate that not everyone was aware of this prior - including ktg.

His video was very useful to instigate the investigation and subsequent findings. Where as you would have buried your head in the sand proclaiming all is well despite having it in front of your eyes - Fanboy did you say. (Spiderman pointing.gif)

Where is the conclusion all issues are remedied by running the demo from the beginning? - I missed it.
users here just lose time proving again and again that ktg clown is a Sony fanboy. And the saddest (or hilarious) thing is that usual suspects were already celebrating trying to find hw deficit on why the Xbox version suffer from this bug (software). Let's close the ktg topic is 'sad enough to mention him all these times.
 
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DarkMage619

Report me if I continue to console war
All the times where it was quoted as XSS $299 vs PS5 DE $400 (perceptual $2xx vs $4xxx trick), but let’s pretend it never happened till the next time it never happened again eh ;)?
Again unless I have misquoted the price I fail to see the point you are making. I did see you say $4xxx. Did I claim the PS5 DE is $4000? If so that is clearly a typo. It's a worse value but not THAT much worse. 🙂 There is no trick the XSS is a far better value than any other console.
“Value proposition of HW+games has nothing to do with this discussion, so I will spend an entire paragraph arguing it”. Interesting choice (wrong conclusions still IMHO, but interesting) ;).
You brought it up. I addressed your point. You've have been pretty clear that your desire for the digital XSX has nothing to do with what MS' goals are or even what gives gamers easier access or value. If that's the case I wonder why you'd stop at a digital $400 XSX. Why not a disc XSX at $400 or even less? Skies the limit since we aren't dealing with reality.

My conclusions are based on what MS desires in the console space. I happen to agree with the goal of getting more people into the ecosystem over winning console spec war debates on forums. You disagree and I respect that.
If the performance of this demo is even more impressive because of the HW price (I.e.: a chance to plug the XSS) then it stands to reason the much higher quality you get for $99 more would impress you a lot to… curiously it does not…
The demo is free. Digital games on PS5 DE are the complete opposite of that. I think the normal disc PS5 is a far better value seeing how I am not captive to a single source for games. I can buy used titles, go to eBay or just about any other retailer. Why would I be impressed by a monopoly? It certainly doesn't benefit me as a consumer. There is nothing curious about that at all.

The demo is impressive on the XSS because for one many here doubted the system is capable of of many of the things it continues to do. I have not seen any PC or other devices that can produce similar performance for the price. Paying more money for more performance isn't really an accomplishment. Getting more performance for less is. The XSS is cheaper than the Switch but the power differences are quite stark. Curiously you aren't impressed by that...
 

onQ123

Member
Should be a banned source after this.

Good to see XSS doing something not actually possible on last gen consoles with this demo, show MS were right to ditch One X and build a new entry point console with a next gen feature set.

I'm pretty sure this demo could be done on Xbox One X with a few changes they ran the Book of The Dead demo on PS4 Pro a few years ago

 

DarkMage619

Report me if I continue to console war
I'm pretty sure this demo could be done on Xbox One X with a few changes they ran the Book of The Dead demo on PS4 Pro a few years ago

I didn't notice any raytracing in that forest demo. I highly doubt the matrix demo would run on any last generation consoles without removing graphical effects that add significantly to the presentation.
 

Riky

My little VRR pleasure pearl goes vrrrooommm.
I'm pretty sure this demo could be done on Xbox One X with a few changes they ran the Book of The Dead demo on PS4 Pro a few years ago


They would have to fall back to software Lumen for starters and I can only imagine what that would do to the framerate that can already plunge, then the CPU side of things as well. I doubt they could get anywhere near Series S performance.
 
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Riky

My little VRR pleasure pearl goes vrrrooommm.
"
it’s still fundamentally able to deliver the same core experience on a box that costs significantly less than the more powerful Xbox Series X and PS5.

The Matrix Awakens demo is yet another example that good things do come in small packages, and it serves as irrefutable proof, if more were needed, that the Xbox Series S is clearly a next-gen console."


Good to see the press picking up now on how capable this machine is.
 

Panajev2001a

GAF's Pleasant Genius
"
it’s still fundamentally able to deliver the same core experience on a box that costs significantly less than the more powerful Xbox Series X and PS5.

The Matrix Awakens demo is yet another example that good things do come in small packages, and it serves as irrefutable proof, if more were needed, that the Xbox Series S is clearly a next-gen console."


Good to see the press picking up now on how capable this machine is.
Significantly less compared to XSX, maybe… significantly against PS5 DE? Touched quite a bit of the talking points sure, individually some are alright. This demo runs on XSS and it is an impressive demo, that is undeniable, article still reads like a promo 🤷‍♂️.
 

adamsapple

Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Stop what? UE5 is a scalable engine they can make changes to get it running on One X

This is true. With enough scalability and cut-backs they can get a version of this running on any platform that supports UE5. Even Switch.

Will it look and feel like *this* demo ? most likely not. But a version of it will still run on those hardware.
 

DarkMage619

Report me if I continue to console war
Significantly less compared to XSX, maybe… significantly against PS5 DE? Touched quite a bit of the talking points sure, individually some are alright. This demo runs on XSS and it is an impressive demo, that is undeniable, article still reads like a promo 🤷‍♂️.
Certainly significant enough price difference to actually get games with the console even compared to the unicorn that is the PS5 DE. 😉 Speaking of talking points pretty much anyone that says something positive about the Xbox get accused of paid promotion. It couldn't be that a system that's cheaper than a Switch is pushing effects you couldn't get on any other platform for this price point could it? Nah! MS paid em off! It's a bit of a lazy accusation at this point.
 

Panajev2001a

GAF's Pleasant Genius
Certainly significant enough price difference to actually get games with the console even compared to the unicorn that is the PS5 DE. 😉 Speaking of talking points pretty much anyone that says something positive about the Xbox get accused of paid promotion. It couldn't be that a system that's cheaper than a Switch is pushing effects you couldn't get on any other platform for this price point could it? Nah! MS paid em off! It's a bit of a lazy accusation at this point.

I did not say it was paid, it sounded like a collection of talking points (nice deflection on the PS5 DE right there) like some threads here. Amusing how now you call in the Switch as a comparison of price : performance ratio :LOL:.
 
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MonarchJT

Banned
Significantly less compared to XSX, maybe… significantly against PS5 DE? Touched quite a bit of the talking points sure, individually some are alright. This demo runs on XSS and it is an impressive demo, that is undeniable, article still reads like a promo 🤷‍♂️.
and again, when buy a console I don't think it's just the price of the hw that comes into play. add two First party games to the PS5 Digital and you'll instantly get to 550 euro ... with the s under this holiday with 269+1 euro you would get the series s paired with hundreds of games.. practically spend the half and receive more (taking into account that those who buy the series s are not interested in 4k or maximum performance)
 
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DarkMage619

Report me if I continue to console war
I did not say it was paid, it sounded like a collection of talking points (nice deflection on the PS5 DE right there) like some threads here. Amusing how now you call in the Switch as a comparison of price : performance ratio :LOL:.
Amusing how you deny it. Nintendo is a major player in the console space like it or not. Last I checked YOU brought up the PS5 DE in an attempt to deflect from a positive Xbox article. Non paid 'promotion' doesn't really make any sense does it? I suppose it could be that the author was genuinely impressed by the tech you can get for $300. 🤔
 
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