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[bitbydeath]

Obviously it shouldn't be anywhere near single player games, or even MP games that you pay full price for, and there definitely shouldn't be any pay to win involved.
But otherwise GaaS games, or having other people pay to keep the game, not just up and running but also updated on a continual basis is truely the best thing for multiplayer games.

No longer do we need to keep replaying the same 2-8 maps until the next entry arrives, or even having to stare at the same goofy faces each match.
GaaS if you think about it, is all about having the whales pay your way, and we as gamers should learn to embrace it.

I would kill, in a game of Warhawk to have it return, and GaaS could give it a bright future. New maps, rotating weapons, more vehicles, without having to pay ludicrous prices, or any prices.
A lot of other defunct MP games could also benefit from other gamers money.
Socom, Warhawk, Killzone, even Motorstorm could work with the dangers being changed up frequently.

GaaS gets a bad rap, because gamers are looking at it all wrong.

 

[GametimeUK]

Gaas isn't necessarily bad, but I just don't think many games use the service aspect to its advantage.

However, I do kind of miss a simple online game where we don't get DLC and a bunch of updates etc. We just play for the love of the game. It seems everyone needs new xp bars, new trinkets, new skins and unlocks etc... but I kind of miss it when the reward was getting good at a game and just e joking what was there.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Don't you see the industry is imploding?

GaaS/Live games/and GaaP have a very strong incentive to implement predatory and shady tactics for the player to feel FOMO, to keep them hooked.....is drugs, is gambling/casino bullshit.
is a necessary evil, unfortunately.
 

 

[Alexios]

Good.

Great post-release support, updates, content, mod SDK, etc., happened organically to keep games fit for it relevant & selling before companies made up a term to promise grand support & longevity even though they don't know how to make a good game or support it & just nickel & dime users.

 

[Meicyn]

I still play Division 2, and content support is ramping up. Game is great. Will probably keep playing it until Division 3 hits.

There’s a sea of shit GAAS, but there’s a sea of shit single player titles as well. There isn’t a single GAAS title as bad as the Gollum game, but hey.

 

[FoxMcChief]

I don’t mind them so much. I play Fortnite still. Last night was the first time I played a game not called Starfield, and it was Fortnite.

 

[Del_X]

GaaS is fine.

Diverting talent geared toward Single Player AAA stuff to chase the multi-billion dollar bobble is not. AAA single player games sell well when they’re good because they resonate with people who can actually afford to buy these games new (30-55 year-olds) but can’t afford the time commitment to grind (16-30 year olds).

 

[Wildebeest]

Some earlier GaaS were actually good because they were made by good devs looking for a way to stay in business without having to deal with the horrendous practices of traditional game publishers. Some actual old-fashioned passion went into them. But when you have the GaaS games made those same old horrendous publishers who just see more money and more growth, there is just salted earth.

 

[rofif]

Studios before GAAS - let's make new game ever year, maybe every 2 years. Ship it complete. Let's be creative.
Studios after GAAS - let's make one game every 10 years, let's put everything we have on it. Ship it incomplete. Let's copy fortnite or someone else

 

[aclar00]

I havent really played an online multiplayer, let alone GaaS title since like Modern Warfare on PS3...take that back, SF4 on and off for years. Before those it was SOCOM II. For the most part ive moved on from multiplayer in general, except for a good co-op.

I guess it works for many people, but somehow i like being tricked sort of speak, with a sequaled release instead of gradual updates. If it's just continual updates i feel like it would be boring and actually not fresh, even though the content may be the same as that of a sequal.

It's like gradually seeing an extremely overweight person losing weight on a day-to-day basis....its just not the same as randomly seeing them 6 months later and being like "holy shit you loss a ton of weight". The dramatic effect of the sudden weight loss (in your eyes) just makes it pop.

 

[Elder Legend]

I am one of those people that likes GaaS games. However, the issue is that majority of those types of games are

1 - Not very good quality
2 - Worry too much about squeezing every dollar possible
3 - Bad content cadence/support

There are very few titles that are able to keep up while maintaining good quality. Here are some of those games that I believe have good GaaS models in no particular order or ranking.

1 - Sea of Thieves
2 - Warframe
3 - Apex Legends
4 - Final Fantasy 14

5 - World of Warcraft (last few years were bumpy, but Dragonflight has been amazing and WoW has a bigger dev team now and the content is more frequent and worth it. I've been very satisfied with every new season.

I would normally include Destiny 2 but it has fallen quite down and its very expensive. Destiny 2 was very good during its early days but the last expansion was terrible.

Diablo 4 also started and the game itself is good but the balance and the handling of Season 1 was very poor, so I'll wait and see how Season 2 goes. It does have good potential though.

Gears 5 was also really solid for the time I've played, but I believe they've moved on to Gears 6 and I am not sure what the new structure will be. But I wouldn't be surprised if it goes full GaaS route.

Any time there is annew GaaS it usually fails miserably because it's very hard to compete. Most people also don't have the time to dedicate too multiple games like these. All of them eat up a bunch of time and you have to pick and choose your battles that appeal to you the most. That is another issue.

 

[Comandr]

Don't you see the industry is imploding?

GaaS/Live games/and GaaP have a very strong incentive to implement predatory and shady tactics for the player to feel FOMO, to keep them hooked.....is drugs, is gambling/casino bullshit.
is a necessary evil, unfortunately.
 

It’s this. GaaS aren’t inherently evil, in fact, they can be very good. MMOs are some of the earliest examples of GaaS. But $15 bucks a month got you unlimited content with no restrictions. That’s the difference.

The problem is the predatory practices designed to elicit FOMO with limited time bonuses, skins, time savers, etc. the nature of humanity is to compete. Someone always wants to be better or have more of something than someone else. And if you can BUY that advantage…

Predating on these instincts is what make the practice inherently malicious. It’s by design; but you can’t quit because you’ve been tricked into believing you don’t want to.

As long as publishers and principle monetization designers push to find new inventive ways to sink their hooks into the entire system will be a blight. Sadly there’s no closing Pandora’s box.

 

[Honey Bunny]

Yeh cos its releasing unfinished games spun as a business model.

 

[Danny Dudekisser]

Theory and practical realities are two very different things.

 

[Metnut]

Serial killers get a bad rap too.

 

[Faust]

Obviously it shouldn't be anywhere near single player games, or even MP games that you pay full price for, and there definitely shouldn't be any pay to win involved.
But otherwise GaaS games, or having other people pay to keep the game, not just up and running but also updated on a continual basis is truely the best thing for multiplayer games.

No longer do we need to keep replaying the same 2-8 maps until the next entry arrives, or even having to stare at the same goofy faces each match.
GaaS if you think about it, is all about having the whales pay your way, and we as gamers should learn to embrace it.

I would kill, in a game of Warhawk to have it return, and GaaS could give it a bright future. New maps, rotating weapons, more vehicles, without having to pay ludicrous prices, or any prices.
A lot of other defunct MP games could also benefit from other gamers money.
Socom, Warhawk, Killzone, even Motorstorm could work with the dangers being changed up frequently.

GaaS gets a bad rap, because gamers are looking at it all wrong.

20 years ago I played Quake 3 and Unreal Tournament. I had a few maps at first, then it grew. Modders created more maps, new game modes, all for free.

15 years ago I was playing Team Fortress 2 and Counter-Strike: Source and the same thing occured. New modes, new maps, new skins, models, etc. All for free. Not a single dime to be paid outside of the purchase of the game.

GAAS (in it's current iteration*) is greed, pure and simple.

 

[Loxus]

Gaas aren't bad at all, it keeps players in the game.

PS Home probably is a good example of gaas done right.

Sports games should be gaas by default, and without the yearly releases.

Multi-player games should also have some form of gaas to keep them alive.
Look at GTA Online vs Red Dead Online for example.
Lack of gaas content killed Red Dead Online. While GTA Online gaas content is the reason it's still in the top 10 game sales after 10 years.

 

[German Hops]

We should start a gaas-roots movement.

 

[diffusionx]

An industry dominated by GAAShit is not sustainable. Why is this, because the vast majority of people can only play one of them, and they will play what is already popular. It's going to take a lot to move you, and you're already going to be feeling FOMO, and like you are starting from scratch. Better to keep playing what you are already playing. So when you launch a new one, you're basically trying to either get people who are not playing a GAAS game to play one (risky), or get them to switch from what they are playing already (extremely risky). The most likely option is yoru game doesnt make enough money and folds.

We've seen this before. After World of Warcraft blew up, tons of studios tried to throw their hat in the ring, and they all failed, and the companies went out of business.

 

[Elder Legend]

20 years ago I played Quake 3 and Unreal Tournament. I had a few maps at first, then it grew. Modders created more maps, new game modes, all for free.

15 years ago I was playing Team Fortress 2 and Counter-Strike: Source and the same thing occured. New modes, new maps, new skins, models, etc. All for free. Not a single dime to be paid outside of the purchase of the game.

GAAS (in it's current iteration*) is greed, pure and simple.

Yes and no. It depends on the developer and publishers. Titles such as Sea of Thieves, Grounded, , No Man's Sky and Warframe provide amazing content updates of high quality and at 0 cost. The only things you pay for if you wish is a battle pass sith cosmetics or individual items. I've spent some money on SoT when I used to play it religiously cause I wanted to support and I had 0 regrets because the time I put in already and the amount of fun I had was unmatched compared to a regular $60 or $70 experience at that point. It's all about what you find value in for your time spent and how much fun you had.

But yes, there are plenty of titles as well with horrific predatory practices that I tend to stay away from. I used to really like Hearthstone, but releasing 3 expansions once a year to keep up competitively and spending $80 for the card packs every time just gotten way too greedy for me and not worth it when a new expansion comes out every 4 months.

 

[Bumblebeetuna]

GaaS done right is amazing. It’s the best way for games to exist imho. The problem is a lot of publishers have the devs shoehorn it into their games and it greatly affects quality and longevity.

 

[Elder Legend]

GaaS done right is amazing. It’s the best way for games to exist imho. The problem is a lot of publishers have the devs shoehorn it into their games and it greatly affects quality and longevity.

Another issue is that the business suits who handle final decisions have never touched a controller in their life and want only the fastest way possible to the dollar. Because of this, a lot of games end up with shitty designs where a game encourages you to spend money than actually being a fun game which what makes people stay and play for a long time. The idiots are too focused on short term game instead of a long term commitment.

 

[ByWatterson]

Can we just start calling it "GAS," or Games As Services?

That second "A" drives me nuts man.

 

[Elder Legend]

Can we just start calling it "GAS," or Games As Services?

That second "A" drives me nuts man.

No, because that is grammatically incorrect and makes no sense in the English language.

 

[A.Romero]

20 years ago I played Quake 3 and Unreal Tournament. I had a few maps at first, then it grew. Modders created more maps, new game modes, all for free.

15 years ago I was playing Team Fortress 2 and Counter-Strike: Source and the same thing occured. New modes, new maps, new skins, models, etc. All for free. Not a single dime to be paid outside of the purchase of the game.

GAAS (in it's current iteration*) is greed, pure and simple.

Ironically I'd say Team Fortress and Counter-Strike are the ones that truly showed the financial appeal of GAAS.

Personally I think there are good ways to do it (Like Magic Arena) and wrong ways to do it (Like Gatcha games).

 

[ShadyAcshuns]

Fuck, no they don't, they're trash. I was addicted to one for several years and instead of playing actual good games I was stuck in a hamster wheel that never went anywhere.

 

[Guilty_AI]

Can we just start calling it "GAS," or Games As Services?

GAS GAS GAS

Spoiler

 

[Guilty_AI]

GaaS gets a bad rap, because gamers are looking at it all wrong.

It gets a bad rap because publishers and developers do a terrible job utilizing the format. Either by abusing monetization systems or just through sheer incompetence. It can bring in a lot of money, which is why it attracts the worst characters of the industry that will certainly abuse it, until the bubble bursts.

Thats said, its 100% possible to make a gaas model that is both sustainable and respects the player, or even appeals to traditional players.

 

[bitbydeath]

Studios before GAAS - let's make new game ever year, maybe every 2 years. Ship it complete. Let's be creative.
Studios after GAAS - let's make one game every 10 years, let's put everything we have on it. Ship it incomplete. Let's copy fortnite or someone else

With games taking longer to make now, the second option would be more attractive, no?

 

[bitbydeath]

I am one of those people that likes GaaS games. However, the issue is that majority of those types of games are

1 - Not very good quality
2 - Worry too much about squeezing every dollar possible
3 - Bad content cadence/support

There are very few titles that are able to keep up while maintaining good quality. Here are some of those games that I believe have good GaaS models in no particular order or ranking.

1 - Sea of Thieves
2 - Warframe
3 - Apex Legends
4 - Final Fantasy 14

5 - World of Warcraft (last few years were bumpy, but Dragonflight has been amazing and WoW has a bigger dev team now and the content is more frequent and worth it. I've been very satisfied with every new season.

I would normally include Destiny 2 but it has fallen quite down and its very expensive. Destiny 2 was very good during its early days but the last expansion was terrible.

Diablo 4 also started and the game itself is good but the balance and the handling of Season 1 was very poor, so I'll wait and see how Season 2 goes. It does have good potential though.

Gears 5 was also really solid for the time I've played, but I believe they've moved on to Gears 6 and I am not sure what the new structure will be. But I wouldn't be surprised if it goes full GaaS route.

Any time there is annew GaaS it usually fails miserably because it's very hard to compete. Most people also don't have the time to dedicate too multiple games like these. All of them eat up a bunch of time and you have to pick and choose your battles that appeal to you the most. That is another issue.

They do usually fail, but I think that lends to the practices they put in their game and not necessarily because it is outright a GaaS title.
If they build it correctly, there is serious money to be made and players won't be abused.

 

[bitbydeath]

Yeh cos its releasing unfinished games spun as a business model.

If we're just talking MP games, then they will never be finished.
That's the point of the model.
Unfinished SP games however is just bad business.

 

[RoboFu]

But seriously people will complain night and day but as soon as their favorite devs start scaling back to make games cheaper they will be the first to cry.

 

[bitbydeath]

20 years ago I played Quake 3 and Unreal Tournament. I had a few maps at first, then it grew. Modders created more maps, new game modes, all for free.

15 years ago I was playing Team Fortress 2 and Counter-Strike: Source and the same thing occured. New modes, new maps, new skins, models, etc. All for free. Not a single dime to be paid outside of the purchase of the game.

GAAS (in it's current iteration*) is greed, pure and simple.

While you are right, and I had played a ton of modded Doom and Duke Nukem games, they were created by gamers in their spare time, and not by devs whom dedicate all of their time and rely on payment to feed their families.
It can be greed if done wrong, but Fortnite as an example, one of the largest (if not the largest GaaS game out there) doesn't force anything on the player and provides no additional gameplay improvements to those who do spend money.

 

[Faust]

While you are right, and I had played a ton of modded Doom and Duke Nukem games, they were created by gamers in their spare time, and not by devs whom dedicate all of their time and rely on payment to feed their families.
It can be greed if done wrong, but Fortnite as an example, one of the largest (if not the largest GaaS game out there) doesn't force anything on the player and provides no additional gameplay improvements to those who do spend money.

I would rather spend 60 dollars on a game and rely on a community to update the game with new content than the nickle and dimeing that games like Fortnight provides.

 

[bitbydeath]

An industry dominated by GAAShit is not sustainable. Why is this, because the vast majority of people can only play one of them, and they will play what is already popular. It's going to take a lot to move you, and you're already going to be feeling FOMO, and like you are starting from scratch. Better to keep playing what you are already playing. So when you launch a new one, you're basically trying to either get people who are not playing a GAAS game to play one (risky), or get them to switch from what they are playing already (extremely risky). The most likely option is yoru game doesnt make enough money and folds.

We've seen this before. After World of Warcraft blew up, tons of studios tried to throw their hat in the ring, and they all failed, and the companies went out of business.

I agree, nobody wants that.
I'm more of an SP gamer, but I would like to see more variety in MP which I think has become rather stale over the years.

 

[bitbydeath]

Can we just start calling it "GAS," or Games As Services?

That second "A" drives me nuts man.

I agree in principle, but it'd probably get confusing.

 

[ByWatterson]

I agree in principle, but it'd probably get confusing.

No way dude.

It'd be a GAS.

 

[Pelta88]

No.

Releasing mediocre games that you plan to fix with updates get a bad rap. Also the narrative of "Game X is utter trash but I got it for cheap on a service." Gets a bad rap because it inevitably leads to paid astroturfing and shilling for piss poor games and the accompanying service.

 

[bitbydeath]

I would rather spend 60 dollars on a game and rely on a community to update the game with new content than the nickle and dimeing that games like Fortnight provides.

Works well on PC, consoles however...

 

[Faust]

Works well on PC, consoles however...

For Consoles, I miss the days of map packs. I would much rather pay 60 dollars for Halo Reach and 15 dollars for 4 maps than a "free" MP release with 95% of its content locked behind grind walls and MTX.

 

[Elder Legend]

I would rather spend 60 dollars on a game and rely on a community to update the game with new content than the nickle and dimeing that games like Fortnight provides.

How does Fortnite nickle and dime you? The whole game is F2P and there are 0 advantages to the battle pass. Plus, their skins are amazing. No one is pointing a gun to anyone's head to purchase them. The games that nickle and dime you are the shtty mobile titles that force you to watch ads after every move that you make.

Fortnite gets so much hate for no good reason. Absolutely saddening.

 

[[Sigma]]

For Consoles, I miss the days of map packs. I would much rather pay 60 dollars for Halo Reach and 15 dollars for 4 maps than a "free" MP release with 95% of its content locked behind grind walls and MTX.

This has been my stance for years once I seen how the GAAS was played by a lot of the devs/publishers. You can't just get me on the F2P and maps will be free ride anymore.

 

[Faust]

This has been my stance for years once I seen how the GAAS was played. You can't just get me on the F2P and maps will be free ride anymore.

Exactly.

We get less game immediately, nearly half if not a quarter of what we got in the 7th gen. Unique cosmetics? Unlockables? That used to all be free with the purchase of the game. Now they are removed, sold for absurd prices and defenders will often cite that this is how they pay for new content. There is no logical sense to this claim. We get less content with the promise that their may be more content over the course of a few years (most of said content being locked behind further MTX).

 

[AJUMP23]

I hate GAAS. It is just there to suck more money out of a player. That is why they switched to the business model they earn more.

 

[Sojiro]

I would say it's earned the reputation it has. The few that do GaaS without completely bending over the player are far far fewer than the fucking sea of ones that are predatory as fuck.

For Consoles, I miss the days of map packs. I would much rather pay 60 dollars for Halo Reach and 15 dollars for 4 maps than a "free" MP release with 95% of its content locked behind grind walls and MTX.

Absolutely agreed.

 

[Kataploom]

Gaas isn't necessarily bad, but I just don't think many games use the service aspect to its advantage.

However, I do kind of miss a simple online game where we don't get DLC and a bunch of updates etc. We just play for the love of the game. It seems everyone needs new xp bars, new trinkets, new skins and unlocks etc... but I kind of miss it when the reward was getting good at a game and just e joking what was there.

Say that but whenever a game doesn't update each 2 weeks with new content, even if the game loop is the same and great which is expected in an eSports type of game, many people start complaining and leaving the game... like why do I need more modes or different content and shit in Halo infinite if I'm happy with the game as it is? Say whatever about it but the core loop is great and kinda addictive, yet again I don't see what else people asks for it, it's pretty good already in my book. I actually hate some of the latest modes they added.

Paladins is a game I play consistently, people started complaining about not different content and shit, then they added daily quests with different roles etc and people started trolling matches by picking whatever In order to do the quests instead of actually picking the lacking time and playing the fucking game. But they were happy.

Let's assume that the problem with a more simple approach is people asking for variety for the sake of it or they'll move on.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

 

[KXVXII9X]

I do not like G.A.A.S games, I do not like them Bitbydeath.

I would not play them smoking meth, I would not like them if my name was Beth.

I do not like those pesky games; I do not like them Bitbydeath.

 

[bitbydeath]

How does Fortnite nickle and dime you? The whole game is F2P and there are 0 advantages to the battle pass. Plus, their skins are amazing. No one is pointing a gun to anyone's head to purchase them. The games that nickle and dime you are the shtty mobile titles that force you to watch ads after every move that you make.

Fortnite gets so much hate for no good reason. Absolutely saddening.

Agreed. Fortnite does it best which is likely why they’re so popular.

 

[Danjin44]

I personally never had and never will like GaaS games but with that being said they can exist and I will ignore it like I did sports games as long as they stay the fuck away from SP games.