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Gamasutra Opinion: "2009 - The Last Days of the Japanese RPG?"

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
Gamasutra has posted up a new opinion piece entitled "2009 - The Last Days of the Japanese RPG?" in which they talk about the decline of the JRPG.

I'm not sure I agree with this article, but I thought it would be interesting to talk about.

I'd suggest checking out the article at their actual site, as reading it here will cause it to look like a giant wall of text. However, for anyone who can't access Gamasutra at work, I've quote it here as well.

Article Link: http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/26637/Opinion_2009__The_Last_Days_of_the_Japanese_RPG.php

Gamasutra said:
Opinion: 2009 - The Last Days of the Japanese RPG?
by Jeffrey Fleming

[Where have the vital Japanese role-playing games gone? If 2009 was a bad year for the game industry, it was even worse for the heart-sick JRPG fan. Game Developer magazine's production editor - and committed JRPG scholar - Jeff Fleming looks back at the past year of Japanese RPG releases in North America, and finds troubling signs of a genre in decline.]

The post-PlayStation 2 era has not been kind to the Japanese role-playing game. At the start of the decade it was easy to imagine Japanese RPGs taking over the world. Titles like Final Fantasy X and XII, Shin Megami Tensei: Nocturne, Xenosaga, Shenmue, Shadow Hearts, Skies of Arcadia, Legend of Zelda: Wind Waker, and Phantasy Star Online were just some of the highlights of time when another new JRPG was added to the stack faster than we could play them.

But as console hardware transitioned, JRPGs began to drift into the background. Some might say that no one except the hard-core aficionado is very interested in them any more. Sure, there are a few exceptions. Final Fantasy XIII will sell like crazy. Western-developed RPGs like Dragon Age and Fallout 3 are doing very well. However, the unique style of Japanese developed RPGs is in distinct abeyance.

But what makes a Japanese RPG different and worth preserving? Beside the obvious points that they are made by Japanese people and generally have something to do with magic and dragons, they can be tricky to define in concrete terms.

Linear narrative, turn-based combat, anime-style art direction are all good points of reference. Perhaps more than any other mechanical aspect, the defining characteristic of Japanese role-playing games is their unapologetic sentimentality. Feelings of nostalgia, wistfulness, and longing are the emotional currency of Japanese RPGs. Emotions that I struggle to conjure, as I look across the JRPG landscape in these last days of 2009.

Senescent Paedomorphosis

Nintendo's DS handheld has been the platform of choice for the bulk of this year's new JRPG releases, and it is this fact that I find most troubling. What was once a grand adventure of color and sound has shrunk down to a three-inch screen. This is what we have to sustain us.

Atlus published some of the best JRPGs of the year and their SMT: Devil Survivor for the DS was a terrific entry in the long running Shin Megami Tensei series. The publisher also brought over experimental titles to the DS such as The Dark Spire and Knights in the Nightmare that were less successful, but welcomed for their unique art direction that dared to step away from anime stereotypes.

Square-Enix brought a few original titles to the DS including one of tri-Ace's better efforts -- Valkyrie Profile: Covenant of the Plume. The game deviated from the side-scrolling action/RPG play that the Valkyrie Profile series is known for, and instead presented itself as a tactical RPG. Although Covenant of the Plume stayed closed to genre conventions, its somber storyline was given extra weight thanks to a smart translation from Alexander O. Smith. For those who like spiky haired teens and Disney characters, Kingdom Hearts 358/2 Days was money in the bank for Tetsuya Nomura.

While not strictly a RPG (although it does contain a fully realized out Dragon Quest clone called Guadia Quest), indieszero's Retro Game Challenge was one of the year's best games. However, like so many games, the high critical praise it received in the press totally failed to translate into strong sales.

NIS America brought the kid-oriented titles A Witch's Tale and Atelier Annie: Alchemists of Sera Island to the DS. Sega revisited Ragol with Phantasy Star 0 and Nintendo gave us another finely polished Zelda game in The Legend of Zelda: Spirit Tracks. Media. Vision, the creators of Wild Arms tried something different with The Wizard of Oz: Beyond the Yellow Brick Road but it was a hard sell, straddling the line uncomfortably between children's game and role-playing. Based just on its name, Nostalgia from Red Entertainment and Matrix had a lot of expectations to live up to. Unfortunately, it didn't quite hit the emotional mark that its title inspired.

Despite having been extremely popular, I suspect that the market for the DS is quietly eroding. The hardware will soon be in its fourth revision and there is no stated plan for what comes next from Nintendo. A quick look around on local public transportation will show that most Americans are far more likely to be fondling a cell device or an iPhone/iPod during their idle moments than a Nintendo DS.

Once the generous slate of announced DS games for 2010 clears the deck, it will probably be apparent that many of the developers who had previously been focused on the aging handheld will have already left the party. But where will they have gone?

PSPooped

Despite having the highest technical specs for a handheld, Sony's PSP continues to be under-utilized as a platform for RPGs. Marvelous Entertainment's Half-Minute Hero was one of the more interesting games of the year with its sly deconstruction of JRPG tropes -- but other PSP titles seemed less compelling. NIS America gave us two PlayStation 2 ports in Mana Khemia: Student Alliance and Disgaea 2: Dark Hero Days.

Square-Enix dropped Dissidia Final Fantasy in our laps, which was about as welcome as Ehrgeiz was back in the day. Capcom had some success with Monster Hunter Freedom Unite, but the series has yet to really capture the North American imagination the way it has the Japanese. Sega kept trying with Phantasy Star Portable, a game that attempts to emulate Monster Hunter, which is itself inspired by Phantasy Star Online. Atlus published Class of Heroes but most buyers played hooky.

Wiither Thou?

It could be argued that Nintendo has done more than any other company to bring the Japanese RPG to worldwide attention. Nintendo hardware has been home to such touchstone games as Final Fantasy, Final Fantasy VI, Chrono Trigger, Dragon Quest, Earthbound, and of course, Zelda. But that was a long time ago. Nintendo consoles have not been a significant platform for new JRPGs since the SNES days and the Wii is no exception.

This year Square-Enix brought two entries in its action-oriented Crystal Chronicles series to the Wii, Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles: Echoes of Time and Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles: The Crystal Bearers. I'm not sure where the audience for this series is coming from but I'm increasingly reminded of Square's ill-conceived Final Fantasy Mystic Quest for the SNES. I doubt that any but the most obsessive Final Fantasy completionist will spend much time with them.

Little King's Story was an under ppreciated title from ex-Love-de-Lic staffer Yoshirou Kimura, who had previously produced the obscuro game Chulip. NIS America brought Phantom Brave: We Meet Again to the Wii, a remake of the original 2004 PlayStation 2 title. Those Wii owners with ken for radish farming interspersed with some light dungeon exploring can look to Rune Factory Frontier, part of the long running Harvest Moon franchise.

The Old Man of the Mountain

The PlayStation 2 continues to soldier on. NIS America brought Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy and a buggy version of Ar tonelico 2: Melody of Metafalica to the console but the real reason to keep the machine hooked up was to enjoy Atlus' Devil Summoner 2: Raidou Kuzunoha vs. King Abaddon.

Released in an absurdly oversized collectible package, the game was overlooked by all but the most die-hard Mega Ten fans. Too bad, because it was as slickly playable as the more popular Persona 3 and 4 games but with the addition of Kazuma Kaneko's deviant art direction.

In Case You Missed It The First Time

Another sign of the declining Japanese RPG market is the proliferation of rereleases and remakes of the genre's classic titles. While it certainly helps maintain the audience's flagging enthusiasm and is invaluable for preserving the history of JRPGs, it can't be a healthy development for some of the best games of the year to be revisited classics.

This year the PlayStation Network got Final Fantasy VII, the 1997 PlayStation game that brought JRPGs to a mass audience. It's fashionable now to dismiss Final Fantasy VII as a jumbled mess of a game that hides an incoherent narrative behind visual smoke and mirrors. The game's memory is not well served either by Square-Enix's determined efforts to extract every last bit of emotional (and physical) currency from players with the "Compilation of Final Fantasy VII" project.

However, spend some time with Final Fantasy VII, and you'll find a game that is still as engrossing as you remember it. The next game in the series, Final Fantasy VIII, was a late December release to the PlayStation Network store. Perhaps I can finally figure out the "correct" way to play this game so that it is fun.

Square-Enix also brought Final Fantasy Tactics to the PlayStation Network. Designed by Yasumi Matsuno (Vagrant Story, Final Fantasy XII), Tactics is the art house alternative to Final Fantasy VII's blockbuster aspirations. Be warned however that this is a straight port of the original PlayStation release, with all of its garbled translation intact.

The PlayStation game Star Ocean: The Second Story was remade for the PSP by Square-Enix as Star Ocean: Second Evolution. Presumably so that players of Star Ocean 4 can discover just how little progress the series has made over the decade plus of its existence. The PlayStation Network also got Wild Arms 2, which was a solid, workman-like entry in a series that has never quite earned the love that its contemporaries enjoy.

Atlus is to be commended for bringing the first Persona game to the PSP in a remastered form that corrected many of the heavy-handed English localization cuts from the game's 1996 PlayStation release. However, the original Persona was the product of an earlier time and many of its awkward game mechanics will come as a shock to players who were introduced to the series by the smoothly playable Persona 3 and 4 entries.

Despite the lack of JRPGs on the Nintendo Wii, the console's Virtual Console service remains a compelling reason for RPG fans to embrace the hardware. This year saw a number of classic titles added to the list including Yasumi Matsuno's Ogre Battle: The March of the Black Queen, Phantasy Star, The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask, and the original Final Fantasy. The Virtual Console was also home to Final Fantasy IV: The After Years (a cell phone port no less!), which presents a newly created sequel to the almost two-decade old game with a retro-style graphics.

The Nintendo DS was home to some nicely executed remakes. Atlus started the year off with a deluxe release of Legacy of Ys Books I & II. Nintendo revisited the very first Fire Emblem with Intelligent System's Fire Emblem: Shadow Dragon. Square-Enix gave us perhaps their best title of the year in Dragon Quest V: Hand of the Heavenly Bride which marked the game's first appearance in North America, despite having been originally released almost two decades ago.

Letters To Santa Will Be Shredded

Conspicuously absent from under this year's Christmas tree is Final Fantasy XIII. For the past decade Final Fantasy games have traditionally been released in North America during the fall season but this year Square-Enix has decided to join the general publisher flight from Christmas by pushing Final Fantasy XIII to March of the new year, where it can the join a slew of other high-profile Q2 releases.

It will certainly be a big event when the game arrives in the spring, but I doubt that it will signal a flood of new RPGs from the company. Here we are, over four years into the current hardware cycle, and Square-Enix has been slow to commit its signature widescreen adventures to the new consoles. Instead, the company has largely traded on its past with RPG remakes for handhelds, and now seems more focused on action and strategy titles for the bulk of its future catalog.

The company's only big console release of 2009 was tri-Ace's Star Ocean 4: The Last Hope for Xbox 360 and that offering was a distinctly stale and soulless affair. I single Star Ocean out for extra vituperation for its ridiculous "Children are the future!" message, its shameless pandering to the recursive obsessions of anime fandom, and its reliance on tired game design modes that are long outdated.

The first Star Ocean was released thirteen years ago and one would imagine that the developers of the series (as well as the fans) would have undergone some life changes during the intervening years; moving through adulthood, taking on new responsibilities, experiencing love and loss. Absolutely none of these concerns are reflected in their work.

It's Over Johnny!

There are a variety of reasons why the JRPG has been diminishing in recent years and Japanese RPG developers will find themselves increasingly sidelined unless they begin to acknowledge the pressing need for change.

Everyone has a story. In the past, one of the key selling points of an RPG was that it had a fairly involved narrative; something that was usually lacking in most other action oriented video games. However, video games as a whole have become much better at telling a story. For example, Uncharted 2: Among Thieves tells a story that is at least as literate as the average RPG, better paced, and in a fraction of the time.

RPGs are labor intensive and expensive to create. The hardware transition to the Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3 hit Japanese developers hard. The demand for high fidelity visuals made asset creation an order of magnitude more difficult. In the West, sophisticated middleware solutions have sprung up to help mitigate some of this complexity but many Japanese studios have been slow to adapt to the new development landscape. Because of their large scale, RPGs have been particularly squeezed by the technological demands of the new consoles, resulting in only a handful of truly next-generation titles.

The anime and manga bubble has burst. The late 90s saw a tremendous surge in Western interest in Japanese pop culture. Book and comic stores rushed to create floor space devoted to vast piles of manga. Video retailers that had previously only carried the odd Akira or Ghost in the Shell tape suddenly embraced anime with shelves of outrageously expensive box sets and bizarrely titled movies, all delivered on the new DVD format. Kids were buying up anything sporting multicolored hair and big eyes and JRPGs benefited greatly from this hunger for all things Japanese. The current reality, however, is that the teens that were driving all this economic activity are now adults with different priorities and like all fads, anime and manga has somewhat run its course in the West.

Grown-ups don't like kids stuff. Despite the industry's fixation on serving a youth demographic, the audience for games is aging and it will age out completely unless developers create work that is relevant to adults. Western RPG developers seem to understand this but Japanese studios continue to target 13 year olds. From Software's Demon's Souls for the PlayStation 3 was one of the most successful Japanese RPGs of the year in North America, both critically and commercially, because it refused to conform to genre expectations. Here was a game that was serious. It demanded focus and attention and in return it gave players a meaningful experience that was refreshingly free from the adolescent cliches that are so prevalent in JRPGs.

The Sun Rises in the West

None of this is to suggest that the RPG genre is going away for good. On the contrary, North American and European developers are making some of the most compelling RPG experiences in recent years. Western developers seem far more willing to take creative chances and push game play in new directions. They also have the money and manpower to tackle big, ambitious projects.

While the future of RPGs is secure in the hands of the West, I fear that as the Japanese become less relevant to the genre something essential will have been lost. As more "badass biotic bitches" take center stage, the RPG will slip away from the world of dreams and longing. The fantasy will be gone.
Source: http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/26637/Opinion_2009__The_Last_Days_of_the_Japanese_RPG.php
 
His argument pretty much hinges on dismissing the DS, which is pretty goofy. He says that the DS is going to slow down because he doesn't see people using them on buses in America anymore? The DS is selling better than ever in the USA, numbers that positively embarrass every other system on the market. Even if it started tanking in the US, I really don't see how that would effect JRPG output on the system. Most JRPGs are developed for the Japanese market, and there's absolutely no question the DS is alive and kicking here.

Things are slower on the home consoles this gen, but that's obviously to be expected with the way things went down in Japan.
 

bistromathics

facing a bright new dawn
doesn't gamasutra have a "blogs" section?

This is the kind of sensational, traffic-driving stuff stuff I hate about blogs and game sites and didn't really expect from gamasutra.

2ecji10.png


And the author...

If 2009 was a bad year for the game industry, it was even worse for the heart-sick JRPG fan. Game Developer magazine's production editor - and committed JRPG scholar - Jeff Fleming looks back at the past year of Japanese RPG releases in North America, and finds troubling signs of a genre in decline.

Who? Do I even know what a magazine production editor does? It's cool though, he's a JRPG scholar.

I don't even care about the topic, but isn't this desperate grab for hits easy to see through? Or am I just being insane internet guy?
 

Salazar

Member
For example, Uncharted 2: Among Thieves tells a story that is at least as literate as the average RPG, better paced, and in a fraction of the time.

An RPG's unhurried pace is not a defect. Speed in the telling is not an unalloyed virtue across genres.

This much is obvious. Game A is good, but Game B would by no means necessarily be improved by imitating it.
 

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
bistromathics said:
doesn't gamasutra have a "blogs" section?
This one is an article they officially published, not a blogs section post.

They probably put it in the news section because of who they got to write it, even if it is more like a blog post.

It does seem to have several... errors though.
 
JRPGs died almost 10 years ago. They have been recycling their ideas for the last 20 years.

It is a good thing... makes Japanese developers think about new stuff. Look at Demon's Soul... how awesome is that?

For example, Uncharted 2: Among Thieves tells a story that is at least as literate as the average RPG, better paced, and in a fraction of the time.

Errrr??? That is just wrong.
 

IrishNinja

Member
Square-Enix dropped Dissidia Final Fantasy in our laps, which was about as welcome as Ehrgeiz was back in the day.

haha, burn.

i dont see why this surprises anyone, really. genres get their moment in the limelight, and then they fade out of it - but people keep making them.

remember when platformers were the biggest game in town? sure, we still get a few, but not nearly as many - this isnt a bad thing though, i tend to think it paves the way for outside thinking like Braid. J-RPGs had the floodgates open with FF VII and alla sudden (as the article pointed out) what i believed to be a niche genre growing up was vastly popular - sometimes for the cutscenes, sometimes anime chicks jumping on board, etc...there was something new for everybody, and it wasnt entirely suited to my tastes most times but there was enough going on where something'd work for me.

now look at last gen - how many forgettable entries to the genre did PS2 get? we went from whatever square & a few companies gave us every few times a year (SNES days) and missing out on quality imports not being brought over, to me having to check the internet to see what Alterier Iris and La Pucelle Tactics even were. most hardcore JRPG fans i know still have extensive backlogs from last gen.

so yeah, the scene's largely on handhelds right now - but even that's not a bad thing, because im still getting Lost Odyssey, VC, Vesperia etc on the big screen, and new things like TWEWY on DS. i dont see this as a bad thing; jazz was once the predominant form of music many years back, and now its not nearly that, but people still make it, and rather well.
 

Gravijah

Member
NemesisPrime said:
JRPGs died almost 10 years ago. They have been recycling their ideas for the last 20 years.

It is a good thing... makes Japanese developers think about new stuff. Look at Demon's Soul... how awesome is that?



Errrr??? That is just wrong.

I DO NOT REMEMBER 10 YEARS AGO HAVING AN RPG ABOUT A SCHOOL FOR ALCHEMISTS!
 
None of this is to suggest that the RPG genre is going away for good. On the contrary, North American and European developers are making some of the most compelling RPG experiences in recent years.

Really? Name a few. The only decent I have played in past few years is Fallout 3.
 

Kintaro

Worships the porcelain goddess
Did this fool just say this?

Despite having been extremely popular, I suspect that the market for the DS is quietly eroding.

Did he miss the 1.7 million units of DS sold in November alone? Is he going to ignore the over 2 million units it will push in December (no question in my mind)? Is he missing the 80-120k it sells every week in Japan?

I don't even have a DS...but...what?

o9ljqe.gif
 

usea

Member
For once, gaf pretty much gets it right. Within the first 10 posts, all the main points are covered. How this guy is a "committed JRPG scholar" is beyond me.
 

DR2K

Banned
Until the market shifts back to the consoles in Japan, we probably won't see as many console JRPGs. Hopefully the resurgence of the PS3 over there gets us a few gems.
 

Chozo

Member
Kintaro said:
Did he miss the 1.7 million units of DS sold in November alone? Is he going to ignore the over 2 million units it will push in December (no question in my mind)? Is he missing the 80-120k it sells every week in Japan?

I don't even have a DS...but...what?

Hey man, you just don't get it

the iPhone man, it's going to totally shit on the DS' chest and eat its lunch

like, any day now

for real

serious
 

D3RANG3D

Member
akachan ningen said:
Really? Name a few. The only decent I have played in past few years is Fallout 3.

The Witcher

Drakensang

Dragon Age

Titan Quest

Torchlight

S.T.A.L.K.E.R.

Sacred 2

Divinity 2
 

-MB-

Member
Kintaro said:
Did this fool just say this?



Did he miss the 1.7 million units of DS sold in November alone? Is he going to ignore the over 2 million units it will push in December (no question in my mind)? Is he missing the 80-120k it sells every week in Japan?

I don't even have a DS...but...what?

o9ljqe.gif


It is a Nintendo system, so in the mind of the media it is always close to going into a decline, regardless if it sold a billion last month :p
Nintendo somehow is always doomed if u had to believe them.
 

Steroyd

Member
NemesisPrime said:
JRPGs died almost 10 years ago. They have been recycling their ideas for the last 20 years.

Not this shit again.

It is a good thing... makes Japanese developers think about new stuff. Look at Demon's Soul... how awesome is that?

And yet people argue that it isn't a JRPG.
 

dogmaan

Girl got arse pubes.
I think a lot of the people complaining above me have forgotten that he is talking mainly about the appeal of new jRPG's to adults.

I'm in my mid 20's, and I used to love jRPG's, I really wish that square would create a new franchise or make a main line final fantasy which appeals to adults, I find it strange that they would overlook this bloody huge section of the market.

in a way even Harry Potter grew up with its audience, since FF8 (poss FF7?) final fantasy has been in eternal teenage angst ( even FF12 was changed to add angst, Vaan & Penelo)

I bought my PS3 (perhaps naively) expecting a deluge of jRPG's, I have 30 PS3 games and 0 RPG's, god damn it, that pisses me off
 

Kintaro

Worships the porcelain goddess
Bah, fuck this dude. I'm buying a DS XL and enough DS RPGs to drown in. I'll take a picture as my hand slowly fades from view. :lol
 

Danielsan

Member
dogmaan said:
I think a lot of the people complaining above me have forgotten that he is talking mainly about the appeal of new jRPG's to adults.

I'm in my mid 20's, and I used to love jRPG's, I really wish that square would create a new franchise or make a main line final fantasy which appeals to adults, I find it strange that they would overlook this bloody huge section of the market.

in a way even Harry Potter grew up with its audience, since FF8 (poss FF7?) final fantasy has been in eternal teenage angst ( even FF12 was changed to add angst, Vaan & Penelo)

I bought my PS3 (perhaps naively) expecting a deluge of jRPG's, I have 30 PS3 games and 0 RPG's, god damn it, that pisses me off
Shame on you.
As a PS3 owner you should at least have Demon's Souls and Valkyria Chronicles.
 
Not really sure why the genre's success on the DS doesn't count. I did like this part, though:

Grown-ups don't like kids stuff. Despite the industry's fixation on serving a youth demographic, the audience for games is aging and it will age out completely unless developers create work that is relevant to adults. Western RPG developers seem to understand this but Japanese studios continue to target 13 year olds. From Software's Demon's Souls for the PlayStation 3 was one of the most successful Japanese RPGs of the year in North America, both critically and commercially, because it refused to conform to genre expectations. Here was a game that was serious. It demanded focus and attention and in return it gave players a meaningful experience that was refreshingly free from the adolescent cliches that are so prevalent in JRPGs.

There's not a single HD JRPG upcoming or already released that I can't wait to play, and it's because of this shit. I'm tired of saving the world as an idealistic kid (with a dark past if we're getting really creative).

Of course, DQ and any future sequels (please?) to SoA and BoF are exempt.
 

dogmaan

Girl got arse pubes.
Danielsan said:
Shame on you.
As a PS3 owner you should at least have Demon's Souls and Valkyria Chronicles.

I have played a friends copy of Valkyria Chronicles

is Demon Souls out in the UK?
 
Segata Sanshiro said:
Yup yup, this thread is on a one-way express ride to WRPG vs JRPG, I can see it already.
You dropped those truth bombs too early. You were supposed to wait until the thread elevated itself to lunacy, then storm in here with your well-grounded and not-nonsensical-enough reply that would ultimately end up ignored. Play by the rules next time.
 
Night_Trekker said:
Not really sure why the genre's success on the DS doesn't count. I did like this part, though:



There's not a single HD JRPG upcoming or already released that I can't wait to play, and it's because of this shit. I'm tired of saving the world as an idealistic kid (with a dark past if we're getting really creative).

Of course, DQ and any future sequels (please?) to SoA and BoF are exempt.
Agreed

Developers are too afraid to face a potential backlash from weirdo otakus
 
dogmaan said:
I really wish that square would create a new franchise or make a main line final fantasy which appeals to adults, I find it strange that they would overlook this bloody huge section of the market.

Because the market that they sell to already is bigger than that market that you're referring to. Same would apply to something like DQ. DQ9 has sold over 4 million units in Japan alone. Most RPG's whether they best Western or Japanese developed would be lucky to sell that on a worldwide scale.

Now that question you're asking could certainly apply to other developers who don't have that built in fan base that FF has. But Square would be taking an unneeded risk to try to change a formula that works so well.
 

Tokubetsu

Member
D3RANG3D said:
The Witcher

Drakensang

Dragon Age

Titan Quest

Torchlight

S.T.A.L.K.E.R.

Sacred 2

Divinity 2


Fallout 3, Titan Quest, Torchlight, STALKER and Sacred 2 are pretty weak though. Risen yo!
 

dogmaan

Girl got arse pubes.
SolidSnakex said:
Because the market that they sell to already is bigger than that market that you're referring to. Same would apply to something like DQ. DQ9 has sold over 4 million units in Japan alone. Most RPG's whether they best Western or Japanese developed would be lucky to sell that on a worldwide scale.

Now that question you're asking could certainly apply to other developers who don't have that built in fan base that FF has. But Square would be taking an unneeded risk to try to change a formula that works so well.

I think the problem is more likely to be, that people like me still buy the mainline FF's despite the angst, in the vain hope that "maybe they'll get this one right", kind of like the Sonic Cycle, except we still all buy the game, thus giving SE no incentive to actually innovate.
 
Telling JRPG developers that they need to stop targeting their products at teenage boys is a bit like telling a toy company they need to make action figures for grown-ups. You aren't the most important demographic anymore, guys... deal with it.
 

Danielsan

Member
dogmaan said:
I have played a friends copy of Valkyria Chronicles

is Demon Souls out in the UK?
It is if you want it to be. Importing it is relatively cheap, at least for us mainlanders.
In The Netherlands there even were a couple of stores who imported it and then stocked it themselves.
 

Aaron

Member
Segata Sanshiro said:
Telling JRPG developers that they need to stop targeting their products at teenage boys is a bit like telling a toy company they need to make action figures for grown-ups. You aren't the most important demographic anymore, guys... deal with it.
Meanwhile, the Transformers toys are all being bought up by 20-30 year olds.

Though I'm surprised someone around my age has time for RPGs. I definitely don't.
 

ThatObviousUser

ὁ αἴσχιστος παῖς εἶ
Segata Sanshiro said:
Telling JRPG developers that they need to stop targeting their products at teenage boys is a bit like telling a toy company they need to make action figures for grown-ups. You aren't the most important demographic anymore, guys... deal with it.

I especially like how the author implies "You guys better make RPGs for grown-ups, or else!" Or else what? The games industry will continue to expand exponentially? :lol
 
Segata Sanshiro said:
Telling JRPG developers that they need to stop targeting their products at teenage boys is a bit like telling a toy company they need to make action figures for grown-ups. You aren't the most important demographic anymore, guys... deal with it.

:(

Well, DQ will be enough. And SoA2. That's still going to come out at some point, right?

Don't crush all my dreams.
 
Segata Sanshiro said:
Telling JRPG developers that they need to stop targeting their products at teenage boys is a bit like telling a toy company they need to make action figures for grown-ups. You aren't the most important demographic anymore, guys... deal with it.
I don't know much about Japanese culture (I'm not an expert), but if they're anything like Western teenage boys, they would like games with mature aesthetics just as much
 

Lafiel

と呼ぶがよい
Meh, i don't see how you could say the j-rpg genre is in decline, and then go say the "w-rpg genre has been growing strong" in comparison, when we are well past the "golden age" of that genre.
 
Some things:

1) Nintendo barely helped to the JRPG worldwide acceptance. Unless "Worldwide" means "America" for the this guy. I still remember the "1 JRPG year" rule with nintendo spain.Sony did a much better job.

2) Seems like he missed the insane DS numbers last NPD. DS is healthy, some consoles could only wish had his "decline"

3) At times seems like his analysis were to the Japanese industry as a whole, at least when he was naming non-rpg games...

4) I think that JRPG was probably a coup of fresh air for a fair number of console users, where the plot most of the times was a merely an excuse for a game.And that same people considered "Battle systems" "character groth" and those things like secondary things, so as the genre grew stale on the storytelling, character personality, etc..., these ones stayed away from the genre adn looked to some alternatives, and that alternative came in form of "WRPG".
 
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