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[Fularu]

Like literally nothing in this post is true.

Monsanto isn't the only company that makes GMOs, seeds are less efficient if reused, and GMOs aren't tasteless at all.

The scientific consensus is that GMOs are safe.

I never said they weren'T safe to use, I'm saying that the pushback from GMOs is way more tied to their "one and done" approach than anything else.

Also the use of the "GMO" term is super misguiding. We have been altering genes on crops/food knowingly for over 5 centuries now. It isn't the act of altering it that's beeng called into question, it's the underlying nature/goal of it beeing done *now* that is beeing called out.

Farmers beeing completely dependant on seed makers is a very real problem. They're prety much prisonners of them.

The initial pushback for Organic food/anti GMO diatribe came prety much (at least in Europe) from those farmers who were fed up of conglomerates like Monsanto dictating them everything.

But hey, by all means, keep thinking that GMOs make aliments (on the whole) healthier or tastier. That's not the goal, it's to make them more standardized. Standard size, shape, color, weight, taste, etc.. to facilitate their display on shelves and attract the consumer's eyes. This is why you such such an homogenisation of the food products on your shelves.

 

[slit]

But GMO didn't help to feed the people of our planet.

GMO is not a done deal. It can improve.

 

[Famassu]

Not sure why the dumb thread title. These similar types of scaremongers for whatever subject have been around way before Youtube and millenials.

 

[old manatee]

YOU WON'T BELIEVE WHAT MILLENIALS ARE EATING

 

[Sandoval]

My problem with GMOs is the way that they are crushing farmers who refuse to use them. I don't think that GMO corn in my Cheetos will make my theoretical children autistic or whatever, but I prefer not to support companies who litigate farmers out of their livelihood and turn the rest into sharecroppers. That's said I don't go too far out of my way to stand by those convictions. I grow my own garden anyway so I'm fortunate enough to have a degree of control over my intake that most people aren't afforded.

 

[tuxfool]

Not sure why the dumb thread title. These similar types of scaremongers for whatever subject have been around way before Youtube and millenials.

It is a Gizmodo article, they have to have an angle to tie it into their site's interest.

 

[ClosingADoor]

But GMO didn't help to feed the people of our planet.

I'm going to need to see some numbers for that, and predictions for the future.

My problem with GMOs is the way that they are crushing farmers who refuse to use them. I don't think that GMO corn in my Cheetos will make my theoretical children autistic or whatever, but I prefer not to support companies who litigate farmers out of their livelihood and turn the rest into sharecroppers. That's said I don't go too far out of my way to stand by those convictions. I grow my own garden anyway so I'm fortunate enough to have a degree of control over my intake that most people aren't afforded.

How are they crushing other farmers?

 

[Vulcano's assistant]

I'm here to solely question the premise of the tile, as it would be the generation after millennials that you could argue were educated by YouTube. Remember millennials = "90s kids"

 

[Beartruck]

But GMO didn't help to feed the people of our planet.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Borlaug

I suggest you read the above, particularly the bits about doubled harvests in several areas they implemented his policies.

 

[Timedog]

Are there any GMO scientists on GAF?

 

[Brhoom]

GMO is not a done deal. It can improve.

I agree. GMO right now are being exploited, and they aren't helping the soil, and when the soil is poor the quailty of your produces becomes poor as well.

I'm going to need to see some numbers for that, and predictions for the future.

I linked to some links and videos on a gmo thread a while back, I can't find them now. The video series on youtube is by a professor at university.

 

[CrocMother]

To be fair, food science historically has been kind of a joke. I don't really trust it fully either.

 

[~Devil Trigger~]

GMO food itself is not the issue

its the business of GMO farming thats the problem

 

[Beartruck]

I agree. GMO right now are being exploited, and they aren't helping the soil, and when the soil is poor the quailty of your produces becomes poor as well.

Farming in general hurts the soil. This is why fallow fields exist.

 

[slit]

I agree. GMO right now are being exploited, and they aren't helping the soil, and when the soil is poor the quailty of your produces becomes poor as well.

Show me proof. I'll help you out, there is none. Just because you read an article somewhere does not mean it 's been proven that GMO impact the soil worse than any other kind of farming.

 

[CrocMother]

You are still eating pesticides. In fact, you are likelier eating MORE pesticides by buying organic.

.

I worked on an organic farm, and we used no pesticides. I'm not sure what you're referencing, but it is in no way universally true.

Farming in general hurts the soil. This is why fallow fields exist.

That is only true if you monocrop. Farmers normally rotate crops, and use nitrogen fixers and cover crops to revive the soil after a harvest.

There seems to be a lot of ignorance about farming on GAF in general.

 

[darkace]

GMO food itself is not the issue

its the business of GMO farming thats the problem

Almost all GMO 'problems' have turned out to be blatant lies from extreme greenies.

GMO's are awesome. GMO companies provide an awesome product while being ok.

 

[Transhuman]

How do scientists test GMO's for possible long term effects?

Society is a clinical trial. The Amish are the control group.

 

[Aaronrules380]

I worked on an organic farm, and we used no pesticides. I'm not sure what you're referencing, but it is in no way universally true.

Organic foods aren't required to not use pesticides, they just have to use "natural" pesticides, which are usually much much worse for human consumption than the ones non-organic foods use. And part of the point of GMOs is to make crops more pest resistant so they need less pesticides in the first place

 

[Aaronrules380]

How do scientists test GMO's for possible long term effects?

I mean, all the chemicals in GMOs are already present in other things we consume, since the whole point is to mix and match dna. I mean, we already have a long history of crossbreeding plants and animals for specific traits. All we're doing to make GMOs is handling the process in a slightly different, more selective and controlled way

 

[MidgarBlowedUp]

I'm so anti-millennial I vaccinate my GMO foods.

 

[Beartruck]

That is only true if you monocrop. Farmers normally rotate crops, and use nitrogen fixers and cover crops to revive the soil after a harvest.

There seems to be a lot of ignorance about farming on GAF in general.

I knew about the nitrogen fixers. Didnt know about the crop rotation although that makes perfect sense.

 

[kess]

Organic foods aren't required to not use pesticides, they just have to use "natural" pesticides, which are usually much much worse for human consumption than the ones non-organic foods use. And part of the point of GMOs is to make crops more pest resistant so they need less pesticides in the first place

The other side of that is herbicide resistant crops, the absence of pesticides does not mean the elimination of all cropping systems.

 

[CrocMother]

Organic foods aren't required to not use pesticides, they just have to use "natural" pesticides, which are usually much much worse for human consumption than the ones non-organic foods use. And part of the point of GMOs is to make crops more pest resistant so they need less pesticides in the first place

The most common one we used was neem oil, which is harmless.

 

[Transhuman]

I worked on an organic farm, and we used no pesticides. I'm not sure what you're referencing, but it is in no way universally true.

Organic crops are generally weaker and require more herbicide/pesticide tending to be viable.

 

[slit]

The most common one we used was neem oil, which is harmless.

That's all well and good but the majority of organic farmers do not use that.

 

[AbsolutBro]

Farmers beeing completely dependant on seed makers is a very real problem. They're prety much prisonners of them.

Except they're not, and it isnt. There are plenty of organizations like Seed Savers Exchange and Heritage Farms that specialize in heirloom seeds. Heirloom seeds breed true from year to year so you really only need to buy them once, ever, if you practice proper seed collection.

But farmers don't grow heirlooms. They are nowhere near as prolific, yielding, hardy or profitable as hybrid plants. Hybrid plants are patented and owned just like GMO crops are. Farmers buy those seeds from year to year JUST LIKE THEY WOULD FOR GMO CROPS. This whole "starving farmer struggling to buy seed" story is objective shit and everyone that propogates it needs to stop. Buying seed every year is nothing new. It is something farmers have been doing for decades now.

 

[entremet]

YT is an amazing learning resource, OP. Don't hate!

Like anything, you need to learn how to parse the bullshit. This isn't a YT thing. It's a life thing.

Something being on printed paper doesn't make it true.

 

[spekkeh]

Stupid millennial hippies buying their organic foods from farmer markets, ruining my sugarated snacks produced by large factories, whaaaat.

 

[CrocMother]

Well that's all well and good but the majority of organic farmers do not use that.

If you are getting your produce from a factory farm that monocrops, it's almost certainly going to have been exposed to a lot of pesticides one way or the other.

Buying from smaller, local farms is what is important. If that option is available to you, the food is fresher and tastier, which is good for you. Not to mention it's better for the environment, and your local economy!

The process of getting organic certification is a huge pain in the ass, so I know for a fact that there are tons of great farmers who don't bother with it. I put little stock into the organic label.

For people in parts of the world where they don't have access to farmers markets and local food, GMO is the future. But if you're arguing that a Green Giant bag of lettuce farmed in Central California is no worse than a bag bought down the street at a farmers market, I cannot agree with that.

 

[KingV]

My wife asks me to buy organic.

I just tell her I do.

I don't.

Damn, I laughed way too hard at this.

"Yeah baby, those are organic apples"

 

[Pomerlaw]

But GMO didn't help to feed the people of our planet.

GMO is going to help modern agriculture.

I think we can conclude now that agriculture helped feed the world.

People have to realize that the Earth's biosphere has never been able to sustain us in a decent manner until we learned to adapt it to our needs.

 

[slit]

If you are getting your produce from a factory farm that monocrops, it's almost certainly going to have been exposed to a lot of pesticides one way or the other.

Buying from smaller, local farms is what is important. If that option is available to you, the food is fresher and tastier, which is good for you. Not to mention it's better for the environment, and your local economy!

The process of getting organic certification is a huge pain in the ass, so I know for a fact that there are tons of great farmers who don't bother with it. I put little stock into the organic label.

For people in parts of the world where they don't have access to farmers markets and local food, GMO is the future. But if you're arguing that a Green Giant bag of lettuce farmed in Central California is no worse than a bag bought down the street at a farmers market, I cannot agree with that.

No you just changed the argument. You are arguing buying local vs not buying local. That was not what we were talking about. We were talking about the misinformation that is spread concerning organic farming. If the local famers market is not organic that changes nothing about the equation is the point.

 

[Nevasleep]

Companies aren't particularly trustworthy these days, all they care about is the shareholders.
I can understand why some wouldn't trust it.

 

[Xe4]

If you are getting your produce from a factory farm that monocrops, it's almost certainly going to have been exposed to a lot of pesticides one way or the other.

Buying from smaller, local farms is what is important. If that option is available to you, the food is fresher and tastier, which is good for you. Not to mention it's better for the environment, and your local economy!

The process of getting organic certification is a huge pain in the ass, so I know for a fact that there are tons of great farmers who don't bother with it. I put little stock into the organic label.

For people in parts of the world where they don't have access to farmers markets and local food, GMO is the future. But if you're arguing that a Green Giant bag of lettuce farmed in Central California is no worse than a bag bought down the street at a farmers market, I cannot agree with that.

Can you point to scientific evidence saying that it is worse? Almost no such evidence has come up. It's fine to feel certain ways about things, but our food supply is such an important issue, any sort of agreement must be made based on science.

 

[CrocMother]

No you just changed the argument. You are arguing buying local vs not buying local. That was not what we were talking about. We were talking about the misinformation that is spread concerning organic farming. If the local famers market is not organic that changes nothing about equation is the point.

I'm agreeing with you, people who universally think organic=better are misinformed. There is no argument against that at this point.

I'm just defending the smaller organic farmers who use proper farming techniques from getting roped in with the large scale producers.

 

[Trokil]

They're inferior.
Aside from that nothing really. But some people buy organic simply because they believe for some reason GMO is bad.

That is maybe the most laughable thing I read in a long time, that GMO is better for you than Organic food.

There a dozens of studies about pesticide in your blood comparing GMO, regular and organic food and there is not a single study which shows, that there are less in your body compared to organic food.

Even the Stanford study, which claims that there are nor health benefits has to admit that there are less chemicals in Organic food.

Stanford study

https://med.stanford.edu/news/all-n...-benefits-from-organic-foods-study-finds.html

While researchers found that organic produce had a 30 percent lower risk of pesticide contamination than conventional fruits and vegetables, organic foods are not necessarily 100 percent free of pesticides. What’s more, as the researchers noted, the pesticide levels of all foods generally fell within the allowable safety limits. Two studies of children consuming organic and conventional diets did find lower levels of pesticide residues in the urine of children on organic diets, though the significance of these findings on child health is unclear. Additionally, organic chicken and pork appeared to reduce exposure to antibiotic-resistant bacteria, but the clinical significance of this is also unclear.

And of course it is unclear, because nobody pays to make it clear.

New answer to the study

https://www.fibl.org/fileadmin/docu..._stellungnahme_lindenthal_englisch_121106.pdf

And another interesting study

https://www.uclm.es/Actividades/repositorio/pdf/doc_3721_4666.pdf

The lengths the pro GMO people go, ignoring science and everything the not like is really impressive, it is like a religion. But somehow you can expect this when people quote GMO fans which tell you after Fukushima, well a little radiation may be great for you.

 

[Aaronrules380]

Companies aren't particularly trustworthy these days, all they care about is the shareholders.
I can understand why some wouldn't trust it.

Scientists aren't all associated with corporations. Plenty are with universities and other organizations without the conflict of interest

 

[CrocMother]

Can you point to scientific evidence saying that it is worse? Almost no such evidence has come up. It's fine to feel certain ways about things, but our food supply is such an important issue, any sort of agreement must be made based on science.

A landmark study on the topic by Donald Davis and his team of researchers from the University of Texas (UT) at Austin’s Department of Chemistry and Biochemistry was published in December 2004 in the Journal of the American College of Nutrition. They studied U.S. Department of Agriculture nutritional data from both 1950 and 1999 for 43 different vegetables and fruits, finding “reliable declines” in the amount of protein, calcium, phosphorus, iron, riboflavin (vitamin B2) and vitamin C over the past half century. Davis and his colleagues chalk up this declining nutritional content to the preponderance of agricultural practices designed to improve traits (size, growth rate, pest resistance) other than nutrition.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/soil-depletion-and-nutrition-loss/

 

[Gnome Scat]

GMO is fine so long as it is done ethically.

 

[AbsolutBro]

I worked on an organic farm, and we used no pesticides. I'm not sure what you're referencing, but it is in no way universally true.

That is only true if you monocrop. Farmers normally rotate crops, and use nitrogen fixers and cover crops to revive the soil after a harvest.

There seems to be a lot of ignorance about farming on GAF in general.

This is part of why "organic" as a term has become meaningless. Or rather, there is a governmental designited definition that does not mean what people think it means. In the US, organic just means growers have to use pesticides and herbicides that are naturally derived. Neem, pyrethrin, deet, etc. But most people think it means "no pesticides or herbicides at all", which is patently false.

And yeah, crop rotation is awesome. Pioneered by none other than George Washington, at least as far as the US crops. There are actually several books on his advances in farming.

 

[Corronchilejano]

Even the Stanford study, which claims that there are nor health benefits has to admit that there are less chemicals in Organic food.

Your own quote clarifies that both cases are within safety parameters.

And of course it is unclear, because nobody pays to make it clear.

New answer to the study

https://www.fibl.org/fileadmin/docu..._stellungnahme_lindenthal_englisch_121106.pdf

And another interesting study

https://www.uclm.es/Actividades/repositorio/pdf/doc_3721_4666.pdf

The lengths the pro GMO people go, ignoring science and everything the not like is really impressive, it is like a religion. But somehow you can expect this when people quote GMO fans which tell you after Fukushima, well a little radiation may be great for you.

The first opinion paper makes a lot of assumptions with no data to support it, such as the benefits of an organic diet for breastfeeding nor the long term benefits of switching diets from conventional to organic.

The second paper relates does directly to a very toxic type of pesticide, Glyphosate, which IMHO should be banned for use anywhere.

 

[CrocMother]

This is part of why "organic" as a term has become meaningless. Or rather, there is a governmental designited definition that does not mean what people think it means. In the US, organic just means growers have to use pesticides and herbicides that are naturally derived. Neem, pyrethrin, deet, etc. But most people think it means "no pesticides or herbicides at all", which is patently false.

And yeah, crop rotation is awesome. Pioneered by none other than George Washington, at least as far as the US crops. There are actually several books on his advances in farming.

Another way we controlled pests was to plant something they found tastier next to the stuff we actually wanted to harvest, like a decoy. It's a proven technique people have been using for thousands of years. These are the kind of things that factory farms cannot utilize.

 

[Jobbs]

We think organic food is healthier, Boomers get Trump elected.

I think we're doing okay.

You could argue that young people not turning out to vote has been a big problem

 

[jakonovski]

Africans will starve if you don't eat your GMOs! The guilt tripping dimension of GMO marketing is really weird.

 

[JP_]

Your own quote clarifies that both cases are within safety parameters.

...we don't always have a perfect understanding of the effects things can have on long term health. You understand that, right? Our safe consumption guidelines are evolving. On top of that, you have misinformed GMO cult zealots claiming eating organic will expose you to MORE pesticides.

I eat GMO but I value consumer choice, ongoing publicly funded research, and an informed public. GAF hive mind basically thinks people shouldn't even have the option to avoid GMOs. They think the public cannot handle the responsibility of accurate labeling. Even if GMOs are safe for most, some individuals have unique diet needs -- choice is important.

 

[ZealousD]

Organic crops are generally weaker and require more herbicide/pesticide tending to be viable.

You're getting your terms confused. Organic is not the same as non-GMO. You can have organic GMOs and you can have non-organic non-GMOs.

Organic foods should not be farmed with synthetic herbicides or pesticides.

non-GMO are foods that are not genetically modified.

What often happens is that non-GMO foods that aren't organic are a relative pain to farm with and require more herbicides and pesticides.

 

[CrocMother]

This is part of why "organic" as a term has become meaningless. Or rather, there is a governmental designited definition that does not mean what people think it means. In the US, organic just means growers have to use pesticides and herbicides that are naturally derived. Neem, pyrethrin, deet, etc. But most people think it means "no pesticides or herbicides at all", which is patently false.

And yeah, crop rotation is awesome. Pioneered by none other than George Washington, at least as far as the US crops. There are actually several books on his advances in farming.

There is not even a federal organic designation, I worked in Hawaii and we got our certification from California. It's done through states, usually on the West Coast like California and Oregon. And the main requirement seemed to be copious amounts of paperwork.

Also fairly certain that crop rotation was being used since pre-historic times and in the case of America I think we have to give that distinction to the Native Americans 

 

[Damerman]

I'm sure Mosanto is championing GMO for science's sake and absolutely not to make every farmer completely dependent on them to get seeds since their crops would be sterile and useless for future ones.

It's not like GMO's are usually tasteless and devoid of any real quality either.

Yep, they'Re hated because people hate science.

Bill nye said gmos are okay... so this post is bullshit.

 

[lawnchair]

there are a lot of negative consequences we could associate with a generation being 'educated' by youtube or social media, more GMO-free foods isn't near the top of the list ..