• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

I hope Microsoft gives Arkane Studios a blank cheque for their next game

SF Kosmo

Al Jazeera Special Reporter
I don't think the graphics of Deathloop and Redfall have a budget issue. It's the art style they've willfully chosen.
Deathloop's structure of using the same four levels over and over for the entire game was surely a way to make a big game on smaller budget, though.

That's not a bad thing, necessarily. I could also say the same about Control's setting entirely in the Oldest House, but in both cases it resulted in a unique and memorable story and world. But yeah.
 

Chukhopops

Member
Prior leadership but Dishonored 2 was a sales disappointment and I doubt whatever the next game was did any better.

Deathloop was also a poor game by their standards, I doubt it did very well on any platform, and Redfall... lmao. Look, it has nothing to do with the acquisition, I have a PC that can play any of their games, stop thinking that any criticism or negative comments about any Microsoft game is butthurt PS5 owners. At some point these studios need to be sell units and be held accountable or MS is just pissing money down the drain endlessly.
Maybe you didn’t like it but Deathloop reviewed well and personally I loved it, never understood what issues people had with it. It’s such a unique concept.

I think the problem really was the marketing, trying to push a game like that so hard on the console crowd wasn’t the best idea.

Redfall isn’t out yet, let’s see how this one fares but as long as it creates GP engagement it’s going to be fine from MS’ perspective. You’re tripping if you think MS will close Arkane, they need their output.
 

The_Mike

I cry about SonyGaf from my chair in Redmond, WA
I hope they revisit Prey.
I can only get behind this if its revisiting the original Prey.

R.51e1a7935e2d7ed705c8a90b10fe6ace

Hopefully they stop copy/pasting their FPS games and make something interesting in 3rd person.
Theres an entire platform dedicated to this. Microsoft shouldn't need to follow the market leader, they need to make something else people want.
 
Last edited:

simpatico

Member
The first Dishonored was a solid 9/10 game. Bordering so close to classic. The sequel had a bit of a stumble and some unfortunate perf issues. Then we got Prey, which is an incredibly unique experience. How they went from that to Deathloop is beyond me. I really think Deathloop started it's like as a $39.99 mini game and covid made them shift gears. The bad thing is, somehow it got reviews scores it absolutely did not deserve. I'm an Arkane fanboy and SP FPS fanboy, and I couldn't find anything to love in it. Between the weird response to that, and now Redfall, it's hard to see them making a comeback. At least for a moment in time, that 3 game run was god tier. Looks like they're joining Rocksteady in developer heaven.
 

diffusionx

Gold Member
Maybe you didn’t like it but Deathloop reviewed well and personally I loved it, never understood what issues people had with it. It’s such a unique concept.

I think the problem really was the marketing, trying to push a game like that so hard on the console crowd wasn’t the best idea.

Redfall isn’t out yet, let’s see how this one fares but as long as it creates GP engagement it’s going to be fine from MS’ perspective. You’re tripping if you think MS will close Arkane, they need their output.
It was ok, I'd give it a 6/10, unique concept yes but totally underdone and babby shit compared to what they did with Prey and even Dishonored. MS doesn't need any one studio, what they need to do is make money and create a sustainable business. I've mentioned before on this forum why I think the whole "oh we are in a post-sales era, what matters is engagement" we've been hearing about subscription services for the past decade is total garbage.

Deathloop's structure of using the same four levels over and over for the entire game was surely a way to make a big game on smaller budget, though.

That's not a bad thing, necessarily. I could also say the same about Control's setting entirely in the Oldest House, but in both cases it resulted in a unique and memorable story and world. But yeah.
Control was WAY more interesting visually than Deathloop, and more varied too (especially when you add on the DLC). I like to think that they had much bigger plans for Deathloop but had to scale it back because of the pandemic. Maybe that's cope but the game really could have been so much bigger, more varied, and more dynamic than what it was.
 

Chukhopops

Member
It was ok, I'd give it a 6/10, unique concept yes but totally underdone and babby shit compared to what they did with Prey and even Dishonored. MS doesn't need any one studio, what they need to do is make money and create a sustainable business. I've mentioned before on this forum why I think the whole "oh we are in a post-sales era, what matters is engagement" we've been hearing about subscription services for the past decade is total garbage.
I don’t see what to argue with, that’s just your opinion on the game and business model and I respect it.

But when it comes to sub models engagement is what matters, series on Netflix / Prime get cancelled or renewed based on how many people watch it and for how long. If Redfall functions well either as a co-op shooter or as a SP game and people play it that way in sufficient numbers then that’s good enough for the model. Plus MS isn’t going to close studios when they are paying premium to get more…
 

ZehDon

Gold Member
Hopefully they stop copy/pasting their FPS games and make something interesting in 3rd person.
Absolutely. Instead of the open high-agency FPS games Akane clearly likes to make, they should something new - like third person games! It should have a grounded, character focused story. Long sections where the player just walks and listens to dialogue. Hours of elaborate cutscenes. A semi-open world structure, with RPG-style upgrade trees.
 
One: It’s my take.

Two: The ratio of FPS to TPS games are 75/25.

Three: Arkane develops nothing but FPS games. Similar to Bethesda and the majority of Microsoft’s studios.
- yes but many people have this random take on the internet about making games into third person. I get some people prefer it but... it’s weird. The perspective of a game shouldn’t be the concern
- Sony primarily does third person. They are great at it. That is the console for you.
- Arkane and Bethesda make very different types of games from each other, and very different from other Microsoft studios. Why alter what they’re good at?
It was ok, I'd give it a 6/10, unique concept yes but totally underdone and babby shit compared to what they did with Prey and even Dishonored. MS doesn't need any one studio, what they need to do is make money and create a sustainable business. I've mentioned before on this forum why I think the whole "oh we are in a post-sales era, what matters is engagement" we've been hearing about subscription services for the past decade is total garbage.


Control was WAY more interesting visually than Deathloop, and more varied too (especially when you add on the DLC). I like to think that they had much bigger plans for Deathloop but had to scale it back because of the pandemic. Maybe that's cope but the game really could have been so much bigger, more varied, and more dynamic than what it was.
You give it a 6/10, and professional reviewers give it a way higher score. It was far better than control imo - control was not more varied at all. It was an office building and some caves which all looked very samey. The entire gameplay loop of deathloop was fun because the whole concept is going through the stages in a specific order - it’s a puzzle similar to how Resident evil 2 works where you have to find a specific key to get into a specific area and you still have freedom in how you kill the visionaries and the powers you have. Redfall may end up being bad but Deathloop was not a bad game - you may not like the type of game it was but yeah
 

Teletraan1

Banned
Why close a studio that produce well-reviewed games with a dedicated fan base on a AA budget? Is MS going to close Double Fine too?

Deathloop had 20k peak players at launch on Steam, Prey 25k, Dishonored 19k and Dishonored 2 25k - completely fine numbers and that’s only the PC part.

Such a weird way to cope with the acquisition.
Yeah you are right. MS, and Sony are perfect in their sublime handling of acquisitions. They always make perfect decisions. Praise be thy console manufacturer.

I mostly play games by small developers. I think I play maybe 2 AAA games per year. I would prefer a lot of these studios remain autonomous rather than sucked into some arms race for products I don't give a fuck about. In my opinion and I could be wrong because I often am, a change of management/culture and not the type they are going to get from MS of all places, would have done this dev more in the long run than the acquisition. I will take a game made by passionate people over a corporate assembly line any day.
 
Never knew a studio that every single time overcomplicates simple game mechanics for the sake of it to be different. Deathloop reached a point where even after 4 hours I had no clue wtf I was supposed to be doing.
 

Pfroebbel

Member
I think their Art Style is a Problem. If they would go realistic Style (maybe like Atomic Heart) they could imo reach a far greater Playerbase.
 
Prior leadership but Dishonored 2 was a sales disappointment and I doubt whatever the next game was did any better.

Deathloop was also a poor game by their standards, I doubt it did very well on any platform, and Redfall... lmao. Look, it has nothing to do with the acquisition, I have a PC that can play any of their games, stop thinking that any criticism or negative comments about any Microsoft game is butthurt PS5 owners. At some point these studios need to be sell units and be held accountable or MS is just pissing money down the drain endlessly.
Their single player games failing to be a commercial success led to Deathloop. They took inspiration from Dark Souls "invasion" gameplay.
Doesn't seem to have worked though.
 

Rippa

Member
You know absolutely nothing.
Here’s one you’ll like:

They’re all the same FPS games with a fresh coat of paint.

Name a Arkane game that isn’t developed with hands and/or guns present on the left and right of your screen.

Don’t be angry at my opinion/facts 🤣
 
Absolutely. Instead of the open high-agency FPS games Akane clearly likes to make, they should something new - like third person games! It should have a grounded, character focused story. Long sections where the player just walks and listens to dialogue. Hours of elaborate cutscenes. A semi-open world structure, with RPG-style upgrade trees.
everybodyssocreative-tanaradoublechocolate.gif
 

Banjo64

cumsessed
I don’t think a blank cheque would help as no matter how good their games are I just don’t think they have mass appeal. And that’s ok.
 
Preys controls are horrible by all them metrics. Makes KZ2 on PS3 feel like a snappy shooter.

Couldn’t get past the horrible controls
I mean it’s not some competitive action game - it’s an immersive sim. Regardless having played both quite a bit I think you’re misremembering KZ2
 

sankt-Antonio

:^)--?-<
I mean it’s not some competitive action game - it’s an immersive sim. Regardless having played both quite a bit I think you’re misremembering KZ2
I used KZ2 so drive home the fact that I really hate Preys controls (on console) with a deep passion.
The first confrontation in the game using the gun and I felt like the reviewer from that famous Doom meme/review. Like holly crap.
 
I see them getting closed very soon.

Microsoft is going to get a bunch studios, Redfall might be their down fall. Like every other studio’s “fall” named games.
 

JusticeForAll

Gold Member
They sure made some great games.
Arx Fatalis, M&M Dark Messiah, Dishonored 1 & 2 and Prey are all great. Played and loved each of those.

I played Deathloop first on PS5 and didn't finish it because I got bored halfway through. When it came out on Gamepass, I tried again on series X but the result was the same. Game just didn't do it for me.

But what really worries me, is Redfall. It looks generic and boring. And based on the general reception of that one, I don't think they will get any blank cheque.
 

Heisenberg007

Gold Journalism
Yeah let’s make everything AAA and inflate their budgets so every game is crammed in the same 2-3 genres considered worth the investment.

Don’t you realize the issue with Redfall is that it was probably designed initially as a co-op shooter to chase the trend before being redesigned?
It is still a co-op shooter. What exactly did they redesign?
 

Chukhopops

Member
It is still a co-op shooter. What exactly did they redesign?
They removed the always online requirement so the game could be played SP offline, announced there would be no online shop (which was planned at some point based on the pre-alpha) and pivoted the entire marketing message into « Arkane’s Far Cry ».

It’s clear there was a pivot from the initial plan if you rewatch the announcement trailer for example.
 

Drizzlehell

Banned
It seems like everyone is missing the fact that the most important players behind that company's most successful and critically acclaimed games are gone. The last "Arkane" game that was created by the same team that worked on their first couple of titles, including Dishonored, was Prey. After that they've made a shitty Wolfensetin spin-off that everyone hated, and one original IP that was met by the audience with a resounding "meh".

I have some hope in Redfall due to Harvey Smith being back in the director's chair but we'll se how that goes. His personal track record ain't spotless either.

In any case, without those big creative forces (the "auteurs" if you will) behind the wheel, Arkane is gonna turn into yet another corporate tool for churning out games that may be okay if they're lucky enough, but we will never get another Dishonored or Prey out of them. Forget it.
 

PillsOff

Banned
All they ever done with their games is undelivered.

No.


Also.
They had a studio they "blindchecked" like crazy n all studio did is spend 10(!!!) years eating that money n then released alfa version of whatever the fuck Halo Infinite was supposed to be n then they ate some more of their cash making 3 mp maps in 2 years...
 
Last edited:

Zuzu

Member
That would be great. But we already have something like that, they're called "Thief".
There hasn't been a top tier Thief game since Thief 3 in 2004 and the Thief series isn't set in a cyberpunk future so that series doesn't provide what I'm looking for. Also, in addition to gadgets I'd love the cyberpunk Ninja to have abilities tied to augmentations. Those could also be the substitutes for Dishonoured's supernatural powers.
 

Drizzlehell

Banned
There hasn't been a top tier Thief game since Thief 3 in 2004 and the Thief series isn't set in a cyberpunk future so that series doesn't provide what I'm looking for. Also, in addition to gadgets I'd love the cyberpunk Ninja to have abilities tied to augmentations. Those could also be the substitutes for Dishonoured's supernatural powers.
Why don't you play Deus Ex Human Revolution & Mankind Divided, then? It's literally the game you're looking for, complete with stealth mechanics that personally reminded me a lot of Metal Gear Solid 2. The only thing that's kinda missing is that Jensen doesn't possess Corvo's agility and speed but otherwise both games share a lot of similarities, both being immersive sims and all.
 

OceanGaming

Member
Who is this studio and what have they done with Arkane?
They had an internal conflict (around 2016 to 2018) and one side lost and got either purged from the company/left the company or forced into silence and treating game making just as a job that got paid, without having any passion for their jobs anymore. Do not think newArkane is the oldArkane. Similar thing has happened to many other dev studios, more recent example being Rocksteady.

 
Last edited:

Giallo Corsa

Gold Member
I want them to make a dishonored-style cyberpunk ninja game. But no supernatural powers; just give me cool gadgets please.

Dunno man, i'm already tired of cyberpunk-themed games, just in the past 5 years we had :
-Katana Zero
-Ruiner
-Ghost runner
-Observer
-Cyberpunk 2077
-Signalis
-Stray
- The Ascent
...not to mention, older ones like the Deus Ex games, Remember me, the system shock ones or, who knows how many other indie ones released just in the past few years like Citizen sleeper, Unsighted etc etc.

I get that you're expressing your personal opinion friend but in my honest opinion the whole cyberpunk theme has been played to death and has gotten as banal as the zombie one, i don't think a Dishonoured-styled CP ninja game would be anything original.

Also : If you haven't played it, give Ghost runner a try, it's more of a Hotline Miami "1-hit kill rinse-and-repeat" game in first person but you'll get your Cyberpunk Ninja fix ;)

Cheers
 
Last edited:

xrnzaaas

Member
I don't think they're capable of making another great immersive sim like Dishonored or Prey. The genre usually doesn't promise good sales and Deathloop has proven you can't make a good game like that with a smaller scale and a smaller budget. Also doesn't help that the aesthetics in their newer games are just awful.
 

Fatmanp

Member
Deathloop and Redfall are cleary designed to break the mould of typical Arkane games to include more simplistic and casual gameplay to avoid studio closures prior to the acquisition. The AI in Deathloop and Redfall (by the looks of it) are Ubisoft tier.

They need to double down and embrace what they are like Fromsoft did.
 
Arkane reduced to making GaaS games. Yep that sounds like Microsoft.
Does it? Everything seems to point at rare wanting to make a game like sea of thieves. Also, don’t really see it as being “reduced to”. Nothing about fh5 or flight sim seem worse than a one and done game imo
 
Top Bottom