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[newtypepilot]

lol already a season pass even though the game isn't out yet. Too bad Epic store doesn't have early access or else you will all instantly become glorified beta testers.

 

[scalman]

so you all just believe in it because you read in online ? sound like legit info sure.
devs made game. then publisher comes and now they make all moves and whos backed who is forgotten i guess. its business.

 

[Enjay]

I backed it as well and I am getting the full game (even better than what the original backing would have allowed) , now as an exercise how many of you are protesting against Oculus with a proportionally scales anger response?

Remember that Oculus used the KS money to generate a product they then used to raise additional funding and only that second layer of private backers/investors got a share of the billions that Facebook paid them?

No one grew up waiting for Oculus Rift's story to conclude. it's amusing seeing how much this thread can make you type.

 

[Lastyou1]

You could have built a nice story and gameplay around it... yet the exclusive DLC for the new pre-order campaign is soooooo much bigger?

That was 15 years ago, for God's sake.
It was a dumb decision, but at least I got access to chapter 2 without spending a dime.
If you fail to understand that the problem is story content is hidden behind paywalls, well, I'm sorry, but you're dumber than you think. I didn't get to pay to read chapter 2, that's it.

Breaking a record does not mean making billions, it is good, but also speaks of the relatively low KS ceiling.

Again, that was their choice, not mine.
Also, setting the bar too high would have Condemned the game into oblivion. You know 11 millions are an impressive and unpredictable result, but don't push your luck.
You set your standards too high, and you are left empty handed.

They kickstarted the game, maybe were hoping to get more, maybe they miscalculated cost vs scope, and maybe at the beginning they thought they could reasonably give the proper Shenmue sequel fans deserved and slowly realised they could not?

Again, this is not my fault nor the backers'. They set their own standards and was up to them keeping up with them. It's not like their failure to stay within budget is a valid excuse to justify DS involvement.

I am not saying DS is a group of saints, they accepted Ys.Net terms and invested as they saw something that could turn into something even better and that could sell hopefully well... so they invested in it and allowed Ys.Net to make a better game.

More money doesn't equate better game, that's a wrong assumption from you about the game.
I never, never complained over the graphics or the few glimpses of gameplay that were shown. A low budget game was all I asked because I know how Yu Suzuki tends to screws things over with too much creative freedom and, more dangerously, budget management freedom.
Shenmue had to be a low budget game because that's what I signed and paid for. Everything else is just bad Deep Silver PR.

Where was SEGA for 15 years? Where was MS? Where was Nintendo?... etc... etc...

This is a non-sequitur.
Nobody's asked for them.
Yu Suzuki step forward and said "give me 7 millions and I'll try to make a decent game".
Nobody asked for any other third party involvement.
If Yu Suzuki felt that third party involvement was necessary he had to share his decision with the backers and, eventually, give back all the money to the backers who disagreed with him.

--> "So nothing of great value was lost." ?

Are you serious?
Are you still comparing the two situations? One was released for free, the other is a piece of game that I'll have to pay for and that wasn't included in the original vision of the game.
I don't know how much Deep Silver pays you, but all your claims are invalid to say the least or even in bad faith.

 

[Panajev2001a]

No one grew up waiting for Oculus Rift's story to conclude. it's amusing seeing how much this thread can make you type.

I am glad too, I get thumbs exercise and box glaciers at the same time . Me and my bad habit to support arguments and rationalise things...

I did not expect the comeback to the Facebook thing to be “so, they only missed a pie of a $2.4 Billion sale they helped make possible, I am potentially missing a different in game sock or something“ .

Again on the episodic game that will tell its story in the core game and may have non preorder exclusive additional story chapters is where you want to hold the ground on now?
Suzuki told people the story would not conclude in III quite a while ago, just like it did not conclude with the other games... so if they would have to make a fourth game at least, what would be wrong with theoretical Shenmue III.5 content as additional short stories sold through post launch DLC (maybe only expanding the current story and not even pushing it much forward)?

 

[Dr.Morris79]

The game that keeps on not giving.

 

[lukilladog]

Deep Silver gave Ys.Net money used to make a better game and do not deserve to make money off it at all despite the game seemingly being better because of this? And all because of these pieces of DLC?

Please stop it, the only reason Deep silver can get away with this is because of the poor negotiation skills from YS. Deep Silver obviously doesn´t have any plans to thank the backers for the opportunity to make money, and probably think they are a bunch of losers that need to be ignored.

 

[Constant Flux]

So, does anyone know who to contact about getting a refund of my $250 pre-order via Kickstarter?

I just checked it and it's actually $270.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Please stop it, the only reason Deep silver can get away with this is because of the poor negotiation skills from YS. Deep Silver obviously doesn´t have any plans to thank the backers for the opportunity to make money, and probably think they are a bunch of losers that need to be ignored.

, what? What did DS do to you and your family? They must not be saints, but it is getting ridiculous now.
The game scope increased, more stretch goals were added even though the KS did not clear them, and the game is bigger and better as a result. This is making the game better for the backers too.

 

[lukilladog]

, what? What did DS do to you and your family? They must not be saints, but it is getting ridiculous now.
The game scope increased, more stretch goals were added even though the KS did not clear them, and the game is bigger and better as a result. This is making the game better for the backers too.

But how do you arrive to the conslusion that because the game got better for the backers, therefore they can´t ask or demand for the DLC?. You are drawing the line arbitrarily on how much content of "the better game" they deserve, you are offering no reason why they should not get it other than DS deserve the money, as if DS was the only one that put money on it.

 

[Panajev2001a]

But how do you arrive to the conslusion that because the game got better for the backers, therefore they can´t ask or demand for the DLC?. You are drawing the line arbitrarily on how much content of "the better game" they deserve, you are offering no reason why they should not get it other than DS deserve the money, as if DS was the only one that put money on it.

Where did I say you should not ask for the DLC? You can do whatever you want... whether I believe it is meaningful DLC or if this is a big outrage mountain over peanuts, whether you are going to get anything or not, whether I believe you have grounds based on this particular issue or you don’t is another matter altogether...
DS is not the only one putting money in it, but I seem to recall there is exclusive content for the KS backers alone too.

KS backers are getting 100% of the better game, actually more than what they backed since Ys.Net is including stretch goals the community did not fund too.
Season passes are something beyond for KS backers and for people who buy the game now, but then it is an episodic series... if Shenmue IV is a possibility to extend the story, why not some side story content in DLC aka Shenmue III.5?

Pre-order bonuses are likely not anything story related or major at all and KS backers have some exclusive bonuses customers late to pre order will not get... so, sure it would be nice to get that as well in the KS, but I am not sure why that would warrant hating on Ys.Net and wishing for the game to fail... all because one is not getting the equivalent of a virtual sock ... it feels like some people are looking for and holding onto any excuse to rage no matter how small.

 

[Kazza]

KS backers are getting 100% of the better game, actually more than what they backed since Ys.Net is including stretch goals the community did not fund too. Season passes are something beyond for KS backers and for people who buy the game now, but then it is an episodic series... if Shenmue IV is a possibility to extend the story, why not some side story content in DLC aka Shenmue III.5?

This is why I'm perfectly happy with the situation. So long as the core game is good, then I'll be happy to pay extra for (substantive) DLC too. The pre-order bonus doesn't look great, so I'm not bothered by it too much. While it might have been nice to gift the season pass etc to those who contributed a lot (say $100+) to the kickstarter, I don't think people have a right to it, as it wasn't a part of the kickstarter in the first place.

 

[lukilladog]

Where did I say you should not ask for the DLC? You can do whatever you want... whether I believe it is meaningful DLC or if this is a big outrage mountain over peanuts, whether you are going to get anything or not, whether I believe you have grounds based on this particular issue or you don’t is another matter altogether...
DS is not the only one putting money in it, but I seem to recall there is exclusive content for the KS backers alone too.

KS backers are getting 100% of the better game, actually more than what they backed since Ys.Net is including stretch goals the community did not fund too.
Season passes are something beyond for KS backers and for people who buy the game now, but then it is an episodic series... if Shenmue IV is a possibility to extend the story, why not some side story content in DLC aka Shenmue III.5?

Pre-order bonuses are likely not anything story related or major at all and KS backers have some exclusive bonuses customers late to pre order will not get... so, sure it would be nice to get that as well in the KS, but I am not sure why that would warrant hating on Ys.Net and wishing for the game to fail... all because one is not getting the equivalent of a virtual sock ... it feels like some people are looking for and holding onto any excuse to rage no matter how small.

You are making no points other than they might be overreacting.

 

[Panajev2001a]

You are making no points other than they might be overreacting.

I would like to ask you to read that and the other posts. If you want to move the goalpost and/or ignore what I am saying fine.
Of course I think people may be overreacting, today's outrage culture to take share of the blame too, but I am also spending time explaining why I say that.

But how do you arrive to the conslusion that because the game got better for the backers, therefore they can´t ask or demand for the DLC?

For example this... I addressed it, but I will do it once more. The game improved thanks to DS's additional funds, the core game is better, KS backers have exclusive pre-order bonus already, why the outrage?
You are getting a better game, what is the moral ground to crucify Ys.Net for not giving you additional free content?

Harping on the non KS backer pre-order exclusive bonus feels disingenous as it is a drop in the bucket in terms of content compared to the core game...

 

[Lanrutcon]

I would like to ask you to read that and the other posts. If you want to move the goalpost and/or ignore what I am saying fine.
Of course I think people may be overreacting, today's outrage culture to take share of the blame too, but I am also spending time explaining why I say that.

For example this... I addressed it, but I will do it once more. The game improved thanks to DS's additional funds, the core game is better, KS backers have exclusive pre-order bonus already, why the outrage?
You are getting a better game, what is the moral ground to crucify Ys.Net for not giving you additional free content?

Harping on the non KS backer pre-order exclusive bonus feels disingenous as it is a drop in the bucket in terms of content compared to the core game...

Look, you can keep dancing in circles for however many posts your daily free time allows: doesn't change the fact that the most hardcore, loyal fans that initially made the game possible are being denied a bonus that's aimed at early adopters when they are the earliest goddamn adopters possible.

And for the love of Christ, stop this shit:

, what? What did DS do to you and your family? They must not be saints, but it is getting ridiculous now.

You have the balls to ridicule other people's opinions on the subject when you've done nothing but shill acrobatics from page 1. You're not even being subtle in your mindless, aggressive policing of any post that speaks negatively of the developers. There's biased, then there's fanboy, then there's should-be-getting-a-fucking-paycheck levels of defense force asshattery. No-one doubts where you sit on the scale at this point.

 

[Lastyou1]

I stopped wasting time with Panajev... He keeps on saying that we should be thanking DS because they have "improved" (lol) the game.
Majority of people are saying we could live on even without DS supposed improvements.

We are talking different languages or he simply wants a DS paycheck, that's it.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Look, you can keep dancing in circles for however many posts your daily free time allows: doesn't change the fact that the most hardcore, loyal fans that initially made the game possible are being denied a bonus that's aimed at early adopters when they are the earliest goddamn adopters possible.

And for the love of Christ, stop this shit:



You have the balls to ridicule other people's opinions on the subject when you've done nothing but shill acrobatics from page 1. You're not even being subtle in your mindless, aggressive policing of any post that speaks negatively of the developers. There's biased, then there's fanboy, then there's should-be-getting-a-fucking-paycheck levels of defense force asshattery. No-one doubts where you sit on the scale at this point.

The loyal early backers are getting exclusive bonuses other people are not getting. New small tiny bonuses are given to new pre-orders today... not ideal, but not a huge issue either IMHO. You prefer DS not to have ever been involved and get only the game the original budget would allow.

I put the pro’s and con’s on the project reaching out and securing additional funding on a scale: based on facts, based on what we know it is a net positive.

 

[lukilladog]

...
For example this... I addressed it, but I will do it once more. The game improved thanks to DS's additional funds, the core game is better, KS backers have exclusive pre-order bonus already, why the outrage?
You are getting a better game, what is the moral ground to crucify Ys.Net for not giving you additional free content?
...

A correspondency gets created between the inversions, so this content is using the money from backers to some degree. It´s lame that DS gets to fully benefit from the project started with backers money, but backers have to pay extra for some of the stuff created with DS funds.

...
I put the pro’s and con’s on the project reaching out and securing additional funding on a scale: based on facts, based on what we know it is a net positive.

I don´t think backers being treated like this is a net positive.

 

[Enjay]

, what? What did DS do to you and your family? They must not be saints, but it is getting ridiculous now.
The game scope increased, more stretch goals were added even though the KS did not clear them, and the game is bigger and better as a result. This is making the game better for the backers too.

 

[Panajev2001a]

It may make you laugh, but either you agree I am correct or you address what I said in a constructive manner.

 

[Enjay]

It may make you laugh, but either you agree I am correct or you address what I said in a constructive manner.

That did make me laugh yes. I disagree with the notion that you are correct.

 

[Panajev2001a]

That did make me laugh yes. I disagree with the notion that you are correct.

... and yet you avoid giving reasons why in any shape or form... and deflect with laughter or one liners .

 

[Enjay]

... and yet you avoid giving reasons why in any shape or form... and deflect with laughter or one liners .

Mhm. I disagree. That's all.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Mhm. I disagree. That's all.

I know and that is how the conversation is kind of going: “this is shit! they are scamming people! Hope they fail” —> “how? I disagree because XYZ” —> “ “ / “you have not got a f’ing clue”...

Make a bold statement, avoid supporting it with reasons, mock people, walk away pretending that it is an agree to disagree situation... .

 

[Crowza]

Stick with me.

So, once upon a time there was a game that was so deeply unique that it created a lot of very loyal fans, yet due to multiple internal and externals factors - it was never finished. The last part ends on a tantalizing cliffhanger that only made fans want to know what happened next. Over the course of the next twenty years most rational fans gave up on the possibility of a sequel ever seeing the light of day.

That all changed one day out of the blue at E3 and suddenly - there was hope. Luckily in this moment - a lot of people have the means to immediately back a Kickstarter for hundreds -if not thousands- of dollars. Granted, it wasn't a sure shot and backing the game wouldn't magically make it appear into existence, but it was a "chance". A chance is all that was offered and yet, money poured by fans by the millions by people who just wanted the story to continue.

Fast forward a few years and the game is now finally coming into existence. There is no "chance" any longer, it is going to be actually released! Not only that, but there is further content that is planned to be made in the form of DLC. This means more development, possibly maybe even a further continuance of the story after the game has shipped.. but, the backers, some who spent hundreds and thousands on a "chance" of development - need to spend $20 or $30 more to get more content. OMG NO WAY! I SPENT $500! I SHOULD GET SHENMUE 4 FOR FREE! $20?? IT WILL BANKRUPT ME! FORGET IT! REFUND, ETC. OUTAGE. ETC. ETC. ETC.

I'm glad I've lived into the year 2019 for many reasons, just one of them is to finally get another chapter in the Shenmue series.

But, this fake outrage is fucking bullshit.

 

[vkbest]

I paid $29 (26€) for PS4 version on KS, when buying on PSN will cost 60€. So even if season pass cost 34€ I’m saving money

 

[Kazza]

There was a Kickstarter update last week, in case anyone missed it:




Being a cheapo digital copy backer I won't be getting any goodies. The only one I'm really jealous about is this cool black jacket: