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Star Wars: The Old Republic [Releasing Date: Dec 20 NA/EU - NDA Lifted]
- Thread starter Blackface
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I'm not always into the look of TOR, but the number of unique art assets at play is way ahead of any other MMO. I wish those assets were of a higher quality, but it's impressive nonetheless.
RIFT was terrible. Quest were pretty much all the same with no point to them. Combat was much slower than this game and animations were all the same. The whole RIFT idea got old after the first try. Game ran like shit also. Textures were better I guess but I didn't like the artstyle at all personally.
-tetsuo-
Unlimited Capacity
How is the combat slower than TOR? They play out, like, exactly the same, except TOR animates better. THe quest are also all the same in this. At least in RIFT you are in nice sized zones with dynamic content made for grouping popping up all over the place for which you get great rewards for completing. In TOR, I ran around one zone doing the same fetch and kill quests as any modern MMO except I could talk to people. Great.
The combat in RIFT feels very sluggish and clunky compared to this, doesn't matter that they both use hotkeys. The biggest factor is the animations though.
Every planet in TOR has dozens of heroic areas in the open world that requires a full group to beat. The dynamic RIFTs were all pretty repetitive and got old after a couple of them. The story, choices, and character in the SWTOR quest are what keeps them interesting. RIFT had nothing to make the questing experience actually enjoyable.
Every planet in TOR has dozens of heroic areas in the open world that requires a full group to beat. The dynamic RIFTs were all pretty repetitive and got old after a couple of them. The story, choices, and character in the SWTOR quest are what keeps them interesting. RIFT had nothing to make the questing experience actually enjoyable.
-tetsuo-
Unlimited Capacity
I guess you have played further than I have. I played a Consular up to lvl 12 and it was all nothing out of the ordinary. The quest are just as mundane as ever, and the character interaction doesn't really add anything. The choices I made had no impact besides sliding a meter either way. Like I said earlier if they really wanted to have some nice story driven content they should have looked to DDO for inspiration, not WoW.
So people have to be forced into certain classes they don't even want to play perhaps, just to have fun? Pretty poor design.
No, but if you don't like 1 class, you shouldn't assume the whole game was like that. Not saying some people wouldn't like Jedi Consular, but it's pretty much the general consensus that they have the worse story.
I agree with a lot of this
. I'm torn on wanting to keep my preorder because there are some things I like with the game. I'm not sure any of the things like have anything to do with the MMO aspects of the game though.Smuggler is what people should play.
I gotta say I was extremely sceptic towards The Old Republic when checking out all the previews and videoclips, but after playing it myself, I was actually enjoying it pretty well. Story was nice, voice acting wasnt too bad in most cases, the combat felt fluid (though still too much on the old-school mechanics for me personally) and the quests were pretty well designed too. I liked the bonus quests that gave you a choice of killing X stuff without forcing you while most quests were designed on around more interesting things like "Go and disarm these bombs." "kill just the leaders." and etc. And usually, you would complete the bonus stuff while aiming on doing just the quests. I am myself still looking forward most to Guild Wars 2, but I am considering getting this to play in the wait, it was pretty fun (especially running up to guys and kicking them in the crotch, seriously, smugglers rule).
Yes, maybe the class isn't for you but creating a downright boring class, with a dead duck story and nothing to spruce up your time with the character is still a poor design. Every class should have their own niche and interesting marks - You can already see that people keep recommending the same 2-3 classes for people to start with to have some basic "fun". Then again, I tried these so-called "fun" classes and still wanted to jab my eyes out - Game is pretty bad.
Hmm. I hate rifts art style/engine >.< thats my main problem with the game. Also leveling up takes too long >.> I kinda hate how in mmos lvling up takes up so long, but then end game 'is the real game' idea, and who end game and lvling up are nothing alike, for one thing end game is all group play basically, yet you can solo to max level in every mmo now, indeed its usually alot faster to lvl up if you do it on your lonesome.
Thinking about it, and especially since there is no AUS release date even mentioned.... I think ill just stick to Rift if I want some mmo action before GW2 comes out >.<!
Swtor does things right, the stories are nice, the characters are interesting.... but everything else is kinda ben there dan that (hurr).
I just think they played it too safe, they should have tired to innovate in more areas, voice acting is not a game changer, the choices dont do alot, the questing is as simplistic as possible, the quest design is the same old, the entire template hasnt been changed at all, its simply been reinforced, and thats not good imo, when people are sick of the 'wow' as they are now, many of whom have been playing wow for 6+ years.
As for character stories... well, they are good, but you essentially go through 90% of the same quests in the same zones... I mean, its not going to encourage more play throughs when the only real difference is getting to a room and picking door a/b/c for your little story bit, then doing basically the same thing the rest of the time.
Thinking about it, and especially since there is no AUS release date even mentioned.... I think ill just stick to Rift if I want some mmo action before GW2 comes out >.<!
Swtor does things right, the stories are nice, the characters are interesting.... but everything else is kinda ben there dan that (hurr).
I just think they played it too safe, they should have tired to innovate in more areas, voice acting is not a game changer, the choices dont do alot, the questing is as simplistic as possible, the quest design is the same old, the entire template hasnt been changed at all, its simply been reinforced, and thats not good imo, when people are sick of the 'wow' as they are now, many of whom have been playing wow for 6+ years.
As for character stories... well, they are good, but you essentially go through 90% of the same quests in the same zones... I mean, its not going to encourage more play throughs when the only real difference is getting to a room and picking door a/b/c for your little story bit, then doing basically the same thing the rest of the time.
I hope this is a joke
Also RIFT is one of the most boring MMOs on the market.
At least you have choices. In WoW or RIFT, you will go through the exact same quest no matter what class, besides a few faction based quest. The actual story in SWTOR makes each class differ much more besides class abilities.
-tetsuo-
Unlimited Capacity
It wasn't just the story stuff though. Instead of trying to build something original, they just took the same mundane questing structure and added some 1-2-3 dialogue options into most of them. They don't even do anything, considering that if you are in a group, the dice roll decides what is said.
I will still end up getting it, because my friends have never really played an MMO before and they like it. So we will roll Sith on retail and I'll play as long as they do. I just can't imagine it will be very long. One of them stopped playing the beta after a day, lol.
Heeeeeellll no. Leveling is super easy and super fast in RIFT, just like most modern MMOs. I miss the days of Everquest, being level 8 after a week lost in the woods barely abelto kill one thing alone. Or FFXI< getting to lvl 50 that first time and having to complete a limit break to even level up again. MMOs straight up too easy nowadays.
At least in WoW, no class has some advantage. Like, I wanted to play a Warrior but then I'd have to put up with some boring ass zone, with some super dry story. Then say, the priest, a class I would never play would have tons of awesome quests, awesome story and everything would be a breeze. Fine they want to do a story per class and mix things up, points for that but you can't go and have this kind of imbalance in it all. Get some QA up in that bitch. I'd rather have the exact same quests as everyone else than knowing I have to wade through some boring quests, just because I wanted to play X class
Let's not forget that TOR is aimed at more casual players in which case any kind group finding system would be more than welcome.
I don't really think there's an imbalance. Everyone has an opinion on what story and class they like more, it's not like it's set in concrete what is more fun to people.
No, it wouldn't.
Dungeon finder pros and cons
+ saves time (not that it takes long to get a group on populated servers or if you're in a good guild)
- promotes laziness and less social interaction
- destroys any sense of community
- removes people from actually being out in the world, instead they just stand in cities and use menus to access everything
Just look what it did to WoW. Fuck dungeon finders and everything they stand for. The day Bioware implements it is the day I will stop playing.
If you want to play a class that's like the consular but didn't want the story, you could play a sith inquisitor. Exact same playstyle, different story. Classes also have more variety in this game than WoW. Consular/Sith Inquisitor can play like a mage, priest, rogue, or tank.
Probably not the best example as you just described a druid.
But anyways I want this game to succeed so Blizzard can steal the good parts and put it in WoW!
But if you want to play X class? If I wanted to play a Rogue, I don't want to be told I can play a Druid beause it's almost the same.
And on a different faction as well ... C'mon.
But why do people keep recommending the same 2-3 classes over and over and over again, for people to have fun with? And majority have already agreed there's some classes on some sides that are just downright boring.
There's a very clear imbalance already, some of the people behind certain stories and zones didn't really come through.
See, from what ive seen, there are 4 starting zones, each to about lvl 10, most of them have the exact same quests, just with a few different options based on which class you are. Then there is the 'story' quests which are all at least unique in the story and characters you meet, even if you are basically doing the same thing. Then after that you go to other planets with the rest of the classes, same quests most of the time, same story, just the 'class' quests and stories being tweaked abit for each class.
>.< its not all that revolutionary imo, I like it, but there isnt alot of different content between one class or another, the only difference is the main story of your character, but you still do 90% of these other quests if you want to lvl up, and they are all the same. And the story quests just have you go through different doors, or loot different things in essentially the same quests.
Dungeon finder works if it is restricted to the realm you are on only, that way you are not never going to see those people again.
And the problem with class... 'variety' is that at lvl 10 you are forced to pick, and cant unchoose, so you dont really have all that much variety, you either pick healer/dps or tank dps or dps/dps
I know all that, but look at the problem from the point of view of the company. The main selling point of the game (aside from being SW) is the story. By focusing and advertising this part, they want as many people as possible to progress it without downtimes, which looking for groups may cause.
I get your point and I also don't like MMOs without social interactions/with lot of empty areas outside of towns because of the dungeon teleports, but I think in this case it would really profit the company.
Perhaps, I've only played 2 different classes so I'm not exactly qualified to comment on everything but I've enjoyed both of them so far. Imperial Agent was more engaging to me than Jedi Consular, though.
Druid is also the only class with that much variety in WoW. Most classes in SWTOR can do most roles.
Again, just because you don't like it doesn't mean everyone wont. There is actually variety in the stories and that's a good thing. It's better to have only one class you don't like because of the quest than every class because the quest are all the same.
No they cant >.< you essentially pick a role at lvl 10 and are restricted completely in what you do, no class can do all 3 I dont think.
You know this isn't about "Oh I just don't like the story", this is because the stories or zones are downright poor. Maybe I'm a huge Jedi Consular and love their story outside of the game but maybe the *shock* writers just put up some muck and the designers just made some shit ( Starting zone etc. ), which seems to be the case with some classes, whilst other classes just got all decent stuff.
LaserBuddha
Member
Never played Rift, but I agree with everything you're saying about TOR. I played the beta for several hours just because it has fleeting glimpses of the magic of Star Wars (the Sith space station you hit after you leave the starting planet is pretty cool!), but I've definitely decided not to purchase it. Bioware's stature in my mind has gone down yet another notch.
Here are some randomized gripes:
- This game spans a GALAXY, but there is NO exploration. Exploration is the one thing, other than the social aspects, that MMOs naturally excel in over single-player games. No MMO I've ever played has had good enough story or gameplay (compared to single player games) to be able to stand on it's own without exploration.
- The gameplay is a straight up copy of WoW, even down to the "rage" meter on the Sith Warrior I tried out. In other words it's boring, even when it's challenging (which it rarely ever is.). Of course with Star Wars fights being about laser swords and a lot of guns, I feel like action-based gameplay a-la Mass Effect would have been the best choice. Being able to really take cover would go a long way to making it feel like the gun battles in the movies. That aside, auto-aimed shooting is just about the most boring thing there is.
- The race selection is shameful. A game with Star Wars on the box needs to have stimulating race variety, but even a generic fantasy MMO beats what is offered here. These are all just recolors of a human, with some doodads here and there like a crappy episode of Star Trek. We can't have any of the iconic species from a franchise largely remembered for it's cantina scene? You're really going to be lazier than EVERY OTHER MMO maker out there, and pretty much just create one human model and tack different colors on it? Even WoW can put on a hell of a better "cantina scene" than your STAR WARS MMO.
- I guess the real draw here is the dialogue/cutscene aspect. It does make quests a lot more memorable than WoW, where I often didn't even read the quest. The quests themselves are still very uninspired, and the cutscenes are of little use to me since they are just people standing around talking. That's something that has put me off a bit even to the Mass Effect series, because endless scenes of people standing around talking just puts me to sleep.
- Theme park
- ...but one of those crappy theme parks where all the rides are just a little too far away from each other.
- This is really an ugly game. The saddest part is, when you see rocky areas like Korriban, or any of those mini dungeons in the starting area, you see that they were aping Blizzard textures and "chunkiness". It doesn't feel like a good fit for Star Wars. But worse than that, it has no personality, no charm. This graphical fidelity is fine for a 7-year old game, but it's not fine for a game just coming out in 2011, with an audience looking for something to stick with for a long time.
You pick an Advance Class at level 10, and each Advanced Class has 3 talent trees. Most Advanced Classes can perform multiple roles, usually healing and damage or tanking and damage. You can respec your talent trees, but you currently can't change Advanced Classes. Bioware did say you would be able to change Advanced Class for free the first time, then anything after would charge you. It was a while ago though so I'm not sure of their current stance.
- The race selection is shameful. A game with Star Wars on the box needs to have stimulating race variety, but even a generic fantasy MMO beats what is offered here. These are all just recolors of a human, with some doodads here and there like a crappy episode of Star Trek. We can't have any of the iconic species from a franchise largely remembered for it's cantina scene? You're really going to be lazier than EVERY OTHER MMO maker out there, and pretty much just create one human model and tack different colors on it? Even WoW can put on a hell of a better "cantina scene" than your STAR WARS MMO.
So true.... there are basically 'small, normal, large and fat' for all male characters, just with some head stuff differentiating the races. Why? I dont understand it at all, take one of the positives from star wars, races from an entire freaking galaxy, and make them all the freaking same humanoid with nothing really different? Its retardicular. Its probably down to lazziness, but I would have prefered some variety there... honestly is more important to me than hearing quests of reading them >.>
So true.... there are basically 'small, normal, large and fat' for all male characters, just with some head stuff differentiating the races. Why? I dont understand it at all, take one of the positives from star wars, races from an entire freaking galaxy, and make them all the freaking same humanoid with nothing really different? Its retardicular. Its probably down to lazziness, but I would have prefered some variety there... honestly is more important to me than hearing quests of reading them >.>
-bakalhau-
Member
I think the game looks fantastic. With AA = 4 it just looks phenomenal. Great art style overall... It has that cartoony look but that's exactly what makes it look so good. It looks the same 100% of the time, which is, imo, great. Character models look wonderful too. Again, they're not supposed to look realistic and that's why they look good. It's a good cartoony style like TF2.
The Jedi started world looks really, really good.
I guess I'm the only one.
The Jedi started world looks really, really good.
I guess I'm the only one.
LaserBuddha
Member
If you took this game, sans the multiplayer, and called it KOTOR, Mass Effect, or Dragon Age, it would be the most disappointing sequel in video game history.
The game pauses to give you mission briefing and other dialogue in cutscenes. Everything else is the most generic MMO grind (kill 10 of these, pick up 3 of these) and unnecessarily long/hazardous travel to pad the content. There is nothing to do in this world but kill mobs and pickup/turn in quests.
I've been all the weekend playing this game and I think that is the best mmo that I've tested. It's something like WoW 2 meets Mass Effect, it's excellent. The story is amazing, the quests are not ever the same, the instances are fun and the ost is incredible. Before the beta I didn't have preordered the game, but now, is one of my most anticipated games. The day one I'll be inside playing like a jedi guardian. See u guys.
NemesisPrime
Banned
I think a lot of you are being very harsh on the game.
The conversations had me laughing and shouting "OMG! Hell yeah" many times. This has never happened in an MMO before (for me). BTW playing a very dark side Bounty Hunter.
I am rating it above WoW on almost all fronts TBH (except smoothness of graphics... that was a bit of a disappointment). Also the PvP is kinda weak (Throwing balls? REALLY???).
The conversations had me laughing and shouting "OMG! Hell yeah" many times. This has never happened in an MMO before (for me). BTW playing a very dark side Bounty Hunter.
I am rating it above WoW on almost all fronts TBH (except smoothness of graphics... that was a bit of a disappointment). Also the PvP is kinda weak (Throwing balls? REALLY???).
-tetsuo-
Unlimited Capacity
If only every game had such variety in quest. In this one, I killed 15 twi'lek and took a left to talk to a person/computer/rock with carvings in it. In the next, I took a RIGHT after killing 15 flesh raiders to talk to the next person/computer/rock with carvings in it.
I didn't any quest like these, when I had quests with these objectives were bonus quests. The main quests for the jedis are very diferents.
-tetsuo-
Unlimited Capacity
lol@ bonus objectives in this shit as well
"Kill 12 Flesh Raiders". The flesh raiders HAVE to be killed, they are on the damn walkway leading to this guy I have to talk to. Terrible. No, killing the enemies is not part of the quest. They are however in the way, and you have to kill them.
No, they don't have to be killed. That's why It's called BONUS quest. They are in the area and you can kill them if you want to for a little extra xp, but you don't have to at all. In the hundreds of hours I've played this game, I don't remember one time where a BONUS quest was actually required.
Its bonus XP. And I have skipped PLENTY of them. So no, they do not HAVE to be killed.
Generally, you cant get to quest objectives unless you kill some of them though. I never went out of my way to do the 'bonus' ones, well once >.<, but usually it just happens because you need to clear a path to your objective.
actually, it's a great addition. because like you said, you are killing them anyways, it turns them from annoyance to at least worth it because you get an extra easy 2-4k xp.
but anything to speed up leveling is welcomed. not sure why that system still exists to be honest.
Oni Link 666
Member
I played a Jedi Knight to lv 9 tonight and really liked it. The story is mostly lame so far, but there are interesting parts. I think the quests are pretty good. They're nothing too different from WoW, but they're alright. I don't feel like I'm doing the same shit over and over and I feel like it matters more in the world than some stupid shit I did for a Goblin in Vashjir. Goblin quests are the worst.
I also like the combat. I think they do a good job of making you feel powerful even at such a low level and I like that there is no auto attack. It just feels like I actually have to learn my class to make it through the quests.
I also like the combat. I think they do a good job of making you feel powerful even at such a low level and I like that there is no auto attack. It just feels like I actually have to learn my class to make it through the quests.
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