EruditeHobo
Member
Haven't played the game, I was tagged here for no logical reason that I can discern myself... but since I'm here I must say, that is a solid twist.
Let the scales fall from your eyes, good sir:
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Haven't played the game, I was tagged here for no logical reason that I can discern myself... but since I'm here I must say, that is a solid twist.
Let the scales fall from your eyes, good sir:
Explosive Zombie
Banned
I can't believe people even liked life is strange season 1. I mean yeah it had me going for a few episodes the aesthetic and how cringey it was was a problem but it had me invested and then the last two episodes just absolutely ruined that investment. The vampire game they made is just average it's not offensively bad like these but then again I didn't finish it yet.
Jon Neu
Banned
By your own summary, it's literally used to portray
a parent
So it's pretty much what I said it is.
The game is filled with the trans character suffering oppression for being trans and the final emotional twist has to do with
his trans identity being accepted by a book about raising a little trans child.
The fact that the game has more content doesn't negate the political nature of it.
I read the OP, which was pretty informative.
And after reading your spoilers, it's clear I wasn't wrong regarding the book being sold so hard as something good.
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SCB3
Member
Vampyr, Remember Me and the First LiS were pretty good
Explosive Zombie
Banned
Vampyr wasn't good enough for me to sit through sjw stuff piled on top of it. and then life is strange doesn't even have satisfying gameplay loops like a vampyr attempts to have. I don't know how anyone is okay with those two endings or that second to last episode in particular.
Vampire On Titus
Member
No, what you said is that it fetishizes having a trans kid (it doesn't in any way) and to do so it shows the book as "so cool and progressive" (also not true).
You've now shifted your position so that showing the mom in any degree of a positive light satisfies your initial claim. It doesn't.
Do you think any element of a trans parent being depicted as positive is tantamount to propaganda? Because that's what you're demonstrating with your arguments and that's dumb as fuck.
Jon Neu
Banned
Seems you didn't understand what I said.
But anyway, the game fetishizes trans people, literally.
When will we have a game about someone who just happens to be trans instead of games about someone who's identity is being trans?
The book is literally the proof that his mother was a good mother who accepted his trans identity. How is that not being cool and progressive?
I haven't shifted anything. The fact that the mom is shown in a positive light by the book, simply corroborates what I said.
It's pretty trans-parent to me (ha, get it?).
Maybe the mother was cheerful and that obviously doesn't have anything to do with her son being trans. But if she is being depicted as someone good because she wrote or read books about how to raise a trans child, then that part is pretty propagandistic.
I don't know if you can see the difference.
Vampire On Titus
Member
The mom does have good and negative points outside of the trans subject matter. Literally there's an entire other Twins worth of experience that never saw her through an issue of trans identity. It's only you assuming her characterization begins and ends there because you read a really dumb post on GAF and called it a day.
I can quite clearly see you tap dancing between any argument you need to use to fit your preconceived notion despite the only plot thread you know in detail coming from the description I gave you.
i have read that the trans stuff takes a back seat in part 2 & 3
TheMay30thMan
Member
I mean, the game’s themes weren’t a secret to anyone so I’m not sure why OP is surprised. Maybe do your homework next time?
Hayabusabruh
Member
The sister with the red beanie is foine!
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
I'd be curious to know why these guys got so fucking weird. Remember Me was pretty good.
Hayabusabruh
Member
I had to clip this part. If The Last of Us was an Xbox exclusive. Lol
Heimdall_Xtreme
Jim Ryan Fanclub's #1 Member
Now Joel is a drunk redneck?
Explosive Zombie
Banned
While this tangent belongs in this thread more than the one I accidentally put it in it's still not fully on-topic so I dunno, do with this what you want, I like musing on these things
I never got the feeling TLOU II was ramming some agenda in my face. The entire argument for Abby being too much is just her appearing as she does. Does the game focus on it narratively? Is her superiority to men some overt narrative? You can also point to intent, Druckman stated his intent, that he has an agenda... but I think most creative minds DO. It's just what is that agenda and how does it affect the quality of the product? If the immersion is broken by Abby's abs then it's broken... there's nothing I can say to change that. Telling someone they're wrong to feel that way doesn't do much. I let immersion falter all the time, personally, I enjoyed Overlord despite historical inaccuracies (before anyone says it, I know it's a sort-of sci-fi/horror war movie but the central conceit is that it all COULD HAVE happened and that's broken by certain decisions they made) but do I begrudge someone else for having problems with it?
Here's the way I look at it...
Some people are going to play a game and say "OMG look at all the x race and y genders! FORCED DIVERSITY" regardless of the situation, location or anything else about the game...
Some other people are cognizant of people in a board room deciding collectively that cultural marxism will be pushed via their game regardless of whether or not their audience likes it. This to me, goes beyond the diversity issue, though, look at Outer Worlds. In Outer Worlds I can respect an egalitarian future where gender and color doesn't matter, simple productivity because it's corporate future... but why is everyone so ugly and androgynous looking? It's not a deal breaker, even when I had trouble making an attractive character via the character creator it didn't really matter because you only talk through text and barely ever see your character. If they had leaned into the idea that part of the corporate utopia was corporate wokeness and that metrosexuality/androgyny and all that were pushed in that world it could also work but it's not played that way at all. It's a small concern, again didn't ruin the game for me.
But who am I to tell someone they're sexist/racist/homophobic/whatever for having a problem with some of this? You need to go case by case, person by person and examine arguments as they're presented. Coming up with straw man boogeymen does no one any favors and considering the game we're talking about it's not hard to believe it's FORCED in some way.
I also agree, when it comes to artists with passion... they should do what they want. If a trans person wants to make a game about their experience why should they be stopped? The market will decide if it's worth their time and if they decide it's not you've got to live with that. We can no more force people to consume media they don't want to than we can force artists to suppress their passion. Intent is a hard thing to judge but in the video game world, especially since Gamergate there's been a push to change games from what was intended. We've seen it in action.
With this game I think SJW politics IS their passion and in this case it's why I'm not very interested. These are artists who want us to vote Biden and change the English language to suit them, to ignore biological science and to defund the police. I'm all for every voice getting a platform, but no one is forcing me to listen to that voice and so long as this is a free world they never will.
I never got the feeling TLOU II was ramming some agenda in my face. The entire argument for Abby being too much is just her appearing as she does. Does the game focus on it narratively? Is her superiority to men some overt narrative? You can also point to intent, Druckman stated his intent, that he has an agenda... but I think most creative minds DO. It's just what is that agenda and how does it affect the quality of the product? If the immersion is broken by Abby's abs then it's broken... there's nothing I can say to change that. Telling someone they're wrong to feel that way doesn't do much. I let immersion falter all the time, personally, I enjoyed Overlord despite historical inaccuracies (before anyone says it, I know it's a sort-of sci-fi/horror war movie but the central conceit is that it all COULD HAVE happened and that's broken by certain decisions they made) but do I begrudge someone else for having problems with it?
Here's the way I look at it...
Some people are going to play a game and say "OMG look at all the x race and y genders! FORCED DIVERSITY" regardless of the situation, location or anything else about the game...
Some other people are cognizant of people in a board room deciding collectively that cultural marxism will be pushed via their game regardless of whether or not their audience likes it. This to me, goes beyond the diversity issue, though, look at Outer Worlds. In Outer Worlds I can respect an egalitarian future where gender and color doesn't matter, simple productivity because it's corporate future... but why is everyone so ugly and androgynous looking? It's not a deal breaker, even when I had trouble making an attractive character via the character creator it didn't really matter because you only talk through text and barely ever see your character. If they had leaned into the idea that part of the corporate utopia was corporate wokeness and that metrosexuality/androgyny and all that were pushed in that world it could also work but it's not played that way at all. It's a small concern, again didn't ruin the game for me.
But who am I to tell someone they're sexist/racist/homophobic/whatever for having a problem with some of this? You need to go case by case, person by person and examine arguments as they're presented. Coming up with straw man boogeymen does no one any favors and considering the game we're talking about it's not hard to believe it's FORCED in some way.
I also agree, when it comes to artists with passion... they should do what they want. If a trans person wants to make a game about their experience why should they be stopped? The market will decide if it's worth their time and if they decide it's not you've got to live with that. We can no more force people to consume media they don't want to than we can force artists to suppress their passion. Intent is a hard thing to judge but in the video game world, especially since Gamergate there's been a push to change games from what was intended. We've seen it in action.
With this game I think SJW politics IS their passion and in this case it's why I'm not very interested. These are artists who want us to vote Biden and change the English language to suit them, to ignore biological science and to defund the police. I'm all for every voice getting a platform, but no one is forcing me to listen to that voice and so long as this is a free world they never will.
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Lionel Richie
Member
I feel like the joke's on you OP, Life is Strange is an absolute shit looking game from a mile away and there's so much decent stuff to try so why even bother?
bender
What time is it?
People were so overwhelmingly positive with Life is Strange that I ended up trying it despite being weary of the characters. I really disliked the game as it felt like the character dialogue was adults trying to send like teenagers. I think i'm mostly over this genre of game. I remember being fascinated by Indigo Prophecy. Sure it's filled with all of the terrible things that David Cage tends to insert into his narratives but there were segments and moments that really showed potential. The Walking Dead Season 1 and Until Dawn probably came as close to living up to that potential as I've seen. Too bad the follow-up efforts to those games never matched those highs (in the case of the Walking Dead, it got progressively worse and Man of Medan was just terrible all together). Little Hope looks interesting though. /ramble
Explosive Zombie
Banned
For me I played it because anything time travel has my attention... but it does some of the things that time travel fiction likes to do that I absolutely hate and since it's so character-centric where they go with the characters really upset me. Not going to bother with part 2 where Trump's border Wall is the big bad.
Lionel Richie
Member
Thank God time travel is not my fetish. I saw the danger hair early and I knew from day one it was a no-hoper.
Danjin44
The nicest person on this forum
If thats the case then you are going to love 13 Sentinels!
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Explosive Zombie
Banned
Yeah, I've enjoyed some of the lowest rent games because time travel, stuff like Singularity and TimeShift. My favorite levels in Titanfall 2 and Dishonored 2 were the time travel levels by far, as well.
SF Kosmo
Al Jazeera Special Reporter
I don't want to spoil shit, but it's none of those things. It's a pivotal story beat, but it's a retrospective one. It's also worth mentioning that it's found alongside a conversion therapy pamphlet so it's a conflicted one as well. This is a game about putting together the pieces of the past.
It really isn't, though. It appears that way at first, but then they totally subvert the trope, and I quite liked it.
It's also French writers trying to sound like Americans. The series has gotten a lot better about this as it has gone on.
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bender
What time is it?
That's probably why the dialog felt off to me.
SF Kosmo
Al Jazeera Special Reporter
I finished Episode 1 tonight.
Reviews I have read seemed to suggest this one might peak early, but I have to say it's a very good start. It feels a lot closer to a Life is Strange title than I was expecting, even, it could almost be part of the series except for the change in art style and the focus on adult characters. And it seems to have better production values than LiS too (thanks, MS). It's well written, and subverted a lot of my expectations. It handles the subject of transphobia with a lot more nuance than LiS2 did racism, and doesn't make it the sole focus of the story. Instead it just adds dimensionality to the story.
Pleasantly surprised so far.
Reviews I have read seemed to suggest this one might peak early, but I have to say it's a very good start. It feels a lot closer to a Life is Strange title than I was expecting, even, it could almost be part of the series except for the change in art style and the focus on adult characters. And it seems to have better production values than LiS too (thanks, MS). It's well written, and subverted a lot of my expectations. It handles the subject of transphobia with a lot more nuance than LiS2 did racism, and doesn't make it the sole focus of the story. Instead it just adds dimensionality to the story.
Pleasantly surprised so far.
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Vawn
Banned
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
nikolino840
Member
Anyway this is just the prologue
Need the main episode and the epilogue to judge
And yes trans exist in the real world so what can we do?
Try to understand the situation or praise the lord to save them?
And as i said before, the main theme is the family not the transphobia,this is just the subject of the plot but could be everything
I saw many tv series (mainly law & order) where the subject of the plot is a kid having problem with the family and ended bad for the kids or the parents but the theme is the same
Need the main episode and the epilogue to judge
And yes trans exist in the real world so what can we do?
Try to understand the situation or praise the lord to save them?
And as i said before, the main theme is the family not the transphobia,this is just the subject of the plot but could be everything
I saw many tv series (mainly law & order) where the subject of the plot is a kid having problem with the family and ended bad for the kids or the parents but the theme is the same
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anothertech
Member
I wonder what would happen if a indie level dev came out and said 'if you're a gay or trans person of color, this game is not for you'
Forsythia
Member
While I like to laugh at transtrenders and non-binary attention seeking whores, the woke left was told to make their own game instead of shoe-horning identity politics into existing franchises. This is what you get, and we were told upfront, so I don't see the need to whine that much.
I'm going to play it for myself to see what they cooked up, it's on GamePass, so why not. If I don't like the first episode I won't play the rest, it's that easy.
I'm going to play it for myself to see what they cooked up, it's on GamePass, so why not. If I don't like the first episode I won't play the rest, it's that easy.
Humdinger
Member
I'm fine with them making a game like this -- artistic freedom and all. I don't have any interest in the subject matter, though, so I'll skip. I appreciate that trans people struggle in ways I don't, but that's true of many forms of suffering/struggle. I don't play games to have my awareness expanded of the different forms of struggle/suffering people experience. That's just not what I play games for.
M1chl
Currently Gif and Meme Champion
I did not said, that trans people does not exists, that I don't respect them or anything like. Or even that they was not up-front with what is that game going to be with, as a main character. However the problem which I have that the message, for the people who is probably the target audience, is not really positive in any sense and with that saidI naively hope for a game, while trans, not just about being trans. Because in this sense, it gives the person quite one dymensional look. Game is not bad for having trans character, hell swap it with straight character and it's going to be even more plain.
I think I lack quite a bit with my articulate skills, when it comes pushing my point through. And by "woke" I mean, that they push some sort of narrative which is not productive, helpful and just make people victims which let's be real, many of them don't want to be.
nikolino840
Member
Even if the message is to treat with calm and speaking with the son or daughter about gender disphoria you think is a bad message?
The best is to kick their ass out the house?
Happened To my father's cousin because she had fallen in love with a black boy she married after
As you see happen bad things in the world around the family...
And this in tell me why , is one of this stories (with ESP powers) , is not an lgbt propaganda
Vampire On Titus
Member
Correct, and this is true of the first episode as well. Tyler's gender identity is one of many plot threads but the main plot revolves around finding out what really happened to Tyler and Alyson's mother in the last few months of her life. You find out within the first hour Tyler wasn't targeted by their mom for being trans. So the entire main thrust of the mystery is about something else entirely and finding out what that something else is.
M1chl
Currently Gif and Meme Champion
Arguing the absolutes, it's not really a productive discussion. I haven't said that, what you imply. No you definitely should be parent in a good faith and don't do cruel stupid shit to your kids, not matter who they are. That father is some dumb fuck who probably care a lot about his reputation about his readneck white friends, because otherwise do this henious shit to your child is reprehensible. That's not what I am saying. I kind of look from my eyes, not really as parent, because I am not one. So basically, I try to be empathic towards the main character and I can do that, however I think that people should be given some form of hope. Not in a way, that this is going to happen to you, if you are going out about your situation, let's put it this way. That if you are trans, that your parents going to hate you, you are going to be isolated with just your sibling (which could very well methaphorically can be displayed as living in the remote area) and nobody is going to understand you, especially not old people. Even though in the game, that old guy was pretty respectable when he was given direction, let's just say. But that way it was communicated, sounds more condescening than anything, which I do not find is the way. That clerk in the shop, was also doing some awkward shit and his wife or who that lady in the shop was, wanted send you to the conversion camp theraphy. So attack on you everywhere.
Being born in the wrong body must be hard enough and the narrative, that is push by woke media is that basically "don't even try, because everyone is going to hate you, joins us, the most tolerant group™"...seems like other people who don't even know you has influence on your life way bigger than you want.
And where I am coming from this, I have multiple mental health issues thoughout my life, I was in mental asylums and things like that. I know people first hand, who has been feeling really down with the "why even try" mentality, when they were different and there is not much hope for them to have their own life. And based on statistic, trans people killing themself in a big way, so since couple people suicided themselfs and obviously I was pretty close, I don't want it to continue and I don't this to be the only narrative. Being victim by some proxy political/culture war is bad.
So I hope I write it in a understanble way.
Fart Knight
Al Pachinko, Konami President
Dontnod games have been going downhill. I enjoyed LiS tho. Played a lil bit of TMW, got off the boat but I cant stomach this shit.
Humdinger
Member
You quoted my message in your post, so I'll just clarify -- I wasn't implying that you were saying any of that. I was just stating my own point of view.
I hear what you're saying about the character seeming too one-dimensional. I don't have an opinion on that, because I'm not going to play the game.
Again, it's not because I have anything against a developer making a game about trans people. It's just because I don't find it particularly interesting, personally, and I don't play games to be morally enlightened about the suffering or struggle of some small subgroup.
I mean, we can divide humanity up into thousands of different subgroups, each of them suffering and struggling with their own troubles. No one is making videogames about them. I'm okay if trans people get a videogame focused on their issues, but I do think the attention this one particular subgroup gets is disproportionate.
ShadowWolf712
Member
From the studio that gave me "Stupid GUN!"?
nah, i'm good
nah, i'm good
M1chl
Currently Gif and Meme Champion
I guess that's why they have that "trans" prefix, you know...
nikolino840
Member
So...finished the game?
M1chl
Currently Gif and Meme Champion
Not yet, but finished second episode, but my opinion have not change that much. That begining of second episode fucked me up pretty badly.
Well, it was a great game.
the only thing I missed was the going back the time travel thing from part one where you just could see direct consequences are alter course. But we'll it is what it is a dramatic story driven game. And I absolutely love it and my wife, too.
Yes, you could tell in advance how the game would end and maybe a little bit backstory here and there would have been great, but it still was one of those rare gems we don't see often.
The game also had the courage to speak about hard topics in relevant ways.
And by the way
the only thing I missed was the going back the time travel thing from part one where you just could see direct consequences are alter course. But we'll it is what it is a dramatic story driven game. And I absolutely love it and my wife, too.
Yes, you could tell in advance how the game would end and maybe a little bit backstory here and there would have been great, but it still was one of those rare gems we don't see often.
The game also had the courage to speak about hard topics in relevant ways.
And by the way
in the end it all wasn't about a transgender thing as everyone should know who really played the game.
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Paperboy
Member
Just finished Tell Me Why and it's a nice little story. Less of a game than Life Is Strange, more like an interactive TV series. But just like Life Is Strange the biggest appeal was the settings and the worlds they brought me to. The story and gameplay in Tell Me Why isn't as appealing as in Life Is Strange. The transgender theme is there throughout the whole game but it's never in your face, in my opinion. And I'm one of those "bad" CIS males who don't dislike Trump etc. You know the game is going to be woke before you play it, either be open to see something from another perspective or ignore the game all together.
I agree. They tried to make Rachael miss perfect, despite what we already knew about her from LIS 1.
I will point out that the Farewell DLC Chapter of BTS with Max and Chloe was great, but incredibly bittersweet and short