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[ClosingADoor]

You'd think they would release the most important people first. Make the biggest splash.

Doesn't have to be. I hope they put out these clear cases first, have our Western leaders and such condemn it and then hit them with their own corruption if it is there.

There are already cases of UK politicians it seems also.

 

[Funky Papa]

Assad and Putin close friends, no big US politicians, it smell like a diversion job : feed the disposable ones to quell the plebs.

Out of curiosity, is the Icelandic PM the one who wanted to save the Icelandic banks ?

There are enough high profile American allies to make a huge mess. The Ukrainian revelations alone are massive.

 

[Out 1]

From what I've heard (second-hand insider info; just claims, nothing concrete), Poroshenko and Putin's almost daily contact was coming a tad short of being described as collusion. While Russia was openly invading Ukraine.

Poroshenko should be impeached and prosecuted over this leak.

 

[WhateverItTakes]

Dave Cameron's dad being involved is pretty funny, hope Corbyn brings it up in Parliament.

I just wonder, considering this is mostly based on tax loopholes and stuff if much of it is actually illegal. PR disaster for sure but I imagine some of these figures can shrug it off.

The sad part is this is just information from one company. Just think how many firms there are exactly like this who'll forever remain unknown to the world.

 

[Vastag]

Independent outlets (like meduza.io, Rain TV channel, slon.ru) are covering it. Echo FM station, judging by their website, is also reporting the leak. They are owned by Gazprom, but are kept semi-independent so the intelligentsia has some outlet to blow off steam. Nothing so far from pro-government or government-owned news agencies. And I'm 99.99% certain the state TV is going to ignore this.

Someone who actually lives in Russia should have a better perspective than me, as the above is just a result of a quick search.

Thanks for the update.

 

[Quixzlizx]

As someone active in leftist politics I hope this means we can stop the Ukraine-EU deal and deal some blow to neoliberal parties. Gotta make the most of this leak. The coming week will be field day all day every day.

Communism will bring about a corruption-free society, as proven by the governments of:

 

[curls]

Any US / Brits apart from Cameron's dad?

Been seeing quite a few of these dumps of data in the past week.

 

[Platy]

OF COURSE the brazilian president of the Chamber of Deputies is in it !

Fuck you, Cunha

 

[God of Gamblers]

So how does this kind of thing work?

Say you have £200 million and place that in an off shore company.

A. Does the country in which the person resides not get suspicious as to why £200 million is being moved.

B. Once its been moved off shore, do authorities not get suspicious when money is again moved by on shore? i.e, how is can the money be used with out arousing?

 

[Phantast2k]

‏@OCCRP

As if tonight wasn't enough, there's plenty more from the #Panamapapers coming tomorrow and over the next few days. Stay tuned.

Schroeder and his pal Blair should first and foremost be hanged for their countless betrayals of the working class. And if I'm not mistaken, Gabriel is also part of the new right wing-social democracy, therefore I have no sympathies for him. I'm not sure what you're trying to imply here? That I'm an SPD voter and just against the CDU or something? I'm not, I'm not even from germany.

2) just a thought, how about not going to bed with either one? how's that? There was absolutely no need to take sides. (but that's not really relevant to this thread)

1) You specifically mentioned the CDU, but fair enough.

2) You're right it's off topic, but I will quote & comment on this in the Ukraine OT today (if the time permits it) or tomorrow.

/

From what I've heard (second-hand insider info; just claims, nothing concrete), Poroshenko and Putin's almost daily contact was coming a tad short of being described as collusion. While Russia was openly invading Ukraine.

Poroshenko should be impeached and prosecuted over this leak.

I agree, even though I'm not 100% sure it'll be better for Ukraine as upheaval there will only serve Russia.

 

[eyeball_kid]

I'm kind of shocked that there aren't any U.S. politicians in here, or has not all of the data been publicized yet?

 

[Strax]

Out of curiosity, is the Icelandic PM the one who wanted to save the Icelandic banks ?

Nope.

 

[Condom]

Communism will bring about a corruption-free society, as proven by the governments of:

Communism by definition means having no government. Nice try tho

 

[Randomizer123454444]

People might downplay this that "nothing will change", but these kinds of leaks are the proof that is needed to turn "tinfoil conspiracy theorists" into something people take seriously.

Also yikes, the bank I'm using has been actively helping customers set up these tax haven corporations. Looks like I'll have to wait and see if there are any "clean" banks after the dust settles and switch my bank.

 

[ClosingADoor]

So how does this kind of thing work?

Say you have £200 million and place that in an off shore company.

A. Does the country in which the person resides not get suspicious as to why £200 million is being moved.

B. Once its been moved off shore, do authorities not get suspicious when money is again moved by on shore? i.e, how is can the money be used with out arousing?

In most cases you basically move money around through different companies towards the country with the lowest tax. You create a firm in that country, then write some expenses towards them for licensing a brand name or whatever, so that all your profit in country A is gone and little is taxed there. Then you pay the tax in country B which is lower.

After that you can use that money for investments or other activities. Some companies need to keep it off shore to prevent paying taxes when bringing it back. But the owner of the companies can still use the money I think, just like how you spent money on vacation in another country where that money wasn't earned.

 

[Damerman]

Assad and Putin close friends, no big US politicians, it smell like a diversion job : feed the disposable ones to quell the plebs.

Out of curiosity, is the Icelandic PM the one who wanted to save the Icelandic banks ?

This. I'm surprised there are no american names yet.

 

[SymbiantXenos]

Massive news this.

 

[Vastag]

I'm kind of shocked that there aren't any U.S. politicians in here, or has not all of the data been publicized yet?

Nope, they are doing it in small batches, they just made public some of the names today.

 

[1.21Gigawatts]

This. I'm surprised there are no american names yet.

They smart.

 

[Dictator93]

This is pretty great. Happy to hear about journalists being able to expose this level of corruption.

 

[Quixzlizx]

Communism by definition means having no government. Nice try tho

And "true" capitalism is also a utopia. Looks like we're tied!

 

[Out 1]

Thanks for the update.

Update: Vedomosti (Russia's equivalent to FT; country's best newspaper) and RBK (Russia's Bloomberg, I guess; owned by billionaire Prokhorov) are now reporting on the leak as well.

 

[chadskin]

FAQ:

How big is it?
Mossack Fonseca is the world’s fourth biggest provider of offshore services. It has acted for more than 300,000 companies. There is a strong UK connection. More than half of the companies are registered in British-administered tax havens, as well as in the UK itself.

Are all people who use offshore structures crooks?
No. Using offshore structures is entirely legal. There are many legitimate reasons for doing so. Business people in countries such as Russia and Ukraine typically put their assets offshore to defend them from “raids” by criminals, and to get around hard currency restrictions. Others use offshore for reasons of inheritance and estate planning.

Are some people who use offshore structures crooks?
Yes. In a speech last year in Singapore, David Cameron said “the corrupt, criminals and money launderers” take advantage of anonymous company structures. The government is trying to do something about this. It wants to set up a central register that will reveal the beneficial owners of offshore companies. From June, UK companies will have to reveal their “significant” owners for the first time.

via http://www.theguardian.com/news/2016/apr/03/what-you-need-to-know-about-the-panama-papers

 

[Purkake4]

Update: Vedomosti (Russia's equivalent to FT; country's best newspaper) and RBK (Russia's Bloomberg, I guess; owned by billionaire Prokhorov) are now reporting on the leak as well.

Everything or just the "useful" bits?

 

[Out 1]

I agree, even though I'm not 100% sure it'll be better for Ukraine as upheaval there will only serve Russia.

It won't help, but what else can be done? Ukrainians are incredibly efficient in ousting assholes, but, so far, are proving to be unable to build even a resemblance of a functioning democratic state.

 

[Vol5]

It's difficult to even wrap your head around the scale of this, and it's just one law firm that's been compromised. It'll be very interesting to see how this plays out over the next few weeks and months. It really does seem like corruption really runs wilder than even some conspiracy theories may have thought, albeit in a rather mundane way.

These people are not corrupt criminally with regards to these leaks. Off shore tax avoidance is a legal enterprise. These leaks will be highly embarrassing for those contained within but if you earn a tonne of cash, the tried and trusted way you make more money is to avoid tax and have a directorship setup for an offshore company.

Now whether these people are morally corrupt is another question and the answer probably depends on how much money you earn and how much tax you pay.

Edit: I live in one of the countries mentioned as having these structures in place. In fact I'd say our whole economy is built on it.

 

[Barajas_201]

I hope something happens with Peña Nieto, he got away with his white house the last time so I'm not too confident in anything good happening in Mexico.

Of course their aren't any Americans in this leaks, they're actually smart and prefer to use other services like the Clinton Foundation.

Spoiler

I am joking HillGAF, please don't kill me.

 

[Out 1]

Everything or just the "useful" bits?

Everything. Putin's name is in the headline on RBK.

 

[maquiladora]

Iceland PM facing calls for a no confidence vote and snap elections. The government there may fall because of this.

 

[KDR_11k]

It's difficult to even wrap your head around the scale of this, and it's just one law firm that's been compromised.

Yeah, this being only one company probably leaves massive holes in the coverage of who's involved. So if you're missing your favorite scum there they might just be with someone else instead.

 

[Jezbollah]

Does anyone know if this is the final list of everyone implicated in the leaks?

 

[navanman]

Few more sports people involved.

Mossack Fonseca’s internal files reveal, for example, that at least 11 retired National Hockey League players used the law firm to help administer offshore structures. The records show that Nick Faldo, one of the top professional golfers of all time, owned an offshore company in the British Virgin Islands from 2006 until 2008. Faldo is one of at least five golfers whose names appear in the documents.

http://www.irishtimes.com/business/...s-become-enmeshed-in-offshore-world-1.2595555

 

[1.21Gigawatts]

I hope something happens with Peña Nieto, he got away with his white house the last time so I'm not too confident in anything good happening in Mexico.

Of course their aren't any Americans in this leaks, they're actually smart and prefer to use other services like the Clinton Foundation.

Spoiler

I am joking HillGAF, please don't kill me.

US tax obligations are also bound to citizenship, that makes tax evasion a lot harder and the usual structures don't work.
So its not surprising that we don't see americans here.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Meanwhile the "old money" rich are already elsewhere. The Rothschilds for example reportedly keep their money in the Cook Islands.

US tax obligations are also bound to citizenship, that makes tax evasion a lot harder and the usual structures don't work.
So its not surprising that we don't see americans here.

It's actually because Americans like to keep their money in the Cayman Islands.

 

[DedValve]

If you say so.

I can't imagine that anything is contained in them they we all didn't already expect to be there.

Is the oil industry scummy? Yeah, but that is hardly "news".

So we shouldn't investigate or attempt to find a solution instead the world is scummy and thats just how it is?

 

[Makai]

How do you leak terabytes

 

[Lactose_Intolerant]

How do you leak terabytes

winzip

 

[Spwn]

The PM of Iceland has apparently resigned. Unconfirmed.

https://twitter.com/Snowden/status/716726997339226112

 

[kabel]

How do you leak terabytes

By copying and uploading their whole backup.

 

[ezekial45]

The PM of Iceland has apparently resigned. Unconfirmed.

https://twitter.com/Snowden/status/716726997339226112

He deleted this tweet to confirm wait for proper confirmation.

https://twitter.com/Snowden/status/716728517422137344

 

[chadskin]

Does anyone know if this is the final list of everyone implicated in the leaks?

There are more non-politicians to be revealed, definitely.

It remains to be seen, though, if more politicians and public officials (who seem to be today's focus) will be revealed in the coming days as well.

 

[God of Gamblers]

Cheers man,

How do the drug dealers do it though? As there money is laundered/dirty money.

In most cases you basically move money around through different companies towards the country with the lowest tax. You create a firm in that country, then write some expenses towards them for licensing a brand name or whatever, so that all your profit in country A is gone and little is taxed there. Then you pay the tax in country B which is lower.

After that you can use that money for investments or other activities. Some companies need to keep it off shore to prevent paying taxes when bringing it back. But the owner of the companies can still use the money I think, just like how you spent money on vacation in another country where that money wasn't earned.

 

[ginger ninja]

At least this gives the world something to act surprised over for couple of weeks. Being surprised at finding America still very bigoted and racist was getting stale.

 

[Unit 33]

Fasten those seat belts folks, this is going to be a fun one.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Cheers man,

How do the drug dealers do it though? As there money is laundered/dirty money.

The same way organized crime does it. The worldwide Mafia use these offshore financial havens to launder their money too.

 

[chadskin]

For our foreign friends out there: #Iceland PM has not resigned over #PanamaPapers

There is a parliamentary meeting and a protest tomorrow. We'll see what happens after that.

https://twitter.com/visir_is/

 

[Makai]

By copying and uploading their whole backup.

7 weeks remaining...

 

[KingBroly]

The problem with how cynical the Internet is is that when you just assume things like this are happening when it is revealed that they really are you don't feel outrage but instead vindication. And you don't do anything about it.
This probably won't even make the news.

People have known offshore accounts have been a thing for a long time.

 

[Jezbollah]

There are more non-politicians to be revealed, definitely.

It remains to be seen, though, if more politicians and public officials (who seem to be today's focus) will be revealed in the coming days as well.

Cheers. The next few days are going to be extremely interesting.

 

[sphagnum]

Lol @ anyone who thought Poroshenko would be good