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[sircaw]

It was literally a game no one asked for or wanted.

- gass
- more sci-fi fantasy
- bad character designs
- bad player character choices
- dull gameplay
- dull environments
- right after Athem just failed for most of the same reasons.

sorry to say but it sounds like you have not played the game.

 

[Bumblebeetuna]

The Gamepass Effect is how we keep seeing flopped games show up in the service, it's a place for publisher to dumb games they are unsure about before release and guarantee they at least get some money for it or to get money from MS for a game that has already flopped outside of it.

SE already did this multiple times already with their games. Once a publisher gets into this, people are even more likely to not buy their future games since they expect to see it on Gamepass any day now. It even happened to Control to the point the dev had to come out publicly to say it wasn't entering Gamepass (but it actually did end up there).

How in the world do you know these games are “flopped” games? And what is wrong with a publisher releasing a riskier title and getting some guaranteed money upfront for it? What makes it “flopped”? See, this is what I was talking about. You make a stupid point fueled by console warrior feelings and then you’re going to play victim when someone calls you out for said stupid point.

Yes, we know SE has put multiple games on GamePass that failed to meet their sales expectations. But that’s a SE problem, not a GamePass problem. One of those games sold well without GamePass. One was already out for a long time before GamePass. And one was available on way more machines without GamePass than with GamePass, so that’s not a valid excuse for Outriders lack of profit, either.

What are all of these other “flopped” titles?

Also can we please get over this idea that GamePass users here think or ever said that every single title on GamePass explodes in sales and sees incredible results? The only thing that has ever been claimed is some pubs/devs have said the service had a positive effect on their games. Meanwhile we don’t have any dev claiming otherwise. That doesn’t mean that every game released “should be put on GamePass to increase sales”.

 

[Gamer_By_Proxy]

That has more to do with the fact that MS are selling Series S consoles so little to no customers come back to buy games from retailers.

That's true. Probably more of a combo of both.

 

[adamsapple]

When pubs talk about lifetime sales I get the impression they include via subscriptions (across the board). My impression could be wrong. Even if right that doesn’t mean MS counts those downloads as sales either. As far as I know We really don’t know if they count GP downloads in top sellers list.

Right, we have no idea if MS uses the streaming music method and counts a certain number of unique downloads as a sale.

But if something like that were happening, we may have heard about it from an indie developers or two by now.

 

[nominedomine]

How in the world do you know these games are “flopped” games? And what is wrong with a publisher releasing a riskier title and getting some guaranteed money upfront for it? What makes it “flopped”? See, this is what I was talking about. You make a stupid point fueled by console warrior feelings and then you’re going to play victim when someone calls you out for said stupid point.

Yes, we know SE has put multiple games on GamePass that failed to meet their sales expectations. But that’s a SE problem, not a GamePass problem. One of those games sold well without GamePass. One was already out for a long time before GamePass. And one was available on way more machines without GamePass than with GamePass, so that’s not a valid excuse for Outriders lack of profit, either.

What are all of these other “flopped” titles?

Also can we please get over this idea that GamePass users here think or ever said that every single title on GamePass explodes in sales and sees incredible results? The only thing that has ever been claimed is some pubs/devs have said the service had a positive effect on their games. Meanwhile we don’t have any dev claiming otherwise. That doesn’t mean that every game released “should be put on GamePass to increase sales”.

How do I know GoTG, Avengers and Outriders flopped?


?

 

[Three]

On UK, I assume? Yeah it did, it was at 4th. 3rd on combine digital and retail behind Vanguard and FIFA.
5 was already the lowest selling Halo in the UK, so it's not that hard to believe that Infinite sales are inline with 5.

It didn't. For 1 week it was 4th (launch week) which is poor by itself. it wasn't in the launch month charts because it sold so poorly.

If you want to catch up on that discussion go here where adamsapple tries to say Halo sold well with gamepass:

https://www.neogaf.com/threads/microsoft-says-games-don%E2%80%99t-need-to-be-on-game-pass-to-be-viable-on-xbox-vcg.1633222/page-2#post-265869072

I post the monthly chart in that thread and discuss its sales.

 

[Bumblebeetuna]

How do I know GoTG, Avengers and Outriders?


?

So again, a SE problem.

 

[nominedomine]

So again, a SE problem.

Why are you asking how I know if they flopped if you already know they did and even know why? No more ?

 

[Leyasu]

The problem is that its a loss-mitigation option for publishers. If the focus group and other marketing forecasts don't seem suggestive of a big hit in the making, they now have the opportunity to cut their potential losses by clawing back a predictable amount of the sunken cost in a single deal.

Its good for them but death for the developer who's reliant upon royalties in the long term.

You need to understand development and publishing are two separate businesses. What's good for one isn't necessarily so for the other. A publisher is akin to a bank, even if you go bankrupt the institution will have procedures in place so it can endure.

You are right about the publishers getting a fixed sum which helps offset dev costs. But, if the devs sign a deal where they get royalties from sales and the publishers then sign a gp deal, then how is that the fault of gp?

If the game launches day one and has a 6 month gp contact,, then it is on the publishers and devs to iron this stuff out.

 

[Bumblebeetuna]

Why are you asking how I know if they flopped if you already know they did and even know why?

No I asked for other examples aside from the SE games.

 

[SomeGit]

It didn't. For 1 week it was 4th (launch week) which is poor by itself. it wasn't in the launch month charts because it sold so poorly.

If you want to catch up on that discussion go here where adamsapple tries to say Halo sold well with gamepass:

https://www.neogaf.com/threads/microsoft-says-games-don%E2%80%99t-need-to-be-on-game-pass-to-be-viable-on-xbox-vcg.1633222/page-2#post-265869072

I post the monthly chart in that thread and discuss its sales.

I stand corrected then, wasn't aware of the full month chart, it's not the full picture but it's a clear metric we can stand on.

 

[AtomicStarving]

I played this game for like 30 min on Gamepass. I couldn't play it anymore

 

[nominedomine]

No I asked for other examples aside from the SE games.

Most big releases there are MS games and they don't provide numbers.

Some others that I remember were Dungeons & Dragons: Dark Alliance, Back 4 Blood, GTA: San Andreas Demaster, Aliens: Fireteam Elite and Twelve Minutes. Those make half the list of biggest flops and disappointments that we had recently. SE would also have multiple entries on such a list, but you asked me not to include them.

It's clearly a place where third-party publisher go to dump game they are unsure about.

 

[Bumblebeetuna]

TIL publishers weren't sure about GTA or Back 4 Blood. And clearly they had HUUUUUUGE expectations for D&D: DA

Also, a "place for publishers to put risky games" is nowhere near "flopped games". Keep shifting, friend.

You are right about the publishers getting a fixed sum which helps offset dev costs. But, if the devs sign a deal where they get royalties from sales and the publishers then sign a gp deal, then how is that the fault of gp?

If the game launches day one and has a 6 month gp contact,, then it is on the publishers and devs to iron this stuff out.

Didn't the Black Widow actress sue Disney for something similar to this? She had theater royalties in her contract, Disney decided to release the film to digital the same day as theaters, she lost a lot of money.

 

[Leyasu]

Didn't the Black Widow actress sue Disney for something similar to this? She had theater royalties in her contract, Disney decided to release the film to digital the same day as theaters, she lost a lot of money.

I don’t know in all honesty. But if dev signs for royalties from sales and the publisher then takes a fixed fee from one platform holder, then this is something for their problem.

This just probably highlights that Microsoft are not paying massive amounts for some of the games that are appearing on the service

 

[Clear]

You are right about the publishers getting a fixed sum which helps offset dev costs. But, if the devs sign a deal where they get royalties from sales and the publishers then sign a gp deal, then how is that the fault of gp?

If the game launches day one and has a 6 month gp contact,, then it is on the publishers and devs to iron this stuff out.

Not saying its a fault, just a consequence.

The reality is that its all about money whichever way you slice it. If a dev takes advances on royalties to fund development they end up in debt to their publisher. So to a large extent its a problem for the publisher to solve should the end product be looking like not being the success anticipated, the developer has notionally been paid already so they don't have any leverage.

So if an option appears for the publisher that allows them to insulate themselves... its pretty much a no-brainer because their goal is continuity. There's always another project that could turn into the hit they desire, all they need is operating capital to keep the train rolling. Their business model incentivizes risk aversion.

The dev on the other hand can end up basically back at square one, years out from being able to create a new hit. The publisher gets to walk away with everything and the developer is left scrambling for a new source of income to keep the lights on.

Breaking even is not a good result on a multi-year development cycle.

 

[DarkMage619]

That has more to do with the fact that MS are selling Series S consoles so little to no customers come back to buy games from retailers.

MS unlike Sony sells digital games at brick and mortar retail stores. I've seen plenty of digital codes in the game section and they take up less space.

 

[Chukhopops]

Most big releases there are MS games and they don't provide numbers.

Some others that I remember were Dungeons & Dragons: Dark Alliance, Back 4 Blood, GTA: San Andreas Demaster, Aliens: Fireteam Elite and Twelve Minutes. Those make half the list of biggest flops and disappointments that we had recently. SE would also have multiple entries on such a list, but you asked me not to include them.

It's clearly a place where third-party publisher go to dump game they are unsure about.

GTA Trilogy didn’t flop and neither did Back4Blood. You cherry pick examples but in which category do you put third party titles added to GP like Red Dead Redemption 2, Hitman Trilogy, Total War Warhammer 3, MLB The Show, Football Manager 2022? Do you think publishers are not sure about those games?

Why does Sega keep pushing their PC games on GP Day1 if they lose so much money out of it? Why does Paradox do it?

You’re so lost in your bias that out of 100+ games added to GP each year you just choose the few that help your argument and ignore the rest.

 

[GymWolf]

Hot take: majority of people who shat on the game never played it or just played the demo with the slow ass introduction.

Not saying that it was incredible or anything, but hot garbage is way exagerated.

 

[nominedomine]

GTA Trilogy didn’t flop and neither did Back4Blood. You cherry pick examples but in which category do you put third party titles added to GP like Red Dead Redemption 2, Hitman Trilogy, Total War Warhammer 3, MLB The Show, Football Manager 2022? Do you think publishers are not sure about those games?

Why does Sega keep pushing their PC games on GP Day1 if they lose so much money out of it? Why does Paradox do it?

You’re so lost in your bias that out of 100+ games added to GP each year you just choose the few that help your argument and ignore the rest.

The dude asked for the examples, how did I cherry pick if I was not the one who asked for examples of flops and games being dumped on the service in the first place? I just said it is something that keep happening and it is.

If you guys stop quoting me I won't be back here, I really don't want to be here forever arguing in loop with people that already have their mind set.

Not the first time this has happened here people ask for something and the when I waste my timing listing it suddenly I'm in the wrong or the subject changes.

If wish there was a way to hide all Xbox related threads so I wouldn't make the mistake of participating, people just can't take any form of criticism or skepticism towards the brand or Gamepass. Let us all applaud and cheer them instead.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

GTA Trilogy didn’t flop and neither did Back4Blood. You cherry pick examples but in which category do you put third party titles added to GP like Red Dead Redemption 2, Hitman Trilogy, Total War Warhammer 3, MLB The Show, Football Manager 2022? Do you think publishers are not sure about those games?

Why does Sega keep pushing their PC games on GP Day1 if they lose so much money out of it? Why does Paradox do it?

You’re so lost in your bias that out of 100+ games added to GP each year you just choose the few that help your argument and ignore the rest.

Exactly.

People assume games going on sub plan are desperate for sales, so that's why they do it. Maybe, maybe not. The money offered by the sub plan maker must be good to take the deal.

If offering games for cheap means desperate, then every F2P game must be the most desperate studios ever because they give out their games for free across all platforms. They dont even charge $1 to download it.

 

[eastcoastkody]

the only GamePass effect it had, is instead of duping ppl out of $60, they played it for a couple hours like me, and realized it wasn't a game worth buying.

 

[adamsapple]

Most big releases there are MS games and they don't provide numbers.

Some others that I remember were Dungeons & Dragons: Dark Alliance, Back 4 Blood, GTA: San Andreas Demaster, Aliens: Fireteam Elite and Twelve Minutes. Those make half the list of biggest flops and disappointments that we had recently. SE would also have multiple entries on such a list, but you asked me not to include them.

It's clearly a place where third-party publisher go to dump game they are unsure about.

Mate, what the hecking heck are you talking about here ?

San Andreas (or GTA Trilogy as a whole) significantly exceed sales expectations.

Guardians and Avengers came to the service long after they have finished their retail sales cycle, game pass had no bearing on it. Same for Aliens: Fireteam elite.

12 minutes was a small indie game, Game Pass has tons of indie games launch and more often than not developers report how they're happy with games being on game pass and in most cases MS helps fund those indie games in the first place.

There are countless examples of indie developers going on record to praise the service for their games longevity and revenue future.

Even the Back 4 Blood developers have gone on record that releasing the game on Game Pass was important for them.

If wish there was a way to hide all Xbox related threads so I wouldn't make the mistake of participating, people just can't take any form of criticism or skepticism towards the brand or Gamepass. Let us all applaud and cheer them instead.

You should probably do that, cause this is maybe the 3rd of 4th thread in the last few days with some Xbox/GP news that you've come in with completely inaccurate and zany posts that I've personally commented on asking what the point was.

It'll be better for everyone.

 

[SomeGit]

Exactly.

People assume games going on sub plan are desperate for sales, so that's why they do it. Maybe, maybe not. The money offered by the sub plan maker must be good to take the deal.

If offering games for cheap means desperate, then every F2P game must be the most desperate studios ever because they give out their games for free across all platforms. They dont even charge $1 to download it.

Some times it's done on desperation, but there are lots of cases where the game sells and it goes F2P, specially GaaS games or games with MTXs. Hell FIFA is going F2P next year, I don't think anyone doubts that FIFA sells.
For Outriders, honestly, if it wasn't for game pass I doubt even minority of the people here would still be talking about it.

 

[Allandor]

sorry to say but it sounds like you have not played the game.

Well, at least I played the game but have the same impression.
I played through the story right after launch and I was not really impressed. The story at first was ok, but later turned into a strange direction without really answering to anything.

It wasn't a bad game though, but also not really good.
Another problem I have with this game, I play it solo. I really don't like such wannabe-multiplayergames. Walking through the story was quite easy, but after that ... getting all the endgame stuff wasn't. After the story the endgame stuff had a much increased difficulty which was not really possible to get through it with the gear I found so far. So I just gave up as there there were no other things to do, that doing the same and same stuff again and again and that with a gameplay that is so shallow that is only consists of walking into a "room" (or bigger area) that you can just leave when every scripted enemy is dead and than enter the next "room" ...
Well without gamepass I would have never tried it.

 

[Lognor]

It is a good thing that Microsoft paid SE to put this game on Game Pass day one. Imagine how much worse off SE would have been if they hadn't accepted that money.

And in fact, more than that, having it on Game Pass day one got Outriders a ton of press. No one knew about this game until they put it on Game Pass. That definitely helped with word of mouth. The game is decent, but I think a ton of people didn't give it a chance because it looked so generic. Game Pass got it into peoples' hands and made more people want to try it. Same situation with GotG. After the horrible Avengers no one wanted to give GotG a chance. But since it's been on Game Pass I've seen a lot of people talking about it. SE really should have put that game on Game Pass day one. It likely would have made them more money.

 

[Bumblebeetuna]

The dude asked for the examples, how did I cherry pick if I was not the one who asked for examples of flops and games being dumped on the service in the first place? I just said it is something that keep happening and it is.

If you guys stop quoting me I won't be back here, I really don't want to be here forever arguing in loop with people that already have their mind set.

Not the first time this has happened here people ask for something and the when I waste my timing listing it suddenly I'm in the wrong or the subject changes.

If wish there was a way to hide all Xbox related threads so I wouldn't make the mistake of participating, people just can't take any form of criticism or skepticism towards the brand or Gamepass. Let us all applaud and cheer them instead.

Oh no, look who made another silly point and is whining about being the victim again.

Why do you need the Xbox threads hidden? Just don’t enter them or don’t reply. Or better yet, do reply, but add something of substance. Don’t just shit out console warrior nonsense.

Yes I asked you for examples of “flopped games” beyond SquareEnix games because you made it out as if the service is full of them. In response you produce a shitty list and now it got mocked. If you don’t like it, don’t make shitty lists

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

Gamepass is coasting 1 billion per month

Well if the Axios reports on subscription numbers, revenues, as well as some calculations from Heisenberg007 and myself are close to accurate based on those reports (and accounting for discrepancies), I'm confident that services like GamePass aren't coasting near $1 billion for a whole year let alone a month

But anyway, I'm kind of surprised the game wasn't profitable almost a year after release if it supposedly had good sales. How much money did Square-Enix sink into the development? How much did MS pay them to get it on GamePass (I'm thinking it had to be less than what they paid for GotG at least, and that was $15 million) and, yes, did the game being on Xbox GamePass Day 1 depreciate sales on other platforms?

Because it's not like some of those PS and PC gamers don't have Xbox consoles, they could've just chosen to play it on Xbox through GP instead of buying it on PS & PC. Not surprising if a lot of people actually did that.

 

[Chukhopops]

The dude asked for the examples, how did I cherry pick if I was not the one who asked for examples of flops and games being dumped on the service in the first place? I just said it is something that keep happening and it is.

If you guys stop quoting me I won't be back here, I really don't want to be here forever arguing in loop with people that already have their mind set.

Not the first time this has happened here people ask for something and the when I waste my timing listing it suddenly I'm in the wrong or the subject changes.

If wish there was a way to hide all Xbox related threads so I wouldn't make the mistake of participating, people just can't take any form of criticism or skepticism towards the brand or Gamepass. Let us all applaud and cheer them instead.

You have 40+ posts in this thread including the first one and you’re upset people reply to you?

You can play the victim if you want but if you argue people will argue back.

 

[MiguelItUp]

I honestly just wasn't intrigued by the game at all. When I watched streamers play it on launch, I thought it did some neat things. But when I played it, it just felt like a drag. It didn't feel bad to me, per se, it just felt like it was missing something, or a lot of something. The result just felt like stuff I had played and experienced before, and others had done it several times already, and better.

I can't say I'm surprised by the lack of profit as a result, the number of players has been sinking across all platforms pretty quickly. I wish them the best because I certainly don't wish anything negative against any developer, but man, I don't think that expansion is gonna save it.

 

[adamsapple]

Well if the Axios reports on subscription numbers, revenues, as well as some calculations from Heisenberg007 and myself are close to accurate based on those reports (and accounting for discrepancies), I'm confident that services like GamePass aren't coasting near $1 billion for a whole year let alone a month

But anyway, I'm kind of surprised the game wasn't profitable almost a year after release if it supposedly had good sales. How much money did Square-Enix sink into the development? How much did MS pay them to get it on GamePass (I'm thinking it had to be less than what they paid for GotG at least, and that was $15 million) and, yes, did the game being on Xbox GamePass Day 1 depreciate sales on other platforms?

Because it's not like some of those PS and PC gamers don't have Xbox consoles, they could've just chosen to play it on Xbox through GP instead of buying it on PS & PC. Not surprising if a lot of people actually did that.

This is purely a Square Enix thing.

They considered both Hitman and Tomb Raider as sales failures even though they both sold upwards of 3 and a half million units in their release windows.

Square's incompetence and unrealistic goals with their Western studios should be known to all by now.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

This is purely a Square Enix thing.

They considered both Hitman and Tomb Raider as sales failures even though they both sold upwards of 3 and a half million units in their release windows.

Square's incompetence and unrealistic goals with their Western studios should be known to all by now.

Since this is Square-Enix, that is very likely the reason. Nothing more than unrealistic expectations from them. Also messed up they didn't share any of the MS money with PCF (or tied their royalties exclusively to copies sold and not include # of downloads etc. if they knew they were going to put the game into Xbox GamePass).

 

[RoboFu]

sorry to say but it sounds like you have not played the game.

I played the demo. I played enough to know at least most of what I posted is true.
I remember everyone was upset because they knew it was going to be a gaas. But it was released not as one. Probably because of the blow back . Doesn’t matter it’s dead anyway.

 

[sircaw]

Well, at least I played the game but have the same impression.
I played through the story right after launch and I was not really impressed. The story at first was ok, but later turned into a strange direction without really answering to anything.

It wasn't a bad game though, but also not really good.
Another problem I have with this game, I play it solo. I really don't like such wannabe-multiplayergames. Walking through the story was quite easy, but after that ... getting all the endgame stuff wasn't. After the story the endgame stuff had a much increased difficulty which was not really possible to get through it with the gear I found so far. So I just gave up as there there were no other things to do, that doing the same and same stuff again and again and that with a gameplay that is so shallow that is only consists of walking into a "room" (or bigger area) that you can just leave when every scripted enemy is dead and than enter the next "room" ...
Well without gamepass I would have never tried it.

i think there are def a lot of issues in the game, they fixed a huge amount with the last update.

They do need to work on mob diversity and add a lot of new endgame systems, which they are somewhat addressing in the next expansion.

The gameplay/shooting/ feel of the character is IMO extremely solid and one of the things they do absolutely spot on, i completed the game and all its content with a devastator with two friends, and we had a lot of giggles.

 

[adamsapple]

I played the demo. I played enough to know at least most of what I posted is true.
I remember everyone was upset because they knew it was going to be a gaas. But it was released not as one. Probably because of the blow back . Doesn’t matter it’s dead anyway.

I'm probably gonna check the DLC out if/when it goes on sale (and if the game is still on the service then lol).

 

[MScarpa]

So many warriors, so little time. Not sure why the same 5 people continue to fight. It gets so old. With that said, Currently playing through Outriders for a second time. Would have never touched this game without Gamepass. I think Gamepass saved this game. But that's just my opinion.

 

[Exede]

Hm, i had a lot of fun with Outriders. It makes nothing new or special, but i had fun.

 

[laynelane]

Since this is Square-Enix, that is very likely the reason. Nothing more than unrealistic expectations from them. Also messed up they didn't share any of the MS money with PCF (or tied their royalties exclusively to copies sold and not include # of downloads etc. if they knew they were going to put the game into Xbox GamePass).

It's weird how it went from this:

"While there were slight issues with bugs and the like on launch, we believe it has gotten off to a good start as a new IP. In addition, we have been pleasantly surprised as the digital sales ratio for the title have been very high, and the number of active users has also beaten our expectations. We believe that our decision to make Outriders available with Microsoft's Xbox Game Pass as soon as the title launched also worked in our favor to build an installed base for the game," Matsuda said in a Q&A session with investors.

Link

To the game hasn't turned a profit. I'm inclined to believe that word of mouth for the game wasn't good so people held off on purchasing it on all platforms.

 

[DarkMage619]

i think there are def a lot of issues in the game, they fixed a huge amount with the last update.

They do need to work on mob diversity and add a lot of new endgame systems, which they are somewhat addressing in the next expansion.

The gameplay/shooting/ feel of the character is IMO extremely solid and one of the things they do absolutely spot on, i completed the game and all its content with a devastator with two friends, and we had a lot of giggles.

I have to agree with you Fishman. Anyone calling the game GaaS should have their opinion ignored because as you have stated earlier they haven't even played it. I found it quite enjoyable with friends when the connection issues weren't causing problems.

 

[sircaw]

I have to agree with you Fishman. Anyone calling the game GaaS should have their opinion ignored because as you have stated earlier they haven't even played it. I found it quite enjoyable with friends when the connection issues weren't causing problems.

yep, I am all for different opinions, but they need to be honest in regards to said game/review.

I have said it before, the game has problems, a number, but there is also huge potential in it.

I and my friends are looking forward to the expansion.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

It's weird how it went from this:



Link

To the game hasn't turned a profit. I'm inclined to believe that word of mouth for the game wasn't good so people held off on purchasing it on all platforms.

Just goes to show how little corporate speak really matters at the end of the day (at least, public statements from corporate).

There was definitely controversy over balance changes shortly after launch (supposedly done to ease server load) that ended up ruining the progression for a lot of people and making certain playstyles worthless. This is what I remember reading at the time.

And that would of had a big effect on longer-term game sales.

 

[Lognor]

The Gamepass effect.

You have it wrong. The game did as well as it did BECAUSE of Game Pass, not the other way around. The game released without any fanfare and it only got any modicum of success because it was on Game Pass and people that otherwise wouldn't have tried it did.

I was one of those people. The game looked generic as hell and the ONLY reason I gave it a shot was because it was free on Game Pass. Countless other people tried it for that same reason which led to positive word of mouth which led to MORE sales.

Think of the disaster sales would have been WITHOUT Game Pass!

 

[Allandor]

i think there are def a lot of issues in the game, they fixed a huge amount with the last update.

They do need to work on mob diversity and add a lot of new endgame systems, which they are somewhat addressing in the next expansion.
...

The next expansion or now is to late. I played the game at launch, played it again a few month later and it wasn't good enough for me to return to that game. First impressions are very important for such a game. So it might be an error for them to start with gamepass as the game wasn't round enough at launch. So many players could try the game but might get the same impression as I.
On the other hand, the game was in the top 10 for a while, so it sold a good amount of copies (even on xbox). But investing in a "mmo" (well just like destiny it is just a p2p game with a lobby were more players can interact) is expensive, so when they still don't reached the break even, the game might just be more expensive than it should or the first investment (e.g. worktime) in the network-infrastructure necessary for that game might also have been so expensive.

 

[Jigsaah]

Should've been banned together with OP

For sharing my opinion on a game I spent quite a bit of time on? You're not familiar with this site's rules are you?

It came out on Gamepass, of course I played it. Got pretty damn far too. I was in end game...and it just lost it's luster really fast for me. To be clear, the game wasn't great throughout the playthrough, but I gave it a fair shot.

You do realize Spinal was banned because he started talking shit about Microsoft's management right? He's a console warrior. I'm not saying anything bad about Microsoft or Sony...I'm saying the game is bad itself. Huge Difference.

 

[eastcoastkody]

Remnant/Avengers/Anthem > Outriders. yeah i said it.

The only looter shooter i would put Outriders ahead of is dogshit Warframe. Because Waframe is just a hack and slash crafting game that ppl think is a looter shooter

 

[OsirisBlack]

I think Gamepass is good for games that don't have a huge budget but I would be wary of putting a AAA huge budget game on Gamepass day 1 unless the MS money was obscene. I understand people think it helps developers/companies make money but I cannot see how something like Elden Ring being on a sub service wouldn't have hurt them.

 

[The_Mike]

For sharing my opinion on a game I spent quite a bit of time on? You're not familiar with this site's rules are you?

It came out on Gamepass, of course I played it. Got pretty damn far too. I was in end game...and it just lost it's luster really fast for me. To be clear, the game wasn't great throughout the playthrough, but I gave it a fair shot.

You do realize Spinal was banned because he started talking shit about Microsoft's management right? He's a console warrior. I'm not saying anything bad about Microsoft or Sony...I'm saying the game is bad itself. Huge Difference.

I know sarcasm is a bitch on keyboard, but it was with a smile I said it.

Outriders was indeed fun for what it was, but it could have been so much more if they weren't afraid of going down the GaaS route.

People hate GaaS, but games like destiny 2 and warframe, as an example, use GaaS, and I could easily have seen outriders up there as well, if they could have added mot meat to the game.

 

[Jigsaah]

I know sarcasm is a bitch on keyboard, but it was with a smile I said it.

Outriders was indeed fun for what it was, but it could have been so much more if they weren't afraid of going down the GaaS route.

People hate GaaS, but games like destiny 2 and warframe, as an example, use GaaS, and I could easily have seen outriders up there as well, if they could have added mot meat to the game.

Sorry I my Sarcasometer was malfunctioning at the time. I don't mind GaaS myself. I pretty much play GaaS all the time. Valorant, GaaS, Apex...Warzone, Star Citizen, Final Fantasy XIV, WOW...all basically GaaS. I love Warframe and Destiny 2. Hell, Warframe has the best implementation of in game purchases I've seen in a game, because you can grind to get the gear as well, and the grind is fun, though I haven't played in a while, admittedly. I like games that can keep me playing for a long time and adds new content all the time.

 

[Lognor]

I think Gamepass is good for games that don't have a huge budget but I would be wary of putting a AAA huge budget game on Gamepass day 1 unless the MS money was obscene. I understand people think it helps developers/companies make money but I cannot see how something like Elden Ring being on a sub service wouldn't have hurt them.

Well it worked for outriders and the show. And I guess it worked for Microsoft's own games - halo infinite, forza, etc.

But it won't make sense for every AAA game. Putting elden ring, for example, on game pass day one would have lost from a lot of money. Not sure how to determine which AAA games work day one for game pass and which don't.

 

[itsjustJEFF]

I don't understand, if it was a better game wouldn't it be leaving even more money on the table?

I get that a publisher get desperate when they think they have a flop on their hands, but ultimately this is what MS wanted to pay for the game.

A game being available for $15 on a subscription service will devalue it on every platform. Who is going to buy the Batman movie now that it's available on HBO? People even make fun of the other services that are trying to charge you for the movie (as people make fun of Sony trying to sell games for $60 when they are available on gamepass). The same thing apply here.

I'll never drop $60 on a game that I know is available for $15 or even less. I would rather burn my money.

I think for someone to believe that there will be NO knock-on affect of being on a subscription service is just not being rational.

We have yet to see a game built from the ground up for Gamepass. Like will that game be shorter? have more MTX to recoup costs? or will it just be like normal and the sub money will hopefully be enough to cover. Like with Netflix, Xbox will be paying VERY close attention to user data. Users actions will likely affect future games in some very interesting ways. Look at Netflix and their original programing. They're shorter, less episodes and seasons to keep costs down and because they've seen that users attention spans for a series is not long, so they end them before the numbers start to drop. Believe it or not guys Gamepass does not have an unlimited budget to make games. I'd be super interested in how their budget will be spread among all it's studios. Who gets the biggest piece of the pie and why? I do not envy Phil and his team, that's a tough job.