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[Birdo]

They probably avg around 2 to 4 million. They have now combined pc numbers but you can get some stats here...

Forza Horizon 4 Sells an Estimated 481,566 Units First Week at Retail

The open world racing game from publisher Microsoft Studios and developer Playground Games - Forza Horizon 4 - sold 481,566 units first week [...]

www.vgchartz.com

We all know vgchartz is trash when it comes to new games but they correct them as official numbers are released. These should be good.

Even at your estimated ratio. It still puts Forza at the top of MS's franchise revenue this and last gen (There were Six Forza games this gen)

So I'm still right

 

[TeamGhobad]

MS really needs to bring it this gen. if they don't they are toast.

 

[Neff]

Do you agree with his assessment of the Xbox One?

Kinda, yeah

Enjoyed Xbox
Loved 360

Xbox One feels like 6 years of low effort at best and disappointment at worst. I feel like Microsoft have lost me.

 

[Bryank75]

It’s really weird that he identified MGS4 as the real turning point in the PS3.... that is exactly when I changed from 360 to PS3. I also picked up BF Bad Company and I never went back from PlayStation.

I know it’s been a rough few years for Xbox fans getting dunked on all the time and I empathize in some ways, you guys have been faithful but in the end Xbox didn’t deliver the games for you.... it’s kinda unfair.

I pretty much agree with his assessment though.... not releasing XBOX revenue or numbers is a really bad sign too.

 

[Birdo]

It’s really weird that he identified MGS4 as the real turning point in the PS3

Yeah, it was Uncharted 2 that put the PS3 on the map. I have no idea why he chose MGS4.

 

[Fuz]

He’s right, but what more can they do

The opposite of what destroyed them: going full pro-consumer (at least until they fix their reputation).

 

[Breakage]

Well I thought it was a funny and entertaining assessment.
It would be cool if Microsoft could recapture that high-tech experimental spirit of the original Xbox, but I don't think they will go down that path again.

 

[-Arcadia-]

The opposite of what destroyed them: going full pro-consumer (at least until they fix their reputation).

That’s a different subject from exclusives, but wouldn’t you say they’ve been trying to do exactly that?

I know I came into this generation with seething hate for Microsoft. Now? They seem pretty cool. A few things I like that they’ve done:

-Allowed indies with an exclusive contract to bring their games to Switch. Likewise, any studios bought were allowed to finish their games for other platforms, and Minecraft continues to be superb on every platform. All of that is pro-consumer

-Fixed their hardware situation with the X, a much better system

-Game Pass is excellent

-BC is the most comprehensive backwards compatibility solution we’ve ever seen, giving you a triple bang for your buck, when buying into Xbox

-Pushed cross-platform online play. Again very pro-consumer

I can’t say I have much of an issue with them anymore. In fact, I quite like them, and would be incentivized to buy the next Xbox over the next PlayStation, with the stuff Sony has been pulling with censorship and online.

 

[Passive_Bob]

If the next generation Xbox ends up only selling 45-50M - like the Xbox One - Microsoft/Xbox will likely pull the plug on physical hardware and instead focus their energy on xCloud (streaming service).

It's redudant to keep making hardware - hardware a very little percentage of the market buys - especially if xCloud is available on every TV, PC, mobile & tablet in the world.

 

[Jigsaah]

Do you agree with his assessment of the Xbox One?

I'll watch the video later, but I'm gonna go with...no.

 

[Boss Mog]

Xbox One was doomed the moment they did the reveal and talked about TV and a $500M deal with the NFL, who the fuck gives a shit? Pair that with forced Kinect and crazy DRM, which included the Kinect spying on you to see how many people were watching a movie you might have rented. Then was the 80s VCR look of it and the external power brick despite being so huge. Plus Bungie quit Halo and Epic quit Gears so lets face it those franchises died right then and there and were just soulless hollow shells of their former glorious entries from then on. The final nails in the coffin came at E3 2013 when it was clear that the PS4 had superior hardware and was going to cost $100 less.

I say all of this as a 360 fanatic last gen. It was painful to make the switch to PS4 in November 2013 but now, with hindsight, it was clearly the right choice for me.

 

[Jigsaah]

Is it bash Xbox week or something?

Sony fanboys trying to maintain a narrative, that's all.

This kind of "counter-threading" is just stupid.

 

[joe_zazen]

Embarrassing clickbait.

Of course that isn't surprising at all.

Dunky is the foremost cultural critic of the age, not some youtuber buying houses off of youtube ad revenue. And dunky has never embarrassed himself, never.

 

[Jigsaah]

If the next generation Xbox ends up only selling 45-50M - like the Xbox One - Microsoft/Xbox will likely pull the plug on physical hardware and instead focus their energy on xCloud (streaming service).

It's redudant to keep making hardware - hardware a very little percentage of the market buys - especially if xCloud is available on every TV, PC, mobile & tablet in the world.

Xbox could sell 90 million and the still focus their energy on Xcloud. The market they are after don't necessarily buy consoles.

 

[Gamernyc78]

Even at your estimated ratio. It still puts Forza at the top of MS's franchise revenue this and last gen (There were Six Forza games this gen)

So I'm still right

I'm correcting your frivolous remark tht thy pull in avg 9 million I follow gaming and I knew tht was way offfff

 

[Juke Joint Jezebel]

In terms of their exclusive output this generation they've been abso-fucking-lutely abysmal.

-Master Chief Collection shipped broken and took years to fix.
-ReCore being merely okay, nothing too special.
-Halo 5 not leaving any lasting impression.
-Gears of War 4 was decent but lacked the magic the original 3 games had.
-Crackdown 3 taking ages to actually come out and to lukewarm reception. (I had fun with it though)
-Quantum Break not really living up to expectations.
-Scalebound getting unceremoniously cancelled years into development.

On the plus side, a few great things have come from trying to change course on their previous failings.

-Game Pass has become a success and decent value for money.
-Pushing Backwards Compatibility with a decent selection of original Xbox and 360 games both physically and digitally is fantastic and something Sony should take note of
-Playing ball with other console manufacturers (AKA Nintendo) and releasing cross-play games and ports of XB1 games on their system has given them positive PR lately.
-Allowing a lot of 360 digital game purchases to be carried over and played on XB1 gave the system a bit more value for long-term xbox customers.

And while the games have been a mixed bag, there were a few games that stood out to me.

-Digged Sunset Overdrive a lot. I hope with Sony owning the IP now they at least try to push out ONE new game!
-Forza Horizon 3 and 4 are fantastic, and in my opinion the best grounded racing games of the generation so far. Sorry Gran Turismo!
-The Gears of War remaster was pretty nice.
-And I really enjoyed Gears 5. Brought a lot of new stuff to the table and differentiated itself from the previous games.


But yeah, mostly a negative experience overall from MS for me. Ever since the reveal of the system they just seemed to be set on ruining the excellent reputation they got from the 360. Yeesh!

 

[Gamernyc78]

Some ppl could be blind to the truth forever. It's like the biggest fans overlooking heinous shit done by their favorite artists. Doesn't change the state or reality of things.

 

[Damian black]

I mean, a lot of people share this sentiment. It's not like it is just those 2 guys.
A lot of people who used to be hardcore xbox fans, dropped the brand this gen, myself included.
It's only the people still on camp xbox who are playing victim, just as usual.

 

[Birdo]

I follow gaming

Sorry. If I knew I was dealing with such a badass gamer, I would have researched better (The 9 million number came from the 360 Forzas BTW. That was my mistake).

My original statement is still true though. Even though you won't admit it lol.

 

[demigod]

Sorry. If I knew I was dealing with such a badass gamer, I would have researched better (The 9 million number came from the 360 Forzas BTW. That was my mistake).

My original statement is still true though. Even though you won't admit it lol.

What are you talking about? You were wrong. Forza games do not average 9million copies sold.

 

[captainraincoat]

Bash Xbox week has obviously been extended due to the favorable coverage of gears and negative coverage of death stranding.....can't you guys simply appreciate the ganes

 

[TGO]

Is it bash Xbox week or something?

The holidays are round the corner and Sony needed a Week off.
It's very kind of Xbox to pick up the slack

 

[ethomaz]

Video is right but he just repeat what everybody already knows and MS never changes.

MGS4 being so celebrated will always be odd to me. Won goty twice here on gaf LOL.

360 did fart out at the end of its lifespan but it did not happen as early as 2008. I can tell ya that.

One of the best games I ever played in my life.

Masterpice.

It has everything a game should have to be perfect (art design, gameplay, dialogue, cutscenes, bosses, ending, etc) ... sad we don't see more games like it.

 

[Hendrick's]

Wonder what happened to get this and Jim's video in the same week.

Gears 5 came out and it was good. Can't let Xbox have any positive buzz.

 

[mcjmetroid]

I haven't watched the video and won't because I don't have time but..

Isn't it a bit early to be using the word "fall". Christ it ain't over yet.

 

[TheSadRanger]

Xbox One was doomed the moment they did the reveal and talked about TV and a $500M deal with the NFL, who the fuck gives a shit? Pair that with forced Kinect and crazy DRM, which included the Kinect spying on you to see how many people were watching a movie you might have rented. Then was the 80s VCR look of it and the external power brick despite being so huge. Plus Bungie quit Halo and Epic quit Gears so lets face it those franchises died right then and there and were just soulless hollow shells of their former glorious entries from then on. The final nails in the coffin came at E3 2013 when it was clear that the PS4 had superior hardware and was going to cost $100 less.

I say all of this as a 360 fanatic last gen. It was painful to make the switch to PS4 in November 2013 but now, with hindsight, it was clearly the right choice for me.

Having the first Mass Effect as an exclusive for the 360 was the main reason I bought one initially.

There's been nothing on the Xbox One in terms of exclusives that's been on that sort of level as Mass Effect,

 

[Juke Joint Jezebel]

I haven't watched the video and won't because I don't have time but..

Isn't it a bit early to be using the word "fall". Christ it ain't over yet.

With their new Scarlett console coming out in just over a year, they'd have to pull off some crazy shit for the XB1 not to be perceived as their biggest failure to date.

 

[ethomaz]

Erm, you might want to look at franchise sales numbers (GT is sony biggest selling franchise by a LARGE margin).

As for Forza. Each Forza game sells an average of 9 million. MS have released one each year for the entire gen...... Do the math

So there you have it. The two biggest selling franchises for MS and Sony, and most people ignore it *Shrug*

#Raceists!

No Forza Motorsport ever sold more than 5m (that talking about the biggest one Forza Motorsport 4)... so your average is more like 3m instead 9m?
Only GT games in the sim-racing sells big numbers... that indeed true.

 

[Potato Chip PRO]

As much as I hate to admit... Dunky does make good points. How the hell do you go from 2 solid consoles with great exclusives go completely abysmal on the Xbox One gen? Saddest gen I've seen for a Brand that I grew up with and love. Hell, compared to the Wii U, they stilk managed to get better games than the X1 gen. Im hoping Scarlett is the restart button to fix all their problems.

 

[Birdo]

What are you talking about? You were wrong. Forza games do not average 9million copies sold.

My original post said that The Forza franchise is the biggest selling franchise for MS (Combined game sales). Which is true.

I seem to have really ruffled some feathers with this statement

Spoiler

I like it.

 

[Boss Mog]

Having the first Mass Effect as an exclusive for the 360 was the main reason I bought one initially.

There's been nothing on the Xbox One in terms of exclusives that's been on that sort of level as Mass Effect,

Yeah totally agree about Mass Effect. They also had some great JRPGs that were exclusives like Tales of Vesperia, The Last Remnant, Infinite Undiscovery, Enchanted Arms, Blue Dragon, Lost Odyssey, and a few more that were timed exclusives like Eternal Sonata and Star Ocean 4. They also had Ace Combat 6 which was an amazing exclusive if you love the series like I do.

 

[demigod]

My original post said that The Forza franchise is the biggest selling franchise for MS (Combined game sales). Which is true.

I seem to have really ruffled some feathers with this statement

Spoiler

I like it.

No, you're still wrong.

Now will you admit you were wrong?

 

[ethomaz]

My original post said that The Forza franchise is the biggest selling franchise for MS (Combined game sales). Which is true.

I seem to have really ruffled some feathers with this statement

Spoiler

I like it.

This is a bit old... actually from 2017.

BEST SELLING MS GAMES

1. Halo 3 (13.5 million)
2. Halo Reach
3. Halo 4
4. Halo 2 (8.5 million)
5. Halo: Combat Evolved (5.5 million)
6. Gears of War (4.7 million)
7. Fable (3 million, may include Mac OS X and PC)
8. Forza Horizon 3 (2.5 million)
9. Project Gotham Racing (2.5 million)
10. Forza Motorsport 2 (2.274 million approximately: 2.23 million in US)

It miss some games like Forza 3, Forza 4 that we don't have them.
I do think Forza Horizon 4, Halo 5 and some other game entered in the list after that.

 

[Clear]

360 gen was overrated. Massively.

Sure, it started out well but if you actually look and see what came out of it, there's remarkably little that's stood the test of time.

It went particularly well for MS for a bunch of reasons, Japanese games falling out of fashion, online multiplayer being the new hotness, being the first to capitalize on the Indie-game breakout, Sony being slow out the gate and devs struggling with the arcane PS3 hardware, etc.

Whats the common thread with all those things? Simple, every one of them had fuck all to do with Xbox itself. They were either external events or the result of them being better positioned to reap the benefits of these market shifts than their competition. Basically it was either inherited from the plan/design philosophy behind the original Xbox, or dumb luck.

Hell, the one tentpole franchise they established was Gears, and that was Epic's baby. The nearest, best to that Crackdown started out on the original Xbox and only really sold thanks to it being bundled with the Halo 3 beta pass.

When they did try to react to the market, what came out of it was... Kinect. Hell, people may have sniggered at the goofy looking move wands but at least they proved to have some lasting value thanks to their convergence with VR.

Looking back, the overwhelming majority of big titles were multi-platform offerings from western third-party developers. Most of which didn't so much become synonymous with Xbox because they ran better on that platform, but more that they ran considerably worse on PS3. This is an important difference due to the PS3 being, when utilized properly, more than a match for 360 and the performance defecitr being the result of them being unwilling/unable to tailor their engines for its oddball architecture. In essence, although this may have been a "win" at the time for MS, it wasn't a direct consequence of their actions, they just benefited from the circumstance.

The irony is that Xbox didn't get lazy with the Xbox One. They'd already settled in that particular rut within the first few years of the 360's life. People just didn't notice because the competition was either struggling (Playstation) or off doing its own thing (Nintendo).

 

[KingdomHeartsFan]

I used to be such a huge Xbox guy, I bought my Xbox before my PS2 and my 360 before my PS3. Bought all my third party games on those consoles and my Xbox/360 library is probably close to double my PS2/PS3 library. This generation I have almost 200 PS4 games and 16 games for my X1...200 to 16. Their first party output has been extremely disappointing and for the first time I don't think I'll be buying a Xbox console next generation until the generation is close to the end and I can get the console for dirt cheap.

 

[TUROK]

>Naughty Dog continues to reinvent itself with each [Uncharted] game

Citation needed.

I agree with the general premise of the video, MS has been stumbling over their feet since the Xbox One was announced, to the degree in which my One X will most likely be my last MS console, but when he gets into specific examples, he sometimes loses me. He calls Halo 5's campaign an "embarrassment" and while the storyline did kinda suck, the gameplay was quite solid. Yeah, opinions and all that, but that felt like a huge exaggeration.

 

[Birdo]

This is a bit old... actually from 2017.

BEST SELLING MS GAMES

1. Halo 3 (13.5 million)
2. Halo Reach
3. Halo 4
4. Halo 2 (8.5 million)
5. Halo: Combat Evolved (5.5 million)
6. Gears of War (4.7 million)
7. Fable (3 million, may include Mac OS X and PC)
8. Forza Horizon 3 (2.5 million)
9. Project Gotham Racing (2.5 million)
10. Forza Motorsport 2 (2.274 million approximately: 2.23 million in US)

Oh cool. Some random, outdated list with no source, I guess.

No, you're still wrong.

Now will you admit you were wrong?

Mate, there have been eleven Forza games. Each selling several million. Combined this makes Forza one of MS's biggest franchises. Hence, why I made the original statement that people shouldn't ignore it.

Why is this bothering the avatar-less bunch so much?

 

[Xenon]

Not a lot too argue there but Death Stranding? It's going to review well cause kojima, but it's not a mass appeal game.

I've never been that much of a Gears fan after the first and have severe doubts about Halo given the history of the leadership.

 

[JSoup]

Dunky is the foremost cultural critic of the age, not some youtuber buying houses off of youtube ad revenue. And dunky has never embarrassed himself, never.

He was also banned by ERA because he refused to apologies for not putting up with SJW bullshit.

 

[ethomaz]

Oh cool. Some random, outdated list with no source, I guess.

You can find the source on google from own MS mouth... all games I listed are know sales from MS.

Example:

Forza Horizon 3 hits 2.5M copies sold, pushing Forza series above $1B (update)

That’s a lot of shiny cars

www.polygon.com

vs you own fantasy sales lol

Mate, there have been eleven Forza games. Each selling several million. Combined this makes Forza one of MS's biggest franchises. Hence, why I made the original statement that people shouldn't ignore it.

Why is this bothering the avatar-less bunch so much?

Last overall Forza franchise sales:

"As of February 2010, the Forza games have sold over 10 million copies since the release of Forza Motorsport in May 2005."

That include: Forza Motorsport, Forza Motorsport 2 and Forza Motorsport 3.

After that MS said:

"As of December 2016, the series has made over $1 billion USD at retail"

What that means in terms of sales I don't know... but in 2013 Sony announced GT franchise made over $4 billion dollars before GT6 launch... make your maths.

 

[Birdo]

You can find the source on google from own MS mouth.

Forza Horizon 3 hits 2.5M copies sold, pushing Forza series above $1B (update)

That’s a lot of shiny cars

www.polygon.com

vs you own fantasy sales lol

So, MS also said that FH4 sold far better than any other previous FH........ Meaning......... MY ORIGINAL STATEMENT IS STILL FUCKING TRUE

JESUS FUCK, these console warrior threads really bring them out of the woodwork.

 

[rofif]

Gears of war 2 and 3 bc in 4k... But not gow 1?!
At least they made the darkness bc

 

[demigod]

Oh cool. Some random, outdated list with no source, I guess.



Mate, there have been eleven Forza games. Each selling several million. Combined this makes Forza one of MS's biggest franchises. Hence, why I made the original statement that people shouldn't ignore it.

Why is this bothering the avatar-less bunch so much?

So you tried to call another member wrong and for them to admit you were right. You were still wrong and won't admit it. Hypocrite much? I see now you changed the wording to prove your point. It seems like you tried to ruffle some jimmies but failed miserably.

 

[KingdomHeartsFan]

Gears of war 2 and 3 bc in 4k... But not gow 1?!
At least they made the darkness bc

They did release that remake of Gears 1, is there something wrong with the remake that you'd want to play the original over it?

 

[rofif]

They did release that remake of Gears 1, is there something wrong with the remake that you'd want to play the original over it?

I prefer original graphics style and grittiness. Also the pacing is better since in the remake they add in this shitty brumak mission from pc version... And pc version is missing some lighting itself but its not too bad... But I still prefer the look of 360 original

 

[ethomaz]

So, MS also said that FH4 sold far better than any other previous FH........ Meaning......... MY ORIGINAL STATEMENT IS STILL FUCKING TRUE

JESUS FUCK, these console warrior threads really bring them out of the woodwork.

Far better can means anything over 2.5m... there is a big gap between that and 9m average .
Like it is high probably no Forza ever sold anything near 9m... imagine average 9m lol

Your claim was both false and ridiculous.

 

[Birdo]

So you tried to call another member wrong and for them to admit you were right. You were still wrong and won't admit it. Hypocrite much? I see now you changed the wording to prove your point. It seems like you tried to ruffle some jimmies but failed miserably.

I already said that I got the 9 million thing wrong (Thanks to GT Chartz LOL).

But my original statement that GT and Forza are some of the biggest selling franchises, and are ignored in comparisons is still correct.

I don't get it. What's your problem?

 

[KingdomHeartsFan]

I prefer original graphics style and grittiness. Also the pacing is better since in the remake they add in this shitty brumak mission from pc version... And pc version is missing some lighting itself but its not too bad... But I still prefer the look of 360 original

Fair enough, I remember that distinct look that the first two Gears games had. People like to shit on it for not having enough color, but for this series it worked.

 

[ethomaz]

I already said that I got the 9 million thing wrong (Thanks to GT Chartz LOL).

But my original statement that GT and Forza are some of the biggest selling franchises, and are ignored in comparisons is still correct.

I don't get it. What's your problem?

Do you think Halo and Killzone are comparable in sales? That is how you are comparing GT and Forza... the main difference was that Forza has way more titles released than Killzone.

 

[The_Mike]

Is it bash Xbox week or something?

It's that every week.