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wavemetrix: Nintendos DS outplays Sonys PSP
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akascream said:
If you've never played it and only witnessed a pair of children play the game (which they SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN DOING -- some cousin you are...and how about their parents??!), you should not speak of it. As an open ended title, there is simply too much content present for one to truly comprehend from such a session. What are you describing is something I've never bothered with simply because I do not find it enjoyable. There is much more to it. You shouldn't speak on something you know nothing about...
dark10x said:
I bitch about it, but it isn't my place to tell them what they can and can't do. I'm sure the game magically turns to gold instead of a violent shitfest once the players 18th birthday rolls around. I'll be sure to watch them play a GTA game in a few years.
In the meantime, I'll tell my aunt that 'dark10x' on the gaming age forums thinks she is a bad mom, and that if she wants to be a good mom, she won't let them play till they are 'dark10x's age, when the horror that was children playing GTA makes a 180 and rides into the sunset of good and innovative game design heh.
But I don't 'know nothing'. I've seen quite enough. Heh, I don't care if GTA has hot ninja sex in it at this point, there is no saving grace good enough to make up for what I saw. Rockstar are whores in my eyes, cashing in on the naughty boners of little children.
No, you can attribute that to the parenting. Rated Mature games aren't good babysittersakascream said:
Newsflash: Letting her kids play Mature games isn't exactly a sign of good parenting...you shouldn't need others to tell you this and you shouldn't pretend that letting her kids play Mature games when they aren't even in high school is a BAD FUCKING IDEAakascream said:
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
Well, people aren't magically mature at 18, but the likelyhood is higher.
PS: Never did the prostitute beat-up thing myself. I prefer to stage massive car accidents by blocking the road and throwing grenades.
PS: Never did the prostitute beat-up thing myself. I prefer to stage massive car accidents by blocking the road and throwing grenades.
Red Blaster
Member
I don't get why some people are on a moral crusade against Rockstar, I mean, it's just a game.
SolidSnakex
Member
akascream said:
So you're comparing something that's illegal to a game that's not?
SolidSnakex
Member
akascream said:
Why not? What harm is a game going to do to someone that knows its nothing more than a game?
radioheadrule83
Banned
I personally don't see why GTAs cartoon violence, movie spoofing, comedy radio and over the top themes lend it the idea: intended for adults. I mean, sitting back and mowing people down wrecklessly just for fun and seeing how long you can elude the police... it's not mature, it's almost downright juvenile. It's fun and that's what counts. I'd let kids play GTA myself if I felt assured they could handle it without being insane. Kids are probably the people who want to play it most today as well.
In a theoretical world where we certified games the same way as movies I'd say it's a PG-13 or an R at best. No way its an NC17 which is what we seem to assume "M" for mature as meaning.
In my opinion GTA is the furthest thing from reality, a world of consequences and realistic violence. I'm not knocking it here by the way - I love it. Turn back the page if you wanna see my own praise.
In a theoretical world where we certified games the same way as movies I'd say it's a PG-13 or an R at best. No way its an NC17 which is what we seem to assume "M" for mature as meaning.
In my opinion GTA is the furthest thing from reality, a world of consequences and realistic violence. I'm not knocking it here by the way - I love it. Turn back the page if you wanna see my own praise.
SolidSnakex said:
If that's the way you feel about it, then I think it's great you like the game. I dunno how we went from DS vs PSP, to GTA being innovative, to the moral implications of the game, but I just don't like GTA violence. There's just something about the reality of running around a functioning city and the freedom you have to be violent that just doesn't jive with me.
Though it is funny how the freedom talked about is always violence related. From what I saw, you aren't really free to do much else.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
For the same reason we have a PG-13 rating. Some audiences are not mature enough for some content. In the case of an interactive videogame, that means an immature player might spend all their time doing the beat-up-the-hooker trick, which is what you observed.
Seems like what you saw *is* the reason that game in rated M.
Seems like what you saw *is* the reason that game in rated M.
SolidSnakex
Member
akascream said:
Perhaps you should actually play it then instead of criticizing it?
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
akascream said:
Driving. Flying. Unless that counts automatically as violence, racing through a city, jumping ramps up over fences and buildings, and generally going anywhere.
When I am not playing a mission, I'll drive around like crazy, barely in control of my car because I am going so fast. That's freedom.
Edit: "From what I saw" meaing immature players, of course.
SolidSnakex said:
No, I don't have to play the game to see that it doesn't interest me. Just like I don't have to look at kiddy porn to know I'm not interested. I've seen the game in action. As far as I'm concerned, it isn't really innovative, and it is garbage. <shrug>
To try and tie it all back into the topic heh, all I was pointing out earlier, is that it really doesn't innovate anywhere that I saw. And it seems you all agree, because while I've asked for how the game innovates, I didn't get any real answers.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
I think I am wasting my time, since I've said this before:
The game innovates having a large streaming world + branching mission struction + mini games all within a seamless unified world (almost seamless in the case of GTA3). The variety of missions in a driving game are also new to the series-- having a walkign + driving engine (plus flying later on) allowed for unparalled variety of mission styles. Include also the economy system of the game. Nowhere before had those elements all come together, anfd the streaming large game enviroment itself was unprecedented.
The game innovates having a large streaming world + branching mission struction + mini games all within a seamless unified world (almost seamless in the case of GTA3). The variety of missions in a driving game are also new to the series-- having a walkign + driving engine (plus flying later on) allowed for unparalled variety of mission styles. Include also the economy system of the game. Nowhere before had those elements all come together, anfd the streaming large game enviroment itself was unprecedented.
Ignatz Mouse said:
So combining a streaming world and mini-games is innovative? There's nothing wrong with improving on existing design concepts, but lets not pretend that that improving the tried and true is innovation. That would make Blizzard the most innovative company in the industry.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
Well, that's half of what I said, and I think you'd best either play the game or watch somebody *actually playing the game* to know hat I mean. Your reply belies your ignorance of the game.
Honestly, it is difficult to put into words just what it is that made GTA so entertaining to me (or why Vice City utterly failed to match GTA3).
Shenmue was one of the very first games to really excite me about a virtual world. Just exploring the world and seeing the sights was enough to interest me. While I ended up enjoying Shenmue in the end, it failed to deliver what I was hoping for; a large, open world with no visible loading. The missions were great fun and well designed (for the most part), but outside of those missions, I could simply enjoy cruising the world. Taking a walk down the street and obeying the laws while admiring my surroundings was someone a serene experience. It was the initial discovery of everything that really impressed me.
The voiceless character you played in GTA3 combined with the less obtrusive comments coming from others on the street really worked well. Watching the sun go down by the ocean, walking along a deserted river bank as rain poured down in the middle of the night, finding ways to climb various buildings and structures and looking out over what I just conquered, etc. Those kinds of activities were entertaining and worked great within the context of the missions.
I enjoyed GTA3 for the same reasons I would later enjoy Morrowind (Daggerfall came before both, of course, but it was simply too limited by technology to really compare). You have a game that provides a large number of fun, variety filled missions that allow a lot of freedom in their approach backed by an exciting and interesting world (though, Morrowind's world was quite stagnant...but there was even more depth to be found, sooo...).
Sure, it's violent at times...but a mature, stable person is not going to take what they see and apply it to the real world. Unlike movies, GTA doesn't really look a whole lot like reality. Fictional violence does not bother me one bit. Though, there are exceptions. Irreversible (a movie), for example. -shudder-
Shenmue was one of the very first games to really excite me about a virtual world. Just exploring the world and seeing the sights was enough to interest me. While I ended up enjoying Shenmue in the end, it failed to deliver what I was hoping for; a large, open world with no visible loading. The missions were great fun and well designed (for the most part), but outside of those missions, I could simply enjoy cruising the world. Taking a walk down the street and obeying the laws while admiring my surroundings was someone a serene experience. It was the initial discovery of everything that really impressed me.
The voiceless character you played in GTA3 combined with the less obtrusive comments coming from others on the street really worked well. Watching the sun go down by the ocean, walking along a deserted river bank as rain poured down in the middle of the night, finding ways to climb various buildings and structures and looking out over what I just conquered, etc. Those kinds of activities were entertaining and worked great within the context of the missions.
I enjoyed GTA3 for the same reasons I would later enjoy Morrowind (Daggerfall came before both, of course, but it was simply too limited by technology to really compare). You have a game that provides a large number of fun, variety filled missions that allow a lot of freedom in their approach backed by an exciting and interesting world (though, Morrowind's world was quite stagnant...but there was even more depth to be found, sooo...).
Sure, it's violent at times...but a mature, stable person is not going to take what they see and apply it to the real world. Unlike movies, GTA doesn't really look a whole lot like reality. Fictional violence does not bother me one bit. Though, there are exceptions. Irreversible (a movie), for example. -shudder-
akascream said:
akascream said:
You know, of all the insipid and extremely short-sighted points you tried to make in this thread about violence these two statements right here are by far the two you should be most ashamed about. I can't imagine how you thought it was a good thing to trivialize something like kiddy pornography or pedophilia in the same god-damn breath as GTA.
Really, akascream, this thread was really bad for you. But to highlight the most hilariously misinformed part of your post...
akascream said:
Let's see. Well, there certainly is a lot of violence! No doubt about that. And there certainly is a lot of freedom to pick my weapons, or my targets. But what else does the game allow me to do? Well, as stated - driving, flying, boating, biking. Racing on motorcycles, racing against clock in planes, racing in cars, in trucks, in bikes. Jumping out of a moving plane and parachuting onto the base of a huge dam. Playin' pool in the back ends of town. Horse betting. Blackjack. Wheel of Fortune. Slots. Video Poker. Searchin' for horseshoes. Searchin' for clams. Searchin' for grafitti. Takin' pictures and tryin' to find those 'special photos'. Puttin' out fires around town. Being a good citizen and arresting people who break the law in a police vehicle. Drivin' an ambulance and going on missions to rescue people who are dying. Drivin' a taxi to try to pick up passangers and drop 'em off, ala Crazy Taxi. Goin' to drivin' school, motorcycle school, boatin' school. Oh, participating in various colisseum events liked destruction derby. Ride up Mount Chiliad and make a badass jump off the top of the mountain. Or, better yet... race the other bikers down the mountainside. Or, if you don't like that... use your bicycle or motorcycle to go to the trick courses and try to get all the icons before time runs out! Still bored? Well, you could also go around trying to find cars to export for cash. You can train at the gym if you like, or become a fatass by eating all day. You can go on pimpin' missions if you like... but perhaps your "mind" rejects that idea! Too exploitative, huh? Well skip that then. You can ride your rocketpack over to the train station and then try to make your scheduled stops on the train by trying to stop in the highlighted area. Oh also, the game is violent and you can kill a lot of stuff.
Hm, there's more. Should I go on?
That's still your distinct subjective take though, all your "points" being quite arguable. The situations however are clearly parallels... DS is essentially the handheld PS2 in terms of software cycle.dark10x said:
Well, it's going to be hard making any worthwhile comparisons until after this holiday really. DS does have plenty of high profile anticipated sequels coming though, including Nintendo's first worldwide online games... there's a good spread of anticipated 3rd party stuff as well (Sonic Rush, Dynasty Warriors, Castlevania, Winning Eleven, FFCC, etc). Hard to predict if DS will have ground breaking title a la GTA3 though, given nobody even saw GTA3 coming... but DS does seem to be poineering new markets in Japan with stuff like Trace Memory, electroplankton, Brain Training and especially Nintendogs (most of which comes west this fall). There's certainly the potential for DS to spark something there given it's unique lineup, it's bringing plenty of new ideas with huge potential impact to the table.dark10x said:
As big as GTA3 has been, it's still dwarfed by what Pokemon did a few years earlier. Don't count Nintendo of all companies out in terms of trends, especially on handhelds.
SantaCruZer said:
It was based on a very small group. It's like taking a national census and only including 100 people in the thing...
Honestly, I'm not concerned about looking less biased. I'm VERY biased here. As usual, I'll enjoy all sides (unlike some people here), but I want PSP to succeed (along with the DS even).
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