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[gofreak]

Here's the challenge: I've got a PC, a GameCube, an Xbox, a DVD player, and potentially a PS2. I want to get a surround sound setup that will work with all of these things. I have done a small bit of reading, and I'm guessing I need to get a) speakers and b) an amplifier, although I'm not sure if the latter is completely necessary. The minimum setup I would like to have is 5.1, but if I could get 6.1 or 7.1 all the better. So I need recommendations on good 5.1/6.1/7.1 speakers, and good amplifiers to match. I would like my setup to work with most if not all of the audio standards (including Dolby Pro Logic 2 for my GC). Here's the potentially hard bit - my budget is limited. At a stretch I could maybe go to €500 for the lot, but I'd prefer to pay less if I could. The room I'll be using them in isn't huge (12'x14'), so the speakers don't have to be "blow-me-away" powerful, but I'd still like them to fill the room nicely.

Any tips and recommendations would be sincerely appreciated!

 

[Teddman]

And I want to piggyback on this thread and ask if there's any good wireless surround sound sets in a box yet.

 

[Zaptruder]

Do a little looking up on the Logitech Z680 5.1 speakers...

they're pretty damn competent speakers... and while they can support quite a few sound outputs at once, I'm not sure if you can hook all those items you've listed without a little work around.

That said, their merits have been hailed all around the world... and while they had problems initially with some hissing, those problems have been fixed to a large degree.

5.1 speakers, support DTS, DD5.1, DPL2, amplifier comes with sub, decoder comes with volume/speaker control unit... as well as a small dinky remote (works well if you memorise the functions).

http://reviews.designtechnica.com/review38_main188.html
http://www.bit-tech.net/review/266/
http://reviews-zdnet.com.com/Logitech_Z_680/4505-3179_16-20720043.html

 

[gofreak]

Thanks Zaptruder, I've read those reviews and a couple more, and it sounds like a good little system indeed! The THX certification is a nice reassurance of its credentials when it comes to movies too..

Quick question: when you say you don't think I could hook up everything I wanted to it, do you mean simultaneously? I.e. I'd have to get an adaptor or switch? If that's the case, it's not really a problem, but if it's lacking certain inputs I might need, then that'd be a minus..

Also - the bass on this system seems to be pretty strong. Like I say, my room isn't massive, and my neighbours are close aswell, so is it possible to say, turn off the subwoofer whilst keeping the other speakers on? I know I'll lose the really low frequencies, but will the rest of the sound hold together well? If I don't need massive bass or volume, would another system be better for me? The Creative Inspire T7700 7.1 system has caught my eye too..it's nowhere near as powerful as the Logitechs, but since power isn't a massive necessity, the extra speakers might be useful..? (you can see a review of it here: http://www.guru3d.com/article/sound/101/2/)

edit - also, with the Z680s, you don't need a seperate amplifier, right? I also have been having a look at the Creative GigaWorks S750 7.1 package - the Inspire's THX-certified bigger brother. They look tempting, but I'm totally confused as to whether I need an amplifier for them or not..

edit 2 - lest anyone think I'm restricting myself to PC-style speaker setups, I'm not! If anyone knows of good all-in-one amp/speaker packages from the regular HT names, please let me know (I doubt seperates are an option within my budget..)

 

[Shompola]

THX certification doesn't mean a lot most of the time. You basicly pay for a test they have done to assure that the hardware meets the THX standards. Besides the THX mixing that can be found on several receivers isn't anything special. Infact I personally dislike adding DSP effects to my sound.

I would personally get a low/mid-range Yamaha Receiver. Why? they are known to be one of the best in the business and are probably the best bang for the buck.

Yamaha RX-V450+4 small satellites is a very competent setup, especially for a rather small room. If you want more bass then you can extend the system with a 100 euro subwoofer.

Yamaha RX-V450 is somewhere 300 Euro or so including shipping, maybe cheaper I don't know. It's a rather new receiver. It's the successor of RX-V440 but its actually a step above RX-V540. Yah that's how Yamaha upgrades their systems.

http://www.yamaha-audio.co.uk/homecinema/receivers/rx-v450/

RX-V450 supports every format I can think off right now including DPL II+ wich I believe Gamecube also supports now. RX-V450 is a 6.1 channel receiver.
RX-V450 has two component in, and they are true HDTV compatible.
It has composite and s-video inputs. It has no RGB input though. You won't find a single receiver in this class with rgb in. Infact I haven't seen a single receiver yet with RGB in. Too bad though. A cheap rgb switch wouldn't be too bad.

I recommend http://www.technikdirekt.de/
I have shopped from them before. Flat rate shipping is 20 euro for hifi equpments. All prices are including VAT if you live in EU.

I personally have the RX-V650 wich is only 400 Euro. What you get is 7.1 channels, more powerful powersupply unit leading to a more powerful receiver. OSD, auto room configuration with included microfon, PRE OUT etc.

 

[Chittagong]

For a very aesthetically pleasing and rather competent surround speaker set, check out Sony's SA-VS500H:

I ordered them from Digitalo.de, arrived rather quick and the price was good - 519 eur + postage with UPS around 40 - 50 eur. They are absolutely beautiful. The best thing is that you don't need separate (ugly) tripods for them.

 

[Defensor]

I totally agree with the Logitech Z-680. I'm personally waiting for the price to drop even more so, but I also fear that a cheaper better speaker setup might be available by the end of the year:

 

[gofreak]

Thanks Shompola, Chittagong & Defensor - your contributions have intrigued. I'm left a little confused, though...I'm not sure where amplifiers fit into some of these systems (like the Z-680), if at all? Also, is 6.1 or 7.1 surround sound worth it, from a movies or games perspective? 7.1 systems would be within my range, but I don't know if I'm sacrificing quality for the extra speakers..

Also, would I be better off going with one of the Creative Labs or Logitech THX systems, or equivalently priced systems from Sony/Yamaha etc? Looking at some AV forums, a lot of people seem to look down a bit at the Logitechs and Creatives of this world, even though they seem to have got stellar reviews (though those reviews are mostly at PC-centric sites, I guess). I is all confused..

I guess, with a budget of €500 or less, what would you do?

 

[Zaptruder]

The Z680s should fall well under budget

the amplifier is located on the back of the subwoofer. its supplies enough power to the subs and sats... which is no mean feat; 500+ watts RMS system.

 

[Memles]

Been looking into a speaker setup to use for my Laptop DVD Player/GameCube at University, and was trying to figure out a similar situation, just about $300 less expensive. I know the Logitech Z-640 is a slightly less capable model, but it's only listing at $100 Canadian, and that's pretty damn good.

For my purpose of watching movies and playing games, is it worth it to pick up the Surround set for the $100, or is it too expansive and more speaker than I need, and would th X-220s at about $55 after rebate be more than enough?

Sorry to piggyback on your thread, just have been looking into Logitech Speakers myself in the past few days.

 

[Marty Chinn]

You can easily do a combination of like a $300 receiver which will likely take all of those inputs and reasonable $200 speaker setup. That would be the best bet rather than those shoddy computer speaker setups people are suggesting.

 

[gofreak]

You can easily do a combination of like a $300 receiver which will likely take all of those inputs and reasonable $200 speaker setup. That would be the best bet rather than those shoddy computer speaker setups people are suggesting.

This route would definitely provide an audible difference over the Z-680s or Creative's 7.1s?

Also, are there any guidelines for pairing speakers with amps? Asides from buying the best of each that you can afford? Should you stick to the same manufacturer for both?

Sorry for all the questions..thanks for any help!

 

[cybamerc]

Spending 300 bucks on a receiver and only 200 on speakers is insane. Switch the numbers around and it starts making more sense.

 

[Marty Chinn]

This route would definitely provide an audible difference over the Z-680s or Creative's 7.1s?

Also, are there any guidelines for pairing speakers with amps? Asides from buying the best of each that you can afford? Should you stick to the same manufacturer for both?

Sorry for all the questions..thanks for any help!

Most definitely there would be an audible difference. For starters you're likely to get more power to each speaker. In your case, to find the best pairing, you probably want to look at the power out of the receiver to each speaker and then the power of the speaker itself. In general you want to have speakers that at least match the power rating, if not go higher. In general it is said you'll spend the most money on your speakers. No need to stick to the same manufacturer of speakers as a receiver. Even if you cheap out a bit and get like a set of $200 speakers to hook to the receiver, it will sound better than the Logitech or the Creative setup.

 

[Marty Chinn]

Spending 300 bucks on a receiver and only 200 on speakers is insane. Switch the numbers around and it starts making more sense.

Well, he's got a limited budget, and given what he was thinking of going with, he's better off doing that then what he's currently trying to do.

 

[gofreak]

Well, he's got a limited budget, and given what he was thinking of going with, he's better off doing that then what he's currently trying to do.

Hehe, but would I be even more better off spending more on speakers than on my amp?

 

[Shompola]

I think best is to buy a receiver and a pair of fronts. There are fronts that are good and only cost 200USD a pair. Later on you can extend your HT with rears and center and possibly a subwoofer if you really need one.

 

[Marty Chinn]

The thing is, you can get a pretty decent receiver for about $300, and then get some speakers that will make it sound better than the setup you were looking at, but they can be replaced over time as more funds become available. It's much easier to upgrade the speakers than drop down a lot of money on a new receiver.

 

[Marty Chinn]

I think best is to buy a receiver and a pair of fronts. There are fronts that are good and only cost 200USD a pair. Later on you can extend your HT with rears and center and possibly a subwoofer if you really need one.

I'm sure he wants 5.1 now though.

 

[cybamerc]

Marty Chinn:

> Well, he's got a limited budget, and given what he was thinking of going with, he's better
> off doing that then what he's currently trying to do.

Sure. But you can get a pretty decent amp/receiver for $300 and it would be a shame to couple it with a $200 speaker set. Also since his budget is 500 euro I reckon that he won't be needing anything fancy like component switching.

 

[gofreak]

Marty Chinn:

> Well, he's got a limited budget, and given what he was thinking of going with, he's better
> off doing that then what he's currently trying to do.

Sure. But you can get a pretty decent amp/receiver for $300 and it would be a shame to couple it with a $200 speaker set. Also since his budget is 500 euro I reckon that he won't be needing anything fancy like component switching.

I'm gonna stand back and see where you guys go with this, but just FYI, my display will have component inputs. If that's at all what you were getting at. Carry on

 

[Marty Chinn]

Like I said before, he can easily upgrade the speakers over time though. This would just be enough to get him started, and sounding way better than the Logitech or Creative Labs setup.

gofreak: Trust me on this. I understand where they are coming from because your speakers are supposed to be the bulk of your cost. What they keep suggesting is you either get a worse receiver or you just get a couple speakers. I'm telling you to get a decent receiver, and okay speakers that you can easily replace when you have the money to do so properly. What I'm suggesting will sound better than what was being said before, and leave you options to improve over time. If you get a weaker receiver, that limits your improvement over time without replacing the receiver.

 

[cybamerc]

I'm gonna stand back and see where you guys go with this, but just FYI, my display will have component inputs. If that's at all what you were getting at. Carry on

How many progressive scan sources do you have (dvd player, US Cube/Xbox, PS2)?



Marty Chinn:

> Like I said before, he can easily upgrade the speakers over time though.

I suppose. I'd personally rather wait then than buy $200 worth of speakers that I have no intention of keeping in the long term. Or go for a decent stereo set-up.

 

[gofreak]

How many progressive scan sources do you have (dvd player, US Cube/Xbox, PS2)?

My DVD player will do PAL and NTSC prog scan, I have a US cube and a UK Xbox. Does the UK Xbox do prog scan?

Is component switching just multiple comonent inputs? Why would the audio need component inputs..isn't that an image thing only..?

 

[Marty Chinn]

How many progressive scan sources do you have (dvd player, US Cube/Xbox, PS2)?



Marty Chinn:

> Like I said before, he can easily upgrade the speakers over time though.

I suppose. I'd personally rather wait then than buy $200 worth of speakers that I have no intention of keeping in the long term. Or go for a decent stereo set-up.

I went this route when I first moved out and had a limited budget cuz of it. After about a few months, I gradually started replacing components. It was just much easier to do yet still have 5.1 right away. This way you get the instant gratification with room to grow without much compromise. It's not like a set of $200 speakers is complete crap either and it still will sound way better than the Logitech and Creative setups. You can get decent sounding 100 watt speakers for a 5.1 setup for around $200. I know he's speaking euros, but I'm hoping there will be something comparable for the examples I'm giving. Not to mention, let's say he gets this cheap 5.1 setup for $200, he goes out and starts upgrading by buying two new fronts. wow all of a sudden he has a 7.1 setup because now he has two extra speakers. Again, more options.

 

[Shompola]

I still say get a receiver for 300 euro + 200 euro for a pair of speakers. These speakers can later on be used as rear speakers when you upgrade your fronts. You won't miss a lot when not using rear, center and subwoofer. Almost the entire sound is still from the fronts and you can redirect rear/center/subwoofer to fronts anyway. And if you allready have a pair of speakers you can use them as rear ones temporarily, and they don't even need to be any good or big/powerful.

 

[Marty Chinn]

My DVD player will do PAL and NTSC prog scan, I have a US cube and a UK Xbox. Does the UK Xbox do prog scan?

Is component switching just multiple comonent inputs? Why would the audio need component inputs..isn't that an image thing only..?

Ya, it's multiple component inputs. My receiver has two component inputs with one component output. I'm currently looking at an auto sensing switch box that will handle four component inputs as well as digital audio via optical or coax.

Basically you pipe everything through to your receiver is why you would want component inputs. A receiver will have both video and audio inputs. This way when you switch modes, it's all in sync as well as acting like a switch box for your different components. Here's an example of what the back of a receiver looks like to give you an idea:

 

[cybamerc]

gofreak:

> Does the UK Xbox do prog scan?

Yes but the games in general don't. I think it's possible to patch the games to output a prog scan signal but I'm not sure.

> Is component switching just multiple comonent inputs?

Yes.

> Why would the audio need component inputs..isn't that an image thing only..?

Yeah but your tv only has one component input and if you intend to take advantage of the progressive scan capability in all your video sources you will either need to switch cables or use some kind of switchbox (which could be a receiver).

 

[Shompola]

My DVD player will do PAL and NTSC prog scan, I have a US cube and a UK Xbox. Does the UK Xbox do prog scan?

Is component switching just multiple comonent inputs? Why would the audio need component inputs..isn't that an image thing only..?

HT receivers have video in and video out in addition to audio in and out. You can connect 2x component inputs on the RX-V450 and connect component out to the tv. I believe the switching is auto. The RX-V450
also supports multi conversion. That means that you can connect a single cable from receiver to tv and feed all the signals from the consoles from it. The downside is that the RX-V450 is composite only conversion. It still supports component out but the multi conversion is composite only. No big deal really.