A lot of people didn't know about his platform recently being announced in a cohesive narrative. It's literally news. That and his new hire. And the 28k rally.
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Bernie Sanders Unveils Sweeping Policy Platform To Combat Racial Inequality
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Jeevesmeister
Banned
Hush hush you're ruining their heroic mythos being written
Nope.
Bernie Sanders, his team and supporters have made it very clear that this is a grassroots campaign. That's great!
The problem with a grassroots campaign is that if the people who make up those grassroots want to be condescending dicks, that doesn't speak well for the campaign. You can't have it both ways.
If I see a candidate whose political views might align with mine stumble badly on the country's worst social crisis...and the response of his grassroots support is
-shut up
-stop interrupting our party
-we'll get to you later
-how about that .00001%
-economics first
-why don't they go protest in Baltimore**
-MLK TRAP CARD
-your protest is what causes racism
-who else are you going to vote for
-dat Hillary tho
Well, I'm going to act accordingly and not want to associate with said cheesedickery or said campaign.
Why? Because my issue is a life/death thing for family, friends, and people who look like me and mine. You don't want to take that seriously? Fine. We know how this voting strength rolls out, thanks to Obama's WH run - and just as importantly, so do the other Democrat candidates. Someone will fill that vacuum (Martin fucking O'Malley of all people clued into this, like, ASAP) and earn those votes. Your guy doesn't get a pass for what he did 50 years ago when black folks are getting killed now.
no you didn't because I ban everybody I disagree with
**real quote from so-called allies at the NetRoots brouhaha, and you wonder why Negroes are angry
Cause they're batshit crazy.
The issue here is, how do you know the dickheads represent Bernie's supporters as a whole? There are dickheads in every politician's support base. More attention being given to it doesn't make it more representative of the entire base. I mean, if someone has proof that no other candidate has any dickheads supporting them, I'll change my mind.
I mean, I don't recall a politician being criticized without some of their supporters being dickheads in response. I just don't recall headlines coming out about a candidate being "insensitive" to views of a particular group and all the responses from his supporters being "Oh yes, well you're correct about all of that. So sorry, so sorry. We'll get to changing it right away. Anything else we can do for you?"
There's been dickhead responses to just about every critique to every politician ever.
As over-sensitive as Bernie's supporters have been, it's naive to think that you don't get dickheads answering when you protest a candidate and take away the mic from him when he shows up to speak.
You think his protectionist views, seeming willingness to get into a trade war with China, and his 15 dollar minimum wage proposal are economically workable and beneficial? I am genuinely curious because based on your other posts concerning economics you seem to know quite a lot.
We need one of those tweet analyses things.
I don't think you've clicked on that site in years, looking at that front page
The SonyToo! excuse finally makes its way over to OT! 'Tis a glorious day indeed.
I'll just pull this out since you may have missed it
It's more like you and the other guy can't stand to believe that Bernie had to be pushed into doing this.
The same way all blacks are beholden to BLM, of course
And since I don't think all blacks are beholden to BLM... maybe you could reconsider your stance on Bernie's supporters. Don't let some dickheads paint your view of the whole group.The same way all blacks are beholden to BLM, of course
Kid Kamikaze10
Member
See, the problem is that there was a lot of dickheads. Some online, some offline (ie: the people asking for the women to be tasered in Seattle), some are pretty prominent figures and sites (journalists, Gawker, Young Turks, etc.).
A lot of people showed their asses over this. And showed their asses at black activists, journalists, and more.
I hope it's something that'll eventually be washed away, but damage was done.
A few bad apples spoil the bunch. Dickheads will only drag the campaign down, so instead of making excuses, help stomp them out.
What's "a lot"? I mean, when we're talking about a politician whose supporter base is largely active online, it only takes a small percentage of them to be dickheads and there's suddenly a bunch of dickhead tweet online, getting retweeted very quickly by people saying "Look at these dickheads."
Even if there was 0.1% of his supporters being dickheads, that still means thousands of dickheads are online tweeting dickhead stuff, and you're gonna condemn the other 99.9% and possibly support some other candidate who might say the same thing but has no record to show sincerity on that issue?
I don't know what the actual percentages are, but think about how few it takes for the comments to feel like a lot, especially when it's repeatedly pushed in your face by people reporting on the dickheads and whatnot.
By all means, let me know how that's even possible. I've already openly stated that the dickheads' responses were the wrong way to approach it. If you have their names and addresses or something, by all means share.
nah, I supported the netroots protest because before then he wasn't vocal about racial issues and I think it did push him. This latest one just seemed unnecessary since he was already open to addressing racial issues as can be seen by the hiring of Sanders and collaborating with her to create a more defined racial justice platform. If he's open to discussion why not go that route?
Lol, their forbearer were the obamaites and they spoilt Hilary's coronation.
Why is there so much concern about Bernie supporters if Hilary wins? I really don't get it because most Bernie supporters are pretty reserved with their comments on GAF, at least in terms of his chances of winning, which we accept are pretty none. We'll be fine. And we'll likely vote for Hilary when the times comes. Let us have our fun.
D'ultimate
Member
http://www.apnewsarchive.com/2015/N...dorsement/id-0585033a4cb94e9bb4ab3c9d749d098d
He also picked up his 1st major labor endorsement today. Nurses Union.
He also picked up his 1st major labor endorsement today. Nurses Union.
As much as I don't agree with this approach, it depends on how the Hillary camp treats the Sanders camp between now and then.
Condescending references to him not having a chance, and that supporting Hillary is best in the long run? Ignoring certain issues to claim that Hillary and Sanders don't have policy differences? Ignoring polls on individual issues to claim that Sanders' platform is too far to the left? Might push Sanders' people to stay at home during the general.
Classy positivity for their candidate the whole way? I can see lots of Sanders people shrugging and voting for her.
Again, I'm not supporting this, because I don't want a GOP president, but it's likely a real factor.
The fact that you're trying to quantify this is precisely the kind of behaviour that's reflected so badly on Sanders' campaign over the last few weeks.
Stop handwaving. When someone tells you that an inordinate amount of vitriol is being directed their way, your first reaction should be to listen. Not come up with excuses.
Your guy does something good and it's like you can't wait to piss all over his efforts with more nonsense. Ye gods
I can't
My guess is that there will be a fuck ton of white liberal racism as black folks are blamed for his loss. This is just the start of the shit parade.
The biggest thing about the endorsement is the fact that a women dominated Union supports Bernie over Hillary.
I listened. I responded by saying their reaction was wrong. Now you're telling me to do something I already did.
That's what leads to people saying that YOU are not listening.
Abinash117
Member
Got any articles or threads about progressives doing that , not saying you are wrong. I just read the issue on The Hill and Neogaf mainly.
A lot of Bernie supports from what I gather think Hillary can't be trusted because she was ties to corps and Wall Street. She also supported 'tough on crime' back in the day.
Few think she is no different from Bush or some other republicans.
Besides the aformentioned "stop making excuses", you acknowledge that the dickheads are poisonous to the campaign, even if they are in the minority. Be proactive in calling them out on their dickheadedness, and if they start whining about how its not fair about Bernie being targeted, remind them of what Bernie is about.
I HAVE called them out, in more than one thread.
And what "excuse" did I make? Saying that dickheads exist everywhere is not an excuse. It's putting it in perspective.
I didn't even think of this. Ugh, I could really see this happen. Not at GAF where Bernie supporters are civil but the crazies over at Reddit and Democratic Underground who seem to act more like they are part of GamerGate than the Democratic Party.
Well I'm not the biggest Hilary fan, for some of those reasons sure, but let's be honest, who else are we going to vote for? Trump?
No, you responded by putting the onus back on the people being abused.
Oh well that's alright then.
Hillary (or any declared Dem candidate) is going to nominate liberal Supreme Court justices. That is all it should take when it comes to the general election for any liberal.
freeofgreed
Member
Yeah i'm curious as well. I get like 90% of my news from neogaf, so i'm curious how other sources were handling this.
I'm not trying to put the onus on anyone. I said we should look past the inelegance of both camps and move forward. It's what I said in the OP of this thread. I see people here complaining about each other and I'm arguing to move past it. Stop getting hung up on dickheads and look at all people trying to help. Join with them instead of getting distracted by the dickheads. There's no excuse for their behavior, but the cause of racial justice is served better by focusing on the progress that the Sanders camp made in the past two days.
Jill Stein!!!
jk
If people can't get Bernie, Hillary will be better than any Republican.
Yaphett Kotto
Member
Definitely bookmarked.
Problem is the BLM craziness is really the only coverage Bernie gets now in the media.
To the non-hardcore policito Bernie is "is that old white guy on tv the black lives matter people hate" and nothing more at the point.
First impressions are hard to erase.
True. And that's why I'll vote for a democrat for sure. Though I wonder how many voters are aware of how important Supreme Justice appointments really are. Not sure it's a driving point for voting, though it should be.
Great news. Reading through his page now.
It's a deflection.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Varies, really. I don't think he really understands how much globalisation has affected the ability of developed economies to implement socialist policies, which is a big down-side, but I also think (at least so far) the consequences of that are not disastrous.
I can support protectionism as a temporary measure. It's true that in the long-run, free trade benefits essentially all countries and there's a wealth of data to support this, but there are still short-run costs when labour-intensive industries in capital-advantaged countries see unemployment. That'd be fine if countries had the kind of retraining programmes to get these people into other industries and the welfare system to support them during that time, but America has neither of those, and Sanders is keen on both of them, so at least temporarily I'm content to support a candidate who proposes that - the protectionism is at least reasonable as a sticky plaster procedure while the actual root problems are addressed, although I'd obviously not like to see it as a long-run policy solution.
Trade war with China is largely irrelevant. The amount of economic interlinkage China and the United States have is vastly overexaggerated, and for the most part where they do interact they have complementary economies - China does stuff the United States doesn't do and vice versa. I think it's diplomatically stupid and doesn't help the United States from a foreign policy perspective, but economically I don't think it would actually do very much either way, so I can ignore it. There's an element of Cnut and the sea, here.
You know from previous threads I'd much rather abolish the minimum wage and replace it with a citizen's income system, but I'll take the best thing that's on offer given that's not available.
Sanders isn't a perfect candidate by any means (on many issues other than the ones you name, too, like his stance on gun rights, and also how poorly he handled Netroots Nation), but in comparison with other candidates, he would be my preferred choice.
Seems like they transitioned from Hillary to Palin and stayed in the republican corner ever since
But the problem is by saying "eh they're everywhere" you're still being an apologist and discounting the effect they have to onlookers. Fuck them. We know that dickheads are everywhere, so why remind us other than to distract from Bernie dickheads? Step 1 is acknowledging the problem without making excuses.
Obama didn't become president by having whiny dickhead supporters, but they're certainly one of the reasons Clinton's 2008 campaign failed.
Kid Kamikaze10
Member
Honestly, so many of them dealt with it, from BLM activists to black feminists like Feminista Jones to Son of Baldwin to op-ed article writers like Charles M. Blow to even comedy podcasts hosts like Black Guy Who Tips. It would be hard to really collect them all.
This isn't an example (but his twitter is filled with them), but the general feeling that many have stated (many of the activists I follow have said the same) via Elon James White.
For a background check, Elon James White was at Netroots. He's a journalist and podcast host. He was there when everything went down with Bernie and BLM, and got a bunch of the backlash then and now.
https://twitter.com/elonjames/status/630832406312792064
He had a count going for how many people he blocked this weekend. It was only 73 or so, but he stopped at times.
But it's led to stuff like Gawker and Young Turks disparaging the whole movement among other media sources as well.
Again, it's not an excuse, not an apology for them. I'm saying stop getting sidetracked by them. The bandwagon of justice moving forward doesn't have room for them. Leave them behind and work with the people who are there for you.
If someone tells you "Forget the haters," do you respond with "What? How can I forget them? You're advocating that I DON'T use my time and energy to go up to all of them and challenge them all?"
Seriously, our time and energy needs to be focused on the progress made in the last two days. Bernie has a better-communicated platform. Let's push the platform.
You can't deny they are increasingly becoming the face of his supporters online. Places like Reddit where the supporters act like GamerGate wackos with a lot of weird implied racism do the candidate no good.
There is none of that here at GAF, but there is no way to deny this type of supporter is all over the Internet and a very loud faction.
I'm sure a Hillary supporter like you wants them to be seen as the majority. The fact is, that Bernie's reddit supporters responded to the protest at Netroots by writing an open letter to Bernie to focus on race and flesh out his platform on it.
That's no one's fault except for the campaign that couldn't even rally their own ardent supporters
That's bullshit and I don't appreciate people throwing around "white liberal racists" like that. Some turd called for a lady to get tazed and now there's a thing where white liberals are racists? What a bunch of crap!
People get really REALLY passionate about politics. When you storm the stage and steal the mic, it doesn't take a racist to get annoyed with you and call for your removal. Doesn't matter what color you are, the fact is you stole the stage when it wasn't your turn and now you've made people in the audience angry. They didn't come to see you. They don't care what color you are, they just want you to stop ruining the rally. Some people will lose their shit and call for a tazering. It's a shitty thing to jump to, but it's not surprising considering all the reasons I listed above.
So please, enough with the white liberal racists shit. They're not racists they're just angry and in that moment they were total assholes. BLM wanted to make a point, it got made, it more importantly got heard, and we are moving forward together, aren't we?
Let's do that. Let's move on together. Please.
As if placing blame and fault makes it all better? Just avoid that situation the best you can, by withholding the condescending references to his poll numbers.
freeofgreed
Member
I don't think he was calling them racist specifically, but was more referencing the more subtle racism that exist among some liberals. Which is definitlty a thing.
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