You're really reading a lot into a question that was specifically about Bernie's support of down party tickets in the Democratic establishment.
They weren't asking about his ideology, they were asked about his party affiliation.
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Hillary Clinton on Sanders: 'I'm not even sure he is a Democract'
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You're really reading a lot into a question that was specifically about Bernie's support of down party tickets in the Democratic establishment.
They weren't asking about his ideology, they were asked about his party affiliation.
Orbis Tabula
Member
I can understand why someone would agree with "Hillary isn't a liberal" or "Hillary isn't a progressive."
"Hillary isn't a democrat" though? Nah, fuck that. She's as blue as they come. An absolute party loyalist. If you don't think that the Democratic party is liberal enough, then that's fine, but I can't see any interpretation of the last few years of politics that doesn't establish Clinton as firmly a democrat.
"Hillary isn't a democrat" though? Nah, fuck that. She's as blue as they come. An absolute party loyalist. If you don't think that the Democratic party is liberal enough, then that's fine, but I can't see any interpretation of the last few years of politics that doesn't establish Clinton as firmly a democrat.
Hillary is only left in a relative sense.
Oh come the fuck on.
David Incorporated Esq.
Member
Because it's a straight up Trump-esque semantic dodge. Shes knows what 'democrat' means in the context of the two party system, modern politics, and an election cycle, and so does everyone else. But there she is, clearly implying that Bernie isn't someone that left-leaning Americans should be voting for, while leaving the door open for, "What? I never said THAT!"
"I said 'their' not 'they're'! Don't you people know what the Oxford comma is?!?!"
'Petty' is a good word for it.
No, Bernie Sanders literally isn't a member of the democratic party, and in a question about helping out down-ballot votes that's relevant.
I think if he were a full in party member you'd see less dumb shit from Sanders voters about going for Trump if Sanders doesn't win the primary.
No actually, she really is.
Where exactly does this criticism come from? Why does the left eat its own so fucking often?
Ugh. Combined with the horseshit I read earlier (25% of Bernie voters would not vote for Hillary in a national election), this fucking stupid country deserves Trump.
I know, it's hilarious seeing people fall all over themselves to emulate the ideological purity of the Tea Party. A large group of the party of diversity is crowing for messianic figures like sanders that won't compromise with anyone after 8 years of obstructionism. It's fucking incredible that Clinton gets called a republican while she is to the left of Obama on many issues. Incredible
cartoon_soldier
Member
Hillary has done more for Democrats than Bernie ever did and ever will.
NoblesseOblige
Banned
Hillary is both the embodiment of the Democratic 'establishment' while simultaneously not being a Democrat. Solid logic from some people.
benicillin
Banned
Yeah, there's some crazy halo effect going on here. Gotta hate what Hillary says and love what Bernie says. Even when they're the same thing.
Well I think some people get annoyed by it because they identify as democrats and see Bernie as, even if he's not technically a democrat, representing their positions more accurately than someone like Clinton. She's objectively correct, but they might be taking it more as "no he's not a democrat ideologically" and less "he's literally technically not a member of the Democratic party."
I can understand why someone would agree with "Hillary isn't a liberal" or "Hillary isn't a progressive."
"Hillary isn't a democrat" though? Nah, fuck that. She's as blue as they come. An absolute party loyalist. If you don't think that the Democratic party is liberal enough, then that's fine, but I can't see any interpretation of the last few years of politics that doesn't establish Clinton as firmly a democrat.
It's hysterical because that's one of the main arguments used against her- 'She's a lapdog for the DNC, stealing all of those superdelegates!'
And now, she isn't really a democrat. I feel like I've stepped into an alternate dimension sometimes.
He isn't.
He doesn't care about the party at all and will do nothing to help them down ticket. Even if Bernie wins the election he would likely harm chances at the house/senate by only focusing on himself.
And then he'll be stuck with a hostile congress and no way to get his one man revolution proposals done.
He doesn't care about the party at all and will do nothing to help them down ticket. Even if Bernie wins the election he would likely harm chances at the house/senate by only focusing on himself.
And then he'll be stuck with a hostile congress and no way to get his one man revolution proposals done.
TheLostBigBoss
Banned
Because it's a straight up Trump-esque semantic dodge. Shes knows what 'democrat' means in the context of the two party system, modern politics, and an election cycle, and so does everyone else. But there she is, clearly implying that Bernie isn't someone that left-leaning Americans should be voting for, while leaving the door open for, "What? I never said THAT!"
"I said 'their' not 'they're'! Don't you people know what the Oxford comma is?!?!"
'Petty' is a good word for it.
I don't think you understand.
He's literally not a democrat, he does not care about the democratic party, and in turn there can be an argument if he actually wants the parties down ticket candidates to succeed.
FrontalMonk
Banned
Nothing quite like career politicians pulling out the 'my opponent is dishonest' rherotical hooks and gouging away.
It's not about dishonesty.
You're really reading a lot into a question that was specifically about Bernie's support of down party tickets in the Democratic establishment.
They weren't asking about his ideology, they were asked about his party affiliation.
It's this. You can be a maverick rebel all you want, but if you aren't supporting anyone else in the party you joined solely for the purposes of your presidential bid, how the hell do you think you are going to get any legislation passed?
Interviewer: Hillary, what's 2+2?
Hillary: 4
SandersSupporters: WHO THE FUCK DOES SHE THINK SHE IS?!
Yeah... Was wondering how this was a "line of attack".
Are people being overly defensive?
Omegasquash
Member
She's right. He's not been a Democrat for long, and he's been doing it (I suspect), just to be eligible to run. I guarantee that if you'd have asked Hillary about Bernie being progressive she'd have said "yes" in a heartbeat.
People on here calling her petty for this...SMH. Bernie has even run against Democrats in VT (though not as frequently as he's run against GOP, and not in the last decade). He's been Independent for a looooooong time, and a friend to progressives for sure, but he hasn't been a Democrat, and I'd be amazed if ANYONE that's worked with or done work for the Democratic party would say anything different than what Hillary said.
People on here calling her petty for this...SMH. Bernie has even run against Democrats in VT (though not as frequently as he's run against GOP, and not in the last decade). He's been Independent for a looooooong time, and a friend to progressives for sure, but he hasn't been a Democrat, and I'd be amazed if ANYONE that's worked with or done work for the Democratic party would say anything different than what Hillary said.
Clinton's bringing it up because after WY it's a series of closed or semi-closed primaries in which there will be more affiliated Democrats voting
I mean in NY, which is completely closed, only new voters registered as Democratic before March 25th, or previously registered non—Democratic voters who changed their party affiliation to Democratic before October 25, 2015.
She's targeting the Democratic base.
She's not even really bringing it up. She was point-blank asked about it. She doesn't say that his policies don't belong in the democratic party, just that she thinks Sanders identifies himself as a democrat.
You're really arent either, Hillary
But yeah, he's bot fully dem. Or farrrr left lol
But everyone else wonders the same of her.
There is no question about that, bros. I mean she's only been a registered Democrat since 1968, for starters.*
http://www.biography.com/people/hillary-clinton-9251306#early-years
Orbis Tabula
Member
Because it's a straight up Trump-esque semantic dodge. Shes knows what 'democrat' means in the context of the two party system, modern politics, and an election cycle, and so does everyone else. But there she is, clearly implying that Bernie isn't someone that left-leaning Americans should be voting for, while leaving the door open for, "What? I never said THAT!"
"I said 'their' not 'they're'! Don't you people know what the Oxford comma is?!?!"
'Petty' is a good word for it.
If Bernie Sanders wanted people to consider him a democrat, he had quite a few decades to build up that cred. Instead, he chose to identify himself as an independent. Proudly. And I think that's awesome that he did. We need more independents. But I also think that it's fair game for Democrats to call him out on that. Records matter.
Hillary is only left in a relative sense.
Eveyone is only left in the relative sense. That's literally the only possibility.
Steel said:Liberal, progressive and left are the same damn thing. What she's basically saying is that she doesn't know if Sanders really identifies with the democratic party, she doesn't really comment on whether or not his policies fit in the democratic party. They do.
I'm aware of what she's doing and she's not incorrect to do so.
But I refuse to use this stupid American political ideological scale because it obscures the nature of actual political philosophy. Liberal and left are not the same thing at all. Leftists believe in socialism, liberals believe in capitalism. Period. Yes I'm aware that that's not how the words are used here. We use it wrong. That's why I said she's an exemplary Democrat but not a leftist.
Relative to whom?
And where does Bernie fall on this spectrum?
Relative to the world. She is a centrist.
Bernie is a social democrat, i.e. moderately left.
Awesome so now liberal democrats aren't real democrats in addition to moderate republicans not being real republicans
Fuck this shit
No, this is literally about his political affiliation with the established two parties. Being a Democrat with a capital D means more than just having liberal viewpoints.
NoblesseOblige
Banned
That's why I like him
I'd hope you liked him for his policies rather than him being a nonconformist.
lastflowers
Banned
I've been a longer Astros fan than a Democrat. Fuck these newcomers.
Relative to the world. She is a centrist.
Bernie is a social democrat, i.e. moderately left.
Ah yes. Nearly identical voting records... Yet one is moderately left, the other a centrist.
Sorry, that doesn't make any goddamn sense.
Orbis Tabula
Member
Well I think some people get annoyed by it because they identify as democrats and see Bernie as, even if he's not technically a democrat, representing their positions more accurately than someone like Clinton. She's objectively correct, but they might be taking it more as "no he's not a democrat ideologically" and less "he's literally technically not a member of the Democratic party."
Yeah. I mean, I definitely get why people are reacting defensively. They're just doing it in a stupid way. If Hillary Clinton isn't liberal enough for someone, it's not because she's not a democrat. It's because Democrats aren't that liberal.
Ah yes. Nearly identical voting records... Yet one is moderately left, the other a centrist.
Sorry, that doesn't make any goddamn sense.
Do you know what liberalism means, historically?
Simon Belmont
Banned
I don't think many of the Bernie supporters in here are getting further than "Hillary Clinton on Sanders" before replying.
SenorArdilla
Member
She's right
That's what Bernie supporters would want you to believe. /jk
You're really reading a lot into a question that was specifically about Bernie's support of down party tickets in the Democratic establishment.
They weren't asking about his ideology, they were asked about his party affiliation.
I would be a lot less skeptical if I could believe that everyone involved didn't know how modern media works and which half sentence was going to make it as the headline.
No, Bernie Sanders literally isn't a member of the democratic party, and in a question about helping out down-ballot votes that's relevant.
I think if he were a full in party member you'd see less dumb shit from Sanders voters about going for Trump if Sanders doesn't win the primary.
If that's what she was referring to, party affiliation instead of the colloquially understood meaning of democrat as left-leaning or progressive, then there shouldn't be anything to be 'not sure' about.
Well, he's not, and I don't think that people really care.
What a bad line of attack.
She didn't attack him. She could have, but she didn't.
Poodlestrike
Banned
Hillary is only left in a relative sense.
Left is only left in a relative sense.
Ah yes. Nearly identical voting records... Yet one is moderately left, the other a centrist.
Sorry, that doesn't make any goddamn sense.
This is going to be swerved to the Iraq war vote when what you're actually referring to is domestic policy, where they agree on what the problems are but not the solutions.
Dash_Riprock
Member
Have we hit all the marks on the Hillary bingo card yet?
Do you know what liberalism means, historically?
Yes.
Do you know what it means, in the United States, contextually?
Well, he's not, and I don't think that people really care.
What a bad line of attack.
I'm confused as to why the article would actually call it a line of attack. It isn't.
Because it's a straight up Trump-esque semantic dodge. Shes knows what 'democrat' means in the context of the two party system, modern politics, and an election cycle, and so does everyone else. But there she is, clearly implying that Bernie isn't someone that left-leaning Americans should be voting for, while leaving the door open for, "What? I never said THAT!"
"I said 'their' not 'they're'! Don't you people know what the Oxford comma is?!?!"
'Petty' is a good word for it.
She was point blank asked about him continuing to hem and haw on supporting down ticket races.
Her answer was perfectly fine in context. Bernie refused to join the party until it suited his needs and has done nothing that hints he has any desire to grow the party itself.
Bernie supporters try to make this about literally everything but policy, since they're nearly identical.Ah yes. Nearly identical voting records... Yet one is moderately left, the other a centrist.
Sorry, that doesn't make any goddamn sense.
God I want to like Bernie, but people make it so hard sometimes.
I would be a lot less skeptical if I could believe that everyone involved didn't know how modern media works and which half sentence was going to make it as the headline.
She even goes so far as to say that he's bringing lots of great, important Democratic issues to the table. She's definitely not questioning his ideological purity.
I get that some people irrationally hate Clinton, but let's try to give her the benefit of the doubt with a simple question and answer such as this.
MarauderShields
Member
She's right, but this is not the time to say that. You say that and nip it in the bud early on. Not when we're chest deep in the Democratic Primary and he's your only remaining opponent. That just splinters the party.
Yeah that's Bernie's job
JesseEwiak
Member
Do you know what liberalism means, historically?
In the last seven years, it's become calling everybody who isn't as liberal as you a neoliberal sellout because God forbid you understand the facts on the ground instead of being upset Obama didn't turn us into Sweden in his first six months.
Orbis Tabula
Member
Have we hit all the marks on the Hillary bingo card yet?
I don't think I've heard "shrill" yet, so I've only got four in a row.
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