IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
Uh... the show is exclusive to Prime lol
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IGN: Exclusive First Look at the Orcs From Prime Video's The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power
- Thread starter Represent.
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Uh... the show is exclusive to Prime lol
Batiman
Banned
Well I’ve enjoyed tons of things that many here considered woke.. I love LOTR and thought the trailer looked good so hopefully I’ll enjoy this. The little things people complain about being woke just isn’t noticeable to me.
And I’m not familiar with the makers, but I do know a lot of creators make trash to masterpieces so I never like to judge people by their past work. I don’t really look into those things. I just learned to keep my expectations in check for everything nowadays while still being optimistic.
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
What are you even referring to?
One of the show runners is.. Mormon.. about the least "woke" group of people on the planet.
You misunderstand. It said exclusive teaser. Bow what is an exclusive? Generally it's when a third party gets dibs on something.
So if, say, ET ha posted it, and nobody else, they could claim it's an exclusive. But when the company behind it does so? No, it's their product, exclusive is the wrong go.
Dame goes for the show being on prime. They're making it, calling it an exclusive is just dumb word fuckery to make it sound special.
Lord Panda
The Sea is Always Right
The Istari arrived by boat. They were greeted by Cirdan when they arrived at the Grey Havens.
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AJUMP23
Gold Member
Ya but I figured they would make them arrive like a star.
Kssio_Aug
Member
You're looking too much into it. I see no problem in them claiming it's exclusive to Prime... because it in fact is, it doesn't matter if it's being produced by them or not. When it comes to videogames, for example, no one argues with Sony because they call their productions Playstation exclusive.
And they should make it sound special btw, that's their job.
Lord Panda
The Sea is Always Right
You know, that would be kinda cool.
It's a teaser for a trailer, posted on their own youtube channel. It's silly word fucker.
You're looking too much into it. I see no problem in them claiming it's exclusive to Prime... because it in fact is, it doesn't matter if it's being produced by them or not. When it comes to videogames, for example, no one argues with Sony because they call their productions Playstation exclusive.
And they should make it sound special btw, that's their job.
I will fight you on this.
ManaByte
Gold Member
There was a longer version on the Amazon website you could only view with a Prime account.
AJUMP23
Gold Member
That is why it won't happen.
ultrazilla
Gold Member
Nobody is going to beat Peter Jackson's The Hobbit and LOTR films and we'll always have those.
This shit show of wokeness infesting middle earth is more deadly than Sauron. It looks terrible.
This shit show of wokeness infesting middle earth is more deadly than Sauron. It looks terrible.
Some of it looks absolutely spectacular. It's the story that worries me. Everything said about thr characters so fsr just contradicts so much of how I've perceived things for decades.
Can't quite wrap my mind around accepting it.
TaylorSwiftFan
Member
Backlash against the FotR trailer? I was around during those times - took me ages to download the trailer on dial-up. I thought it was amazing.
ManaByte
Gold Member
People were mad about Arwen having such a big role in the movies when she's literally in two scenes in the book and has no dialog. And that DID affect the movies because originally Arwen in Two Towers is the one who brought the Elves to Helm's Deep and even fought in the battle. That scene was deleted before the movie came out and altered in reshoots, but you can still see one shot of her fighting in the battle in the finished movie:
Imagine how pissed off people would've been if they didn't put a CG Troll over Sauron at the Black Gate.
Then when the movies came out people got mad about Faramir being tempted by the ring when that is a complete 180 from his character in the books. Aragorn was reluctant to be king, again a complete 180 from him in the books. Then the Hobbits were taken to Osgiliath, which never happened in the books. You can't forget the completely invented storyline of Arwen dying if Aragorn doesn't man up and become King. Complete bullshit invention that's nowhere in the original story.
The movies are probably the best way the book could've been adapted into a film, and the structure is very very similar to the BBC radio drama that had Ian Holm as Frodo. You couldn't do a 1:1 adaptation of the book to a movie. Bakshi tried that and failed. Almost every line of dialog in the book is a declarative speech, and a lot of the book is a character describing things to another after it happened, such as the Ents sacking Isengard. And there's no way the book chronology of Two Towers could work in a movie. Again, the changes they did to the structure of the story is probably one of the only ways to adapt it to a movie, but they're still 100% fan fiction when compared to the actual books; especially with the changes to the characters of Arwen, Aragon, and Faramir.
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Eh, I don't know what circles you were in back then. I was religiously reading theonering.net, and camped for weeks for tickets among a horde of lotr fans.People were mad about Arwen having such a big role in the movies when she's literally in two scenes in the book and has no dialog. And that DID affect the movies because originally Arwen in Two Towers is the one who brought the Elves to Helm's Deep and even fought in the battle. That scene was deleted before the movie came out and altered in reshoots, but you can still see one shot of her fighting in the battle in the finished movie:
Imagine how pissed off people would've been if they didn't put a CG Troll over Sauron at the Black Gate.
Then when the movies came out people got mad about Faramir being tempted by the ring when that is a complete 180 from his character in the books. Aragorn was reluctant to be king, again a complete 180 from him in the books. Then the Hobbits were taken to Osgiliath, which never happened in the books.
The movies are probably the best way the book could've been adapted into a film, and the structure is very very similar to the BBC radio drama that had Ian Holm as Frodo. You couldn't do a 1:1 adaptation of the book to a movie. Bakshi tried that and failed. Almost every line of dialog in the book is a declarative speech, and a lot of the book is a character describing things to another after it happened, such as the Ents sacking Isengard. And there's no way the book chronology of Two Towers could work in a movie. Again, the changes they did to the structure of the story is probably one of the only ways to adapt it to a movie, but they're still 100% fan fiction when compared to the actual books; especially with the changes to the characters of Arwen, Aragon, and Faramir.
"people" didn't get mad. People fucking loved it. A tiny tiny portion of people were mad. Which is okay. There will always be changes in an adaption, someone will hate them, but to suggest there was a ton of hate for lotr is just absurd.
Maybe there were in some circles, but they were drowned out by positivity unless you actively went looking for them.
ManaByte
Gold Member
My point is people are screaming that this show is fan fiction when the Jackson movies are just as much. Again, Arwen is in two scenes in the book and has zero dialog. She was such a central character in the movies that she was actually in storyboards as a member of the Fellowship in Jackson's pitch to Miramax (the two movie version). Of course when that leaked out (I remember seeing pictures of the Moria storyboards with Arwen with the Hobbits around '98) Jackson changed his story and claimed she was never going to be part of the Fellowship when Harry Knowles interviewed him on AICN, even though that was part of the two-movie pitch he made to Weinstein.
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Batiman
Banned
I did too. Nerds were upset with some changes. Now we just have more nerds with easy access to the internet
Batiman
Banned
Imagine if woke was a thing back then. People would be writing off one of the greatest films of all time because they made women a more integral part of the story
Yeah, you know there is a difference between taking established stories and characters and rearranging them to fit a narrative that often needs to be a tad bit more snappy in their new medium, and taking outlines and creating entirely new characters and stories around them, yeah?
ManaByte
Gold Member
If the movies came out now there would be endless bitching on YouTube about Arwen's role.
Tolkien literally wrote four scenes about Arwen and only two are in the actual text of the story. She's at Rivendell when the Fellowship is there, and then at Minas Tirith for the coronation. The other stuff is in the Appendix where Aragorn meets her in Rivendell. Jackson actually filmed that scene and it's in the Two Towers special preview that was added to FOTR screenings. And then Tolkien wrote a LOTR Christmas special that's in the War of the Ring books that Christopher Tolkien published about the making of LOTR where Ellesar and Arwen visit Sam and Rosie in the Shire on Christmas and bring presents.
Jackson completely invented a story for Arwen in the movie though. He had her replace an established character in the book, created a story that her life was linked to Aragorn becoming king, had her fight in Helm's Deep. That's not rearranging a story, it's fan fiction.
No, it's an adaptation. It's what happens in every single adaptation. Things are changed, minimal characters are given far more importance.
Arwen is important, very important, but for movie goers to understand that without having read the books they had to rewrite her. It's not rocket science.
It is an ocean apart from basically writing new stories in the world tolkien created.
The two are not even remotely equal.
Ironbunny
Member
Jacksons Arwen is quite a tame "wokeism" example compared what they are doing most of the time today. At that time I heard nothing about it but the cancer was propably just taking over universities. Today the agenda takes over the plot and the charecter and hits you in the face with it.
ManaByte
Gold Member
She wasn't important in the books. She was window dressing. She said nothing. Had no lines. She's in the background in two scenes.
Yeah, of course. One of the main characters' one true love isn't important at all. So what do you do then? Cut her out, and with her a huge part of Aragorn's driving force, or expand her part to make her significance more understandable?
I'm getting the feeling we read two different trilogies.
ManaByte
Gold Member
I don't think you read LOTR. Arwen wasn't really a driving force in the book. In the book Aragorn wasn't reluctant to be king, his goal in the book was to retake his throne. He carried Narsil with him. Jackson made Aragorn reluctant to be king. He didn't have a driving force, so they had to invent a storyline for a character who was just seen in the background in the books. Fan fiction.
I reread it last year, thank you. Not talking about his desire to be king.
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Hezekiah
Banned
Sounds like narratives are being created to discredit people that don't agree with your point of view.
Batiman
Banned
What point of view is that?
Dr. Claus
Vincit qui se vincit
”REEEEEE STOP CRITICIZING IT, YOU JUST THINK ITS WOKE REEEEEE”
It isn’t hard to figure out, mate. You are as obvious as a clown at a funeral.
Kssio_Aug
Member
But that is his point. Aragorn, in the books, has a strong will to assume the throne from the beginning. That was his main driving force.
The thing is, even Peter Jackson's movies had changes that were not in the books (hence why "fan fiction"), and people were fine with it.
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Dr. Claus
Vincit qui se vincit
Because, at their core, the characters were still the same characters. A few scenes were added, a few situations changed - but they were still very notably Aragon, Gandalf, Frodo, Sauron, Faramir. From what has been shown in this new series? The characters are almost completely unidentifiable as who they were.
Yes, adaptations will have changes being made to better fit the medium they are being adapted into - but trying to conflate that with what we see in the Amazon show is pure head in the sand ignorance on your part.
Hezekiah
Banned
I feel like the world would be a better place if the words 'woke' and 'wokeism' were banned from the English language.
And if GAF could be a little less negative, and bit more open-minded about mass media like Era is.
Dr. Claus
Vincit qui se vincit
I just refer to “woke” as slacktivist-bent writing as that is what it actually is. But people still have their heads up their bums and fail to understand the difference between normal writing and writing done by a slacktivist.
I think we've got different definitions of fan fiction. Which is fine.
Lord Panda
The Sea is Always Right
I touched on my reaction to Jackson’s adaptation in my reply to you in the other thread. I was not a fan when it first came out. I was one of those die hard book readers, so I had various story beats in my head and wasn’t expecting certain omissions and deviations from the source.
The most curious thing happened though; my friends and partners, who had never read the books, absolutely loved the movies. And in turn I began to appreciate the movies by not constantly comparing it constantly to the books. There was more than enough reverence and respect to the source material in the movies that it won me, and many others, over. And the production and the cast are simply sublime.
However Jackson fucked up big time with the Army of the Dead at Pelennor.
So I’ll be approaching this new series with an open mind.
Kssio_Aug
Member
I wouldn't call it fan fiction either though. But I also wouldn't call the TV Show fan fiction. Although I don't really care for what terms people want to use to describe things that were changed or not present in the books... We have to wait and see. I have good expectations from this, even if they decide not to be extremely faithful with the books. As I said, the books will go nowhere, and I can reread them freely. I think they can do a good TV Show from LotR lore, even taking some liberties.
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ManaByte
Gold Member
No I absolutely love the movies. I saw the Cannes reel in theaters and I saw FOTR 12 times theatrically. But I'm not under any delusion that they're anything more than a fan fiction adaptation of the books.
Batiman
Banned
Your an idiot. Criticize it all you want but damn right I’m calling all the stupid shit people cry about. At this point the people that call everything woke a more obnoxious then the woke crowd themselves. Imagine crying about black dwarves and elves. Think about that for a second without laughing how ridiculous that sounds.
ManaByte
Gold Member
The same Faramir who in the book said he wouldn't take the Ring anywhere near Gondor?
“But fear no more! I would not take this thing, if it lay by the highway. Not were Minas Tirith falling in ruin and I alone could save her, so, using the weapon of the Dark Lord for her good and my glory. No, I do not wish for such triumphs, Frodo son of Drogo.”
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Head over to The Terminal List thread. Quite positive even though there are some casting differences from the books.
Ain't hard to figure out the complaints. Shit writing leads to shit characters leads to the actor taking the heat. Virtue signaling marketers and producers compounds the issues.
Write a compelling story that follows established storytelling narratives, fill it with interesting characters that obey internal show logic, film it in a way that doesn't induce seizures and VOILA, you could cast good actors from across the globe and I wouldn't complain.
Dr. Claus
Vincit qui se vincit
Yes. Which was a notably stupid scene and people called it out. However, everything else about the character aside from that particular moment was still Faramir. Now compare Elrond and Galadriel within the show to the books. They are completely and utterly different characters who only share the same name.
You can’t even use the correct form of ”you’re”. Please miss me with that idiotic trolling and pure ignorant display.
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TaylorSwiftFan
Member
Same here. Manabyte is just typing bullshit thinking that we weren’t around back then to remember. Sure there were a few people not happy with the deviations from the book like Arwen replacing Glorfindel but the hype for the movie was insane.
TaylorSwiftFan
Member
You still don’t get the complaints, do you? Not only that, you never learn. But I guess corporate cheerleaders will always exist.
Batiman
Banned
I do get the complaints and kinda understand them. I’m just easily willing to look past them as their not a big issue at all to me. If the shows good these things don’t matter in the end.
The Witcher was pretty shit to me but not once did I think it was shit because of the colours of characters. TBH it didn’t even come to mind. Same with WOT which I honestly thought would even bother me. Specifically because the ethnicities of people and where they come from play a pretty big part.
These shows had much bigger problems then what some people call wokeism. So I find it weird that’s the first thing that comes to mind whether a show will be good or not. There’s been some shit woke movies and some good ones but not once has it ever played as a deciding factor into whether I enjoyed a show or not.
If this show is great all around it’s hard for me to dislike it because dwarf women don’t have Beards or there’s black elves etc.
And it’s not destroying Tolkien’s work. Tolkien’s work isn’t going anywhere. The books are not being rewritten over the years like the bible. This is a show being written by different people in Tolkien’s world. If I don’t like it then I’ll just pretend it didn’t exist lol. Simple
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
Well I do think there is a longer version of the teaser that is "exclusively" on prime.
But I think you are just reading the title of the video too literally as though it's a grammatically correct sentence. They just wanted to throw "PRIME EXCLUSIVE" in the title of the video because the show is.
TaylorSwiftFan
Member
Wokeism is a symptom of a bad product. Writers who are trying to push agendas don’t care about the quality of the shows - the shows are vehicles for their political views. Which is why these shows are so often bad. People aren’t necessarily worried about the accuracy of the show because the show’s contents itself aren’t canon. But when you see that the “updates” made are blatantly for socio-political reasons, you know you’re in for something bad. Even worse is that, we don’t get Tolkien-related movies or shows very often. Just look at The Last Jedi or The Wheels of Time or Cowboy Bebop or the He-Man show. It’s never a good sign when writers approach a story with pushing agendas being one of the primary factors.
Batiman
Banned
I agree it might not be a good sign. But I think that’s far from making it a deciding factor and assuming it’ll have nothing else to offer. Writers and movies have always pushed agendas since forever. Some do it while making a good product and some while making trash.
Trailer looks good to me. It’s lord of the rings. That’s all I need to know to be interested TBH. If it turns out to be shit and woke shit is thrown in my face every episode than I’ll gladly call it trash.
Gollum game looks trash and it doesn’t seem woke to me at all. I’d be more interested in being a black beardless dwarf women fucking up orcs if it looked like the next sekiro.
TaylorSwiftFan
Member
The Gollum game is made on small budget but some unknown developer somewhere - it’s got a fraction of the budget of 1 of these episodes. Not a fair comparison.