Support NeoGAF

[adamsapple]

Interesting article on the disastrous launch of the game.

The Human Toll Of Fallout 76’s Disastrous Launch

Former ZeniMax developers claim that Fallout 76 was severely mismanaged

kotaku.com

Point worth noting that this terrible game/launch also effected development of Starfield and Redfall, likely one of the reasons contributing to the delays.

Even if developers outside of QA didn’t want to work on the dreaded project, Fallout 76’s management team was not shy about borrowing. They drafted developers from all over the ZeniMax umbrella, to the point that other projects were negatively affected. Arkane Studios’ Redfall and Bethesda’s Starfield both lost team members to the black hole of Fallout 76.

 

[Ezekiel_]

They only have themselves to blame

 

[STARSBarry]

So did they name the game after the average employees weekly hours or?

 

[I collect VHS tapes]

FWIW I recently spent some time researching the current state of the game, and apparently it's in a good a pretty good place

I don't have time for an MMO or I might even give it a go. I spent a few hours messing around with it and had fun.

 

[AlteredForms]

They only have themselves to blame

There's enough blame to go around but not all the portions are the same.

 

[NickFire]

The plight of the downtrodden who are forced to play videogames never ends.

 

[treemk]

Company assigns resources where they are needed, but its gaming so we cry about it

 

[Punished Miku]

The human toll is that they put out a shitty live service game and then scrambled to fix it. Noooo ...

 

[Fuz]

Human Toll​

 

[Topher]

Human Toll​

 

[DeepEnigma]

They got pulled off one project and were asked to assist on another.

Oh the horror, the human toll. Actually listening to bosses and doing what you're paid to do.

 

[Kagey K]

FWIW I recently spent some time researching the current state of the game, and apparently it's in a good a pretty good place

I don't have time for an MMO or I might even give it a go. I spent a few hours messing around with it and had fun.

It actually is really good now (but still not without it's flaws,) but it took a long time to get there.

Anyone who is just starting it now would have no idea what the game was like back then or why people were complaining about it.

 

[IntentionalPun]

Honestly sound like more whiny cunt QA folks. Like jesus.. you don't even have that much pressure on you, you are just testing the project.. crunch means overtime.. which is liquid gold in the contractor field.

Some testers would only find reprieve when they finally left the Fallout 76 team. Two former testers recounted that one of their colleagues said in a QA group chat after leaving the project: “I didn’t cry last night when I was taking a shower.” Another said in the same chat: “I pulled into work today, and I sat in my car for a second, and my chest didn’t feel heavy like it normally does.”

Jesus christ we've raised a generation of poosies. QA is not a job that requires a ton of skills particularly in gaming... get over it, there are a whole hoard of people willing to do your job waiting to take your spot.... hence why the pay isn't amazing just like any job that doesn't require a ton of skill/education.

 

[HercRaato]

I need to get new glasses. I read the title as the Human Troll.

 

[PhaseJump]

"The Human Toll of Spreading Kotaku Articles"

 

[Trogdor1123]

Did they do a next gen patch? I really want to try the game but want the patch first

 

[Fuz]

I have very conflicting thoughts on the matter.

On one hand, they sound like fucking spoiled brats that never done real work in their lives. If that job is soooo hard and stressing, why don't you just go and, I dunno, work the nights in a bakery or go harvest grapes?

On the other hand, I think my previously shown mindset is dangerous and does nothing good for no one: everyone should have better work conditions, lesser hours, fair wages. We shouldn't equalize toward the bottom.
It just pisses me off that they're always focusing just on those workers, who are very privileged compared to others.

 

[InfiniteCombo]

Honestly sound like more whiny cunt QA folks. Like jesus.. you don't even have that much pressure on you, you are just testing the project.. crunch means overtime.. which is liquid gold in the contractor field.



Jesus christ we've raised a generation of poosies. QA is not a job that requires a ton of skills particularly in gaming... get over it, there are a whole hoard of people willing to do your job waiting to take your spot.... hence why the pay isn't amazing just like any job that doesn't require a ton of skill/education.

Well, shit... I usually disagree with your opinions but this one is SPOT ON. Well said.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

 

[Zimmy68]

The clickbait worked. I started reading the article for behind the scenes secrets on how they wanted a pay to win game, etc.
Instead, its "on the condition of anonymity they told use they were overworked". Oh boy, What a revelation.

 

[brian0057]

"The Human Toll of Spreading Kotaku Articles"

Hey, it might be a Kotaku article but at least it's actual journalism.
Credit where it's due.
It doesn't remove Kotaku from my shit list but it was a very interesting read.

 

[IntentionalPun]

On the other hand, I think my previously shown mindset is dangerous and does nothing good for no one: everyone should have better work conditions, lesser hours, fair wages. We shouldn't equalize toward the bottom.
It just pisses me off that they're always focusing just on those workers, who are very privileged compared to others.

I'm fine with raising the minimum wage myself; the lowest end jobs should still pay a living wage.

But legislating anything beyond that is just counter productive to me. Jobs with heavy OT are actually sought after by loads of folks.. it allows someone with dick all education/skills to actually make much better money. That's the part never reported on.. that's why these companies keep "getting away" with this "treatment." They ARE paying people for it.

I mean, we got overtime, but like all the money in the world doesn’t matter at that point… When we did weekend work, they would get pizza for us… [It] takes time to, you know, come out of that mindset and realize, yeah, they’re giving us something for free, but it’s not worth it. And it’s kind of the same with the overtime money. It’s like, yeah, it’s more money. But at what cost?

And they claim "low" hourly rates? Yeah, the job you are doing doesn't require much skill. But you get overtime.. if you don't want that kind of job, go do something else.

Some of this shit is just mind numbing in this article:

But no matter how desperate their circumstances, two sources believed that their colleagues felt financially compelled to stay at ZeniMax, the largest games employer in the Rockville, Maryland area. Crunching at ZeniMax was considered by Rockville-based developers to be the only way to work in games without moving their families.

Yeah wow the gaming industry isn't buzzing in Rockville, Maryland lol Like.. come on people.. moving for job opportunities in a given industry is just... normal ass shit.

 

[Matt_Fox]

There's war in Ukraine.

The "human toll of Fallout 76"? Just don't.

 

[ANDS]

"Human tool" might be a bit too dramatic. It doesn't sound like lives were ruined, careers cancelled or a general love for gaming eroded by this games development project. Yes, the failures of this game are long documented, but "human tool" for what were essentially long-ago burnt out staff feels a bit much.

Jesus christ we've raised a generation of poosies. QA is not a job that requires a ton of skills particularly in gaming... get over it, there are a whole hoard of people willing to do your job waiting to take your spot.... hence why the pay isn't amazing just like any job that doesn't require a ton of skill/education.

What does that have to do with them being glad to be off a toxic project? They're literally recounting stories about being told to come in to work on a weekend to work on development builds. . .that are out of date. You're really saying you wouldn't breathe a sigh of relief to be no longer working on such a poorly managed project?

Wild. We've had tons of threads on this forum about the absolute shartshow that FO76 development was (hell one of my favorite YouTube videos is "The Fall of 76" which I found through this forum), but an article comes out from KOTAKU (yikes!) based on anonymous reporting (uh oh!) from QA testers (oy vey!) that says exactly what we've known and it's "Oh boohoo. . .poor baby!"

. . .wild.

 

[DeepEnigma]

toxic project

Stopped reading right after this adage.

 

[SirKicksalot]

People on this forum are apoplectic over microtransactions but don't care about people being followed in bathrooms by their team leads or being called to work on weekends on 100% useless things.

Loved this part:

Our employment contracts felt very American. I’ve never seen a contract like that in Sweden… It was very long and in many ways describing how much they own whatever you make… Me and [Paixao] said to management: ‘Many of these parts of the contract might not be viable in Sweden.

 

[Fuz]

I'm fine with raising the minimum wage myself; the lowest end jobs should still pay a living wage.

I'll be more specific: bobby kotick shouldn't earn THAT much more than his employees.

 

[IntentionalPun]

What does that have to do with them being glad to be off a toxic project? They're literally recounting stories about being told to come in to work on a weekend to work on development builds. . .that are out of date. You're really saying you wouldn't breathe a sigh of relief to be no longer working on such a poorly managed project?

There's a far cry between being glad you are off a project and talking about crying in the shower. It's a QA job... they sit and play a game and file bug reports. Filing a bug against an old dev build? That's stupid but not the fault of the QA person and not worth crying over.

As far as the low skilled thing? I'm just making the point that supply and demand means a company isn't going to bend over backwards to be shuffling you around to the projects that are going better than others.

 

[Kerotan]

Sounds like Bethesda were cheaping out on their work force and they needed more Devs.

 

[MHubert]

Some testers would only find reprieve when they finally left the Fallout 76 team. Two former testers recounted that one of their colleagues said in a QA group chat after leaving the project: “I didn’t cry last night when I was taking a shower.” Another said in the same chat: “I pulled into work today, and I sat in my car for a second, and my chest didn’t feel heavy like it normally does.”

I'm litteraly shaking right now

 

[Jinzo Prime]

Human Toll​

Fucking thank you, how dare developers have to do their jobs? What about the "human toll" I go through every day for 12 hours on concrete floors? Game developers and journalists don't know what real work is like, but I have much more respect for the former than the latter, as at least game developers can positively contribute to society.

 

[nominedomine]

Will Bethesda be able to recover from this? Maybe.

It's pretty clear why the executives were so eager to sell if a disaster like Fallout 76 was able to affect multiple studios and games that are yet unreleased so many years later.

 

[Daytonabot]

We shouldn't equalize toward the bottom.

True. We should equalize exactly where the supply and demand curves intersect.

 

[Zathalus]

Fallout 76 is pretty decent now, although it took several years to get to this point.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

I don't trust Kotaku.

 

[Skifi28]

I laughed at the crying in the shower part. Save that for customer support jobs, not QA.

 

[cinnamonandgravy]

not clicking that link

 

[Fermbiz]

Gotta pay the Troll Toll to get into the...

 

[Fake]

See that mountain?

 

[Bernd Lauert]

QA are the bitch bois of game development. Nothing new.

 

[strange headache]

Well it gave us this classic video, that will probably long outlast the game itself.

 

[ChuckeRearmed]

Knowing Kotaku they probably went through Glassdoor reviews and asks the folks that don't work there anymore

 

[Draugoth]

Not hard to consider knowing the state the game came out.

 

[SlimySnake]

This article explains why Starfield likely got delayed. These guys have no clue how to run a video game company. The fact that QA and Engineers were told NOT to work together and go through a third party is beyond insane. The quickest and most efficient way to fix issues is working directly with QA. The management's job is to remove bottlenecks, not create them.

Todd also seems like a clueless executive. He seems to be responsible for the game not having any NPCs at launch. A mind boggling creative decision that no one on the team was in favor of. The other leads werent any better. I cant believe they refused help from the Elder Scrolls Online devs. Just shitty management in general.

 

[MachRc]

Did they do a next gen patch? I really want to try the game but want the patch first

It got updated to 60 fps when Xbox rolled out their FPS boost campaign late last year.
"compatibility options" then tick box for FPS Boost.


Ive been playing 76, and it def feels like a single player game. I once in awhile run into other camps, but rarely.
I finished the water park and airport area, and now headed south. If you want to aimlessly burn a few hours...its okayyyy

 

[anthony2690]

I have to ask if this is massively overdramatic.

"Today was the first day I didn't cry in the shower"

And other weird statements.

I go work, I do a good job I get praise, my co worker does a shitty job, higher ups express their frustration.

I get offered over time, I usually accept unless I really don't fancy it/or can't make it.

I feel like we are going to get to a point where, you can not give feedback to a poor performing worker, as you may hurt their feelings or they may try cancel you.

We have a couple of really smelly workers at work, and I know management is scared of how to address it with them (despite numerous flyers since being stuck to the walls all around the warehouse/staff room, yet these two workers still haven't freshened up)

 

[Trogdor1123]

It got updated to 60 fps when Xbox rolled out their FPS boost campaign late last year.
"compatibility options" then tick box for FPS Boost.


Ive been playing 76, and it def feels like a single player game. I once in awhile run into other camps, but rarely.
I finished the water park and airport area, and now headed south. If you want to aimlessly burn a few hours...its okayyyy

What about on ps5?

 

[Edgelord79]

Should have worked harder and did more “crunch”.

 

[NikuNashi]

They all got paid.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

I read a couple years back that it made some money though.