midnightAI
Member
So, first trailer about to be shown within next couple of months? Should be about right going off Kotaku's track record?
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Naughty Dog is laying off contract developers, asking them to keep it quiet. TLOU Online "is basically on ice at this point"
- Thread starter Tiago Rodrigues
- Start date
FF:Enhanced_Reality
Member
I don't understand this. If I'm Naughty Dog, I ask who the fuck are Bungie to decide if our product is good enough? I've played Destiny for a few hours and it's nothing special. Naughty Dog could have knocked this out of the park. Unfortunately this bullshit around games as a service really doesn't fill me with confidence. Sony only need one but they're investing in so many, I think they're signing these exclusivity deals, effectively to fill gaps they've left to make these GaaS titles. But from what I've seen of FairGames and Concord, I see both shut down within three years. They look really poor. If you're going to chase this market, do it right. Don't throw good money after bad trying to make it work.
Honestly people think I'm being ridiculous when I said I think Jim Ryan has been given his marching orders and I really do. I think this lack of coherency makes a lot of sense when you consider the rumours about a power struggle in PlayStation and how the tried and tested vision has changed. You can't communicate what's happening because it's still in a state of change and within that change your opposition are buying up the fucking industry and you said we'll be okay, more than okay and when it sunk in you were like oh... actually this is some bad shit.
If there is any studio I trust in Sony, it's Naughty Dog. I bet their game is great but it's been ruined by that old saying, too many cooks spoil the broth. And from the sound of it, Bungie had a mouthful of broth and then asked to speak to the manager in private.
Honestly people think I'm being ridiculous when I said I think Jim Ryan has been given his marching orders and I really do. I think this lack of coherency makes a lot of sense when you consider the rumours about a power struggle in PlayStation and how the tried and tested vision has changed. You can't communicate what's happening because it's still in a state of change and within that change your opposition are buying up the fucking industry and you said we'll be okay, more than okay and when it sunk in you were like oh... actually this is some bad shit.
If there is any studio I trust in Sony, it's Naughty Dog. I bet their game is great but it's been ruined by that old saying, too many cooks spoil the broth. And from the sound of it, Bungie had a mouthful of broth and then asked to speak to the manager in private.
thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Gold Member
I get a distinct feeling that Naughty Dog as a game developer is pretty much done. I don't expect them to make another good game ever again. Uncharted 4 was the last one. RIP.
Very extreme take but okay.
No, your talent doesn't evaporate instantly just because of one (troubled) GaaS. Although I hope ND's new IP is unique enough from TLOU and Uncharted stylistically and thematically, even if it borrows elements from them, to stand on its own.
I don't want them becoming like Polyphony Digital and just focusing on a single IP or "new" IP very similar to existing IP (kind of like what Bethesda's going through with Starfield).
Comandr
Member
Headline seems intentionally misleading to try to paint ND in a bad light. This is the normal ebb and flow of development. Contract workers get laid off when things slow down, devs move to other projects, etc. This feels like inventing news where there isn't anything else noteworthy to report.
Nearly a half dozen waitstaff were sent home early today from local IHOP in the early afternoon after manager deemed them "not necessary." See? Any every day activity can be spun into a sensationalist headline if you try hard enough.
Nearly a half dozen waitstaff were sent home early today from local IHOP in the early afternoon after manager deemed them "not necessary." See? Any every day activity can be spun into a sensationalist headline if you try hard enough.
DonJorginho
Banned
Hilarious how Bungie have been appointed as some overseer of GaaS content as if they're actually any good at it, they're constantly fucking up and most fans (including me) have only stuck around for nostalgia/friendships made in-game.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
I don't know why but Kotaku felt the need to tag this news under a Microsoft tag 
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Dr. Wilkinson
Member
- We've known the multiplayer live service thing has been walking dead for awhile now, clearly there's low interest there, internally as well as from players. People want a big AAA single-player game from ND, not some third-person multiplayer shooter with no soul
- This is the whole point of using contractors. As projects swell due to where products are in development, they staff up or staff down to maintain P&L and budget constraints. If the above live service game is indeed canceled, then obviously some staff would be cut as a result
- ND has a lot of money and high pedigree among the industry and at Sony, but they have a budget to keep just like everybody else. Not every game they try making is going to come out. Layoffs are normal part of the business cycle. Welcome to capitalism! It's not a perfect system, but it's better than any alternative.
Dr. Wilkinson
Member
Because Kotaku is a cesspool and full of illiterates and people who are unqualified to be press. That's why. It is digital toilet paper.I don't know why but Kotaku felt the need to tag this news under a Microsoft tag
FoxMcChief
Gold Member
PS+ price increase should help with the wasted money. I guess Jimbo did have a plan after all. Let the consumers pay for his mistakes.
makaveli60
Member
Let’s not continue dominating the industry but waste money on shitty gaas games even with our best studio - Jim Ryan
Gambit2483
Member
Tbf Druckmann could have flat-out refused, right? Right...?
Ceadeus
Gold Member
RickMasters
Member
That’s exactly why Sony bought them. Ex- destiny 2 player ( gave up on that game sometime last year) as terrible as destiny is in terms of its business model….. people still play it. And accept the bare minimum from bungie in terms of richness and diversity of content. Spare a thought for the poor souls who still been doing the same strikes and raids for years all for the sake of weapon grinding.
Bungie have not been bungie since halo reach. Destiny at its best is still not a patch on their beast halo game. I’d even argue that halo infinity is a more enjoyable game mechanically than the unbalanced PVP mess that is destiny 2.
That said, I think the marathon reboot will be interesting. Also wondering if they will be saving their best ideas for themselves. Just how much of their ‘ bottled lighting’ formula are they willing to share.
I read an article the other day saying some Sony 1st party studios are uncomfortable with the GAAS focused direction. I’m also wondering how comfortable they are with the reality that their games are only good enough when bungie tells sony that they are ready to be greenlit. Because as bungie have shown with destiny over the last ten years…they don’t always get it right…. In fact they get it wrong and infuriate their player base with startling regularity……. As you and I both know. Shit…. As anybody who played destiny for anything serious amount of time. It’s one of the few games where I feel like my time was wasted. They really don’t respect the players time.
Ceadeus
Gold Member
Not necessarily AAA but at least give more than only one game, no ? Nintendo have Mario RPG, Mario Wonder, Wario Ware, Dragon Quest Monsters: The Dark Prince and also Wargroove 2 for advance wars fans. On Xbox Starfield came out, Forza motorsport and also Darktide finally coming out right before xmas.
If they'd release one big title for the PSVR2 I think it would have suffice. Especially at a time where its direct competitor is releasing its new headset, with a free game (Asguard Wrath 2).
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ShadyAcshuns
Member
They've totally been way too dependent upon two franchises for far too long now.
Uncharted 4 was a bloated, boring mess. Lost Legacy was much better.
I get a distinct feeling that Naughty Dog as a game developer is pretty much done. I don't expect them to make another good game ever again. Uncharted 4 was the last one. RIP.
Topher
Gold Member
I don't know why but Kotaku felt the need to tag this news under a Microsoft tag
Fucking knew it
Snowdonhoffen
Member
If the game gets canned at least they already have a lot of assets for TLOU 3 lol
Flutta
Banned
Worst idea i’ve ever heard in a long ass time….
Why would you want to infect Insomniac with whatever virus that is running rampart in ND atm???
Some of you are cray cray..
The day Starly left ND is the day ND would never be the same again, and we see why. Neil has messed up that place big time. But in the end i blame Sony the most for what’s happened to ND.
6 Effing years for a stand alone MP game made from a last gen game is now put on ice??? LMAO
Sad day really sad.
Kotaku:I don't know why but Kotaku felt the need to tag this news under a Microsoft tag
NinjaBoiX
Member
Well it wasn’t pushed “for no reason” was it? Game would’ve printed money as a GAAS, whether or not you like to admit it.
Not saying it would’ve been the right move, but let’s not pretend anyone is scratching their head about why it was greenlit.
Drizzlehell
Banned
Naughty Dog wouldn't be the first studio to crumble due to hubris of its leaders. This is actually the longest gap in between games for them and they haven't even announced anything new until now. Instead, we're learning that they have nothing new to announce for their own celebration day, and a mere multiplayer mode for an already released game that has been languishing in development hell for so long is now losing developers. Obviously things aren't going very well over there.
I would even go as far as speculating that with TLOU TV show getting off the ground, Neil Duckman is kinda checked out of this whole video game business and shifted his focus toward producing the show instead. Especially after his last magnum anus was met with such a polarising reception. That kinda leaves the studio leaderless because he made sure to push out any other creative leads capable of producing an actual game, so it's very possible that whatever next project that they're trying to get off the ground is struggling to even get past the conceptual stage of the production.
Negotiator101
Member
TerribleAtThisGame
Member
No severance pay and forced hush hush. ERA in shambles after seriously believing any business is a "Good Guy" because virtue signaling.
Also, jesus, just release a fucking game. TLoU2 mechanics are rock solid, do more of that.
Also, jesus, just release a fucking game. TLoU2 mechanics are rock solid, do more of that.
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Drizzlehell
Banned
Lost Legacy was merely a "best of" collection for the series where they stitched together the best set pieces from all of the previous games and tied them together with a mediocre story at best. Uncharted 4 actually evolved the series in an interesting direction and featured fantastic performances from its cast, so it was an overall more interesting game to me. A worthy closure for the series, or at least for Nate and Elena's adventures.
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all factions 2 needed to be was TLOU2 with pvp. I don’t understand how they didn’t understand that.
What are your thoughts on the gameplay itself? Overall length?
semiconscious
Member
for as established a developer as naughty dog, this is extremely difficult to understand &/or attempt to justify. a sudden wave of incompetence? i'm still of the opinion that too much success too fast caught up with naughty dog & has ended up taking its toll...The day Starly left ND is the day ND would never be the same again, and we see why. Neil has messed up that place big time. But in the end i blame Sony the most for what’s happened to ND.
6 Effing years for a stand alone MP game made from a last gen game is now put on ice??? LMAO
Sad day really sad.
Pejo
Member
You guys got this all wrong. The Sony suits at the top saw that Sega just cancelled Hyenas®, so that "burning white hot as the sun" IP is now available. They probably snatched it from Sega (on a Wednesday) and diverted all development resources to it. You wouldn't want to dilute the brand of Hyenas™ with other live service multiplayer shooters from an inferior IP that just wouldn't hold a candle to it.
Jimbo Ryan strolling with his pimp cane out the back door as he stops, turns around, winks, and sticks a lollipop in his mouth as he crosses the threshold: "This one's on me, Playstation fans. Power 2 the players!"
(I tried for like 10 minutes to get Dall-E to do a Jim Ryan-like businessman but it just wouldn't)
Jimbo Ryan strolling with his pimp cane out the back door as he stops, turns around, winks, and sticks a lollipop in his mouth as he crosses the threshold: "This one's on me, Playstation fans. Power 2 the players!"
(I tried for like 10 minutes to get Dall-E to do a Jim Ryan-like businessman but it just wouldn't)
YeulEmeralda
Member
midnightAI
Member
Hold on, some of you are actually believing Kotaku and their single source about the game being cancelled/'put on ice'? I was saying it in jest earlier but some of you actually trust them?
Aenima
Member
Making a TLOU MP standalone game was not Jimbo decision though, was a Naughty Dog decision. They where building the multiplayer for TLOU2 and kept having ideas to make the multiplayer bigger so they (NaughtyDog) decided to make it a bigger standalone project. Also reason why TLOU2 single player got so big as they just focused on the singleplayer and delayed the MP development to when that was done.
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0neAnd0nly
Member
I mean, all humor aside -
Since he took over a leadership role (2018, VP to currently, Co-Pres) the company has released…
1 game. TLOU2.
He has more movie and show credits in that time than he does game credits.
I would truly say, that’s pretty gross mismanagement. It isn’t solely on him for sure, but still.
Sure the quality of games ND puts out has been great for a 15 year run, but that doesn’t excuse poor management and wasted resources either.
IMO, of course.
anthraticus
Banned
So nothing of value was lost then.
Flutta
Banned
This is not correct. ND has been in the game for a long time we talking crash bandicoot era here. Their first really successful game was Uncharted 2... so yeah it took them a long a very time before getting to where they are.
Negotiator101
Member
Let's not forget this was going to be a much smaller MP component of TLOU2 and it would have been out years by now if that's how it stayed. Unfortunately Ryan decided he wanted a single player focused studio to make a standalone GaaS title, absolutely awful decision and I don't think anyone could disagree.
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cybertailor
Neo Member
I think they should just scale it back to the basics and add it to TLOU II Remastered as a bonus. Also think that Naughty Dog is fine, there being no news is just Sony switching to a strategy where titles won't get announced years before they actually release so it seems a bit try atm with Wolverine being the only big title we actually know about.
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IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
You are supposed to pay quarterly, otherwise you are violating the law lol
Not that it matters much as long as you square up.
Also there are contracting agencies that make you a regular W2 employee of the agency + benefits. You can still make loads more money than a full time employee working at the same place, but not quite as much as direct. Especially if you can get something that pays OT rates.. whoo boy.
ProtoByte
Member
Unfortunately, being mechanically solid is not enough for multiplayer games today, especially if you want longevity or to make money.
Drizzlehell
Banned
On Uncharted 4? Yeah it's a slow burn at the beginning but it was the good kind, where I actually got to spend some time with those characters and the game provided some good reasons to give a shit about them so that when the action finally kicked in, the stakes felt much higher and made the game even more exciting and emotional. Admittedly, I didn't like it on my first play through because I was used to the first 3 games where you start shooting up dudes in the first 10 minutes and the most dramatic thing to happen was when I got shot in the noggin' for the 50th time. But upon subsequent playthroughs it kinda clicked for me and I loved it. It's not as pretentious and dreary like The Last of Us but I appreciated a bit more nuance and levity in the writing this time around.
Now, I get that The Lost Legacy is a much more compact version of that experience, because you still get to spend some time with beloved characters (well, at least one of them) and don't have to go through so many scenes where nothing happens. But I dunno, I just didn't find the story very interesting, Sam Drake felt a little shoehorned in, and Nadine still irritated me, albeit a little less here than in the previous one. Still, it's an awesome game, it's just that I prefer U4 overall.
Alex Scott
Member
5 years wasted*
This is going to sound snarky, but I don't mean it that way; it sounds like you would rather have Naughty Dog just make TV shows instead of video games.
Drizzlehell
Banned
Well, not exactly. If we'd be talking about The Last of Us then sure, I would rather watch the show then play the game again. But Uncharted is a very rare example of a series of video games where I actually give a shit about the story but I don't think it would work as well in another format. That Tom Holland movie only proves it.
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