Support NeoGAF

[LionPride]

People can try and use it in a different manner but ultimately it will always recall its negative connotation regardless of who says it. More so if other ethnic groups in a multicultural society can not politically correctly use it because of its historical usage within a particular society. The surrounding sensitivity of the word that one ethnic group can use it in a positivity yet others can not even if they aren't intending the usage to carry any malice highlights how foul the word is. Not only does it infer division of us vs them historically it still does just with a different narrative. Those who use the word in either case are helping perpetrate societal division, if people want to see that disappear then it is a word better left in history books as a reminder of how fucked up societies can be and how barbaric actions can be to others under the guise of normalcy.

Nigga what

 

[The Kree]

People can try and use it in a different manner but ultimately it will always recall its negative connotation regardless of who says it. More so if other ethnic groups in a multicultural society can not politically correctly use it because of its historical usage within a particular society. The surrounding sensitivity of the word that one ethnic group can use it in a positivity yet others can not even if they aren't intending the usage to carry any malice highlights how foul the word is. Not only does it infer division of us vs them historically it still does just with a different narrative. Those who use the word in either case are helping perpetrate societal division, if people want to see that disappear then it is a word better left in history books as a reminder of how fucked up societies can be and how barbaric actions can be to others under the guise of normalcy.

Anti-black sentiment doesn't live or die by the use of the n-word. Abolishing the word wouldn't even begin to repair race relations in America or anywhere else. Throw this one away and there would be a dozen new slurs circulating by lunch time.

 

[GoldenCrow]

Black using nigga is not keeping racism alive. FOH.
Are you black? I sincerely doubt it.

I'm not. I didn't say it was racism because it isn't (unless used in its nastier/older context) rather I said it is perpetrating division, very different things. In a society that is primarily of one type and I assume in certain areas in the US where there is still large division and categorisation based on race then the usage of the word can easily avoid the clash of cultures. In multicultural societies that have tighter integration then the use of the word becomes extremely awkward because regardless of context the reference will always bring to the table its nasty past.

Then again the US is the only place I have ever heard it thrown around so lackadaisically (regardless of race) so there may be another cultural difference at play similarly to how the English say cunt like its nothing.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

I'm not. I didn't say it was racism because it isn't (unless used in its nastier/older context) rather I said it is perpetrating division, very different things. In a society that is primarily of one type and I assume in certain areas in the US where there is still large division and categorisation based on race then the usage of the word can easily avoid the clash of cultures. In multicultural societies that have tighter integration then the use of the word becomes extremely awkward because regardless of context the reference will always bring to the table its nasty past.

Then again the US is the only place I have ever heard it thrown around so lackadaisically (regardless of race) so there may be another cultural difference at play similarly to how the English say cunt like its nothing.

Literally no one is excluded by black people having a slang word to call each other. You're taking personal offense to the act because you want it to be about you.

 

[Enzom21]

I'm not. I didn't say it was racism because it isn't (unless used in its nastier/older context) rather I said it is perpetrating division, very different things. In a society that is primarily of one type and I assume in certain areas in the US where there is still large division and categorisation based on race then the usage of the word can easily avoid the clash of cultures. In multicultural societies that have tighter integration then the use of the word becomes extremely awkward because regardless of context the reference will always bring to the table its nasty past.

Then again the US is the only place I have ever heard it thrown around so lackadaisically (regardless of race) so there may be another cultural difference at play similarly to how the English say cunt like its nothing.

Then be quiet about what we call ourselves. Non-black people(especially white people) have absolutely no say in that particular conversation.
It's societal division based around race, is it not?
But really keep your opinions about what black people call themselves to yourself.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

You know what's actual societal division by race? Redlining, gerrymandering, gentrification, and white flight.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

But I understand why things get heated about this and why people are jumping down my throat.

Oh do you now...

I talk about these things in an emotionally detached and purely intellectual way like only a white person could,

........................................................................



I... what?

Even if you meant to say "I'm too privilege to really grasp it", whiteness still doesn't make sense, because an Asian or another non-black minority would also not be on the receiving end of the n-word so uh seriously what the FUCK

 

[Enzom21]

Edit: Unnecessary and petty.

 

[GoldenCrow]

To Enzom21 and Liu Kang Baking A Pie . I have no problem with people calling people whatever they want, it is their decision and understand the impact behind the word but that doesn't change that it is a disgusting word. However I feel it would be better left in the past like many of the words that are consigned to the depth of history. Any group can try and change the meaning of a word but in its wider sense it will always maintain its vileness if it was used in such a manner.

Plus I never said anything negative about any group, or positive for that matter all your allegations about negative perceptions are your own imaginings. Nor am I affronted that others have differing opinions, I'm not sensitive enough to get hurt feelings from an internet discussion.

I also totally agree about redlining, gerrymandering, gentrification, and white flight as they are the main cause of division, alongside just plain old racism and cultural bias.

 

[Enzom21]

To Enzom21 and Liu Kang Baking A Pie . I have no problem with people calling people whatever they want, it is their decision and understand the impact behind the word but that doesn't change that it is a disgusting word. However I feel it would be better left in the past like many of the words that are consigned to the depth of history. Any group can try and change the meaning of a word but in its wider sense it will always maintain its vileness if it was used in such a manner.

Plus I never said anything negative about any group, or positive for that matter all your allegations about negative perceptions are your own imaginings. Nor am I affronted that others have differing opinions, I'm not sensitive enough to get hurt feelings from an internet discussion.

I also totally agree about redlining, gerrymandering, gentrification, and white flight as they are the main cause of division, alongside just plain old racism and cultural bias.

Once again, you're not black so your opinion about what black people call themselves is irrelevant and pretty much unwelcome.
We've heard from white people about what black people should or shouldn't do for decades. Enough.

 

[GoldenCrow]

Once again, you're not black so your opinion about what black people call themselves is irrelevant and pretty much unwelcome.
We've heard from white people about what black people should or shouldn't do for decades. Enough.

Get over yourself. This is a thread specifically aimed at white people and the usage of the word. Do you think people that is aimed at who reply aren't going to have an opinion of some sort?

I legit couldn't give a shit what anybody calls themselves or others, what they do in their spare time but I'm gonna give an opinion on something I find interesting from the only perspective I can give it from which would be my own.

If you think this is a subject only black people can give an opinion on you are completely incorrect because there are many here. You might not like it, agree with it or want to hear it but that is what I think and unless somebody gives a decent counter argument that would change my opinion, non of which I actually see in any of the responses to my original post then I am going to hold onto my opinion.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

I legit couldn't give a shit what anybody calls themselves or others

If you think this is a subject only black people can give an opinion on you are completely incorrect because there are many here. You might not like it, agree with it or want to hear it but that is what I think and unless somebody gives a decent counter argument that would change my opinion, non of which I actually see in any of the responses to my original post then I am going to hold onto my opinion.

Opinions aren't some protected speech for being opinions. They can be wrong, ignorant, uninformed, or just not your place.

 

[Enzom21]

Get over yourself. This is a thread specifically aimed at white people and the usage of the word. Do you think people that is aimed at who reply aren't going to have an opinion of some sort?

I legit couldn't give a shit what anybody calls themselves or others, what they do in their spare time but I'm gonna give an opinion on something I find interesting from the only perspective I can give it from which would be my own.

If you think this is a subject only black people can give an opinion on you are completely incorrect because there are many here. You might not like it, agree with it or want to hear it but that is what I think and unless somebody gives a decent counter argument that would change my opinion, non of which I actually see in any of the responses to my original post then I am going to hold onto my opinion.

No this thread is about how you shouldn't say nigger not what you think us negroes should or shouldn't say. Your opinion on us is not welcome. I get that it's infuriating when a black person tells you what to do but, "get over yourself".

 

[HiiiLife]

If I hear anyone use this word or any variations of it, my respect for them decreases (either slightly or entirely, depending on context).

Ayyyy

 

[GoldenCrow]

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/Ic2c-WMP2So/maxresdefault.jpg

Why would I though? Just because I think a word is vile doesn't mean I don't think you should use it, I have my preferences but that doesn't mean I'm a mini dictator wanting everyone to do as I think. I also wish religion didn't exist but I know that isn't going anywhere.

 

[GoldenCrow]

No this thread is about how you shouldn't say nigger not what you think us negroes should or shouldn't say. Your opinion on us is not welcome. I get that it's infuriating when a black person tells you what to do but, "get over yourself".

Where did I say that back people shouldn't say the word? My original post says I will always find it to be loaded regardless of who says it or what their intention is.

 

[8 X 11 Printer Paper]

Reading through this thread is just baffling, we Whites, Asians and Hispanic (with low African/Black hereditary) should not ever use the damn word. It doesn't matter if you like rap, don't use the damn word. And yes, Blacks have every right to use and not use the word since it was a word to chain them down. If they want to take back the word they have every right to do so, just as we Jews could take back Kike and so on. Them being able to use the word makes no difference to racists, it just gives them an "excuse" to use when they use the word. They would still use the word or another one regardless if the Black community didn't try to take back the word. While, yes as a white guy it does make me feel uncomfortable to hear the word, so what? My uncomfortably means shit in the end, a few seconds of being uncomfortable is nothing much compared to the real damage that word has done to countless Black Americans for decades.

 

[Subpar Spatula]

If I don't state my ethnicity online... c-can I say it?

 

[Enzom21]

If I don't state my ethnicity online... c-can I say it?

Based on your posts in threads involving black people and racism... fuck no!
Edit: Why do you want to be able to say it?

 

[LionPride]

If I don't state my ethnicity online... c-can I say it?

Hell no

 

[Professor Beef]

guys, hear me out

what if I have an out of body experience

can I say it then

Spoiler

yes this is sarcasm

 

[Order]

"If a black guy steals my girl, can I say it then?

 

[Subpar Spatula]

Based on your posts in threads involving black people and racism... fuck no!
Edit: Why do you want to be able to say it?

I don't want to say it.

It's interesting because it's one of many aspects that become something when observed. Schrodinger's Cat and all, ya know?

 

[Aaronology]

Where did I say that back people shouldn't say the word? My original post says I will always find it to be loaded regardless of who says it or what their intention is.

Crow, that's not dissimilar from my opinion either in regards to nigger. However I don't consider nigga to be the same term regardless of its derivation, and this is a widespread if not ubiquitous view among black people. I think your problem is that you conflate the two while ignoring their respective negative and non-negative connotations, usage and history.

By your own admission you're white, and if your vocabulary is any indication you also aren't American. I imagine you simply lack the cultural familiarity with this subject to not see this thread as just black people proclaiming only they should be able to call themselves niggers. It's only from that mindset do your posts make sense to me.

 

[HiredN00bs]

Oh do you now...


........................................................................



I... what?

Even if you meant to say "I'm too privilege to really grasp it", whiteness still doesn't make sense, because an Asian or another non-black minority would also not be on the receiving end of the n-word so uh seriously what the FUCK

That was a self-depricating statement about myself. What I had meant was that black folk are going to have a different attitude towards whites saying the word, essentially, no matter how much empathy a white person can muster. I came to this thread to say that I didn't think telling people to just not say a word is an effective way to get them to stop using it. I think that psychologically, when you tell someone not to do something they can pretty much do with almost no effort (like saying a word), you're daring them to do it, in a way.

While I originally came into the thread with an attitude of "as long as you're not using the word in an offensive way and around those who might be offended" that attitude has changed based on the responses I got. This goes beyond words and to the heart of the fucked up situation racism and dehumanization have put us in. The idea that someone would be so casual about such a hateful word is offensive, even to me now. But I didn't learn that from the OP.

 

[keffri]

I'm mixed (white/black) and I don't say nigga because I wasn't raised around black culture, nor do I know a lot of black people. I would feel awkward saying it myself even as it would be very forced.

I have friends who say it occasionally (non-black) and it just makes me cringe/shake my head.

 

[GoldenCrow]

Crow, that's not dissimilar from my opinion either in regards to nigger. However I don't consider nigga to be the same term regardless of its derivation, and this is a widespread if not ubiquitous view among black people. I think your problem is that you conflate the two while ignoring their respective negative and non-negative connotations, usage and history.

By your own admission you're white, and if your vocabulary is any indication you also aren't American. I imagine you simply lack the cultural familiarity with this subject to not see this thread as just black people proclaiming only they should be able to call themselves niggers. It's only from that mindset do your post make sense to me.

You are right in both regards that I am not American (though I have spent a good amount of time in the US) and that I do conflate the two. After all should a person who isn't black (or Black American to be more specific) really see the separation of the word outside of cultural differences.

"Er" and "a" both were born out of the same event and people who are racist will use both versions of the word in the same demeaning context and why would somebody who isn't black want to use either word when it adds nothing but hateful and hurtful context unless that is their aim. A quick side note in most UK accents words that end in "er" and "a" is pretty much the same pronunciation.

 

[Glass Rebel]

I don't want to say it.

It's interesting because it's one of many aspects that become something when observed. Schrodinger's Cat and all, ya know?

nobody stop this

I wanna see how this develops

 

[ldcommando]

"If a white guy says the word in the woods and no one is near to hear it, is he a racist?"

 

[Captin Quacker]

again if you have to ask it probably is

 

[Enzom21]

nobody stop this

I wanna see how this develops

Or just ignore it. Which people should do with all of Subpar's posts... especially about race/racism.
I forgot that rule and mistakenly responded to his nonsense.

 

[LionPride]

Or just ignore it. Which people should do with all of Subpar's posts... especially about race/racism.
I forgot that rule and mistakenly responded to his nonsense.

Ignoring Subpar is a good thing to do

 

[Aaronology]

You are right in both regards that I am not American (though I have spent a good amount of time in the US) and that I do conflate the two. After all should a person who isn't black (or Black American to be more specific) really see the separation of the word outside of cultural differences.

"Er" and "a" both were born out of the same event...

Putting the accuracy of this statement aside, I find this irrelevant. Language evolves, Crow. Words change. Gay, bitch and faggot are other controversial terms with contemporary usage defined by what they mean today and not historically, or by what other words they're derivative of. You know this, I am sure, which is why I don't understand your disconnect when it comes to nigger/nigga.

...and people who are racist will use both versions of the word in the same demeaning context...

This hasn't been my experience, and even if it had: So what? What I choose to say or not say will not be governed by the actions of racists.

...and why would somebody who isn't black want to use either word when it adds nothing but hateful and hurtful context unless that is their aim.

Someone who isn't black using either word is going to be controversial, as this thread highlights. Regardless, "nigga" is a term of endearment and a casual form of address lacking the stark negative connotation and sting of nigger, by design. You keep insisting otherwise, and that is perhaps the problem I have with your posts. It feels as if you're attempting to dictate the definition of terms used by and amongst people in a culture you are not a part of. But you can't.

 

[GoldenCrow]

Putting the accuracy of this statement aside, I find this irrelevant. Language evolves, Crow. Words change. Gay, bitch and faggot are other controversial terms with contemporary usage defined by what they mean today and not historically, or by what other words they're derivative of. You know this, I am sure, which is why I don't understand your disconnect when it comes to nigger/nigga.

This hasn't been my experience, and even if it had: So what? What I choose to say or not say will not be governed by the actions of racists.

Someone who isn't black using either word is going to be controversial, as this thread highlights. Regardless, "nigga" is a term of endearment and a casual form of address lacking the stark negative connotation and sting of nigger, by design. You keep insisting otherwise, and that is perhaps the problem I have with your posts. It feels as if you're attempting to dictate the definition of terms used by and amongst people in a culture you are not a part of. But you can't.

I totally get that it is used as a term of endearment by some people and I don't think I'm missing out by not using it. Nor do I want to dictate it either (I haven't said that in entirety of my postings or even alludeded to it), certainly not to a group of people that live thousands of miles away and the usage of the word would have no impact on my life even if they were in the same room.

Regardless even when people use it as the soft term, say I'm watching The Boondocks, every single time the hard definition will also come to mind even though I clearly hear the context and the change in tone and ending. Even though the word has been softened and the sting has been removed it is still essentially the same sounding word especially in other areas of the word. To demonstrate some people still freak out when they hear the word niggardly just because it is similar sounding and has a negative definition but has no relation to the term.

Same goes for the other words you mentioned a female dog, old person/bundle of sticks and happy will all come to mind when they are used. With those none really hold the same impact, they weren't used to de-humanise (forms of abuse certainly but not de-humanise) an entire group of people for centuries and word that reflects the atrocities that happened and still happen. It's not exactly an easy thing to ignore. There aren't many other words that I can think of that hold the same vileness and because it is so similar it always brings this to the surface. Maybe that is a good thing, lest not forget.

 

[MogCakes]

I just stay away from any noun that has racial implications. Has worked out pretty well, not exactly hard because I never see a reason to use words like that.

 

[NCR Redslayer]

I just stay away from any noun that has racial implications. Has worked out pretty well, not exactly hard because I never see a reason to use words like that.

When i get angry or serious, I use the C word. No reason to have someone beat you down for also being racist or make things worse if they were already racist to begin with.

 

[SENPAIatLARGE]

I love when white people feel the need to guide us lost negroes away from the word. Once we stop using it, the curse will be lifted and racism will be finally over.

 

[The Artisan]

I don't want to say it.

It's interesting because it's one of many aspects that become something when observed. Schrodinger's Cat and all, ya know?

off topic, I wish I understood that :\

 

[NCR Redslayer]

off topic, I wish I understood that :\

umm, (im basing this off your avatar)
Would this help?

 

[paragonpro]

I know the rules. If you're white, just dont say it. I hate it when racists try to use the i can say whatever I want excuse or the worst is "why are they allowed to call us cracker?" Excuse. It shouldnt have to be explained but most white americans backgrounds arent steeped in slavery or hatred.

 

[LookAtMeGo]

I know the rules. If you're white, just dont say it. I hate it when racists try to use the i can say whatever I want excuse or the worst is "why are they allowed to call us cracker?" Excuse. It shouldnt have to be explained but most white americans backgrounds arent steeped in slavery or hatred.

I cant imagine a black guy telling me not to call my white friends peckerwood.

 

[Corronchilejano]

The only black guy in our group started using it to refer to anything and anyone, along with as many demeaning memes he could find (black people can't read, nigga stole my bike, etc) while also encouraging us to do it too. At first I was uncomfortable, now we all use it, almost instinctively. Its just for fun, and it's not like we don't know we're doing it for the sake of being politically incorrect.

Still, I am terrified of unconsciously using the word in a normal conversation by accident.

 

[Enzom21]

I know the rules. If you're white, just dont say it. I hate it when racists try to use the i can say whatever I want excuse or the worst is "why are they allowed to call us cracker?" Excuse. It shouldnt have to be explained but most white americans backgrounds arent steeped in slavery or hatred.

if you're not black, it's not just white people. Other races don't get a nigga pass... in spite of The Artisan's insistence that they should. People who aren't white call black people niggers too.

The only black guy in our group started using it to refer to anything and anyone, along with as many demeaning memes he could find (black people can't read, nigga stole my bike, etc) while also encouraging us to do it too. At first I was uncomfortable, now we all use it, almost instinctively. Its just for fun, and it's not like we don't know we're doing it for the sake of being politically incorrect.

Still, I am terrified of unconsciously using the word in a normal conversation by accident.

Why would you be terrified if there is seemingly nothing wrong with it? If you're so goddamn comfortable joking about it, you should be able to say it to everyone.
Your black friend is a fucking idiot, by the way.

 

[Corronchilejano]

Why would you be terrified if there is seemingly nothing wrong with it? If you're so goddamn comfortable joking about it, you should be able to say it to everyone.
Your black friend is a fucking idiot, by the way.

We're not in the US. Racial disparities function differently over here, and the word is basically meaningless to most (that don't speak english).

EDIT: Maybe a culture clash is a wrong thing to share in this thread, sorry about that.

 

[The Artisan]

umm, (im basing this off your avatar)
Would this help?

na...

if you're not black, it's not just white people. Other races don't get a nigga pass... in spite of The Artisan's insistence that they should

i already said I stopped that

 

[cordy]

Tbh, if whites or other races don't get why they shouldn't say the word even after explaining to them (say even if they they try to find a way around it or bring up a lot of "well what is I" type of situations) then chances are they'll never get it. It shouldn't take multiple explanations as to why not use the word. Sure, I've given homies passes to say it if they wanted (and they didn't except my one white friend who DIDN'T GET A PASS and he still said it) but most understand.

Some shit you should just get pretty early. It's like putting your hand over fire as a baby. If you get burned then that tells you to not do it. If you get a few explanations as to why don't try to find a way around it or act like that's not good enough. If I tell you my neighbor hates teenagers and has shot one before so don't dance on their lawn are you willingly going to go dancing on their lawn? Nah, you'll be smart about it.

Or at least I hope so.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

off topic, I wish I understood that :\

in its most popularized use, even if not entirely accurate, it essentially boils down to "if a cat is in a closed box, it's both dead and alive as long as you don't go to find out which it actually is"

so obviously you gotta get a dog

 

[KTS2448]

This thread...lulz.

Its sad this ever needed to be made. As a white dude, I really don't see why its so hard for other white peeps to grasp. Taking one word or its "alterations" out of your speech for the sake of Billions of others' feelings requires virtually no effort. You don't even have to understand why, Just understand it causes negativity and that should be enough to not say it. Although for the sake of not being a fail of a human, You should still look up why so you in return don't repeat past mistakes others in the white race have committed.

 

[Permanently A]

off topic, I wish I understood that :\

there's a cat in a sealed box. with the cat is a vial of poison that is automatically released if radioactivity is detected. (an atom decaying). The question is that we have no way of knowing when the atom decays, and therefore no way of knowing whether the cat is dead or alive unless the box is opened. Thus, in a sense, the cat is simultaneously alive and dead.

"Schrodinger's Nigga" is basically saying that it is simultaneously okay and not okay for someone to use the word nigga until their race is observed and you can say whether it is okay or not.

 

[Enzom21]

We're not in the US. Racial disparities function differently over here, and the word is basically meaningless to most (that don't speak english).

EDIT: Maybe a culture clash is a wrong thing to share in this thread, sorry about that.

You know what nigger means so this whole "I'm not from the US so it's all good." nonsense doesn't fly. Your friend is still an idiot though.

na...

i already said I stopped that

I'm just fucking with you. Don't worry about the Schrodinger's cat thing. It's just another stupid post in a long line of stupid posts from Subpar.
It's basically his way of saying, "Because you don't know what everyone's race is online, everyone should be able to say it."
Ignore that shit.