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VG247: "If Xbox can't beat PS5 this holiday, I'm not sure it ever will"
- Thread starter AlexxKidd
- Start date
SenjutsuSage
Banned
Sounds to me like they're severely underestimating Starfield. And here's what they fail to understand. Xbox doesn't need to "beat" Playstation. It just has to succeed. That's all. It succeeding with its own great set of incredible, high quality experiences and great value services is all Xbox ever needs to do from here on out. Just deliver incredible and tempting gaming experiences. These guys are stuck in a very old fashion frame of mind.
Kokoloko85
Member
Regardless if Xbox is doing there own thing, adding PC players, only gamepass matter or console sales don’t matter……
Xbox are not ever selling more then 60million consoles again.
Xbox are not ever selling more then 60million consoles again.
You conveniently forget everyone that drowned. Magazines are not what they used to be. When I was a kid there were walls covered in magazines, now there's one or two racks. That industry has plummeted.
I never said he wasn't responsible, I said to claim that journalists alone are responsible is ignorant. Now where did I misunderstand you exactly?
Stuart360
Member
Demand more what?. I dont know what more Phil could of done in his tenure. This is the first time since the 360 that there is genuine positivity around Xbox. They have the studios now, they have the hardware, they have Gamepass, they are set ready for the streaming future (i know it sucks but its happening).
The only thing they could do better is get the games out quicker, but that could be down to covid.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
Nah, we're being fed with enough games right now.
If you're happy with that fine. Just don't expect people with investment in other platforms to share your enthusiasm. Because from their (my) perspective, nothing has changed sufficiently to justify it. Its the same Xbox as in prior generations with the same banner franchises.
And as I keep stressing to you, there's nothing whatsoever wrong with those products, those franchises. Its simply that stuff that has proven to be insufficiently appealing to entice us outside Xbox in, in the past, is not magically going to become a massive draw in 2021!
alabtrosMyster
Banned
Granted, I'm no good at list wars... I can see how Forza Horizon at least gains some serious traction, flight simulator is a PC thing, at least if you find it important enough to get hardware for it (don't buy a console for flight simulation).
The other item is Halo infinite, while I will not argue with you how much you like it, but one has to look with rose tinted glasses to think it will push meaningful hardware sales or gamepass subs.
Sony on the other hand does their thing, they have years with less big releases (still not a barren year tho)... Then the next one they blow everyone's minds, these years are why people buy their consoles.
I will not say that MS can't pull it off, but this is not the year... That article is just someone doing their job, it's a useless take. MS has the number of studios necessary to get a critical mass of high quality games out there. the question is more, will they let their studios do their thing? Will they get above the "good and competent games" level to something meaningful on a regular basis?
The last time they pulled it off was over 10years ago
twilo99
Member
Not for me it doesn't.. I was able to play some fh5 on my old laptop which has some horrible integrated Intel graphics without a problem. It gives people more options, I don't see how that's not a good thing. Its also perfect for testing games out before you commit to a download.
DaGwaphics
Member
In a holiday season where the "winner" will be determined entirely on production capacity and logistics? I don't think it matters a great deal. LOL
Dr Bass
Member
And again, how did that work out for them?
Remember how for ages people called the Xbox the Halo/Gears/Forza machine? I feel like thinking Halo and Forza games are going to move the needle in customer behavior and perception when talking about wanting to sell dozens to over a hundred million consoles, potentially, is a foolish notion. The only people that care about these titles are the dedicated Xbox gamers, much like Metroid Dread won't affect Switch sales one way or the other, but it was a damn nice treat for Nintendo fans. Same thing.
There is just some weird stuff going on on this board right now. A certain contingent that thinks sales no longer matter, but cheer vociferously for premium bundles selling for Forza. Celebrating 4.5 million players at launch when 20 million gamers have access to it for free across PC and multiple gen consoles, when we live in a world where Mario Kart 8 sold 40 million copies on the switch alone. But in the midst of dropping all this noise, this same contingent whines and cries "stop console warring!" when you try to point out why their perception doesn't match up to numbers. But their very behavior is goading on this kind of response, merely out of necessity to keep the discussion grounded in reality.
My point in this is that plenty of games sell millions at launch, and don't depend on giving it away for free. So there is a certain group of people celebrating a very small number of sales, while at the same time celebrating people playing for "free" and then none of the numbers really come close to meaningful in terms of the competition. But the launch is also being heralded as some turning point, even though its like the 12th game in the Forza series? Where is the actual data to back any of these hypotheses up?
By all means, enjoy the game/s. I used Metroid Dread as an example above, and that's probably my personal GotY for 2021. I also don't care how many copies it sells beyond the fact I hope it's enough for Nintendo to want to make more. And I own Nintendo stock too. But truly rah-rah-ing sales numbers (or free player numbers?) starts to devolve into treating consoles like team sports, and that's just ridiculous. Again, I don't give a
about the consoles. I sold my PS5 last month. It's a great console and I played some fantastic games on it during 2021, but I didn't see a need to have it during 2022 at the moment, and I have a lot more important things I want to spend my free time on right now rather than massive single player games.And as I like to say, over and, over. Discussions are fun. But let's deal with reality please. The numbers for FH5 are good so far, but also far from meaningful. The Xbox is a great console, and it has a lot of great games. But it's still also the least desired platform by consumers, and by a large margin. That doesn't mean it's not fun, or that people who prefer it have bad taste. Nintendo has always been my favorite game creator, even when their console was my least played. I HAD to get a PSX back in the day to play the games I wanted to play, even though I liked the N64. I really liked the select GameCube games I bought, even though I thought the OG Xbox was so far superior in terms of overall experience to both the GameCube and PS2. I preferred X360 to PS3 (btw, I bought 4 360s over time because of the RRoD lol) and liked some of the Wii games I had more than anything on either console. I also thought the Wii was by far the worst console at the time, even though it sold more. Etc etc. Trying to spin your preferred platform of choice as somehow being the best in all circumstances is pathological. All you have to do is like what you like, and accept the numbers and consumer trends and preferences for what they are. It doesn't take away from your enjoyment of anything. Or at least it shouldn't.
MOTM
Banned
Somebody come look at this ..
Revenue is up because of inflation ??!!
And revenue always goes up over time ??? What the ...
LeftThumbstick
Member
Dear god, they have around 20+ studios now rather than the 5-ish they had at the start of Xbox One. They will have much more than just Halo & Forza. They just bought Bethesda ffs. A few years into this generation, they will have the potential to release a new exclusive every 3-4 months if they really want to.
I'm glad they're taking their time, it's clearly paying off as they have 4 exclusives in the top 10 highest rated games of this year, and who knows, Halo could be the next.
cormack12
Gold Member
I didn't. That's how capitalism works. You either adapt or a new business with a better model takes your place. Some magazines adapted - just look at the celeb shite or womens section. Markets like Readly popped up etc. Some couldn't, maybe because of investment or readership or finances.
Youtubers, influencers etc. demonstrated exactly the model to follow and most gaming magazines followed an alternative or dotcoms applied the wrong model. Their widest audience now is probably the blue hair twitter brigade who overlap very conveniently with the 'I aint paying for shit, but if you write something I like, I might retweet it or say you're a good person' market.
They've alienated most of those who actually want high quality game news, articles, insight and forced them to patreons. Fucking hell, do you remember Angry Joe cutting his teeth at expo's and trying to relay what was going on at the conferences. Despite being shit, it was honest and what people wanted. Same as those setting up live instagrams from PAX. Where was the outcomes and all the cool shit in development from EGX Digital in October on these sites?
There will always be fanboys and fangirls, but largely those stupid discussions stay on sites like gaf, mumsnet or audiworld because legitimate outlets don't use them as the basis for real publications.
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
And R&C has about 15 games as well, and DS isnt even a new game, but a remaster. Spiderman MM is similar game to the original Spiderman PS4 game. So if youre going to talk about rehashes, PS is no better.
And it's obvious you said 16 Halo games since launch since MS used to make more frequent. Also, many of them arent even MP shooters. You included Halo Wars and that XBLA Spartan twin stick shooter, a demo VR game and the Halo arcade game to get to 16. The last real Halo game was Halo 5 in 2015. What you did is go to Wiki and saw a list of 16 Halo games.
FH5 has done great. Probably going to be the biggest FH game ever. Already outsold DS and R&C by a mile. And it might even beat Spiderman MM if you give FH5 some time.
So despite you downplaying, people are liking FH5. It's at 4.5M and will probably hit 5M by end of the week.
It's ok to have competing system games do well.
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Stuart360
Member
Dr Bass wtf dude, why have the Forza numbers riled you up to this extent?.And again, how did that work out for them?
Remember how for ages people called the Xbox the Halo/Gears/Forza machine? I feel like thinking Halo and Forza games are going to move the needle in customer behavior and perception when talking about wanting to sell dozens to over a hundred million consoles, potentially, is a foolish notion. The only people that care about these titles are the dedicated Xbox gamers, much like Metroid Dread won't affect Switch sales one way or the other, but it was a damn nice treat for Nintendo fans. Same thing.
There is just some weird stuff going on on this board right now. A certain contingent that thinks sales no longer matter, but cheer vociferously for premium bundles selling for Forza. Celebrating 4.5 million players at launch when 20 million gamers have access to it for free across PC and multiple gen consoles, when we live in a world where Mario Kart 8 sold 40 million copies on the switch alone. But in the midst of dropping all this noise, this same contingent whines and cries "stop console warring!" when you try to point out why their perception doesn't match up to numbers. But their very behavior is goading on this kind of response, merely out of necessity to keep the discussion grounded in reality.
My point in this is that plenty of games sell millions at launch, and don't depend on giving it away for free. So there is a certain group of people celebrating a very small number of sales, while at the same time celebrating people playing for "free" and then none of the numbers really come close to meaningful in terms of the competition. But the launch is also being heralded as some turning point, even though its like the 12th game in the Forza series? Where is the actual data to back any of these hypotheses up?
By all means, enjoy the game/s. I used Metroid Dread as an example above, and that's probably my personal GotY for 2021. I also don't care how many copies it sells beyond the fact I hope it's enough for Nintendo to want to make more. And I own Nintendo stock too. But truly rah-rah-ing sales numbers (or free player numbers?) starts to devolve into treating consoles like team sports, and that's just ridiculous. Again, I don't give a
And as I like to say, over and, over. Discussions are fun. But let's deal with reality please. The numbers for FH5 are good so far, but also far from meaningful. The Xbox is a great console, and it has a lot of great games. But it's still also the least desired platform by consumers, and by a large margin. That doesn't mean it's not fun, or that people who prefer it have bad taste. Nintendo has always been my favorite game creator, even when their console was my least played. I HAD to get a PSX back in the day to play the games I wanted to play, even though I liked the N64. I really liked the select GameCube games I bought, even though I thought the OG Xbox was so far superior in terms of overall experience to both the GameCube and PS2. I preferred X360 to PS3 (btw, I bought 4 360s over time because of the RRoD lol) and liked some of the Wii games I had more than anything on either console. I also thought the Wii was by far the worst console at the time, even though it sold more. Etc etc. Trying to spin your preferred platform of choice as somehow being the best in all circumstances is pathological. All you have to do is like what you like, and accept the numbers and consumer trends and preferences for what they are. It doesn't take away from your enjoyment of anything. Or at least it shouldn't.
Chill man, its all good.
Dr Bass
Member
Hey everyone who read the post he quoted ... made my point with this response, to wit.Dr Bass wtf dude, why have the Forza numbers riled you up to this extent?.
Chill man, its all good.
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ManaByte
Gold Member
Last numbers we got for Spider-Man: Miles Morales was 6.5M. There are 5M people playing FH5 right now. FH5 could pass 6.5M by Monday, especially with the holiday tomorrow.
Topher
Gold Member
That the decision to write a clickbait console war articles comes from the journalist and the journalist alone.
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
You guys talking journalism and magazines are giving too much credit to modern day web site writers. Anyone can upload an article. Doesnt make them a journalist.
My buddy used to run a game site and post articles and videos after dinner. Guy has a day job on an office and married with kids. He crammed in whatever he could upload when he had free time away from the fam.
Trust me. He's no journalist. Guy even had spelling mistakes because he was too lazy to proof read his own content.
My buddy used to run a game site and post articles and videos after dinner. Guy has a day job on an office and married with kids. He crammed in whatever he could upload when he had free time away from the fam.
Trust me. He's no journalist. Guy even had spelling mistakes because he was too lazy to proof read his own content.
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
It never will..
But either way clearly Sony is out-producing units, secured far more supply chain.. so just a dumb article either way.
But either way clearly Sony is out-producing units, secured far more supply chain.. so just a dumb article either way.
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
I don't think anyone ever beat Nintendo's combined GameBoy/Home console numbers either.
Not a knock on them or an attempt to downplay their success.. as nobody ever beat GameBoy at their game either, but it's just not very comparable to look at Switch vs Ps5 vs Xbox sales as the latter 2 do not have screens and batteries.
Topher
Gold Member
That is true. Most people who are referred to as "journalists" are really nothing more than bloggers who purchased a professional looking theme on WordPress.
saintjules
Member
I agree.
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Basil King
Member
According to my wallet Microsoft already won considering I’m not paying $70 for these games.
I’m still waiting for a reason to turn on my PS5 after beating ratchet and clank.
so in that regard, yeah they beat Sony to me. This generation won’t be measured by NpD numbers but value and services the eco system offers.
I’m still waiting for a reason to turn on my PS5 after beating ratchet and clank.
so in that regard, yeah they beat Sony to me. This generation won’t be measured by NpD numbers but value and services the eco system offers.
ManaByte
Gold Member
Really sucks if you just spent money to launch a forum built around NPD video game sales.
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
LOL. Ya he used Wordpress too. I dont think he even paid for it. Knowing him he's a cheap ass and wasnt doing it to make a career out of it. Probably used free templates.
kingfey
Banned
Sony benefited massively from the f2p games (Battle passes), and the player base. Right now, its different. With gamepass, MS should have enough revenue to match what the ps5 is generating.
Until its between ps5 and series console, ps4 would come to sony rescue.
There's a reason why almost every website down to local newspapers want you to subscribe to read articles these days. It's cause times are hard. It's a hopeless business model since who in their right mind would subsribe to something just to read one article, but I know why it's like that. Giving away content for free doesn't pay bills.
It's easier with patreon since it's a site that established itself on a very specific business model, and it caters very well to an audience interested in video content.
And there is another reason for a decline in written quality. People want videos, so the youtubers ate a huge portion of the cake. Being a good journalist isn't necessarily grounds for being good at making videos, and keeping up with changing market demands can be brutal.
I mean, just look at your own magazine examples. Gossip rags and garbage like that are the things that sell best, and it's pretty much the print equivalent of click bait.
I wish things were different. I've worked in media long enough to enjoy the glory days and lament the crash.
I know all too well what it's like to invest time and effort into creating quality content only to see it get no attention next to article 984 about random game going gold. It doesn't feel worth it anymore, I'll tell you that.
The content you miss is gone for a reason. Most likely it just didn't generate enough revenue to make the work worth it.
Yes, of course it is. Not my point. My point is that they wouldn't make that choice if their audience didn't teach them, time and time again, that that's the shit that sells.
leo-j
Member
The game is free on gamepass? Idk tbh, it’s like Sony releasing numbers for Uncharted 4 including free ps plus numbers? What the game was engaged 40 million times so it sold 40 million?
PharaoTutAnchAmun
Member
But he is telling his take about what he thinks. Its his opnion.
He is not doing what other gaming sites been doing before the new consoles where hitting the streets.
Some sites where and are obvious biased towards one of the two consoles. He gives is opnion and he is not biased to one console. This is not feeding the console war, only console warriors are by saying here that he is.
Its his opnion, agree ore disagree. But not saying its klickbate,and leave it by that.
Lognor
Banned
MacReady13
Member
My opinion counts for nothing and even this little story means nothing, but anyway.... here ini Australia a few days ago, EB games were allowing in store ONLY pre orders of PS5 and XBOX series X consoles. I went in store to purchase a Switch game for the kids and I was about 6th in line. Every person ahead of me pre ordered a PS5. When I got to the front, they said that they have pretty much only had PS5 pre orders and not many Xbox pre orders. In fact the pre orders for PS5 were cut off a few hours after opening, yet Xbox I don't believe closed for pre orders (well I didn't see anything).
Point is, with or without big 1st party releases, Sony has such a stranglehold on the industry (along with Nintendo) that Microsoft will never catch them. Hence why Microsoft HAD to come at it all from a different angle, and as such it's not about console sales but gamepass subscriptions.
Point is, with or without big 1st party releases, Sony has such a stranglehold on the industry (along with Nintendo) that Microsoft will never catch them. Hence why Microsoft HAD to come at it all from a different angle, and as such it's not about console sales but gamepass subscriptions.
Topher
Gold Member
Then why is it that plenty of journalists make the choice not to write clickbait articles every single day?
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Shut0wen
Member
MS are just not interested in it anymore, they have about 3 subscriptions on xbox alone to help generate money as well as there own first party games but i will say personally speaking MS fucked up making the series s, i have one because i cant find a series x available and the fact that its disc less and has shit memory is another huge downer, you can literally buy an S anywhere but incredibly hard to get a series x
kingfey
Banned
You pay 15$ for it. Before day1 gamepass release, its was 1.5m.
Even those ps+ people pay 10$ to play it. That is still money for Sony, same for MS.
Punished Miku
Gold Member
Starfield? Dumb article.
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nightmare-slain
Member
so i should be banned because i don't like the upcoming playstation games?
got/death stranding are last gen games. horizon forbidden west i will be able to play on my PS4 and the same for God of War/Gran Turismo.
i'm definitely not console warring here. i'm simply saying i don't see anything that i like about upcoming playstation games and you think that's ban worthy? when i got banned yeah i admit i crossed the line but if i am to be walking on egg shells for not praising Playstation (which I own) then that says a lot about this forum.
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RoadHazard
Gold Member
It won't. Well, maybe in the US it will, but not globally.
kingfey
Banned
More money, more console games.
Its like someone giving you more sponsorship money, compared to regular sponsorship deal.
Topher
Gold Member
kidding
I'm talking directly, not indirectly. PC versions of games are not not going alleviate the console shortage for non-PC gamers.
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PharaoTutAnchAmun
Member
Nope the PS3 won in the end by a very little margin. It was by all means the worst generation according to hardware sales for Sony especialy after the PS2.