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[Deleted member 775630]

This is scary because it’s like reading a quote out of Stadia ad.

They have been saying this since 2016 with their "Play Anywhere" capabilities for games. They are just now pushing it even further. Xcloud, Game Pass, Play Anywhere, Windows for PC and Xbox consoles. Gives gamers the possibilities to play any game anywhere, however they want. Players at the center, giving them all these possibilities. You can claim that due to this you constraint developers, but that's not really the case since most of them have always been developing for PC (low, mid, high settings), and this won't change.

 

[Lort]

so what's been going on here past few days? what did i miss?

Nothing of any substance.

 

[chemical boy]

They have been saying this since 2016 with their "Play Anywhere" capabilities for games. They are just now pushing it even further. Xcloud, Game Pass, Play Anywhere, Windows for PC and Xbox consoles. Gives gamers the possibilities to play any game anywhere, however they want. Players at the center, giving them all these possibilities. You can claim that due to this you constraint developers, but that's not really the case since most of them have always been developing for PC (low, mid, high settings), and this won't change.

Developing a game with a low, medium and high configuration does NOT exploit the hardware. If a single game were developed using only a 2080TI as a base, we would have graphics and physics far superior to everything seen so far.

 

[Deleted member 775630]

Developing a game with a low, medium and high configuration does NOT exploit the hardware. If a single game were developed using only a 2080TI as a base, we would have graphics and physics far superior to everything seen so far.

Definitely true, but that's not what Microsoft wants. They don't want every possible gamer in the world to buy their one and only console. They want gamers to have choice, and play on the device of their choosing without needing to put down $500 at launch. Obviously they want that those people play on their platform, but it doesn't have to be Xbox Series X. It can be PC, Xbox One S/X, or Xcloud too.

Is this a bad thing? For hardcore gamers that only want to play the newest and customised for 1 console games, sure. But for the rest of the population it's actually a good thing.

 

[existensmaximum]

You're kidding yourself if you think it's clear cut. There are many specifics yet to be seen. That could be a false assumption you posted...that "based" equals "dedicated". We don't know yet. We believe certain things right now, but "know" we don't...... yet.....for Sony or MS. When all, many of the RT technical details are released, then we will. I believe both Sony and MS will have "dedicated" RT, which how they perform could vary drastically, but I sure as hell don't know for sure if it is "dedicated" and neither do you....that I do know. You or anyone else not under NDA, engineers in the know etc...and people that do know can spin this many ways, parse words and summize technical details...until those details are known, released. Then when a real technical analysis can be performed. Besides, semantics and implementation will mean little if performance is terrible in the end. The bottom line will be the bottom line....we will see that unknown and that's exciting to see how it works for both Sony and MS. Wait and see.

Yeah I can make a short list of all the facts about PS5 that are clear cut:

 

[SenjutsuSage]

SenjutsuSage why do you believe MS when they said in the e3 video that ray tracing is hardware accelerated but dont believe the lead engineer of the ps5 when he says the same?



also when the CEO goes up in front of hundreds of journalists and stands behind a infographic that claims the ray tracing is hardware based.

what would you like them to say exactly? right now, they have literally said exactly what MS has said. so what is it that they need to do that MS has NOT done to earn your trust?

It wasn't just the E3 reveal video for scarlett. It's AMD's press release on their official blog where they commit to it while labeling it next gen RDNA. It's also the official Series X reveal post. Microsoft is doubling and tripling down. Cerny's first example was regarding audio ray tracing, no big deal, likely a misunderstanding. He then clarifies hardware acceleratio on a follow-up. I now think the issue is dead. Then the AMD GitHub leak where it doesn't appear at all for ps5 chip, but does for Xbox series x chip. Now I'm rethinking what Cerny said and now have doubts. Then comes CES, they put up a slide showing it. I again think the issue is put to bed, only to then bizarrely learn that of all features on the slide, the guy on stage literally talks about everything on the slide, except hardware based ray tracing.

Consider that to mention every other feature on that slide, he had to skip past hardware ray tracing twice. I found that extremely odd. Why do they seem so reluctant to talk about one of the most hyped new graphics features coming into next gen? Do I expect to see it in every game? No, it's too demanding. Now I've left open the possibility that they may have it, but I have legitimate reason to doubt it now. Phil, again, has further confirmed hardware accelerated ray tracing via interviews also.

So, long story short, I see one side projecting confidence whereas I see the other being evasive on the issue. Maybe I'm wrong, and I will gladly eat crow. But I'm going to need to see it in a released title to believe it.

And, make no mistake, just because I believe Xbox really has it, doesn't mean that they, too, don't need to prove it from where I'm sitting. Both need to prove they have the real deal, or they shouldn't claim that they do. That's how I see it. So hopefully that's a complete enough answer on my thought process. It'll be the last time I address it, though, till we get more verifiable information on both consoles, but Sony have not portrayed the same degree of confidence where ray tracing is concerned. If we are being honest, there has been a clear difference between how the two sides have been marketing the feature.

 

[JAMMA]

.

 

[Panajev2001a]

They have been saying this since 2016 with their "Play Anywhere" capabilities for games. They are just now pushing it even further. Xcloud, Game Pass, Play Anywhere, Windows for PC and Xbox consoles. Gives gamers the possibilities to play any game anywhere, however they want. Players at the center, giving them all these possibilities. You can claim that due to this you constraint developers, but that's not really the case since most of them have always been developing for PC (low, mid, high settings), and this won't change.

Great, but what is the point of owning the HW then? Why pouring billions into R&D when you have the Windows PC ecosystem and tons of other HW makers selling tons of consoles worldwide? They are giving a very close to doublespeak message on this one.

I also would argue that this does constraint devs as the PC market with its multitude of configurations and the cost to support them (or let people optimise the games for them by flicking tons of config switches when they play) was not the big driver for AAA games, but the fixed specs console boxes were and are.

 

[Deleted member 775630]

Great, but what is the point of owning the HW then? Why pouring billions into R&D when you have the Windows PC ecosystem and tons of other HW makers selling tons of consoles worldwide? They are giving a very close to doublespeak message on this one.

I also would argue that this does constraint devs as the PC market with its multitude of configurations and the cost to support them (or let people optimise the games for them by flicking tons of config switches when they play) was not the big driver for AAA games, but the fixed specs console boxes were and are.

Why develop HW? To give the gamers the possibility to play on the best possible system on TV. They started this with the Xbox One X. Best hardware, best place to play games (when it comes to consoles).

There is indeed a constraint, but Microsoft made the trade-off between a small development constraint that they solve by pouring more money into it when buying and funding studios or telling gamers to just buy the new console. How is that different from Mattrick saying, you don't have internet? Just buy an Xbox 360... Spencer now says, it doesn't matter that you currently don't have the money for a new high-end console, we'll make sure you can play games on your older system as well. For our first-party studios, we will make sure that it runs on any system and still looks amazing, so you can decide what you want.

 

[ethomaz]

What do you think about Destiny
Big Bungie fan, top first person shooter game. Love the experience and grind. Great example of cross-gen game that will work on every platform and doesn't focus on exclusivity.

I find funny his big example of cross-gen game is a game that have to rip off the old gen hardware in second year because they where holding the development of new features for the game.

 

[bigol]

It's amusing how every "insider" is now scared to leak more "infos".

 

[hemo memo]

It's amusing how every "insider" is now scared to leak more "infos".

The term “insider” got dragged to the mud. We need a new term for actual insiders.

 

[JAMMA]

.

 

[Kobi]

Haha, look at you trying to bait them out. Nobody's scared. Their just isn't anything else to leak. I doubt we'll see or hear anything else till the ps5 reveal, 5th Feb, 2021

 

[sinnergy]

Untrustworthy leakers?

Feakers “a cross between leaker and faker ,“

 

[Gavin Stevens]

I wish I could lie, I do, but... That Phil interview doesn’t fill me with hope.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Why develop HW? To give the gamers the possibility to play on the best possible system on TV. They started this with the Xbox One X. Best hardware, best place to play games (when it comes to consoles).

There is indeed a constraint, but Microsoft made the trade-off between a small development constraint that they solve by pouring more money into it when buying and funding studios or telling gamers to just buy the new console. How is that different from Mattrick saying, you don't have internet? Just buy an Xbox 360... Spencer now says, it doesn't matter that you currently don't have the money for a new high-end console, we'll make sure you can play games on your older system as well. For our first-party studios, we will make sure that it runs on any system and still looks amazing, so you can decide what you want.

They are not “solving” a constraints by buying some studios up anymore than they solved Xbox One problems by asking people to buy the speeded up Xbox One S and then asking them to buy the even faster Xbox One X. You do not get to create the problem and be greeted as liberator for selling the cure .

Seriously though, creating the best device does not mean much when they say they do not care about devices at all and consoles technically are always bested by PC’s.

They are trying to argue both for al software being multiplatform software as well as exclusive to their devices as far as consoles are concerned. Which is confusing.
Either start publishing Halo Infinite on Switch, iPhone, and PlayStation or stop saying you do not care about which device people use.

MS is believable when they say that about Office 365 as it is available on Windows, macOS, iOS, and Android.

 

[bigol]

Haha, look at you trying to bait them out. Nobody's scared. Their just isn't anything else to leak. I doubt we'll see or hear anything else till the ps5 reveal, 5th Feb, 2021

It isn't a bait though. I don't want them to come back and spread their fake infos. Actual insiders or people in the know just keep their infos for themselves. I see Jason Schreier as someone who already knows everything about Ps5 and XsX specs but he only hinted that both consoles will be powerful and very close in term of performance.

 

[Neo Blaster]

Definitely true, but that's not what Microsoft wants. They don't want every possible gamer in the world to buy their one and only console. They want gamers to have choice, and play on the device of their choosing without needing to put down $500 at launch. Obviously they want that those people play on their platform, but it doesn't have to be Xbox Series X. It can be PC, Xbox One S/X, or Xcloud too.

Is this a bad thing? For hardcore gamers that only want to play the newest and customised for 1 console games, sure. But for the rest of the population it's actually a good thing.

Then premium players will become PC elitist users, paying top for a machine that can never reach its potential for the sake of accessibility.

 

[PaintTinJr]

And, make no mistake, just because I believe Xbox really has it, doesn't mean that they, too, don't need to prove it from where I'm sitting. Both need to prove they have the real deal, or they shouldn't claim that they do. That's how I see it. So hopefully that's a complete enough answer on my thought process. It'll be the last time I address it, though, till we get more verifiable information on both consoles, but Sony have not portrayed the same degree of confidence where ray tracing is concerned. If we are being honest, there has been a clear difference between how the two sides have been marketing the feature.

I assume you don’t think the paradigm shift to real-time RT - however it is achieved in real-time – is actually needed to sell next-gen to the masses then, yes? I personally think there’s no sales pitch for next-gen without RT – especially with the pitch being watered down by mid-gen H/W refreshes. So launching either system without that feature is going lower market size IMHO and potentially be an industry crash for consoles.

I would also say that a big mid-range(or lower) TV will be more damaging to this-gen picture quality benefits from the Pro/OneX ~4K HDR, than the quality gains of a high-end TV in game-mode using an original model PS4 with HDR. Only the other week me and a friend were comparing his 65” LG 4KHDR (750nits) mid-range TV with his Pro running Death Stranding, against it running on my Sony ZD9 with my original PS4. And my TV was the bigger difference to image presentation. We then tried the Pro on my TV at 4K/HDR, and it gave such an underwhelming boost to the game’s presentation above my original PS4. The untrained-eye mass market just won’t see a difference without RT IMHO, and that's coming from someone that is quite critical of lower image quality.

 

[JAMMA]

.

 

[geordiemp]

It's amusing how every "insider" is now scared to leak more "infos".

Not really, I can understand someone passing info about what they have heard from a software developer, its all fair game.

But that is VERY DIFFERENT to Sony marketing reveal dates and planning, as why would a developer know that, its totally un related.

I also believe, my guess, that the timing is fluid in that Sony probbaly had changed dates - nobody wants to be travelling internationally by plane TO OR FROM places like Japan / China / Singapore etc with the current virus, and big companies are pulling out of trade shows in other markets.

As long as the virus is escalating, expect the date to be moved back in time is my opnion.

 

[ArcaneNLSC]

Feakers “a cross between leaker and faker ,“

first thing that came to mind upon reading this was...

 

[JAMMA]

.

 

[bigol]

Not really, I can understand someone passing info about what they have heard from a software developer, its all fair game.

But that is VERY DIFFERENT to Sony marketing reveal dates and planning, as why would a developer know that, its totally un related.

I also believe, my guess, that the timing is fluid in that Sony probbaly had changed dates - nobody wants to be travelling internationally by plane TO OR FROM places like Japan / China / Singapore etc with the current virus, and big companies are pulling out of trade shows in other markets.

As long as the virus is escalating, expect the date to be moved back in time is my opnion.

The latest actual news about Ps5 states that Sony is not ready yet to unveil their console. I don't think the virus has anything to do with it.

 

[Gavin Stevens]

I’d seriously like Phil to moneyhat Street Fighter VI.

Sony did it, why shouldn’t they? Street Fighter is both import for e-sports and the Japanese in general.

Moneyhatting is bad. I’m all for exclusives but money hatting just pisses people off. As an artist you want as many people to see your work as you can, so limiting yourself to such low numbers doesn’t make sense. It’s ok for exclusives because usually, you wouldn’t even be in the position to release a game without their backing.

There are times money hatting is ok, like if there’s no cHands of your game getting funding without it.

But making deals just to keep your game off another platform, even worse when it’s only for a month or year? They need to go away.

IMO.

 

[JAMMA]

.

 

[Darklor01]

The term “insider” got dragged to the mud. We need a new term for actual insiders.

The Vetted can be The Vetted and those that know things can be Tyrion Lannister.

 

[Deleted member 775630]

They are not “solving” a constraints by buying some studios up anymore than they solved Xbox One problems by asking people to buy the speeded up Xbox One S and then asking them to buy the even faster Xbox One X. You do not get to create the problem and be greeted as liberator for selling the cure .

Seriously though, creating the best device does not mean much when they say they do not care about devices at all and consoles technically are always bested by PC’s.

They are trying to argue both for al software being multiplatform software as well as exclusive to their devices as far as consoles are concerned. Which is confusing.
Either start publishing Halo Infinite on Switch, iPhone, and PlayStation or stop saying you do not care about which device people use.

MS is believable when they say that about Office 365 as it is available on Windows, macOS, iOS, and Android.

It's also the cure for getting the games on PC, is it not? You are saying that Microsoft created the problem, but the only reason why they "created" that problem is because they wanted their games to be available on PC. Once their games are available on PC, then why wouldn't they release multiple consoles for different type of gamers? That's just filling in the whole in the market and giving more choice.

They never said they don't care about devices... They said, gamers are in the center and they want to give them a full range of possibilities to play on. One of them is the best console. And I know PC will always best consoles, but that doesn't matter to some people. For example, me. I don't want to play on a PC, I don't like it, it's completely different experience from consoles. But I do have the money for the best console. Hence => I'll buy the XSX or PS5, not sure which one since we don't know anything about any of them.

I do agree that if they REALLY wanted to play the play anywhere whenever wherever card, they should publish their games on other systems, but that doesn't work with their Game Pass/Xcloud strategy. Although I do think that they are open for Game Pass and Xcloud to be available on Playstation or the Switch, I just don't think Nintendo or Sony would like this.

Then premium players will become PC elitist users, paying top for a machine that can never reach its potential for the sake of accessibility.

That has always been the case as a PC gamer. They always have the best quality, and will never reach the full potential of their system.

 

[SenjutsuSage]

I assume you don’t think the paradigm shift to real-time RT - however it is achieved in real-time – is actually needed to sell next-gen to the masses then, yes? I personally think there’s no sales pitch for next-gen without RT – especially with the pitch being watered down by mid-gen H/W refreshes. So launching either system without that feature is going lower market size IMHO and potentially be an industry crash for consoles.

I would also say that a big mid-range(or lower) TV will be more damaging to this-gen picture quality benefits from the Pro/OneX ~4K HDR, than the quality gains of a high-end TV in game-mode using an original model PS4 with HDR. Only the other week me and a friend were comparing his 65” LG 4KHDR (750nits) mid-range TV with his Pro running Death Stranding, against it running on my Sony ZD9 with my original PS4. And my TV was the bigger difference to image presentation. We then tried the Pro on my TV at 4K/HDR, and it gave such an underwhelming boost to the game’s presentation above my original PS4. The untrained-eye mass market just won’t see a difference without RT IMHO, and that's coming from someone that is quite critical of lower image quality.

I don't think next gen consoles need it. If they can do it impressively, then that's gravy. It's one of the last things I saw happening personally. But since they're saying they have it, I look forward to seeing both back it up in a major AAA release.

 

[Gavin Stevens]

Sony Funded SFV, but Capcom didn’t need the funding. In your words then SFV is an example of moneyhatting and not an exclusive? If so, I agree.

I wouldn’t put it as an exclusive no. I think if I remember right at the time SF V wasn’t even on the cards, there was no funding for it. In these cases, you have a choice, something or nothing. So that’s totally fine in my eyes, because I would rather it get made and it played than not at all.

I see exclusives as the big ones, companies owned by the main console maker, first parties. So Naughty Dog, 343 etc. They are true exclusives that you won’t wake up one year and find suddenly on the other console.

Stuff like FFVII? That pisses me off. You're essentially sticking a middle finger up at all those fans that want to play it, but now can’t. Telling them to deal with it and wait a year. That’s really anti consumer to me.

 

[ANIMAL1975]

Isn’t he the guy with the “Legendz” leak?
lmao this shit is gonna be so funny when it turns out he was full of it. He’s gonna pull the “my insider said anything was open for change” card

The Legendz leak is the 4chan bullshit list of games, and with the 5th February Playstation Meeting and the PS5 price. Up to now, the only thing that we can 'call out' on OsirisBlack , is that vague "fortnight" post, that everyone assumed it would be Sonys announcement of the Meetings date (which he did not confirm). That date expired on the 3rd of February i think _ so to be fair, everything else he teased/leaked, is still lacking confirmation until Sony and Ms reveal full specs and games _ so it's all possible.

 

[Nivek OnlyOn]

Champions League returns on th 18th feb.
Sony is a huge sponsor.
Im betting some PS5 info in that week will drop.

 

[MARTYWOLF]

I wish I could lie, I do, but... That Phil interview doesn’t fill me with hope.

Hope for what?

 

[Gavin Stevens]

Hope for what?

Well, he’s saying thinking I don’t really agree with, so hope for the future of what they are planning. I again see what he means, but I’m Not sure I agree with his philosophy here. It feels a bit too much atm like they will release this powerful consoles, but nobody will be able to take advantage of it as much as they should.

Im not sure. Maybe it’s just the cliff notes I read on here (I’ve not listened to the actual interview)but it’s the worst sounding thing thus far for me. It did nothing but add more cloud to stuff we needed more solid answers on.

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

They have been saying this since 2016 with their "Play Anywhere" capabilities for games. They are just now pushing it even further. Xcloud, Game Pass, Play Anywhere, Windows for PC and Xbox consoles. Gives gamers the possibilities to play any game anywhere, however they want. Players at the center, giving them all these possibilities. You can claim that due to this you constraint developers, but that's not really the case since most of them have always been developing for PC (low, mid, high settings), and this won't change.

This is a new generation.

It's also the cure for getting the games on PC, is it not? You are saying that Microsoft created the problem, but the only reason why they "created" that problem is because they wanted their games to be available on PC. Once their games are available on PC, then why wouldn't they release multiple consoles for different type of gamers? That's just filling in the whole in the market and giving more choice.

They never said they don't care about devices... They said, gamers are in the center and they want to give them a full range of possibilities to play on. One of them is the best console. And I know PC will always best consoles, but that doesn't matter to some people. For example, me. I don't want to play on a PC, I don't like it, it's completely different experience from consoles. But I do have the money for the best console. Hence => I'll buy the XSX or PS5, not sure which one since we don't know anything about any of them.

I do agree that if they REALLY wanted to play the play anywhere whenever wherever card, they should publish their games on other systems, but that doesn't work with their Game Pass/Xcloud strategy. Although I do think that they are open for Game Pass and Xcloud to be available on Playstation or the Switch, I just don't think Nintendo or Sony would like this.


That has always been the case as a PC gamer. They always have the best quality, and will never reach the full potential of their system.

You can keep defending it all you want but there's little attraction in playing games with suped up visuals on Series X and base versions on XB1 when this is supposed to be a new gen. We've had that for 8 years where XB1 multiplat titles could be enjoyed maxed out on PC. What's the point of Series X if you've got a powerful PC?

On the other side ND, SSM, Guerilla etc are creating games where the 12tflop PS5 is the baseline, with its uber fast SSD and other new, modern features we havent heard about yet and are going to exploit them, you know, to move the industry forward after 8 years where everything had to run on a netbook CPU and painfully slow HDD. Are you seriously telling me both approaches are as good as each other?

 

[Darius87]

It wasn't just the E3 reveal video for scarlett. It's AMD's press release on their official blog where they commit to it while labeling it next gen RDNA. It's also the official Series X reveal post. Microsoft is doubling and tripling down. Cerny's first example was regarding audio ray tracing, no big deal, likely a misunderstanding.

Cerny talked about audio RT because it's new thing, technology in games, what's wrong with that? how it's misunderstanding? do you think he's gonna spil the beans about RT on his first interview? you might say ps5 lacks BC because cerny didn't talk about it or Ryan didn't mention it at CES.

He then clarifies hardware acceleratio on a follow-up.

and you still doubt it? like what he's have to tell you to make you believe it?

i now think the issue is dead. Then the AMD GitHub leak where it doesn't appear at all for ps5 chip, but does for Xbox series x chip.

wee don't even know if that leak is real and even it's real that don't disprove anything about ps5 just because there's RT in xsex leak.

Now I'm rethinking what Cerny said and now have doubts. Then comes CES, they put up a slide showing it. I again think the issue is put to bed, only to then bizarrely learn that of all features on the slide, the guy on stage literally talks about everything on the slide, except hardware based ray tracing. Consider that to mention every other feature on that slide, he had to skip past hardware ray tracing twice. I found that extremely odd. Why do they seem so reluctant to talk about one of the most hyped new graphics features coming into next gen? Do I expect to see it in every game? No, it's too demanding. Now I've left open the possibility that they may have it, but I have legitimate reason to doubt it now. Phil, again, has further confirmed hardware accelerated ray tracing via interviews also.

yes it doesn't have RT because Ryan didn't mentions it but later he says that they will share more features about ps5 in coming months by then ps5 probably have RT by that time if he mentions it because Cerny mentioning is not enough for you,
it's hard to tell that you're trolling? or really have flawed logic?

So, long story short, I see one side projecting confidence whereas I see the other being evasive on the issue. Maybe I'm wrong, and I will gladly eat crow. But I'm going to need to see it in a released title to believe it.

key word: I see, next time send email to sony and ask that they will talk about what you want them to make a list or something.

And, make no mistake, just because I believe Xbox really has it, doesn't mean that they, too, don't need to prove it from where I'm sitting. Both need to prove they have the real deal, or they shouldn't claim that they do. That's how I see it. So hopefully that's a complete enough answer on my thought process. It'll be the last time I address it, though, till we get more verifiable information on both consoles, but Sony have not portrayed the same degree of confidence where ray tracing is concerned. If we are being honest, there has been a clear difference between how the two sides have been marketing the feature.

here i can prove it:

Spoiler: 1 proof

https://www.wired.com/story/exclusive-playstation-5/

Cerny wants to clarify something. When we last discussed the forthcoming console, he spoke about its ability to support ray-tracing, a technique that can enable complex lighting and sound effects in 3D environments. Given the many questions he’s received since, he fears he may have been ambiguous about how the PS5 would accomplish this—and confirms that it’s not a software-level fix, which some had feared. “There is ray-tracing acceleration in the GPU hardware,” he says, “which I believe is the statement that people were looking for

Spoiler: 2 proof

Spoiler: 3 proof

Spoiler: 4 proof

Xbox Series X specs - what's inside the next-generation console?

This is why Microsoft believes that Xbox Series X specs will deliver the "most immersive console experience ever"

www.gamesradar.com

If that wasn't enough, Xbox Series X will also have support for variable refresh rate and real-time ray tracing. While AMD is yet to properly detail its ray-tracing solution, Microsoft has made it clear that ray tracing is a priority and that it is "hardware accelerated" by the custom AMD chipset.

 

[Mass Shift]

Then premium players will become PC elitist users, paying top for a machine that can never reach its potential for the sake of accessibility.

Premium players becoming PC elitists? Nahhh. Premium consoles would still be the better value for console gamers. And I'm not just talking about cost, there's existing libraries, family room/media room situations and friends lists they would always consider.

Overwhelmingly PC gamers are playing on laptops, not desktops at all. So I now view the PC gaming community by majority a mobile one.

Things shifted in the industry, but none of the dire predictions lined up. PC gaming didn't die, it experienced a mobile renaissance. Consoles didn't die, and are now looking alot more like the desktops they were supposed to replace.

 

[Neo Blaster]

That has always been the case as a PC gamer. They always have the best quality, and will never reach the full potential of their system.

Then what's the point in getting Series X? The hardcore can always pick a top PC, the casuals can get a One S and even you don't want to spend on hardware, you can grab XCloud. That makes all this 12TF bragging irrelevant.

 

[Shmunter]

Definitely true, but that's not what Microsoft wants. They don't want every possible gamer in the world to buy their one and only console. They want gamers to have choice, and play on the device of their choosing without needing to put down $500 at launch. Obviously they want that those people play on their platform, but it doesn't have to be Xbox Series X. It can be PC, Xbox One S/X, or Xcloud too.

Is this a bad thing? For hardcore gamers that only want to play the newest and customised for 1 console games, sure. But for the rest of the population it's actually a good thing.

Sort of like Ford Vs Ferrari

 

[ruvikx]

Then what's the point in getting Series X? The hardcore can always pick a top PC, the casuals can get a One S and even you don't want to spend on hardware, you can grab XCloud. That makes all this 12TF bragging irrelevant.

Because third party games (Assassin's Creed, Destiny, Fifa, GTA etc.) will be as per usual next gen titles. A console isn't only about exclusives. Just look at the top sales charts.

 

[Roronoa Zoro]

Definitely true, but that's not what Microsoft wants. They don't want every possible gamer in the world to buy their one and only console. They want gamers to have choice, and play on the device of their choosing without needing to put down $500 at launch. Obviously they want that those people play on their platform, but it doesn't have to be Xbox Series X. It can be PC, Xbox One S/X, or Xcloud too.

Is this a bad thing? For hardcore gamers that only want to play the newest and customised for 1 console games, sure. But for the rest of the population it's actually a good thing.

It holds back everyone including PC because the baseline will never move up now. PC sees a large bump in scope when old gens are abandoned too. If you just never abandon the old gen that can't happen. The value proposition of consoles is amazing and if you don't buy at launch there'll be more games at a lower price when you do buy.

 

[Deleted member 775630]

Are you seriously telling me both approaches are as good as each other?

Depends on what you care about and what your needs are. Microsoft's approach is better for most gamers, Sony's approach is better for hardcore gamers that only want customised experiences for their console. Also I would like to point out that I'm just explaining why Microsoft is doing something, I myself am not even sure which console I'm going to buy.

Then what's the point in getting Series X? The hardcore can always pick a top PC, the casuals can get a One S and even you don't want to spend on hardware, you can grab XCloud. That makes all this 12TF bragging irrelevant.

Because not everyone likes a PC... I don't want a PC to game on. I don't want Windows, all those useless extra stuff on it that's not needed, I don't want to get notifications for virus scanners, updates or a activity monitor. I want plug&play.

It holds back everyone including PC because the baseline will never move up now. PC sees a large bump in scope when old gens are abandoned too. If you just never abandon the old gen that can't happen. The value proposition of consoles is amazing and if you don't buy at launch there'll be more games at a lower price when you do buy.

That's not true at all. They are just developing games for Xbox One for 1-2 years...

 

[Neofire]

Microsoft has deep pockets, Nintendo or Sony wouldn't be able to keep taking losses by sinking money into the R&D of new consoles with different variations, fragmenting the player base, because not every game is cross platform with the pc version, only to barely sell 40 million units.

You can see that in their financial reports.

 

[CyberPanda]

Because third party games (Assassin's Creed, Destiny, Fifa, GTA etc.) will be as per usual next gen titles. A console isn't only about exclusives. Just look at the top sales charts.

Yep

 

[Mr. PlayStation]

Would you all be surprised if you found out that PS5 has RTX 2080 performance along with a special camera(Sold separately) that uses a tech to recognize your emotions and help improve your overall experience with a game?

 

[Sussoloc]

Would you all be surprised if you found out that PS5 has RTX 2080 performance along with a special camera(Sold separately) that uses a tech to recognize your emotions and help improve your overall experience with a game?

After the Kinect disaster that would totally surpirse me.

 

[pasterpl]

They are not “solving” a constraints by buying some studios up anymore than they solved Xbox One problems by asking people to buy the speeded up Xbox One S and then asking them to buy the even faster Xbox One X. You do not get to create the problem and be greeted as liberator for selling the cure .

Seriously though, creating the best device does not mean much when they say they do not care about devices at all and consoles technically are always bested by PC’s.

They are trying to argue both for al software being multiplatform software as well as exclusive to their devices as far as consoles are concerned. Which is confusing.
Either start publishing Halo Infinite on Switch, iPhone, and PlayStation or stop saying you do not care about which device people use.

MS is believable when they say that about Office 365 as it is available on Windows, macOS, iOS, and Android.

xCloud is MS way of allowing people to play their games across all devices

 

[hemo memo]

Because third party games (Assassin's Creed, Destiny, Fifa, GTA etc.) will be as per usual next gen titles. A console isn't only about exclusives. Just look at the top sales charts.

Now filter by platform...

What really differentiate one console over the other especially with both getting very similar in what they offer other than game exclusives? Isn’t that why Microsoft is investing in new studios?

 

[JAMMA]

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