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[Dr Bass]

even RC works perfectly on 'slow' ssd, pretty much proves my hypothesis about the ssd i/o hype that never really was.

going from hdd to nvme is a huge jump and that's that

big numbers big multiplier, but the real bottleneck is not IO for next gen games

Head in the sand as usual. You don't have a "hypothesis", you just don't seem willing to understand the basics of the technology.

It's been said over and over again, it's not the SSD speed itself in the PS5 that is the game changer, it's the IO/decompression path. And if you've actually played R&C, it's impossible to deny.

I really wonder how many years this discussion will persist with people either refusing to understand or purposefully misrepresenting what the PS5 is actually doing in this area.

 

[FranXico]

Lets see what DF have to say with a more in-depth and conclusive test.

They'll just repeat the same thing. What are you expecting them to say?

 

[K.N.W.]

I think everybody is missing a small detail: The second drive only has to read the game, whatever access the PS5 OS needs it's still happening in the internal drive, leveraging the other one from that duty, that could be the reason why some games are even faster. I would add that developers probably can't access the full PS5 SSD speed, otherwise the machine might stall and stutter, but even if they do, moving games playback to an external drive would still help. Morover, you don't need the whole of the 6 priorities, if your drive isn't reading also the OS. On the top of that we could add that Ratchet started development before PS5 specs were finalized, so it probably was never built to use the whole bandwidth to begin with. Last but not least, any M.2 installed on a PS5 still uses the PS5 I/O, which was purposely designed to help load games faster. But, anyway, I'm not sure future games would still work flawlessly on slower drives.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

The article just says current games work with a slower cheaper drive.

I didnt read anywhere them saying Sony is lying about required speeds.

I didnt read anywhere them saying these cheaper drives will last you through all future games (because no one knows that)

A lot of people getting worked up over nothing, in fact I think games only possible on PS5 like R&C working on these cheap drives right now is great news.

We will find out soon enough when others start doing more in depth tests what works and what doesn't.

Just wow people chill out

As a PS5 owner I think these early results are nice and exactly what beta testing is for.

 

[Bernd Lauert]

Good thing he corrected himself in the next tweet, probably because others shit on him for it:
"so it's .1Ghz faster or slower than PS5"


And CPU is all that matters, too?

He seemed happy that the cheap console spared no expense with the CPU. Does this make him a paid Microsoft shill who wants to hurt Sony?

 

[Mr Moose]

He seemed happy that the cheap console spared no expense with the CPU. Does this make him a paid Microsoft shill who wants to hurt Sony?

Maybe an unpaid shill lol. My memory is dog shit but I am sure you can find a lot of fanboy nonsense on his Twitter.

 

[GHG]

They'll just repeat the same thing. What are you expecting them to say?

I'd expect an outlet of their integrity to test more than just the load times considering they have a better understanding of when the SSD gets hammered during gameplay in games like Rift apart and even Demons Souls.

 

[Spukc]

Anyway how can you even trust the site where Tom Warren writes?

The guy has been basically on Microsoft payroll for more than a year, leaking Series S and more

It's clear why he wants you to think that PS5 fast SSD is useless...

JESUS dude get a grip of yourself

 

[Bernd Lauert]

I'd expect an outlet of their integrity to test more than just the load times considering they have a better understanding of when the SSD gets hammered during gameplay in games like Rift apart and even Demons Souls.

They also tested streaming and said they don't see any real difference. Hard numbers would be better, obviously.

 

[omegasc]

Rest mode is completely borked for me on any games installed on the Samsung 980 ..not sure if it’s the beta firmware or not

I

Is there a way to report this issue?

 

[FranXico]

A lot of people getting worked up over nothing, in fact I think games only possible on PS5 like R&C working on these cheap drives right now is great news.

You know as well as I do that if the barrier of entry for storage expansion was revealed to be lower than expected for another console manufacturer, certain people would be praising them for being so "pro-consumer".

But narratives are mandated

 

[Hendrick's]

Head in the sand as usual. You don't have a "hypothesis", you just don't seem willing to understand the basics of the technology.

It's been said over and over again, it's not the SSD speed itself in the PS5 that is the game changer, it's the IO/decompression path. And if you've actually played R&C, it's impossible to deny.

I really wonder how many years this discussion will persist with people either refusing to understand or purposefully misrepresenting what the PS5 is actually doing in this area.

So why did they put such a fast drive in the system if it was going to be used at half it's speed potential? Sounds like you are damage controlling very hard.

 

[FranXico]

I'd expect an outlet of their integrity to test more than just the load times considering they have a better understanding of when the SSD gets hammered during gameplay in games like Rift apart and even Demons Souls.

I cherish your optimism, but unfortunately do not share it.

 

[GHG]

They also tested streaming and said they don't see any real difference. Hard numbers would be better, obviously.

They said they don't see a difference but Insomniac said there is a difference:

The PS5 worked fine with the slowest compatible SSD we could find

Editors of The Verge tried to test slowest possible NVMe SSD drive in PS5 which was ADATA XPG Gammix S50 Lite with read speeds 3900MB/s and there was no difference in load times in PS5 exclusives like Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart That’s why we tracked down an vg[p]22372194[t]w[r]t.co[d]D']ADATA...

www.neogaf.com

I cherish your optimism, but unfortunately do not share it.

Well if DF wont do their job properly then someone else will.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

You know as well as I do that if the barrier of entry for storage expansion was revealed to be lower than expected for another console manufacturer, certain people would be praising them for being so "pro-consumer".

But narratives are mandated

Yeah there probably is an underlying narrative here but proving cheaper drives work (as of right now) seems to be a win for consumers.

I am sure more people will be testing soon and we will get more data to support either way.

 

[Rocco Schiavone]

They'll just repeat the same thing. What are you expecting them to say?

But but It's digital foundry.

 

[reksveks]

They'll just repeat the same thing. What are you expecting them to say?

If they are able to do record the portal section, we might get a slightly better idea on how taxing that section is.

 

[Mr Moose]

If they are able to do record the portal section, we might get a slightly better idea on how taxing that section is.

I wanna see this on the slower drive:

 

[Andodalf]

It's all relative. Even this 3900mb/s ssd is still 60% higher read speed than the 2400mb/s ssd in the Xbox Series consoles. In terms of consoles you could still call it "Ultra Fast". With a 2400mb/s drive maybe it would crap out.

Source? I mean a week ago someone would have called for you to be banned if you said the slowest PCIE Gen 4 SSD would work just fine.


If there's no difference between their internal and that, whos to say the floor isn't much, much lower?

 

[Hendrick's]

A lot of people getting worked up over nothing, in fact I think games only possible on PS5 like R&C working on these cheap drives right now is great news.

You actually believe that?

 

[Holammer]

Looking forward to more people like DF testing this. The amount of shit I got in another thread for pointing out nobody would develop a game to balance on a razor's edge and how they design to hide streaming was something else.

 

[K' Dash]

Of course. It's just a 5.5GB/s drive. There were faster drives on the market since last year. It's the entire I/O complex that allows the PS5 to hit a real-world benchmark of 17GB/s with compression.

With your level of literacy, I think you're the twelve-year-old here, buddy-pal.

see folks? this is what happens when women take drugs and alcohol during pregnancy, later in life kids like these can see their IQ on the face of a clock.

Sorry you're unimpressed by my literacy, that happens sometimes when you speak multiple languages, but I wouldn't expect you to understand that. Please carry on with your stupidity, it's really entertaining.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

Editors of The Verge tried to test slowest possible NVMe SSD drive in PS5 which was ADATA XPG Gammix S50 Lite with read speeds 3900MB/s and there was no difference in load times in PS5 exclusives like Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart



https://www.theverge.com/2021/8/4/22608153/ps5-ssd-speed-test-storage-expansion-m2-playstation-5

Update, August 4th 7:25AM ET: Article updated to note Xbox Series X sustained SSD performance data.

Sponsored article, using useless data as always.

 

[Mr Moose]

Source? I mean a week ago someone would have called for you to be banned if you said the slowest PCIE Gen 4 SSD would work just fine.


If there's no difference between their internal and that, whos to say the floor isn't much, much lower?

Might as well just use an external SSD, beaten by a ~500MB/s drive! Fucking Sony, the lying bastards.

 

[M1chl]

((concern))

 

[Gameplaylover]

I'm a complete tech noob, but doesn't that also mean there won't be any "secret sauce" games completely built around that system SSD? I mean after the announcement GAF and Sony were like "SSD, SSD, SSD", even more than Microsoft's "tv, tv, tv".

 

[ZywyPL]

Right now, nothing is doing this to any significant extent. Not R&C, not Returnal. It will take years, particularly due to the protraction of cross-gen. But when it happens a 3GB/s SSD - assuming it is not blacklisted by the system software - will render your game unplayable due to hitching and texture pop-in.

The question is if such apeed will ever be required? Like, how much better textures do you really need than those in R&C or DS remaster already? How much more details can the GPU render, given it already does 30FPS at 4K, and has to go down to QHD to achieve 60? Big chances are, such speeds will never be truly required during PS5 entire lifespan, simply because it doesn't have the computing power to bac up such amount of streamed data.

 

[MisterXDTV]

Update, August 4th 7:25AM ET: Article updated to note Xbox Series X sustained SSD performance data.

Sponsored article, using useless data as always.

SUSTAINED has been the word for TheVerge for about a year...

Last year was GPU clocks, now SSD read speeds

 

[Md Ray]

Lets see what DF have to say with a more in-depth and conclusive test.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

You actually believe that?

Nope as a PS5 owner I was being sarcastic

 

[3liteDragon]

Ratchet's definitely pulling GB's of data per second off the drive when you're entering a new world through a portal, but I don't think it's anywhere near 5.5GB/s, probably around 2 or 3GB/s when you're using the portals. The big thing with this game is the fact that it isn't even utilizing the GE and the Primitive Shaders feature (which I think is the most game-changing feature these consoles have next to the CPU) where the I/O architecture and SSD are gonna play big roles, because you're gonna be constantly culling & drawing triangles on a per-frame basis in future games like how it was shown with the first UE5 demo, which Rift Apart isn't even doing.

Which is why I think it's fuckin' hilarious people think drives with speeds below 5GB/s are gonna be enough when the second wave of PS5-only games start comin' out. Lots of self-proclaimed engineers here claiming Sony went overkill with the I/O setup and that it won't help improve graphics performance lol, we'll see if Sony wasted all that R&D money on the SSD and I/O setup when the games are shown off and how they stack up next to the competitor's first-party titles.

 

[squarealex]

still fastests than the Series (Thanks I/O decompressor)

We re-talk on 5 years for the same SSD. Recommanded not means "Minimal"... same word for PC Specs config...

 

[Jigsaah]

Why the fuck are you even bringing XBOX to the table when no one asked? Holy hell, don't you got some Halo beta to be fawning over, clown? Let me guess, did that turn out to not meet your expectations, as usual? Fucking hell.


Unless you believed initially that the I/O complex could literally wipe the Cheetos dust off of your dick and proceed to subsequently fellate you, then this is patently untrue. ALL native first-party games have literally 1-2 second loading times, which is an authentic delivery on all marketing slogans pertaining to the SSD, so what are you blabbering about? Hell, most third-party native apps are on that level of loading speed now, and it's only the start of the generation where most game engines aren't even optimized for next-gen data management. The fact that you have to literally delude yourself on some Scientology shit just to downplay the overt data streaming advantage that PS5 has over every consumer gaming system is, honestly, laughable.


"Oh, let me position myself as a PC owner so I can convince both the moderators and others that I come from a station of impartiality and I'm not just some falseflagging tribalist trying to sow discord in a neutral thread! Ingenious!"

It's not working.


Blah, blah, blah, don't care about your high-roading codswallop when you're literally trolling yourself and you know it. Bake off or put forth actual evidence for your claims, clown.

Inb4take2

Your passionate defense of Sony is maybe a bit overzealous bro. You should maybe tone it down a bit. By "maybe" I mean definitely and immediately.

 

[MasterCornholio]

Has anyone else been able to observe this?

And even still 15% isnt much. Instead of something loading in 1 second it would load in 1.15 seconds.

And why would that discredit the developer?

Also your asking me if the Verge was able to observe this. I'm guessing not because they don't have the expertise that other developers and tech analysts do.

If super slow SSDs have a negative impact it will be revealed to us. Im pretty sure what Mike says is true and while you can install a slower SSD you can't go so low that it has a big impact on performance.

 

[FranXico]

And why would that discredit the developer?

Also your asking me if the Verge was able to observe this. I'm guessing not because they don't have the expertise that other developers and tech analysts do.

If super slow SSDs have a negative impact it will be revealed to us. Im pretty sure what Mike says is true and while you can install a slower SSD you can't go so low that it has a big impact on performance.

Insomniac devs probably used their own tools to measure that data streaming 15% slowdown estimate. I don't think asset streaming speed is something anyone can measure with a stopwatch.

 

[MasterCornholio]

Insomniac devs probably used their own tools to measure that data streaming 15% slowdown estimate. I don't think asset streaming speed is something anyone can measure with a stopwatch.

It's also why some of these tests that people do don't reveal everything.

I think what's not true is that slower SSDs perform the same as the PS5s. Essentially a drive rated for 2GB/s (for example) isn't going to perform the same as one rated for 5.5GB/s.

While you can buy a slower drive then the PS5s it won't perform the same as it. That's something people have to think about when they expand the storage. It's also why I'm aiming for a drive that's on par with the PS5s because I want a guarantee of having the same experience.

 

[Jigsaah]

I just see this whole thing as a big nothing burger.

If currently released games play just fine on slower SSDs then fine. This says nothing about future games though. It could be the case that once Sony's first party studios get advanced enough with their development, the requirements for the SSD could start to match what the specs of the internal storage is.

Right now just take it as a win that you can buy an SSD and have that extra storage because right now PS5's lack of storage space is a much bigger problem for the avid gamer.

I think once Sony get's past the cross-gen era, the games that come out will really push the system and those cheap SSDs you're buying now probably will not make the cut. Meaning you'll need to buy a new SSD.

Hopefully by that time the tech will advance enough to lower the prices of those new SSDs we will need to purchase.

 

[IntentionalPun]

Insomniac devs probably used their own tools to measure that data streaming 15% slowdown estimate. I don't think asset streaming speed is something anyone can measure with a stopwatch.

It wouldn't make sense for them to be talking about anything but actual load times.. as the slower SSD would always be loading data slower, all the time.. not only in SSD-stressed areas.

So it caused a 15% worse load time likely through one of the loading portals. Other loading is not I/O limited, so the load times weren't as different (or different at all.)

 

[Topher]

That's creepy

 

[kingkaiser]

I have both consoles sitting next to each other, so I don’t really care about the pathetic war going on,
but I gotta say that this whole “lightning fast” SSD rhetoric always reminded me of the “power of the cloud ®”
nonsense back in the day. And now it seems to be almost as good as confirmed being the same bullshit MS pulled off last gen.

 

[Dusktildawn48]

Kinda off topic, but the 980 pro 500gb is $100 at microcenter, is that a solid deal?

 

[MasterCornholio]

There goes Alex looking for his ray traced reflections in his cup.

 

[MasterCornholio]

Kinda off topic, but the 980 pro 500gb is $100 at microcenter, is that a solid deal?

Seems about the same as other 500GB drives. I've seen that particular one for 120$.

 

[Dusktildawn48]

Seems about the same as other 500GB drives. I've seen that particular one for 120$.

Well yeah, but it seems to be one of the more recommended ssds for the ps5. I think the lowest it's ever been was $96 on Newegg.

 

[MasterCornholio]

Well yeah, but it seems to be one of the more recommended ssds for the ps5. I think the lowest it's ever been was $96 on Newegg.

I think I've seen one for 80$ but I don't think it's a good choice.

 

[Dusktildawn48]

I think I've seen one for 80$ but I don't think it's a good choice.

You probably know more than me, why do you think it's not a good choice?

 

[MasterCornholio]

You probably know more than me, why do you think it's not a good choice?

I've seen some people say the Sabrant Rocket has a pretty weird warranty. I'm not familiar with the quality of the drives but weird warranties always make me nervous about product.

Edit: From my experience I never had any issues with Samsung drives.

 

[Dusktildawn48]

I've seen some people say the Sabrant Rocket has a pretty weird warranty. I'm not familiar with the quality of the drives but weird warranties always make me nervous about product.

Wait, I'm talking about the Samsung 980 pro.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

I have both consoles sitting next to each other, so I don’t really care about the pathetic war going on,
but I gotta say that this whole “lightning fast” SSD rhetoric always reminded me of the “power of the cloud ®”
nonsense back in the day. And now it seems to be almost as good as confirmed being the same bullshit MS pulled off last gen.

I hate the constant war all the way from the top of certain companies to some so called media types to fighting on forums.

I have just never understood the need to defend a plastic box you purchased and constantly put down others because they didnt purchase the box you bought (not you personally)

And I know I am slow sometimes and every now and then people have to paint me a picture but for the life of me I dont see this article showing current games, especially R&C loading just as fast as drives costing 2 and 3 times as much as an attack on Sony.

Maybe in the future we MIGHT need those faster speeds.

I hope we get someone testing these slower drives side by side of worlds loading on R&C and put this to bed one way or another

 

[MasterCornholio]

Wait, I'm talking about the Samsung 980 pro.

Samsungs are pretty reliable. I never had an issue with any Samsung drive before.