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[kingfey]

That stat doesn't indicate profit, but it really doesn't matter at this point. The current strategy for Game Pass is growth, not profit. That's my opinion, but it makes sense. Similarly, Netflix wasn't profitable for quite some time as the were growing its subscription base.

Growth doesnt bring profit, since everything goes back to the service. Like you said, current strategy for gamepass, is to grow it, so it can reach a point, where it can bring more money.
Until the sub reaches around 50m, it would be hard to bring actual profit, since the demand is getting bigger. And you have to invest in, to exceed those demand.
Current games wont work, when the sub reaches 40m. You are getting alot of people, who have different tastes. You have to satisfy those people, or else they will leave the service.

 

[remember_spinal]

"It's still a small slice of overall gaming".

Yeah, subs haven't exactly taken the world by storm. Game Pass has an easier entry point as there were already millions paying for Xbox Live Gold and the promotions to nudge them towards GP have been significant, but just in terms of Xbox owners less than half are subscribed. I think subscriptions are going to be a slow burn for the industry.

Thats not even taking into account other platforms gamepass is offered on like PC, where they have over 200m users.

So for the amount of people gamepass is available to only a fraction have bought into the “eco system” after 4+ years.

 

[remember_spinal]

It is absolutely being done to compete with Game Pass. What will be interesting to see is if Sony starts rolling all of their "subscription" numbers into a single service name to pump up the numbers instead of separating out PS+ and PSNow numbers.

Thats not interesting thats a given. That is 100% what this is about, there will be no more PSNow after next week. They already phased out retail cards for it months ago and the service doesn’t even appear for download right now

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

With the imminent announcement of PlayStation Spartacus will it stop Game Pass dominance?

That's great and all, but it's not like GamePass itself is a massive revenue earner on its own. It's probably around $2 billion/year of revenue realistically. It can be argued other competitors have way smaller shares because they've yet to actually try competing in the space seriously, given its current size (in terms of revenue compared to the rest of the gaming market).

Still though it is a lead, and a sizable one. That gives Microsoft a unique advantage.

 

[adamsapple]

Thats not even taking into account other platforms gamepass is offered on like PC, where they have over 200m users.

So for the amount of people gamepass is available to only a fraction have bought into the “eco system” after 4+ years.

lol is this post for real ?

 

[El Pistolero]

Netflix is a shitty service mostly.

 

[ZehDon]

That's great and all, but it's not like GamePass itself is a massive revenue earner on its own. It's probably around $2 billion/year of revenue realistically. It can be argued other competitors have way smaller shares because they've yet to actually try competing in the space seriously, given its current size (in terms of revenue compared to the rest of the gaming market).

Still though it is a lead, and a sizable one. That gives Microsoft a unique advantage.

That's both a fair observation, and an interesting consideration. Microsoft has gone all in on Game Pass, whereas everyone else isn't. It makes sense they're dominating the space because, frankly, they're the only folks trying to.

With that said, I think Microsoft is positioning itself with a level of foresight we haven't seen since the original Xbox Live launched. I believe they're ahead of everyone in understanding a shift in consumer spending that's only just beginning. When video game subscriptions rule the landscape the same way video streaming does today, Microsoft will be so deeply entrenched, with so much content, across so many platforms, that "Game Pass" will be synonymous with game streaming and competing with them in that space will be all but impossible. We're already phrasing things as "Sony's Game Pass" because Microsoft own the space they're carving out. If - and it's a big if - they can get Game Pass to be profitable, I don't see how things ever go back.

 

[fallingdove]

You dont own games at all. You own the key that is on the disc.
Also, no one here wants to give up owning games.

The only reason I am interested in gamepass, because it allows you to buy your games. The moment they stop that, and I will be adios. I am out here.

Except I do own my games. I don’t need to pay monthly in order to play them. I also don’t need to pay a monthly fee to demo a game only to have to buy it later.

 

[kingfey]

Except I do own my games. I don’t need to pay monthly in order to play them. I also don’t need to pay a monthly fee to demo a game only to have to buy it later.

Once your disc gets broken or scratched, your ownership is gone. Same for your digital product.
What you have is time limit product.

 

[fallingdove]

Says "You're disconnected from reality".

A couple mins later says "Gamepass users like losing ownership, or just Infinitely play average games".

Pot meet kettle.

How is my comment disconnected from reality oh genius of geniuses? — The part about how the GamePass subscription absolves ownership or that GamePass is full of average games?

Also - nice stealth edit of my original comment.

 

[kingfey]

Thats not even taking into account other platforms gamepass is offered on like PC, where they have over 200m users.

So for the amount of people gamepass is available to only a fraction have bought into the “eco system” after 4+ years.

And has potential to be bigger.
Netflix started its streaming in 2007. And look where they are now. it took them 15 years to reach where they are now.
gamepass started in 2017 on consoles. In 2019, they brought it to PC.
The only problem with PC, is the garbage windows store, which hindred gamepass growth.
That should change with their new windows store updates.

Also, Call of duty would make that service go UP to the sky. Especially gamepass PC.

 

[Dr. Claus]

GamePass is fine, but why do I get the feeling the people who keep bringing it up are the same handful of console warriors? If this were any other publisher’s/console manufacturer’s product, I guarantee you we would see not even a fraction of these folks talking it up.

 

[remember_spinal]

And has potential to be bigger.
Netflix started its streaming in 2007. And look where they are now. it took them 15 years to reach where they are now.
gamepass started in 2017 on consoles. In 2019, they brought it to PC.
The only problem with PC, is the garbage windows store, which hindred gamepass growth.
That should change with their new windows store updates.

Also, Call of duty would make that service go UP to the sky. Especially gamepass PC.

I dont think CoD is gonna be the nuclear warhead for leverage people think its gonna be. Microsoft are already making huge concessions to push this deal through

 

[kingfey]

I dont think CoD is gonna be the nuclear warhead for leverage people think its gonna be. Microsoft are already making huge concessions to push this deal through

Its not about the exclusivity that matters. The idea of All of activision/Blizzard games being available to gamepass, and all future games as day1 is big for pc gamers.
Most of them will flock to gamepass to play them.
Call of duty games are still expensive to this day.

This is how expensive those games are on steam. A 2012 call of duty game.

 

[R3claimer117]

That's great and all, but it's not like GamePass itself is a massive revenue earner on its own. It's probably around $2 billion/year of revenue realistically. It can be argued other competitors have way smaller shares because they've yet to actually try competing in the space seriously, given its current size (in terms of revenue compared to the rest of the gaming market).

Still though it is a lead, and a sizable one. That gives Microsoft a unique advantage.

Take your fanboy glasses off and stop pulling numbers out your ass.

 

[Dr. Claus]

Take your fanboy glasses off and stop pulling numbers out your ass.

…says the person named R3claimer117, two blatant references to Halo and whose post history is mostly defending a particular plastic box owned by Microsoft.

 

[Topher]

lol is this post for real ?

What's wrong with what he said? Seems pretty obvious that the subscription rate is primarily concentrated in Xbox consoles and GP is largely ignored on PC.

 

[Swift_Star]

Its not about the exclusivity that matters. The idea of All of activision/Blizzard games being available to gamepass, and all future games as day1 is big for pc gamers.
Most of them will flock to gamepass to play them.
Call of duty games are still expensive to this day.

This is how expensive those games are on steam. A 2012 call of duty game.

Nah I don’t think this will happen…

 

[kingfey]

Nah I don’t think this will happen…

You are underestimating PC gamers.
We will go to extreme length, just to save money.

 

[Swift_Star]

You are underestimating PC gamers.
We will go to extreme length, just to save money.

Nah. Forum people say they do this. Most people aren’t forum people and they don’t do this. Stop thinking gaf or era are the mainstream.

 

[kingfey]

GP is largely ignored on PC.

You know the reason right?

 

[Topher]

You know the reason right?

Yeah.....Microsoft can only offer games that actually exist in their store and the Windows store sucks. Well that.....and Steam still owns PC gaming.

 

[kingfey]

Windows store sucks

This is it. We know steam is king on pc. But this is primary reason, why pc gamepass is shit.

I am still pissed off about the ghost files from forza horizon 4 and gears 5.

 

[Topher]

This is it. We know steam is king on pc. But this is primary reason, why pc gamepass is shit.

I am still pissed off about the ghost files from forza horizon 4 and gears 5.

It is definitely hindering Game Pass' growth. So yeah, remember_spinal wasn't wrong. Only a fraction of those who can get GP right now want GP. Microsoft has a long way to go on the PC end. But I imagine a lot of their focus will be to try and bridge that gap with xCloud in the coming years.

 

[Chukhopops]

So GP has over 9 times the dollar spend of PSNow and only around 7 times the subscriber count.

Could it be that not everyone is on the $1 deal then? That would be quite a shock to some people…

 

[Swift_Star]

It is definitely hindering Game Pass' growth. So yeah, remember_spinal wasn't wrong. Only a fraction of those who can get GP right now want GP. Microsoft has a long way to go on the PC end. But I imagine a lot of their focus will be to try and bridge that gap with xCloud in the coming years.

Microsoft was stupid to let steam have a
Grip on pc gaming. I can’t understand why they didn’t pursue this before investing on Xbox. They’re so shortsighted it’s pathetic. They had everything in place and still lost.

 

[MScarpa]

That is forced subscription. Not actual subscription.

Alex has been saying the same stuff for a long time. Just ignore him. He makes ZERO sense.

 

[Fredrik]

GamePass is fine, but why do I get the feeling the people who keep bringing it up are the same handful of console warriors? If this were any other publisher’s/console manufacturer’s product, I guarantee you we would see not even a fraction of these folks talking it up.

And I get the feeling that the folks who constantly talk it down wouldn’t do so if the service existed on all platforms. It’s not like you see TV show fans complain about Netflix and saying they prefer to buy TV show boxes.

In the end you simply get more games for less money. I’m closing in on 1.5 years without spending a cent on games on Xbox. Why wouldn’t I like that?

 

[Vognerful]

Watch it! Next week we are going to see people way happier that there are more people subscribed to Spartacus, even though it offers shittier service.

 

[kingfey]

Nah. Forum people say they do this. Most people aren’t forum people and they don’t do this. Stop thinking gaf or era are the mainstream.

I was normie, before forum, and I am still am that person.
Most of us pc gamers play f2p games. We usually subscribe to EA play or Uplay+ to play their games, instead of paying them $60 for their games. We cancel the service, when we don't need to.

Worked out alot.

Then I managed to get xbox one, and got ps4, found this website, and the rest is history.

 

[remember_spinal]

Watch it! Next week we are going to see people way happier that there are more people subscribed to Spartacus, even though it offers shittier service.

It wouldnt’ really be “shittier” because it doesn’t have day one sony games.

If that were the criteria both services would be almost even considering microsoft only has two first party games scheduled to release this entire year.

If thte value is in the first party output what the hell kind of value has the service offered the last two years? 4 games?

 

[kingfey]

Microsoft was stupid to let steam have a
Grip on pc gaming. I can’t understand why they didn’t pursue this before investing on Xbox. They’re so shortsighted it’s pathetic. They had everything in place and still lost.

They are stupid, that is why.

MS is still a corporate. Phil spencer might have changed the xbox image, and made MS little bit friendly, but they are still a corporate.

I dont trust them to make a proper decision. This windows store revamp is still Phil spencer Idea. These dumb heads, let that store rot for years.

 

[Dr. Claus]

And I get the feeling that the folks who constantly talk it down wouldn’t do so if the service existed on all platforms. It’s not like you see TV show fans complain about Netflix and saying they prefer to buy TV show boxes.

In the end you simply get more games for less money. I’m closing in on 1.5 years without spending a cent on games on Xbox. Why wouldn’t I like that?

Oh, the people who talk it down are *absolutely* doing that for the same reason. It is ultimately all console warrior retardation. The service is a success by any metric. The people constantly trying to prop it up and the people constantly trying to tear it down need to shut the fuck up and move on with their lives instead of inundating the forums trying desperately to prove to each other in their dickless battles of who has the least brain cells.

Its a great option for those who want it, but personally I only ever use it as a demo service and buy games if I enjoyed them on Game Pass. I will always prefer physical to rentals, which is all Game Pass/Digital is.

 

[kingfey]

It wouldnt’ really be “shittier” because it doesn’t have day one sony games.

If that were the criteria both services would be almost even considering microsoft only has two first party games scheduled to release this entire year.

If thte value is in the first party output what the hell kind of value has the service offered the last two years? 4 games?

Have you checked gamepass?

MS has diversity of games, which is why their service is successful.

People want to
A: Buy their games.
Bdiversity of games (all kind of genre)
C: Download option.
D: Iconic game (bethesda, EA play, and now Activision-Blizzard's).

MS 1st party isn't enough for the service. Their diversification, the Download option, and the buying option helped make gamepass a successful product.

Also, gamepass contains big hits from 3rd party games.

But the most interesting part, is the 1 year deals. 99% of games stay on the service for 1 year. 1st games are permanent.

That is why they are successful, and psnow failed.

 

[kingfey]

The people constantly trying to prop it up and the people constantly trying to tear it down need to shut the fuck up and move on with their lives instead of inundating the forums trying desperately to prove to each other in their dickless battles of who has the least brain cells.

 

[Topher]

In the end you simply get more games for less money. I’m closing in on 1.5 years without spending a cent on games on Xbox. Why wouldn’t I like that?

Just over a year now with Xbox and all I've invested is my time into MS Rewards. Game Pass and MS Rewards are the reason I own XSX after skipping Xbox entirely last gen.

 

[adamsapple]

What's wrong with what he said? Seems pretty obvious that the subscription rate is primarily concentrated in Xbox consoles and GP is largely ignored on PC.

Well, for starters, the topic is talking about $ spent, not number of subscriptions, so that user bringing in PS Now and PS+ merging to add 50m subscribers is irrelevant in the first place, not that Xbox combines Xbox Gold and Game Pass numbers anyway, so it would be an inaccurate comparison in either case.

Secondly, Game Pass on PC launched in 2019. Which is not that long ago. And saying something like "but PC has xxx million gamers, why aren't they all subscriber to game pass ?" is such a .. for the lack of a better word, dumb, statement. Why is the assumption that all PC gamers must need to subscribe to game pass for it to be considered a worthwhile success ?

Both points are irrelevant and derailing to the topic.

 

[kingfey]

Just over a year now with Xbox and all I've invested is my time into MS Rewards. Game Pass and MS Rewards are the reason I own XSX after skipping Xbox entirely last gen.

For me, it allowed me to own switch, and buy PS 1st party games.
I can now have both worlds, without worrying about my budget.

 

[Topher]

Well, for starters, the topic is talking about $ spent, not number of subscriptions, so that user bringing in PS Now and PS+ merging to add 50m subscribers is irrelevant in the first place, not that Xbox combines Xbox Gold and Game Pass numbers anyway, so it would be an inaccurate comparison in either case.

I wasn't a part of that discussion, but ok....

Secondly, Game Pass on PC launched in 2019. Which is not that long ago. And saying something like "but PC has xxx million gamers, why aren't they all subscriber to game pass ?" is such a .. for the lack of a better word, dumb, statement. Why is the assumption that all PC gamers must need to subscribe to game pass for it to be considered a worthwhile success ?

Both points are irrelevant and derailing to the topic.

Well I guess it would be a "dumb statement" if he had actually said what you quoted, but he didn't. No one said "all PC gamers" must subscribe to Gamer Pass for it to be considered a success at all. I think you simply misread his post. And the tweet makes a comment about the relative size subscriptions are compared to the overall gaming industry. I quoted it directly so talking about that isn't derailing anything.

 

[adamsapple]

No one said "all PC gamers" must subscribe to Gamer Pass for it to be considered a success at all. I think you simply misread his post. And the tweet makes a comment about the relative size subscriptions are compared to the overall gaming industry. I quoted it directly so talking about that isn't derailing anything.

I dunno, when someone says "they have 200 million people on PC", as in 200 million PC gamers, it sounds like they're asking why all 200 million or thereabout aren't subscribed. Which is an absurd statement anyway you look at it.

Anyway, you've already said in your earlier post that the topic is only covering a small slice of gaming, which answers the question of why 200 million people on PC aren't subscribed in itself pretty well.

 

[Topher]

I dunno, when someone says "they have 200 million people on PC", as in 200 million PC gamers, it sounds like they're asking why all 200 million or thereabout aren't subscribed. Which is an absurd statement anyway you look at it.

Anyway, you've already said in your earlier post that the topic is only covering a small slice of gaming, which answers the question of why 200 million people on PC aren't subscribed in itself pretty well.

I didn't read his post that way, but yes that would be an absurd assertion to make. I also acknowledged that the PC side of Game Pass isn't nearly as good as the Xbox side and that is the primary reason that it is so one-sided in favor of Xbox, imo.

 

[BaneIsPain]

Good for microsoft. I don’t care at all if Spartacus fail or not.
What’s matter give us a great single player experience like last gen.

 

[MonarchJT]

Yeah it will increase it by 47m subscribers lol

if they cancel the ps+ ..of course it will
People aren't understanding Sony move. By eliminating psnow and including it in a new tier the same people who would not have wanted psnow will now find themselves paying for it by paying more than the old ps+. If you look at my old posts you will read the same from me .... it was the only way to relaunch and rebrand an absolutely failing service (psnow) exploiting the constraint of having to pay for multiplayer. Another thing would be whether they release their exclusive titles in the service at the highest tier (always depends on the price) but according to rumors I don't believe and it doesn't look like it will
As right now it doesn't sound like a GP rival but just a way for sony to take more money form users slipping into your old subscription a service that no one wanted and was willing to pay

 

[sinnergy]

That’s what you get when you listen to your hardcore fans Sony most people don’t want change .. even though they need it ..

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

That's both a fair observation, and an interesting consideration. Microsoft has gone all in on Game Pass, whereas everyone else isn't. It makes sense they're dominating the space because, frankly, they're the only folks trying to.

With that said, I think Microsoft is positioning itself with a level of foresight we haven't seen since the original Xbox Live launched. I believe they're ahead of everyone in understanding a shift in consumer spending that's only just beginning. When video game subscriptions rule the landscape the same way video streaming does today, Microsoft will be so deeply entrenched, with so much content, across so many platforms, that "Game Pass" will be synonymous with game streaming and competing with them in that space will be all but impossible. We're already phrasing things as "Sony's Game Pass" because Microsoft own the space they're carving out. If - and it's a big if - they can get Game Pass to be profitable, I don't see how things ever go back.

Very optimistic viewpoint; I think it'll mostly hold out as true but a big part of that will come down to the content. If Microsoft can get enough high-quality content consistently and establish that early enough before other competitors really jump into the fold. I don't think they're there yet, but they could start getting there depending on how RedFall and Starfield perform this year (and how well they can maintain momentum for them post-launch. Also if they can recover Halo Infinite in any significant way would help a lot).

One thing for sure though is that Microsoft's sheer size and wealth of money & resources will definitely see them through once others begin competing more strongly in this space. I would almost want to say they invested too much into a future tech too early, except that's only really applicable to a company which otherwise doesn't have the money to weather losses or modest growth for a number of years.

Basically, they aren't SEGA in that regard, and I'd of loved if SEGA had MS money (or even just Sony or Nintendo money) during the Dreamcast era.

I dont think CoD is gonna be the nuclear warhead for leverage people think its gonna be. Microsoft are already making huge concessions to push this deal through

It's not even just that; I honestly don't think the individual CODs will go into GamePass. At least, not new.

It's a business reason IMO. COD sells truckloads on everything at full price every single year; why cut into that for subscription service growth when the annual revenue from that subscription service probably doesn't even bring in near 2x the revenue sales of that game does at full price? They'll definitely put Warzone perks in GP, they'll most likely even offer DLC and Season pack discounts through GP subs, maybe even exclusive skins and weapons, too. The core fans will gravitate towards COD on Xbox and PC because of that.

But the individual releases in GP on Day 1? Don't see it happening. But I'm also one of those guys who feels the ABK acquisition is more a Microsoft move to boost overall revenue, and will have some benefits for GamePass and Xbox. New COD releases in GP Day 1, though, most likely isn't one of those benefits.

Take your fanboy glasses off and stop pulling numbers out your ass.

Man I just can't catch a break. Green rats calling me blue, blue rats calling me green. I'm so confused!!

But seriously tho, what's so asspull about those numbers? You do know not every person subscribed to GP is staying subbed for the whole year, right? That not everyone is paying for GPU or even regular GP? That at least a decent chunk are probably on the $1 conversion plan or doing free trials, or are using MS Rewards points to pay off their subs (or at least some months of it), right?

I don't see where it's so unrealistic to assume they're probably bringing in roughly $2 billion/year in revenue for GP subs. Actual profits from those subs would be lower, probably in-line with their profit margins for Xbox versus their revenues there, so likely $150 million - $250 million/year or something like that (since MS doesn't provide net profits for Xbox, we kind of just have to use PlayStation's revenues and profits as a comparison).

Unless you have some other numbers that prove something else?

 

[Darlingcognito]

No shit, they have no competition.

 

[gametimedecision]

It’s tragic but Microsoft is dumb to not worry about Spartacus, PlayStation fans are the most loyal customers in media…and they take up the majority….they don’t even need to be half as good as gamepass and it will be a massive issue for Microsoft, we shall see, but I honestly feel like next week will change everything for Microsoft even tho it shouldn’t.

 

[reksveks]

Microsoft is dumb to not worry about Spartacus

Who says that they aren't?

 

[Fredrik]

Just over a year now with Xbox and all I've invested is my time into MS Rewards. Game Pass and MS Rewards are the reason I own XSX after skipping Xbox entirely last gen.

Isn’t that a lot of work?

I went with the prepaid trick, 4th year now, if I add it up I’ve paid roughly $5 per month for all GP games on both PC and Xbox plus Xbox Live Gold included. It’s half a pizza at my location, it’s nothing.

The only downside is that my prepayment ends in mid 2024. But who knows maybe there is a new method out by then.

 

[sinnergy]

It’s tragic but Microsoft is dumb to not worry about Spartacus, PlayStation fans are the most loyal customers in media…and they take up the majority….they don’t even need to be half as good as gamepass and it will be a massive issue for Microsoft, we shall see, but I honestly feel like next week will change everything for Microsoft even tho it shouldn’t.

Sony is dumb for not following gamepass after 1 year it was on the market ..