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[kingfey]

Behave. There’s a difference between a one off payment of 40 quid v 120 quid.

As things get pricier, monthly is more manageable, even if you end up paying more for the year.

Or are we meant to be pretending we are all rich gamers with megabucks disposable income?

That is what he trying to do.
People here don't factor the small details. Not to mention his Bragging about he pays it due to rewards. When he clearly spends more time with MS products to achieve that.

Sometimes, common sense is hard to find.

 

[Tams]

They do it because they can. They have a monopoly on the hardware. You have no choice.

They make and sell games because they can. You have no choice.

Well, you could make your own game if you really wanted to.

 

[Topher]

Wow, facts. That a new word coming from you.

Its pointless to argue with you about that at this point.

Well believe what you want.

That is what he trying to do.
People here don't factor the small details. Not to mention his Bragging about he pays it due to rewards. When he clearly spends more time with MS products to achieve that.

Sometimes, common sense is hard to find.

Of course I spend more time with MS products to get MS Rewards points. That's not bragging. That's advocating for an MS product.

Try not being so tribal and you'll figure out that a person doesn't have to be entirely on one side or another.

 

[Swift_Star]

Behave. There’s a difference between a one off payment of 40 quid v 120 quid.

As things get pricier, monthly is more manageable, even if you end up paying more for the year.

Or are we meant to be pretending we are all rich gamers with megabucks disposable income?

why are you all pretending $120 is suddenly an obscene amount of money in a world people buy 2 to 3 games at launch in the same month?
This is bizarre. Specially when thinking this is in dollars. Honestly this makes no sense.

 

[kingfey]

Of course I spend more time with MS products to get MS Rewards points. That's not bragging. That's advocating for an MS product.

Try not being so tribal and you'll figure out that a person doesn't have to be entirely on one side or another.

What tribal are you talking about?

You are the guy, who clearly downplays the 1st party day1 games, which saves money.

I doubt you will see your ignorance there.

 

[Dream-Knife]

They make and sell games because they can. You have no choice.

Well, you could make your own game if you really wanted to.

Like I said earlier, those games don't get the money from your internet tax. Capcom still just gets $60 - 30% for MH Rise, regardless if it was sold on Switch or Steam. Capcom pays for the server through that $42 (minus any retail cut if physical).

They charge what they charge because in 2002 Microsoft sold a $50 kit that included a year of Xbox Live with a period correct wrap around headset. People kept paying to play Halo online. During the 360 it became huge with Halo 3 and COD. Sony, and then Nintendo saw the free money and followed suit. It still doesn't change the fact that you're being fined to use the internet you already pay for.

 

[kingfey]

why are you all pretending $120 is suddenly an obscene amount of money in a world people buy 2 to 3 games at launch in the same month?
This is bizarre. Specially when thinking this is in dollars. Honestly this makes no sense.

Because you are getting worth the money out of these 2 games.

Subscription service, depends on what you want from it. The return investment isn't worth it.

People can tolerate the money for the games, but not 1-3 years upfront money for a subscription service.

Plus 2 games day1 have to be worth it.

Even I won't pay $120 upfront for gamepass. Even for the 3 years.

I won't get my returns, which is a waste of my money.

 

[Swift_Star]

Because you are getting worth the money out of these 2 games.

Subscription service, depends on what you want from it. The return investment isn't worth it.

People can tolerate the money for the games, but not 1-3 years upfront money for a subscription service.

Plus 2 games day1 have to be worth it.

Even I won't pay $120 upfront for gamepass. Even for the 3 years.

I won't get my returns, which is a waste of my money.

Everything you just said makes no sense. $120 is not an obscene amount of money to be paid and most people sign stuff for one year because of the discounts you get for it.

 

[Topher]

What tribal are you talking about?

You are the guy, who clearly downplays the 1st party day1 games, which saves money.

I doubt you will see your ignorance there.

I am not downplaying day one games at all. I flatly said IGN should have broken that aspect out in its graphic as it is an important difference. But that is a different discussion when talking about the differences in the price structures.

 

[kingfey]

Everything you just said makes no sense. $120 is not an obscene amount of money to be paid and most people sign stuff for one year because of the discounts you get for it.

Not everyone will spend $120. Understand that 1st.
Most people are only OK with $60 upfront for online subscriptions. Because they are forced to have these online services, to play online on these systems (You dont pay that on PC).

Discounts only applies, if you are buying games 1st. If you are not buying games, using these services, then you are not benefiting that service.

People can handle $15-$18, because these money is peanut, compared to $120-$180 upfront.

Unless you are a rich person, or have disposal income, $120 is hard for alot of people. That money is 1 month gas money for some people.

Its not feasible.

 

[IntentionalPun]

Not everyone will spend $120. Understand that 1st.
Most people are only OK with $60 upfront for online subscriptions. Because they are forced to have these online services, to play online on these systems (You dont pay that on PC).

Discounts only applies, if you are buying games 1st. If you are not buying games, using these services, then you are not benefiting that service.

People can handle $15-$18, because these money is peanut, compared to $120-$180 upfront.

Unless you are a rich person, or have disposal income, $120 is hard for alot of people. That money is 1 month gas money for some people.

Its not feasible.

If someone can't pay a $120 fee so they can save $60+ they have no business spending $15/18 a month on a gaming sub service.

Anyone living like that could have like 2 months of minor self sacrifice and have much more than enough saved up.

 

[kingfey]

I am not downplaying day one games at all. I flatly said IGN should have broken that aspect out in its graphic as it is an important difference. But that is a different discussion when talking about the differences in the price structures.

Since you brought up these price structures, let's examine gamepass.

Gamepass ultimate contains, $120 GP pc, $120 GP console, $30 ea play pc, $30 console. Total of $300. Xcloud is unknown price.

So you are getting $300 worth of a service, as $180. Or $15 a Month.

You are essentially saving $120 to get all of them together.

But that doesn't matter. Since this is just high tier upgraded service. And you can't apply a one time payment, because it's already heavily discounted.

So only the talk would be day1 games. Since people don't pay attention to these breakdown prices. And would run the narrative, that $120 saves alot, compared to the $180, when that is flat out wrong.

 

[DangerDiabolik]

I am not excited at the idea that I would have to pay to get access to a rolling library of games, which is smaller than the library of games I already own and more importantly picked according to my tastes.

Imagine wanting to replay Halo: infinite in a couple of years... Either the game will be completely different or it may or may not be on the current offerings.

We'll end up like people are with music/video/etc. Where people have to register to a couple of services and spend hundreds of dollars a month in gaming subscription services... Where they used to buy a couple of games, they choose, in a year and be able to play it for as long as they choose to.

So again, I was really just talking about the value of adding first party games day one vs not. Like I say, PlayStation are taking the approach of not adding their games Day One, but instead adding them a year or more down the line. If most PlayStation players buy games like Ragnarok and Spider-man 2 when they launch, what then is the value of them being added to the service later down the line, regardless of how good they may be, if most people already own them?

I guess there's an issue of whether these titles remain as part of the catalog. That remain to be seen. PS Now would rotate first party titles in and out, whereas they are a permanent fixture in the Game Pass library. The only cases I know of first party Xbox games being removed is when some Forza games are delisted due to car licences expiring.

The points you make aren't really anything to do with what I'm saying, but speak to your attitude to subscription services in general. Which is perfectly fine. I'm a huge film geek, much more so than video games. I'm also a huge advocate of physical media and collect films on Blu-ray and 4K and have a pretty sizable collection. I have precisely zero interest in Netflix, Disney+, Prime or any similar subscription services. So I get it. I can only speak from a personal level and say game subscriptions for me have been hugely beneficial. It's actually the thing that got me back into gaming after a few years of totally falling off. Playing so much stuff and falling in love with games I wouldn't have given the time of day if I had to buy it has been a joy.

 

[PropellerEar]

First of all, your math is wrong. Second of all, it is small savings. Maybe not for you, but for me it is.

You are wrong on all counts.

And I'd rather do month to month so I can cancel at anytime. Doing a year at a time, you're locked in. Imagine subscribing to the top tier of PS+ for a year and then finding out it's trash. Yeah, good luck with that.

If that makes you feel special, good for you.

 

[kingfey]

If someone can't pay a $120 fee so they can save $60+ they have no business spending $15/18 a month on a gaming sub service.

Anyone living like that could have like 2 months of minor self sacrifice and have much more than enough saved up.

Right. Let's people spend $120 upfront on a game service, because there is no repercussions at all.

Maybe you need to rethink first.

No sane person, will ever spend that money. $120 at once for gaming is just disgusting price for normal people.

$15-$18 is manageable, because that is 3-4 Big Mac a month.

 

[IntentionalPun]

Right. Let's people spend $120 upfront on a game service, because there is no repercussions at all.

Maybe you need to rethink first.

No sane person, will ever spend that money. $120 at once for gaming is just disgusting price for normal people.

$15-$18 is manageable, because that is 3-4 Big Mac a month.

And this mentality is what these services are taking advantage of.

Wow THAT number is big, THIS number is small, here's my credit card, i'll take the small number!

 

[Swift_Star]

Not everyone will spend $120. Understand that 1st.
Most people are only OK with $60 upfront for online subscriptions. Because they are forced to have these online services, to play online on these systems (You dont pay that on PC).

Discounts only applies, if you are buying games 1st. If you are not buying games, using these services, then you are not benefiting that service.

People can handle $15-$18, because these money is peanut, compared to $120-$180 upfront.

Unless you are a rich person, or have disposal income, $120 is hard for alot of people. That money is 1 month gas money for some people.

Its not feasible.

Everything you just said makes no sense. $120 is not an obscene amount of money to be paid and most people sign stuff for one year because of the discounts you get for it.

Before telling people to understand stuff, learn how to read. Most =/= everyone.

 

[PropellerEar]

My bad. That was the percentage change calculator.

https://www.calculatorsoup.com/calc...e-calculator.php?v_1=120&v_2=180&action=solve

Pretty elemental math Lognor

 

[On Demand]

Should of added the amount of games each service has.

Basic gamepass doesn’t have online play either.

When the new PS plus launches in June it’s going ramp up its library even more and have all the extras announced.

 

[Swift_Star]

And this mentality is what these services are taking advantage of.

Wow THAT number is big, THIS number is small, here's my credit card, i'll take the small number!

They even tell you that it's better to sign anually because of the discounts:
Microsoft themselves do that, as shown below:

It's bizarre they don't do it for GP (yet).

 

[kingfey]

Before telling people to understand stuff, learn how to read. Most =/= everyone.

Most won't pay $120 upfront for a service.
Stop deluding yourself.

 

[kingfey]

And this mentality is what these services are taking advantage of.

Wow THAT number is big, THIS number is small, here's my credit card, i'll take the small number!

Sorry friend. We are not rich, to spend our money like idiots.
There is something called budget.
And gaming doesn't meet that target.

 

[Swift_Star]

Most won't pay $120 upfront for a service.
Stop deluding yourself.

Wrong, most people pay annually for services. Research already proved that.

 

[adamsapple]

Should of added the amount of games each service has.

Basic gamepass doesn’t have online play either.

When the new PS plus launches in June it’s going ramp up its library even more and have all the extras announced.

Bruh this picture is not accurate at all lol.

Just for starters, there's more than just TWO original Xbox games on the service lol.

The rest I'm not even gonna bother going into.

 

[IntentionalPun]

Sorry friend. We are not rich, to spend our money like idiots.
There is something called budget.
And gaming doesn't meet that target.

Bro are you trolling?

$120 a year is $10 a month, pay the monthly price is $216 a year.

They do the discount because they hope some people sign up annually w/ auto-renew and don't pay attention, and then the monthly price also gets people spending more than they really need.

They win either way against lots of folks; but if you actually pay attention and use a service a lot.. the yearly plan is THE ONE THAT IS MORE BUDGET FRIENDLY lol

 

[kingfey]

They even tell you that it's better to sign anually because of the discounts:
Microsoft themselves do that, as shown below:

It's bizarre they don't do it for GP (yet).

Because that service is for business and for schools. Not for gaming. So it makes sense to spend it at once. Since you essentially need it for your daily life (business or school).
Gamepass has alot of services bundled together. $360 if you include xbox live gold. $180 is the discount they offer.

 

[Swift_Star]

Because that service is for business and for schools. Not for gaming. So it makes sense to spend it at once. Since you essentially need it for your daily life (business or school).
Gamepass has alot of services bundled together. $360 if you include xbox live gold. $180 is the discount they offer.

Now you're making mental gymnastics... as usual.

 

[Chukhopops]

Should of added the amount of games each service has.

Basic gamepass doesn’t have online play either.

When the new PS plus launches in June it’s going ramp up its library even more and have all the extras announced.

This is over a year old and not a single number is correct lol.

 

[kingfey]

Bro are you trolling?

$120 a year is $10 a month, pay the monthly price is $216 a year.

They do the discount because they hope some people sign up annually w/ auto-renew and don't pay attention, and then the monthly price also gets people spending more than they really need.

They win either way against lots of folks; but if you actually pay attention and use a service a lot.. the yearly plan is THE ONE THAT IS MORE BUDGET FRIENDLY lol

Because you can recover $10 easily. But you can't recover $120.
How hard is that for you to understand?
People can get $10 back. But they can't get $120 easily.

Unless you have have enough money, no one is stupid enough to sink $120 at once.

That $10 you keep screaming about, costs 10 A month. You can essentially cut 2 of your 1 week lunches to pay that money.

 

[kingfey]

Now you're making mental gymnastics... as usual.

What mental gymnastics you are talking.

You dont see how wrong you are. You literally brought up a non-gaming service to support your arguments.
That is mental gymnastics.

 

[kingfey]

Wrong, most people pay annually for services. Research already proved that.

Non-gaming people.

Only $60 is the maximum upfront for gaming now.

 

[Swift_Star]

What mental gymnastics you are talking.

You dont see how wrong you are. You literally brought up a non-gaming service to support your arguments.
That is mental gymnastics.

There's no point arguing any further when you want to counterpoint facts with mental gymnastics and lies. So, believe what you want:

 

[Swift_Star]

Non-gaming people.

Only $60 is the maximum upfront for gaming now.

Another data taken out of your ass.

 

[kingfey]

Another data taken out of your ass.

Then put that data here, or shut the hell up.

 

[kingfey]

There's no point arguing any further when you want to counterpoint facts with mental gymnastics and lies. So, believe what you want:

Says the one, who has no point in the 1st place.

 

[Swift_Star]

Then put that data here, or shut the hell up.

Don’t get angry when the facts disprove your mental gymnastics. There’s no need for that.

 

[kingfey]

Don’t get angry when the facts disprove your mental gymnastics. There’s no need for that.

Show us the fucking data. Or shut up.

You the one who brought up this shit.

You keep talking out of your ass, then straight up dodge it, when people ask you for evidence.

 

[Gamerguy84]

They even tell you that it's better to sign anually because of the discounts:
Microsoft themselves do that, as shown below:

It's bizarre they don't do it for GP (yet).

They do. The news is 2 hours old and I'm shocked it hasnt been here yet. Someone mentioned it last night in a post.

I'm convinced Phil sits around on gaf half the day and responds accordingly. It would explain a lot.

 

[Swift_Star]

Show us the fucking data. Or shut up.

You the one who brought up this shit.

You keep talking out of your ass, then straight up dodge it, when people ask you for evidence.

Feel free to use google, bud, I’m not going to keep pursuing this any further when you’re in that state. Calm down and we can keep talking.

 

[Swift_Star]

They do. The news is 2 hours old and I'm shocked it hasnt been here yet. Someone mentioned it last night in a post.

I'm convinced Phil sits around on gaf half the day and responds accordingly. It would explain a lot.

Will that be annual? That would be funny in retrospect.

 

[kingfey]

Feel free to use google, bud, I’m not going to keep pursuing this any further when you’re in that state. Calm down and we can keep talking.

Right, the magic word for people who keep talking about their arse.

I feel like I wasted my time, arguing with someone who had no clue about what he is talking about.

 

[Gamerguy84]

Will that be annual? That would be funny in retrospect.

Lol. I don't know yet, I haven't read through that post. Actually I don't think anyone knows the details yet, just that they are going to offer it.

 

[systemr123]

Not everyone will spend $120. Understand that 1st.
Most people are only OK with $60 upfront for online subscriptions. Because they are forced to have these online services, to play online on these systems (You dont pay that on PC).

Discounts only applies, if you are buying games 1st. If you are not buying games, using these services, then you are not benefiting that service.

People can handle $15-$18, because these money is peanut, compared to $120-$180 upfront.

Unless you are a rich person, or have disposal income, $120 is hard for alot of people. That money is 1 month gas money for some people.

Its not feasible.

This whole story makes no sense. In not a single way/situation someone should choose to pay monthly when the yearly price is so much cheaper compared. It makes no sense how you mention people can not spend 120 dollars but they can spend 15x12 dollars in the same time span and that is peanuts . The only reason why you’d ever try the monthly sub is to try it out and see if you like it. Other than that there is not a single reason why you would pay monthly.

 

[Tams]

Like I said earlier, those games don't get the money from your internet tax. Capcom still just gets $60 - 30% for MH Rise, regardless if it was sold on Switch or Steam. Capcom pays for the server through that $42 (minus any retail cut if physical).

They charge what they charge because in 2002 Microsoft sold a $50 kit that included a year of Xbox Live with a period correct wrap around headset. People kept paying to play Halo online. During the 360 it became huge with Halo 3 and COD. Sony, and then Nintendo saw the free money and followed suit. It still doesn't change the fact that you're being fined to use the internet you already pay for.

Mate. No you aren't. You've fucking lost it.

And before you argue that it's 'free' on PC. For those using Valve's service, yes it comes from the sales of games. But developers have to pay Valve to use their servers, and the developers therefore lack less money, making it harder for them. Other games use their own servers, and only a handful of official ones are funded through game sales, especially several years after release. A lot of the servers are actually private ones that are funded by online communities.

And no, servers are not cheap to run at those levels.

 

[kingfey]

This whole story makes no sense. In not a single way/situation someone should choose to pay monthly when the yearly price is so much cheaper compared. It makes no sense how you mention people can not spend 120 dollars but they can spend 15x12 dollars in the same time span and that is peanuts . The only reason why you’d ever try the monthly sub is to try it out and see if you like it. Other than that there is not a single reason why you would pay monthly.

Its mainly because, normal gamers aren't that rich. Or else, we would have seen alot of games, hitting 10m-20m easily.

Then you have the budget issues. You have to save $120 to spend it.

Lastly, people are not keen spending $120 at once on online services. Even I had hard time, buying horizon Forbidden west, and elden ring. That is $120 for 2 games in 1 month. And I don't do that often, because there is limit to how much I can spend on gaming per month.

$120 sounds realistic, if you think of savings. But committing to it, is different.

 

[systemr123]

Its mainly because, normal gamers aren't that rich. Or else, we would have seen alot of games, hitting 10m-20m easily.

Then you have the budget issues. You have to save $120 to spend it.

Lastly, people are not keen spending $120 at once on online services. Even I had hard time, buying horizon Forbidden west, and elden ring. That is $120 for 2 games in 1 month. And I don't do that often, because there is limit to how much I can spend on gaming per month.

$120 sounds realistic, if you think of savings. But committing to it, is different.

You could also choose to save for a few months and then buy the year sub, it’s still way cheaper than paying monthly. Paying monthly is basically throwing money away because you can’t wait to save a little bit.

 

[Swift_Star]

You could also choose to save for a few months and then buy the year sub, it’s still way cheaper than paying monthly. Paying monthly is basically throwing money away because you can’t wait to save a little bit.

Glad there are sensible and intelligent people in this forum. The vast majority of people pay annually if there's discounts involved, the only reason some are trying to pretend this isn't true is because PS+ is cheaper than GP.

 

[Dream-Knife]

Mate. No you aren't. You've fucking lost it.

And before you argue that it's 'free' on PC. For those using Valve's service, yes it comes from the sales of games. But developers have to pay Valve to use their servers, and the developers therefore lack less money, making it harder for them. Other games use their own servers, and only a handful of official ones are funded through game sales, especially several years after release. A lot of the servers are actually private ones that are funded by online communities.

And no, servers are not cheap to run at those levels.

The only servers of Valves companies like Capcom are using is the store. Valve get's their cut like anyone else does. The only Valve hosted servers are for it's own games, and like you said a lot of them are community servers.

COD uses Activision's servers
BF, Madden, FIFA, etc uses EA and community servers
MH uses Capcoms servers
Dark Souls and Elden Ring use Bamcos servers

Xbox live was required for years to use Netflix. Did MS host Netflix's servers?

 

[kingfey]

You could also choose to save for a few months and then buy the year sub, it’s still way cheaper than paying monthly. Paying monthly is basically throwing money away because you can’t wait to save a little bit.

You are not throwing money.

You are throwing money, by spending $120 upfront.

You won't get the return of that investment, until the end of that subscription. Plus you have to be active every day, to recoup that investment.

The monthly money, is easy to recoup. Because you are taking advantage of that month. If you don't like it, you can cancel it, and come back for the 2nd month.

That is what you get from monthly service.

 

[Chukhopops]

You are not throwing money.

You are throwing money, by spending $120 upfront.

You won't get the return of that investment, until the end of that subscription. Plus you have to be active every day, to recoup that investment.

The monthly money, is easy to recoup. Because you are taking advantage of that month. If you don't like it, you can cancel it, and come back for the 2nd month.

That is what you get from monthly service.

I think I get your point that for example with GP you could activate it once every x months to catch up on the service and not sub all the time if you’re only interested in specific games. In that case you’d pay less in the end. I wouldn’t do that but it’s not necessarily a bad idea.

The only thing is, as long as you can buy a 1-year XBLG card for €54 and convert it (and that’s the Amazon price, you can go even cheaper with resellers) you’d need to use the monthly GPU sub only once every 4 months to break even, which isn’t super worth it.