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[analog_future]

After a decent start, this has been an unmitigated disaster. This year was supposed to be a big ne for them as Sony only had a single first-party release whereas Microsoft had 4 but 3 out of them fell short and the only one that met and even exceeded expectations was Hi-Fi Rush which is a smaller game. Redfall was a colossal failure. Forza Motorsport was poorly received and reviled by fans. Starfield has become a meme and is now the lowest-rated Bethesda game on Steam. They couldn't afford to fail this year but they did.

Their numbers in Europe make the Wii U seem like a runaway success and they have made absolutely no progress in Japan. Even in the US, their strongest market, the competition is demolishing them. Their sales figures have become so embarrassing for so long that they refuse to disclose them, instead covering them up with "engagement metrics". What is players having shot 1,000,000,000 bullet in Halo finite supposed to tell me?

People should be calling for Phil's head. He took over in what, 2016? And he somehow managed to sink the brand further. The only good thing he did is Game Pass.

The experiment with the current brass has been a failure. Time to regroup, sack everyone (especially Booty, Geeenberg, and Phil) and rethink their strategy.

What's a next gen console going to do for them other than create an even smaller pool of consumers to develop for/build around?


Xbox as a brand is no longer repairable. Microsoft is going to have to make their money in the gaming space by being largely invisible ala Minecraft. Just profit off of Call of Duty / Actiblizz games, Minecraft, Game Pass, and Candy Crush and keep the Xbox branding to a minimum. Because frankly the Xbox brand is toxic to consumers at this point.


Particularly with younger consumers. It's cool to buy Nintendo. It's cool to buy Sony. It's not cool to buy Xbox.

 

[kruis]

A new management team and a new console won't change the fact that the Xbox brand is dead as a dodo all over the world except for the US and the UK - and even there Playstation is dominating the sales. MS has splurged 75 billion dollars on Bethesda and Blizaard-Acivision, it's now become the biggest game software publisher in the world and at the same moment Xbox Series S/X sales are seriously dropping YOY. It's time for Sateh Nutella to do what's inevitable and turn Xbox Games Studios into a full-fledged third party games publisher. Xbox Series S/X will get full software support, for many years but this should be the end of line for Microsoft's console business. There's really no point for MS to continue with a failing hardware business that can't be turned around anymore. It's over and done.

 

[C2brixx]

The question for Xbox seeing the hardware sales numbers is whether there will be a new generation...

What numbers are the most important to them though. Hardware sales or overall gaming revenue? What constitutes a "new generation". All Microsoft games support the latest cutting edge PC hardware.

 

[Hollowpoint5557]

Nadella was said to be close to shutting Xbox down. Its reported that Phil came to him with a plan that changed his mind on that.The plan consisted of cloud gaming and subscriptions. Microsoft investors dont give two shits about xbox, you can watch the stock go up and down based on the performance of A.I. and their cloud infrastructure. The income from a large subscription base is the icing on top.



The general market is not sold on either of those things. Phil can not pivot away from these things. This was his plan he pitched and unfortunately it didn't work. I think you will see that Xbox pivots to a more traditional service which comes with new leadership, or Xbox gets shut down for not delivering on its promises. It can't continue on much longer the way its going now.

 

[Alan Wake]

And at this stage, after failures with Xbox One and Xbox Series X/S, how many would be interested in the next Xbox ya think?

 

[MisterXDTV]

And at this stage, after failures with Xbox One and Xbox Series X/S, how many would be interested in the next Xbox ya think?

36 TERAFLOPS BABY....

 

[havoc00]

You joke, but he would likely do a better job.

He knew that gamepass was suicide for AAA day one. He admitted it in court in front of his next boss.

Employee culture would need a serious looking at, but he knows how to run a successful publisher.

All memes and joking aside, I really do think Bobby would right the ship or at least point them on a better direction.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

 

[Syphon Filter]

What's the point of releasing another Xbox, if this one has no traction?

It's not like it was in the early 2000s when every console was a fresh start and a way to wipe the slate clean (more or less). Nowadays with digital libraries and BC, each one builds off the next. The far more likely path for them now is just to fall farther and farther behind.

BC and digital was a thing even in mid 2000's with xbla. I dont think that is the issue, the issue is them ruining their strong franchises like Halo and having no exclusives anymore.

 

[Hohenheim]

Yeah he should be awarded for not selling hardware AND software...

The dream of every CEO

I don't really care if their CEO is awarded or not. I care about the product they're selling me. And i'm very satisfied with that product. (Game Pass)

 

[IDKFA]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks it's a real possibility that Microsoft will go software only.

 

[Crayon]

Yes please cut this gen short and go with another console. Come out a year or two before ps6 so you can play games that are targeted at PS5 with slightly higher settings three more years into cross gen, including your own. Let the current population know that you aren't necessarily committed to a whole gen when they buy a console. Live in a a whole year of ps6 hype leading to launch. This is the most Philish plan and I hope they let him do it.

 

[Elios83]

Microsoft just made the wrong bets/decisions:

1) They essentially thought that putting all their games on PC day-one would have limited impact on their console business -> wrong, the platform has become redundant and lost its identity.

2) They thought that people would stop buying full priced games, casuals would subscribe in droves to Gamepass and something like Series S was the perfect device for these people -> wrong bet, people can play a single game for months, games cannot be consumed like TV series. Something like Series S is just perceived like a gimped device.

At this point it's difficult to go back relatively to their console business as traditionally intended. They could become a service/contents provider for multiple platforms. Trying to bring their games everywhere is their best option to be successful in gaming.

 

[Fox Mulder]

MS just spent by far their most amount ever on an acquisition for Activision. They expect cloud gaming in the future.

The Xbox itself just has no real first party exclusives or identity. They release everything on PC, Sony at least makes them wait for stuff like Spider-Man 2. Xbox used to be the Forza/Halo/Gears console and those are all down massively these days.

 

[angrod14]

I've been trying to sell my One S for three weeks and nobody wants it.

 

[Del_X]

They should go third party but keep making a console. The console should be $799-999 just because I want to see what that would look like today.

 

[Sanepar]

It is time to give up console businnes and be a 3p.

 

[Gaiff]

Microsoft just made the wrong bets/decisions:

1) They essentially thought that putting all their games on PC day-one would have limited impact on their console business -> wrong, the platform has become redundant and lost its identity.

Lol, no. Nobody would have bought an Xbox for Redfall, Halo Infinite, or Forza Motorsport. If anything, PC bolstered their numbers.

 

[angrod14]

If the brand goes down, and Series X is their last console, I sincerely hope they at least keep the ability to redownload purchased content. I really love Gears (specially the OG trilogy) and I don't want to play on PC.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

The goal of 4 big AAA games a year is a pipedream for them.

Look at ABK + Zenimax + MGS historically and I doubt they ever delivered that consistently.

Maybe if you count CoD annual releases as a AAA release.

 

[Elios83]

Lol, no. Nobody would have bought an Xbox for Redfall, Halo Infinite, or Forza Motorsport. If anything, PC bolstered their numbers.

This is an other issue. It's obvious that if all the exclusives they release end up being forgettable they won't boost anything.
Releasing their games on PC has bolstered overall software sales but I was talking about their console business.

 

[Forth]

Personally Forza was the end of the line for me, six years and that's the best they could release? It's an embarrassment.
I now realise there is something seriously wrong with Xbox management.
The only way to turn it around is get rid of the Series S and release one hit after another and that's it, people but a games console to play great games, there's nothing fucking magical at play. I just don't think Xbox management know what a good game is anymore.
Also get rid of all those fucking diversity hires who took on over the last five years.

 

[analog_future]

The goal of 4 big AAA games a year is a pipedream for them.

Look at ABK + Zenimax + MGS historically and I doubt they ever delivered that consistently.

Maybe if you count CoD annual releases as a AAA release.

I think they just need to stop making hardware altogether and start trying to get Game Pass on every platform, including Nintendo and Playstation.

If they're no longer making hardware and aren't directly competing with Sony and Nintendo, I don't see why they wouldn't be able to work out a deal to make Game Pass available on those platforms. It'd be no different than a Ubisoft+ or EA Play type platform at that point.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Is it honestly doing worse than the wii u or are we in hyperbole Town?

 

[Jigsaah]

After a decent start, this has been an unmitigated disaster. This year was supposed to be a big ne for them as Sony only had a single first-party release whereas Microsoft had 4 but 3 out of them fell short and the only one that met and even exceeded expectations was Hi-Fi Rush which is a smaller game. Redfall was a colossal failure. Forza Motorsport was poorly received and reviled by fans. Starfield has become a meme and is now the lowest-rated Bethesda game on Steam. They couldn't afford to fail this year but they did.

Their numbers in Europe make the Wii U seem like a runaway success and they have made absolutely no progress in Japan. Even in the US, their strongest market, the competition is demolishing them. Their sales figures have become so embarrassing for so long that they refuse to disclose them, instead covering them up with "engagement metrics". What is players having shot 1,000,000,000 bullet in Halo finite supposed to tell me?

People should be calling for Phil's head. He took over in what, 2016? And he somehow managed to sink the brand further. The only good thing he did is Game Pass.

The experiment with the current brass has been a failure. Time to regroup, sack everyone (especially Booty, Geeenberg, and Phil) and rethink their strategy.

Starfield is in the top 10 games sold this year, and that's with gamepass holding it back brother. I assume this is a statistic you can get behind. Forza will be patched. Redfall...they just need to cut their losses there. It will never be great...it might be average even after fixing it. Regardless, the only game that falls at Xbox's feet is Forza. They didn't have their hand in Redfall as Phil admitted, Starfield was well into development when Xbox picked up Bethesda.

I think what they did with leadership is a bandaid, but I also think you shouldn't change too much unless you risk throwing the baby out with the bath water.

I'll agree with one thing you said though. Aaron Greenberg...get rid of him. Booty is on thin ice IMO. Phil should stay, he got the ABK deal done. That's gotta be worth something.

 

[Hollowpoint5557]

It's the games man. They just don't get it.

* Gears Tactics - did they think anyone would play this longer than a week?
* Microsoft Flight Simulator - Niche
* Psychonauts 2 - lame
* Forza Horizon 5 - car games don't move consoles any longer
* Halo Infinite - not good enough
* As Dusk Falls - literally who gave a fuck?
* Grounded - lame
* Pentiment - lame and gay
* Hi-Fi Rush - oh cool... for like 2 days. What else do I have to play?
* Minecraft Legends - baby's first dungeon crawler
* Redfall - LOL
* Age of Empires IV - virgins only
* Starfield - 360 games, NOW IN 4K!!! (!)
* Forza Motorsport - Why can't you just make Forza 4 but with newer cars.

None of these hit for me. I sold my Xbox, unsubbed from gamepass. Peace out Xbox , see you next gen... maybe.

 

[twilo99]

Even if they come out with a console that is 3x better than Sony, it will change absolutely nothing in terms of market share and sales.

 

[Audiophile]

Honestly feel like Sony are phoning it in and yet they're still trouncing Xbox cause they're so bad right now. My concern is the Xbox brand contracting too much and Sony ending up on complete autopilot. I really wish Apple were in the market heavy.

 

[Matsuchezz]

It's the games man. They just don't get it.

* Gears Tactics - did they think anyone would play this longer than a week?
* Microsoft Flight Simulator - Niche
* Psychonauts 2 - lame
* Forza Horizon 5 - car games don't move consoles any longer
* Halo Infinite - not good enough
* As Dusk Falls - literally who gave a fuck?
* Grounded - lame
* Pentiment - lame and gay
* Hi-Fi Rush - oh cool... for like 2 days. What else do I have to play?
* Minecraft Legends - baby's first dungeon crawler
* Redfall - LOL
* Age of Empires IV - virgins only
* Starfield - 360 games, NOW IN 4K!!! (!)
* Forza Motorsport - Why can't you just make Forza 4 but with newer cars.

None of these hit for me. I sold my Xbox, unsubbed from gamepass. Peace out Xbox , see you next gen... maybe.

You Nailed it! Microsoft and Xbox suck!

OT: A new console is not going to solve all their issues. If that was the case Series X would have done it. Xbox is cock stained. They do not realize that they are ill fated. This ship is sinking but the green rats are not going to abandon ship, they will sink in it.

 

[analog_future]

Is it honestly doing worse than the wii u or are we in hyperbole Town?

It's doing far better than the Wii U. They've already sold about twice as many Xbox Series consoles than the Wii U sold over it's lifetime.

 

[diffusionx]

BC and digital was a thing even in mid 2000's with xbla. I dont think that is the issue, the issue is them ruining their strong franchises like Halo and having no exclusives anymore.

it really wasn't. it existed in some limited form, but the switchover in terms of people building up big digital libraries and abandoning physical only really started on the PS4/XO generation. This guy named Phil Spencer has talked about it and talked about the failure of the Xbox One that gen really put them behind the 8-ball going forward.

 

[Stare-Bear]

They need fucking games. They launched the Series X with 0 first party games…

 

[chromatic9]

You never know, Xbox could come back in a few years once the third party publishers they bought start to produce, perhaps they can target top people in the industry over as well.

Sony are enjoying a huge surge and have generally done well but they could make mistakes on GAAS. The single player studios could start to wane as key people retire or move on to other jobs. The industry can be cyclical and fickle, MS were a sure bet for many after 360 to clean up. Sony were supposed to clean up after PS2's enormous success.

 

[Fabieter]

Obviously bethesda and Activision were not enough to allow Xbox to compete in a fair way, so I think EA and UBISOFT should be their next acquisition, we must have competition, this is the only way, is good for us, MS have to save gaming from Sony and be allowed to buy at least more 02 big publishers.

Its impossible to say if its sacasm or not.

 

[MisterXDTV]

it really wasn't. it existed in some limited form, but the switchover in terms of people building up big digital libraries and abandoning physical only really started on the PS4/XO generation. This guy named Phil Spencer has talked about it and talked about the failure of the Xbox One that gen really put them behind the 8-ball going forward.

Agreed, with PS3/360 you could play games directly from discs and my Internet speed sucked back then...

With PS4 and fiber internet everything changed. Now you have to install the games even if you buy physical. Too bad the spinning disc is now way slower than my internet connection

 

[Gaiff]

They need fucking games. They launched the Series X with 0 first party games…

And with this incompetent management, they will never produce a steady stream of high-quality games. It's been damn near a decade. They no longer have excuses.

 

[ungalo]

They can't rush a new generation, it's not like 15 years ago when you could surprise your competitors with an all new hardware, Microsoft themselves don't even have the studios to push their own hardware, they didn't prove they could align big AAA games/killer app, especially to do it quick.

In any case they are in for 3 or 4 very difficult years. They have some time to think about the next generation. Something tells me it will be even less ambitious than what they did for this one.

 

[Rival]

At this point the only thing I play on my Xbox is old games via the backwards compatibility.

 

[reinking]

IMO they need to do three simple things to get on the right track. Get out of this “how do you do fellow kids” marketing crap that they have been trying from the start since it has never worked. They need to STFU more and let their games do the talking. You can’t overhype every game. It leads to too much disappointment. A good game is a good game but if overhyped it can lead to negativity. Finally, make the games that will do the talking. One of the biggest positives they had this year was HI-FI Rush. A game that got little hype and not much force fed influencer BS. Xbox needs to learn that most gamers are not dumb. Their influencers have basically become a circle jerk that has little influence outside of their own circle. I apologize in advance if my comments cost some of you your job in the near future.

 

[havoc00]

It's the games man. They just don't get it.

* Gears Tactics - did they think anyone would play this longer than a week?
* Microsoft Flight Simulator - Niche
* Psychonauts 2 - lame
* Forza Horizon 5 - car games don't move consoles any longer
* Halo Infinite - not good enough
* As Dusk Falls - literally who gave a fuck?
* Grounded - lame
* Pentiment - lame and gay
* Hi-Fi Rush - oh cool... for like 2 days. What else do I have to play?
* Minecraft Legends - baby's first dungeon crawler
* Redfall - LOL
* Age of Empires IV - virgins only
* Starfield - 360 games, NOW IN 4K!!! (!)
* Forza Motorsport - Why can't you just make Forza 4 but with newer cars.

None of these hit for me. I sold my Xbox, unsubbed from gamepass. Peace out Xbox , see you next gen... maybe.

Psychonauts 2 was great
Halo infinite is in a good spot now

 

[lughnasadh123]

All of this is marketing hogwash.

Hogwash Legacy.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

I think they just need to stop making hardware altogether and start trying to get Game Pass on every platform, including Nintendo and Playstation.

If they're no longer making hardware and aren't directly competing with Sony and Nintendo, I don't see why they wouldn't be able to work out a deal to make Game Pass available on those platforms. It'd be no different than a Ubisoft+ or EA Play type platform at that point.

There is no future with gamepass on nintendo and playstation, people need to give this up.

Ubisoft and EA play are largely catalog subscription services. Both companies have far more catalog titles than Microsoft.

And no one is interested in paying 10 dollars a month for microsoft's own games day 1.

 

[adamsapple]

It's the games man. They just don't get it.

* Gears Tactics - did they think anyone would play this longer than a week?
* Microsoft Flight Simulator - Niche
* Psychonauts 2 - lame
* Forza Horizon 5 - car games don't move consoles any longer
* Halo Infinite - not good enough
* As Dusk Falls - literally who gave a fuck?
* Grounded - lame
* Pentiment - lame and gay
* Hi-Fi Rush - oh cool... for like 2 days. What else do I have to play?
* Minecraft Legends - baby's first dungeon crawler
* Redfall - LOL
* Age of Empires IV - virgins only
* Starfield - 360 games, NOW IN 4K!!! (!)
* Forza Motorsport - Why can't you just make Forza 4 but with newer cars.

None of these hit for me. I sold my Xbox, unsubbed from gamepass. Peace out Xbox , see you next gen... maybe.

 

[Hawking Radiation]

After a decent start, this has been an unmitigated disaster. This year was supposed to be a big ne for them as Sony only had a single first-party release whereas Microsoft had 4 but 3 out of them fell short and the only one that met and even exceeded expectations was Hi-Fi Rush which is a smaller game. Redfall was a colossal failure. Forza Motorsport was poorly received and reviled by fans. Starfield has become a meme and is now the lowest-rated Bethesda game on Steam. They couldn't afford to fail this year but they did.

Their numbers in Europe make the Wii U seem like a runaway success and they have made absolutely no progress in Japan. Even in the US, their strongest market, the competition is demolishing them. Their sales figures have become so embarrassing for so long that they refuse to disclose them, instead covering them up with "engagement metrics". What is players having shot 1,000,000,000 bullet in Halo finite supposed to tell me?

People should be calling for Phil's head. He took over in what, 2016? And he somehow managed to sink the brand further. The only good thing he did is Game Pass.

The experiment with the current brass has been a failure. Time to regroup, sack everyone (especially Booty, Geeenberg, and Phil) and rethink their strategy.

1000% they need new leadership with fresh ideas.

They've been comfortably behind PS and Nintendo for how long now.

I want them to succeed because that keeps PS in check and gives us as consumers better products and services. Strong competition is healthy.

 

[Azelover]

It's not unreasonable to do so.. They cut the OG Xbox short after four years. But they did end it with a huge spectacle with Halo 2. So it's a double edged sword. Needs to be done right.

 

[analog_future]

There is no future with gamepass on nintendo and playstation, people need to give this up.

Ubisoft and EA play are largely catalog subscription services. Both companies have far more catalog titles than Microsoft.

And no one is interested in paying 10 dollars a month for microsoft's own games day 1.

If you're right, which I don't know that you are, then I don't see how Microsoft competes moving forward. I don't think there's a Game Pass game library in the world that's going to be compelling enough to convince massive swaths of consumers to leave Playstation and come to Xbox.


Phil & Co are in a hole without a shovel. I just don't think there's an answer to right this ship any time soon.

 

[ungalo]

1000% they need new leadership with fresh ideas.

They've been comfortably behind PS and Nintendo for how long now.

I want them to succeed because that keeps PS in check and gives us as consumers better products and services. Strong competition is healthy.

They don't even need new ideas, just someone that knows how to produce a game.

I really wonder if today's Microsoft could even release a game as mediocre as Ryse Son of Rome for a new console, i'm really not sure they could. Just a 5 hour game made for the only purpose of showing the power of a new hardware. Seems way too hard for the Microsoft we have now, or they'd manage to release the game 4 years after the console launch instead of releasing it properly for the lineup.

 

[GHG]

They should go third party but keep making a console. The console should be $799-999 just because I want to see what that would look like today.

There's zero point. At that point just buy/build a PC.

 

[Banjo64]

Next year
Next gen

You joke, but he would likely do a better job.

He knew that gamepass was suicide for AAA day one. He admitted it in court in front of his next boss.

Employee culture would need a serious looking at, but he knows how to run a successful publisher.

correct but lol at that line - bobby doesn’t have a boss and has the leverage to do whatever he wants. assisting phil for 3 months for hefty cash is great for him but I promise you phil isn’t trying to sit him down for supervisions or giving him deadlines. only person with power in this r/ship is bobby.

 

[Withnail]

Wow we’re at the “wait for next gen” part of the Xbox fan cycle already.

And anybody saying that MS should go third party seems be overlooking the fact that they already have. Unless you really think they bought all those ActiBlizz games to make them Xbox exclusive