Killjoy-NL
Member
Just common sense.I'm sorry but you *really* want that to happen, don't you?
I'm from the Netherlands. Xbox basically doesn't exist here already, so it wouldn't make a difference if they would continue.
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Xbox held an internal town hall on Tuesday where Spencer said they don’t plan to stop making consoles
I'm from the Netherlands. Xbox basically doesn't exist here already, so it wouldn't make a difference if they would continue.
Negotiator101
Member
Well apparently Starfield which was rumoured to go multiplatform isn't now according to someone
the fan fiction had grown to a point that Microsoft were effectively ending Xbox hardware even though a member on Gaf who has some connections was saying otherwise and a 2025/26 next-gen console is likely. Full third-party was also bandied about as if it was already confirmed, yes rumours started circulating and Xbox haven't done enough to stop them but the rate at which these rumours had grown to where they are now was 99% down to fanboys. You don't have to take my word for it but we now got Gaf members saying it will happen in 3 years from now, just to cover their asses
it's hilarious that's for certain.
Elysium44
Banned
Game pass ultimate is that unified service already. Game pass doesn't seem to be very popular on PC, people prefer the convenience of Steam with its much better user experience. Perhaps if Microsoft had talented developers who could fix that... but they've shown no sign of doing that over the years. The Xbox app is a convoluted mess.
I recently took a screenshot on my Xbox console and wanted to look at it on my PC. I assumed it would be easy to do this... just look in the Xbox app. Nope, no way to do it. I googled, found the OLD Xbox app had this functionality but the NEW one removed it! And no way to find it on the web either, via the Xbox website. Your profile page doesn't have any way to look at captures. This is pathetic. (Yes I know you can copy it via USB stick but it should be made easier than that.)
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Killjoy-NL
Member
I don't really consider Spencer a liar. He's just a businessman like any other.
Sometimes I just point out that Xbox' actions contradict whatever Spencer says.
Having said that, I'm going by what Spencer himself has said throughout this gen.
"Xbox becomes 'untenable' without the mobile market"
"It isn't a matter of just releasing good games"
"We can't outsell Playstation"
"We lost the most important generation last-gen, when people started building their digital library"
And outside of that, we just have to look at all the other ominous signs:
- console sales flatlining
- GamePass stagnating at 25-30M
(Vast majority of subs being on Xbox, 21.5+M, which sales are flatling and availability on PC isn't doing much)
- preparing to quit physical sales
- European retailers not stocking on physical sales
There's an abunce of signs that Xbox is dying.
Quite amazing how Xbox fans refuse to see this.
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Sorcerer
Member
It just means a meeting for employees within a certain division of the company only I imagine. I assume the information is not to be leaked to the press or public or in this case the larger company. The company at large is a "State", a company division is a "town" within that company State.
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cireza
Member
Reads like wishful thinking honestly...
Killjoy-NL
Member
So is thinking that Xbox could make a comeback or something along those lines.
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cireza
Member
Sure, but I am not reading any of this around here. However we get a lot of Xbox is going to die. There is actually an obsession about Xbox failing if the number of threads created is anything to go by.
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Snake29
RSI Employee of the Year
Xbox branded OEM devices will never work. Why would anyone buy that over the current console? It will not even be cheaper and it doesn’t make any sense for developers in general. They are just pc hardware so you get all the same issues pc games have right now.
Steam machines didn’t work, so will Xbox branded machines never ever works.
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DForce
NaughtyDog Defense Force
You're being dishonest about the rumors.Well apparently Starfield which was rumoured to go multiplatform isn't now according to someone
You don't have to take my word for it but we now got Gaf members saying it will happen in 3 years from now, just to cover their asses
Nate is the only one who backtracked from the rumors, XboxERA stands by their report. You said they're falling like dominos when we don't have confirmation of what's going on.
Ending hardware? No one reported they were ending hardware, it was a report about releasing games on other platforms.
Maybe you don't consider P. Spencer to be a liar, but clearly you only choose from what he says and does what interests you to fit your narrative/desires and deny other possibilities.
You have a multitude of statements and clear indications to also support the possibility that MS is going to continue launching new hardware but you simply ignore those.
-The sales? At a time where MS has the best infrastructure to support its own hardware, it is the forecasts that matter. MS can perfectly consider that it is worth launching a product worth 25-30 million for what it generates. And MS can perfectly consider a product where its strategy is different from that of XSeries and previous generations as a last or penultimate opportunity...
- Xbox fans who are blind and don't want to see?? It's funny to hear this when the most surprising thing here has been to see people who defended a possible MS monopoly on consoles for when a new generation of consoles would be launched thanks to ABK and suddenly those same people now defend that there is no possibility of MS launch new hardware or continue in the console business just because they have ABK...
Negotiator101
Member
I'm telling you the rumours were exaggerated that's what I'm telling you, the original rumours doesn't suggest what is being predicted on here does it? The PS fanboys were so and still are wrapped up in Xbox going out of business as a console maker and going full third-party that the original rumours didn't even matter. They'd created in their minds a snowball effect that just kept getting more and more absurd, yet 90% on here were sucking it down like Coca-Cola.
Killjoy-NL
Member
No, it's just a logical conclusion based on more than just what he said.
I literally made a quick summary of everything else.
Like the forecast of -40% decline in HW sales for Q1 2024?
I don't think those groups are the same.- Xbox fans who are blind and don't want to see?? It's funny to hear this when the most surprising thing here has been to see people who defended a possible MS monopoly on consoles for when a new generation of consoles would be launched thanks to ABK and suddenly those same people now defend that there is no possibility of MS launch new hardware or continue in the console business just because they have ABK...
Also, I haven't really noticed anyone making the arguments you just mentioned.
I'm certainly not part of either of those groups, that's for sure.
Aloy's Bad Hair Day
Neo Member
‘We will continue to make Xbox consoles until we decide not to!’ said Philbin the Rouser.
‘When that decision will be made, I don’t know. Ask Amy Hood, because she’s in charge now.’
‘When that decision will be made, I don’t know. Ask Amy Hood, because she’s in charge now.’
TheGodfather07
Member
Whatever fanboys of either side want to believe, the only true reality is the actual market itself. It doesn't lie or have any bias. It's that reality that is why Microsoft are doing any of this begin with. It doesn't matter if Microsoft are a trillion dollar corporation. They ain't gonna sustain something that is continuously declining and not showing any growth. If that trend continues, than Microsoft will consider pulling the plug on xbox. They've done it before with other products.
ManaByte
Gold Member
Standard practice for bullshit peddlers when they set a date for something and their bullshit is debunked.
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Pancakes and Sausage
Member
Xbox is surely making more consoles but when the next box only sells 15 million units????
ManaByte
Gold Member
Doesn't matter much now that the gaming division makes more money for MS than the Windows division.
/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/24038601/acastro_STK109_microsoft_02.jpg)
Microsoft’s gaming revenues overtake Windows thanks to Activision Blizzard
Microsoft’s devices revenue is down once again.
www.theverge.com
Pancakes and Sausage
Member
Doesn't matter much now that the gaming division makes more money for MS than the Windows division.
Microsoft’s gaming revenues overtake Windows thanks to Activision Blizzard
Microsoft’s devices revenue is down once again.
Only because of Activision acquisition.
If the next generation of Xbox consoles only sells 15 million, I don’t think there would be another generation.
Microsoft would become a software company
ManaByte
Gold Member
I think the next generation of hardware is going to be the final hardware generation for everyone who isn't Nintendo.
Klosshufvud
Member
Learn the difference between revenue and profit.Doesn't matter much now that the gaming division makes more money for MS than the Windows division.
Microsoft’s gaming revenues overtake Windows thanks to Activision Blizzard
Microsoft’s devices revenue is down once again.
DForce
NaughtyDog Defense Force
False. The original rumor was about Microsoft releasing their games on Switch and PlayStation. This started around the time when people found out As Dusks Falls was being released on PlayStation. Shinobi on Resetera said there would be more and then we found out about Hi-Fi Rush and possibly Starfield. You said the rumors were falling down like dominos which wasn't true. The only thing being talked about regarding Microsoft going out of the console business is when people were discussing Phil's statement about 2027 and that was MONTHS ago. We heard about the planned hardware for weeks when people were saying Microsoft planned to release their next-gen console in 2026.
The "snowball effect" was about Microsoft releasing their upcoming games on PlayStation after insiders started reporting that Microsoft was planning on releasing games like Halo and Gears on PlayStation. You're lying about saying the original rumor was about MS going out of the console business when it was about Microsoft going third party while releasing a next gen console as soon as 2026.
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
As of Aug? Sept maybe? Whenever I first mentioned Xbox wanted like a 2 year window of having the strongest hardware I can say at that point they did not look to be playing it safe
It will be curious how in depth the talk goes with this meeting
I think the circle of people who know what’s up grew yesterday, will be curious to see if anyone gets fed any info in the next 48 hours
MisterXDTV
Member
Exactly, revenue means nothing without considering COSTS
Their revenue skyrocket because they spent 70 billions to buy ABK, no shit!!!
LOL
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Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
"They should announce next-gen consoles and convince people to spend another $500 on another piece of hardware, when they haven't even released the games they promised for the current-gen yet, e.g., Perfect Dark, Everwild, State of Decay 3, Avowed, Hellblade 2, Contraband, etc.
That's what people want and would appreciate."
Of course, of course it is a logical conclusion..... it is because it only pays attention to some statements and facts while ignoring a whole multitude of others that indicate the opposite....
That's your problem, believing that the possibility of MS continuing or not in the console business and releasing hardware is dependent on how much XSeries sells...
And yes, you have made a summary and I can make you a longer one with facts and indications that indicate that MS can be planning to continue launching hardware...
- MS continues to oppose accepting the obligation to make ABK games multiplatform on consoles beyond COD. From yesterday you have his response to the FTC. If MS had already decided that tthey were not going to launch more consoles..... Explain to me the reason why MS continue to put the acquisition of ABK in danger and the possibility of new acquisitions in many difficulties
-By now Sony should already know MS's plans and know what games are released on PS5.... And yet there you have Sony legally supporting the FTC ( in the aspect of the possibility of affecting competition in the console market ) so that MS does not acquire ABK and that is still despite the agreement COD for 10 years.
-You have confirmation of the leaked documents of the hardware roadmap and you have P. Spencer officially saying less than 1 month ago that they are developing new hardware and that they have a decided roadmap. Is it those parts where P. Spencer lies?
- You have to say that MS has appointed Sarah Bond as head of hardware supposedly as the main competition 1 month ago....... You have to understand that they gave her an empty or residual position or that they are directly making fun of her because there is no plans to launch new hardware??
- You point out certain rumors and turn a deaf ear to those that indicate that new hardware is being developed. Nate, Heis, Tom Henderson, Kepler, Jez, Grubb, this info in OP....
I can accept and respect your opinion that you do not see any possibility according to your criteria... but another thing is to accept that you say that whoever thinks of a high possibility that MS will continue launching hardware and continue in the console business (the philosophy or strategy what he thinks for her is another topic) is simply a blind fan who doesn't want to see. Mainly because a majority here who also think so are far from being an Xbox fan.
I don't think those groups are the same.
Also, I haven't really noticed anyone making the arguments you just mentioned.
I'm certainly not part of either of those groups, that's for sure.
I invite you to take a look at the ABK acquisition thread and then compare..... I assure you that you will have a lot of laughs when you see the 180° turn of many of those who now tell you to think about the possibility of MS launching new hardware is having no judgment...
Aguero9320
Member
I don’t think people on here realize they aren’t the gaming mass market. Most people who would make a purchasing decision between Xbox and PS5 (or Game Pass) have no idea any of this nonsense is even happening…
It can be useful on here though, you learn stuff every day - like this thread just taught me As Dusk Falls was a Microsoft exclusive. Had no idea. The sky is definitely falling if they can’t hang on to that one
It can be useful on here though, you learn stuff every day - like this thread just taught me As Dusk Falls was a Microsoft exclusive. Had no idea. The sky is definitely falling if they can’t hang on to that one
II_JumPeR_I
Member
Another fail decision that will bite them in the ass and this time you will lose the goodwill of the community with that multiplatform strategy
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
I have spent a lot of money over the years investing in properties and even though my ROI hasn’t paid off yet I can still be super happy with my revenue
Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
Why? Console sales do not matter.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
And their gaming dept is now generating $7bn+ in revenue, higher than ever before. Damn.
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
It’s like people expected the ABK acquisition to pay for itself in 2 months or something, that’s not how things like that work
If I invest 3 million into a property if I can get it paid back and in the positive in 5 years I am happy with that return
If it takes me 20 years at my age that’s not worth it
For a company like MS they can let those investments make money for decades if possible
And yet fantasies about the demise of Xbox seem to dominate your every waking thought.
MisterXDTV
Member
Sure, you can be happy but it's still half the picture....
Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
You're happy because the revenue exceeds the expenses. But you wouldn't be happy if the revenue is less than the expenses you incur each month on those properties.
Killjoy-NL
Member
Audiophile
Member
I expect more consoles but I don't think they'll do so well given that the main reason to a buy a console is the games it offers. Xbox doesn't have a lot going on to begin with and moving their games to PS will only further devalue their platform.
If it's a choice of PlayStation, MS/Xbox & Third Party games vs MS/Xbox & Third Party games there's little reason to choose the latter.
Only remaining reason I see to own an Xbox if they go this route is as a plug and play backwards compatibility box going forward; and tbh, the XSX will do that fine and you'll likely not have a need to get a next-gen Xbox. There's also PC but then some people don't want the faff and others don't want to or can't spend 3x the money.
MS also have the economies of scale against them, while with Sony it's very much in their favour. Sony seem to be outselling MS 2:1, with PS5 trending up and XS tending down (plus their main, high selling console is a "lite" one). Sony can build a superior box for less money and as evident by this gen they can match them on performance with superior/more efficient design choices (smaller, cheaper chip with faster GPU front-end & a simpler memory interface) and better APIs.
I wonder if this is MS telling Xbox to stand on its own two feet and recoup costs; but in releasing games on the leading, competing platform to do so they gonna devalue their own hardware. Xbox has backed itself into a corner and are leading into a vicious cycle. They'll do fine as a third-party, but the hardware aspect of the business will almost certainly end up being a great big ball and chain. They'll have to have some crazy-big curve balls for it to go any other way.
If it's a choice of PlayStation, MS/Xbox & Third Party games vs MS/Xbox & Third Party games there's little reason to choose the latter.
Only remaining reason I see to own an Xbox if they go this route is as a plug and play backwards compatibility box going forward; and tbh, the XSX will do that fine and you'll likely not have a need to get a next-gen Xbox. There's also PC but then some people don't want the faff and others don't want to or can't spend 3x the money.
MS also have the economies of scale against them, while with Sony it's very much in their favour. Sony seem to be outselling MS 2:1, with PS5 trending up and XS tending down (plus their main, high selling console is a "lite" one). Sony can build a superior box for less money and as evident by this gen they can match them on performance with superior/more efficient design choices (smaller, cheaper chip with faster GPU front-end & a simpler memory interface) and better APIs.
I wonder if this is MS telling Xbox to stand on its own two feet and recoup costs; but in releasing games on the leading, competing platform to do so they gonna devalue their own hardware. Xbox has backed itself into a corner and are leading into a vicious cycle. They'll do fine as a third-party, but the hardware aspect of the business will almost certainly end up being a great big ball and chain. They'll have to have some crazy-big curve balls for it to go any other way.
Negotiator101
Member
When did I say that? I only know too well what the rumours were, you seem to be confused my friend. It was the fanboys who created something out of nothing and made these silly predictions, sorry buddy but you're barking up the wrong tree
Ah that's good. I feel like I've seen your grumpy avatar a lot in the past week.
cireza
Member
Unlike you, I don't care about sales.Why? Console sales do not matter.
What I will care about though is Sony being the only manufacturer to have an offer for decent console hardware (which excludes Nintendo by default). Obviously, I am not going to spend my money in any Sony hardware in the future. If Xbox gives up on it, then it will most certainly affect my gaming habits in a way.
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Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
Why wouldn't you spend money on a Sony hardware? You'd rather change your gaming habits than play on a PlayStation?
cireza
Member
I am not going to elaborate on my personal behavior, who cares ? It will be a loss for everybody if Sony loses a decent competitor in the hardware department.
DForce
NaughtyDog Defense Force
When did I say that? I only know too well what the rumours were, you seem to be confused my friend. It was the fanboys who created something out of nothing and made these silly predictions, sorry buddy but you're barking up the wrong tree
I'm not confused. You lie often and forget what you have sold people in the past.
Well apparently Starfield which was rumoured to go multiplatform isn't now according to someone
You don't have to take my word for it but we now got Gaf members saying it will happen in 3 years from now, just to cover their asses
There's no confusion. I called you out on your dishonesty and now you just choose to play dumb.
Let me ask you simple questions.
1. Are the sources of these rumors coming from PS fanboys, Xbox fanboys, or journalists?
2. Did Phil say they could exit the console business if things don't improve by 2027?
3. How many rumors have fallen recently?
Killjoy-NL
Member
Days like these...
Have a Blessed Day
It's says that "that there were no plans to stop making consoles" not that there ARE no plans to stop making consoles. Things change. Checkmate gre e n cats.Yeah......that's been repeated multiple times by some of us.HeisenbergFX4 has been preaching that for a while now.
The speculation from some is that Microsoft going multiplat will cause the demise of the console, not that Microsoft plans on killing the console.
Quasicat
Member
We used to call them “Faculty meetings” but then we had a series of years where we were making the local news for really bad reasons. I guess “faculty meeting” had a really bad context for us, but “Town Hall” sounds like we have an open forum to speak.
ReBurn
Gold Member
Sega ran out of money. They were financially incapable of continuing to support Dreamcast. They had also lost most of their third party support with Saturn and they didn't get it back with Dreamcast, meaning they were missing most of the biggest third party games. Neither of those applies to Microsoft.
Nintendo is closer to Sega based on console history. After NES their console base slipped dramatically. SNES sold less than NES. N64 sold less than SNES. Gamecube sold less than N64. As nostalgic as we are for N64, if you look at the numbers it was actually a commercial failure. Like Sega, less than stellar hardware decisions cost Nintendo most of their third major party support. If Nintendo didn't have the DS handheld line to support them financially that plummet from SNES to N64 to Gamecube probably would have killed the company and we likely wouldn't have seen the Wii at all. After WiiU Nintendo leaned into the things that they were always best at, handheld gaming and whimsical imagination, and it made the Switch the success it is now.
The real test for Microsoft at this point is whether they can learn from the mistakes they made from Xbox 360 to now and get back to what made people buy over 80 million consoles that generation in the first place.
In my opinion them going full corporate Microsoft branding is one of the worst things they have done to Xbox. When you think of fun Microsoft is not a brand that stands out. Prior to Xbox One most people might not have even known Xbox was from Microsoft. Then with One they released a VCR with that stupid tiled interface Microsoft was pushing on Windows users and bam, Xbox was boring. Even now, seeing Nadella talk about gaming is boring. Microsoft really needs to be thinking about why people lugged their OG Xbox and 100 lb crt TVs to their friends houses for console lan parties. Because they've lost whatever that was and they need it back.
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Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
Copying this small part from RedDragon Tweet, but I think he nailed what's going on:
Microsoft CFO: "New Strategy & Goal is to have 1st party games on PlayStation and Nintendo."
Phil Spencer: "No plan to bring Xbox Game Pass to PlayStation or Nintendo."
Rumors: "Xbox games will hit PS5 / Nintendo."
Phil Spencer: "Xbox consoles will still exist."
Microsoft CFO: "New Strategy & Goal is to have 1st party games on PlayStation and Nintendo."
Phil Spencer: "No plan to bring Xbox Game Pass to PlayStation or Nintendo."
Rumors: "Xbox games will hit PS5 / Nintendo."
Phil Spencer: "Xbox consoles will still exist."
