Sonic isn't really a good example because the newest game reviewed really bad and couldn't even sell anything on the 3DS. A majority of the people who played on the Wii and DS weren't traditionally gamers so many of them probably either stopped gaming, stayed on their previous devices or went to the next trend which is mobile gaming.
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Nintendo shares plunge 6% by Monday close after trading as low as -18%
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Sonic isn't really a good example because the newest game reviewed really bad and couldn't even sell anything on the 3DS. A majority of the people who played on the Wii and DS weren't traditionally gamers so many of them probably either stopped gaming, stayed on their previous devices or went to the next trend which is mobile gaming.
i think the audience isn't buying the platform specifically because nintendo failed to market to them. they didn't make the system affordable. they didn't make it accessible. the games weren't there. it wasn't marketed in an understandable way. it was poor all-around.
this year, just dance sold a million copies on the wii in the us, and nintendo raised wii software sales for the fiscal year (the only thing to increase). people are out there and buying those games on the platforms that appeal to them. just because the wii u is an unappealing system doesn't mean that they're wholly uninterested in nintendo hardware. nintendo failed to go after this market with the wii u (and 3ds) and that's what i think has been their biggest problem. they chased the ps360 market and not the wii market.
diversification is good, but they shouldn't be just trying things for the hell of it.
maneil99
Member
So make more consoles that dont sell or go deeper into a handheld market which has declined the last decade?
maneil99
Member
1 million casual wii owners buying just dance doesnt equal even 5% of them automaticly being eligible as wii u buyers
Randolph Freelander
Member
But unless I'm misreading, aren't you suggesting they simply focus on handheld? What does that get them, except a consolidation of risk into a shrinking market? Or perhaps you've suggested they go mobile, which also carries risk, because they'd have to adapt to an entirely foreign business model, not to mention one that (at least seems to?) cater to different types of experiences than those Nintendo is presently delivering.
In the grand scheme, spending a few million to port, say, a Mario Kart over to PS4 is far less risky and far less of a commitment than trying to go to iOS/Android (they could still attempt that, too). There's really no particular need for them to do it in house, even, they can just outsource it to cheaper labor that's already familiar with the tools. If it doesn't work, it's really no big deal, the cost isn't particularly high, relatively speaking. If it does, they've got a new revenue stream that they already understand.
Again, that's if they decide they can't make their own platform work. Making their own platform work is always option 1.
it's 2013 and the console market's been in decline for a while, especially on the wii. yet the audience is still buying games. more than that, nintendo's increased forecasts for software sales on the system by about 6m units. it's not a huge amount, but people are still buying those games for consoles.
part of the problem with the 3ds and the wii u is that they're way too expensive for their target audience, and the software is too pricey too. with the wii you got two minigame compilations, two controllers, and the system for $300. you have to spend at least $60 more to get something similar for the wii u, and about $150 more when the system launched. there's no real hook behind the gamepad or the 3ds's 3d. if there was, it certainly wasn't marketed, nor was it supported with software.
I don't think making games for the PS4 or XOne is a good way to go. It'd be hell for them to recover from that if they decided to make their own hardware again. It would be far better to get games on their system. That would be a better way to use money. They should make sure that people don't feel like they're getting the short end of the stick by buying their system. At the moment, they aren't getting any 3rd Party games and that hurts them. Same as it did at the end of the Wii's life. If 3rd parties don't want to port the games, then put together a group that does.
Who wants to buy the Wii U when very few of the recent big games are coming out for it?
Didn't Sony completely shelve Wipeout recently? Hell they closed down the entire studio that develops them right? Face it, futuristic racing games don't sell anymore.
Metroid still is a pretty big deal in the Nintendo catalogue. There will be another soon.
So brutal. Those figures make me weep. The game was fantastic.
Randolph Freelander
Member
Well, I said as much, their own system would certainly seem to be option 1. If they have a plan they're confident will succeed, execute that plan. If they do not have that confidence, the next logical step (to me) is attempting to make it work on other platforms. If it doesn't work, so be it, not much harm would be done as long as they executed smartly. But they would do it with eyes wide open, only knowing that they had no intention of making a new console. (At least, not under present market conditions. If something crazy happened, like Sony cratering and Microsoft electing to get out of gaming or consumer devices entirely, all bets are off.)
well i think they should go third-party in any respect as an absolute last resort. i think it makes little sense for them to make console games while they still have a handheld division going strong. it would be an admittance that they are winding up on hardware production, and it creates gaps in their lineups for such a platform.
i think one handheld for them is preferable to also making console games for other companies.
instead of doing any of that though, i think they should try and reach families through affordable hardware of their own. i suggested making another handheld much like they have: a generational graphic increase, adding a standard controller feature (dual analog)... basically a prettier ps vita, except it has stuff like pokemon, fire emblem, mario kart, etc.
in addition to that, open a budget handheld line. something $80-100 or less, like what the game boy micro was. give it smaller titles and make it into a sort of lifestyle thing (include the pedometer features in the wii fit u meter, or the streetpass stuff from the 3ds). maybe all this has is eshop titles and virtual console games through the snes era.
in short, i think price is a huge barrier.
i think that in a third-party scenario, nintendo would have to produce games for the start of a generation. doing it right in the middle would be an awful proposition, but they could get the ball rolling with outsourced ports.
Yes, I would say trying their hand at another console that may or may not sell is a more logical move than devaluing their brand by becoming a software publisher. Maybe I could see them reevaluating their approach if that fails too, but not so soon after releasing a 100 million-seller. There were a lot of things fundamentally wrong about how they approached the Wii U, but I'm pretty sure Nintendo would try to fix those things in the form of another hardware launch of some sort before unequivocally throwing in the towel.
And doubling down on the handheld market isn't an issue. They own it. Everyone knew it was going to decline. What's left is theirs and it's doing considerably well for what it is. I don't know how you'll ever make that a satisfactory explanation for Joe Wall Street who can't tell the difference between a phone and a portable video game system, but it's something I'm certain Nintendo will stick to, at least until their handhelds reach Vita levels. It's the consoles that are the problem.
lazybones18
Banned
What did I just read.
That may be their biggest problem : whereas other constructor can upgrade their hardware, Nintendo is expected to revolutionize something everytime they make a new product (hardware or software).
Aquamarine
Member
For about 30 minutes.
It ended the day at -6%, a clear sign that the stock isn't going to spiral on this exact news alone.
polyh3dron
Banned
You're being a bit too optimistic there.. This will most likely be a negative change, like badly developed F2P mobile games that are pay to win.. kinda like Squeenix.
I think the bigger problem is what Nintendo do is going to do now.
1. If thy start making smartphone games, doesn't that send out signals like "why buy our handheld when we are making smartphone games!" And loose a big chunk of potential customers that want to buy their 2DS?
2. Releasing games for other consoles wouldn't work since they are so slow at making HD games and it would be costly to try to match the best looking games that are coming out this gen?
1. If thy start making smartphone games, doesn't that send out signals like "why buy our handheld when we are making smartphone games!" And loose a big chunk of potential customers that want to buy their 2DS?
2. Releasing games for other consoles wouldn't work since they are so slow at making HD games and it would be costly to try to match the best looking games that are coming out this gen?
Thomas_Daly
Banned
I am so sad for NintendoNintendo this gen:
I laughed the whole way through. :/ Other than maybe some iOS/Android mobile devices I don't think we will see Nintendo titles on other systems like the PS4/XBO.
I think they need a game with a good subscription or f2p model. Thats where the huge and sustainable cash comes from these days. Then Iwata needs to start money hatting. Minecraft for Wii U and 3ds should be a top priority. Then they should start really looking at upcoming indies and get some exclusives that way. Its time to start actually marketing the Wii U.
Ok, that is good. More of an aberation. Still though a 6% drop is not great. Nintendo needs to act fast to get confidence back, this is serious.
Tricky I Shadow
Banned
Not even gonna lie, I’m glad this is happening to Nintendo. They fully deserve it and need a harsh wake up call.
What is more shocking than the drop, is that all these so called "expert" analysts in the markers are surprised at the news. Nintendo's forecast of 9 million units was never going to happen, and, even if it was by the end Q2 they should have shipped in the region of 5 to 6 million to be on the correct run rate to achieve the 9 million.
Nintendo for my money have mislead investors and the main man should step down for that alone. And the "expert" have proved they nothing of the sort. If we could all spot Nintendo would never achieve their forecast WTF were these experts doing? (probably playing COD!)
Nintendo for my money have mislead investors and the main man should step down for that alone. And the "expert" have proved they nothing of the sort. If we could all spot Nintendo would never achieve their forecast WTF were these experts doing? (probably playing COD!)
I think one of the bigger problems people aren't talking enough about is exactly when would be the right time for Nintendo to release a new console?
I already have my personal idea for what their new direction should be for their next console, but when do they release it?
If they do a short life cycle for Wii U (4 years? They can't go earlier than that) that leaves them launching the successor in 2016. Which is probably the prime of the PS4 and Xbone. Does it make sense to launch a new console 2 or even 3 years before the competition?
If they do a standard life cycle for Wii U (5-6 years), that brings them closer to PS5/Xbtwo launch, for sure... but man, I can't imagine having to endure the Wii U for another 4 or 5 years at this point. I don't know what notable software they can possibly have in 2016, let alone 2017 or 2018.
what I'm trying to say is... Nintendo is kinda fucked in this regard. Grind it out, or mercy kill it in 2 years just when PS4/Xbone are hitting their stride?
Anyone have any ideas? lol
I already have my personal idea for what their new direction should be for their next console, but when do they release it?
If they do a short life cycle for Wii U (4 years? They can't go earlier than that) that leaves them launching the successor in 2016. Which is probably the prime of the PS4 and Xbone. Does it make sense to launch a new console 2 or even 3 years before the competition?
If they do a standard life cycle for Wii U (5-6 years), that brings them closer to PS5/Xbtwo launch, for sure... but man, I can't imagine having to endure the Wii U for another 4 or 5 years at this point. I don't know what notable software they can possibly have in 2016, let alone 2017 or 2018.
what I'm trying to say is... Nintendo is kinda fucked in this regard. Grind it out, or mercy kill it in 2 years just when PS4/Xbone are hitting their stride?
Anyone have any ideas? lol
A link to their...stock page? (I don't know how it's called, sorry XD).
If you consider that they have to launch also the successor of 3ds meanwhile, the 3-4 years timeline is practically impossible, unless they want to end up with the same development issues as for Wii U.
Edit: Also from a financial point of view I don't think they afford all the R&D costs for both console and handheld in the next 2-3 years. I know that they are already working on them, but the costs are much higher towards the launch.
Get the successor out around 2017 and use it as a pivot for a console that releases around the time the next ones do.
StreetsAhead
Member
Let's see how they do with Steeldiver Subwars, when they release that, then. I do imagine we'll see more titles like Wii Sports Club, Karaoke Wii U, and stuff like that.
If Iwata is smart he stops all first party Wii U development right now, gets the teams working on Metroid Prime 4, Super Mario Next and Zelda Next, gets an exclusive made by Epic Games, conceives a new 2 TF hardware priced competitively with PS4 or slightly below and releases all of it together in early 2016.
Azure Dream
Member
And then he has breakfast.
I know I'm in a minority, but if they went third party, I'd see it as a step forward. Nintendo are struggling with a lot of things, HD development, internet infrastructure, hardware, etc. Releasing on another platform means they don't have to worry about some of those things (again hardware, internet, etc), because it's already in place and they can focus on making games.
IMO, Nintendo are in the business of making and selling games. There's a huge user base out there waiting, why not sell them some games?
Before or after filing for bankruptcy?
I agree with this. There is no point continuing with development of wii u games. Its just sinking money into a hole.
I thought people were sick and tired of Mario, Zelda, DK etc?
Personally, I hope for a shorter life cycle, even if it means releasing when the others are hitting their stride. Sitting out the Wii U for 6 years seems like torture for their stock (and my stock!).
If anything, the audience being so unaware of the Wii U might even give Nintendo the chance to release a "proper" Wii successor that has an improved Wiimote and addresses the same audience.
Also, some have mentioned a shorter lifecycle (or killing the console right away) would really upset consumers. While this is probably true (ignoring the prematurely killed Xbox), I think there is a way for Nintendo to mollify their fanbase:
Make the gamepad compatible with the next console. That way it's still useful for Off-TV play etc.
The next console should, of course, not include a gamepad, but it could be sold as an accessory.
That's true too. Though the 3DS is obviously in MUCH better shape than the Wii U at this point. Would it be that surprising if 3DS has a longer life than Wii U? While they are having issues in the handheld space (mobile games), it's nothing compared to what they're going through in the console space. Shouldn't fixing those problems be their first priority?
You've gotten yourself into quite a mess, Nintendo...
clay_ghost
Member
I Just hope Nintendo stick with Wii u for at least 2 more years.
I would like to see a F2P model from Nintendo as a way to create extra revenue but those games would to have to be designed in a way to keep players playing. It would not be as simple as charging players for extra lives or some shit imo.
DeFiBkIlLeR
Banned
But the good news is, the day I'll be able to buy a discontinued WiiU for $50 with the 6 or 7 triple A releases for it at $5 each has come alot closer..)
)
Cygnus X-1
Member
This will put pressure on Iwata, hopefully. Real pressure I mean. That will lead him to operate significant changes.
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