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[Thebonehead]

AMD have showcased this video showing that the 7900 series cards offer "maximum RT performance"

Ironically they show cyberpunk using medium rt settings in it, So is medium the new max?

This video seems like a misfire, in that they should be extolling the virtues they have to hand, i.e. vram and price to raster performance, rather than solely focusing on something their competitors do better.

What say you gaf?

 

[YCoCg]

 

[PlayofSparta]

Dunno, but I love my RX 6800 XT Taichi OC.
RT is shit on this gpu and probably on those from the OP, but oh boy I can run almost every game in 4k/60fps.

 

[Sakura]

Maybe they mean maximum within the AMD family of GPUs.

 

[Fredrik]

Medium ray-tracing and fsr set to performance = 67fps on Cyberpunk
Seems really low, no?
Don’t know what this card is usually compared with though.

 

[Tarnpanzer]

They sure have a weird definition for "max RT performance".

 

[OCASM]

AMD is still very competitive in rasterization performance but they need to do something about ray tracing because there they're getting completely destroyed by NVIDIA.

 

[lh032]

probably good news for consoles i assume?

 

[DenchDeckard]

Poor AMD. They know the windo for raytracing is nearly up, and they haven't caught up. Within on or two more generations of nvidia cards this will be very much the norm for PC development and leap frog it again over consoles, so AMD need to catch up....they saw far from it.

 

[FIREKNIGHT2029]

They are completely getting smoked by Nvidia when it comes to RT performance so I don't know what they mean by 'max RT performance".


That's just false advertising right there.

 

[Kataploom]

Maybe they mean maximum within the AMD family of GPUs.

I think this is it, but as they made those VRAM advantage brag slides some days ago, many must be taking it as a follow up... This won't end well

 

[Bojji]

AMD is still very competitive in rasterization performance but they need to do something about ray tracing because there they're getting completely destroyed by NVIDIA.

AMD cards (RDNA2) are fine in light RT (shadows, AO, even some games with reflections) and in games that have RT on consoles performance is usually ok and close to Nvidia. But for games that have Nvidia logo and have super heavy RT effects performance is absolutely dreadful, for example anything path tracing kills AMD GPUs.

FC6 with RT in 4k:

But yeah, AMD shouldn't brag about RT performance when they are behind (sometimes by a lot).

 

[ParaSeoul]

AMD was late on RT so I have my doubts

 

[Loxus]

Poor AMD. They know the windo for raytracing is nearly up, and they haven't caught up. Within on or two more generations of nvidia cards this will be very much the norm for PC development and leap frog it again over consoles, so AMD need to catch up....they saw far from it.

AMD manage to get their best card to more or less match Nvidia last gen best. If anything, AMD is closing the gap.

This goes for FSR too, I never thought it would have been that good and well received. No doubt FSR 3 will close the gap even further.

Looking at the bigger picture, it's kind of sad people consider AMD a failure without looking at their improvement.

 

[daninthemix]

AMD is still very competitive in rasterization performance but they need to do something about ray tracing because there they're getting completely destroyed by NVIDIA.

And AI upscaling. In my tests FSR just wrecks the image compared to both native and DLSS.

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

I think AMD should not do a single thing more with their raster pipeline. Their next GPUs improvements should solely go to RT performance and AI upscaling.

I felt the single biggest slap in the face on AMD in the past 2 years was Intel releasing their first GPU and having RT on par with an Nvidia GPU and running circles around AMD GPUs in RT and reconstruction technologies. That shit is just embarrassing.

 

[lyan]

AMD is still very competitive in rasterization performance but they need to do something about ray tracing because there they're getting completely destroyed by NVIDIA.

It is unfortunate, there is a place for what they specialize in currently, the present cards as time goes on won't be able to handle future games with RT and that's when vram and rasterization performance matters, but this is a hard aspect to market to the public.

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

Poor AMD. They know the windo for raytracing is nearly up, and they haven't caught up. Within on or two more generations of nvidia cards this will be very much the norm for PC development and leap frog it again over consoles, so AMD need to catch up....they saw far from it.

AMD RT is just a generation behind Nvidia, so they are not that far behind. The issue with AMD, is that RT is its least focused on and developed tech in their GPUs.

They are doing this stupid thing on focusing on raster performance so that picks up the slack of their RT shortcomings. Whereas what they need to do is an Nvidia, and that's what they seem to not what to do. Remember the 20 series? That was Nvidia leaving raster mostly untouched from the 10 series cards but building AI and RT tech into their GPUs. AMD needs to do the same.

 

[Buggy Loop]

Poor AMD. They know the windo for raytracing is nearly up, and they haven't caught up. Within on or two more generations of nvidia cards this will be very much the norm for PC development and leap frog it again over consoles, so AMD need to catch up....they saw far from it.

They’re almost always behind in tech, but I don’t think it’s even been as worse as now with Nvidia going nuts with RT and ML

The thing is they also have to catch up in ML too. While peoples are still flabbergasted how it’s possible for cyberpunk 2077 to have path tracing due to the witchcraft that is ReSTIR (RTXDI), Nvidia is already researching the next step with NRC, neural radiance cache, using AI for even faster performances.

They’re not sitting on their laurels

AMD RT is just a generation behind Nvidia, so they are not that far behind. The issue with AMD, is that RT is its least focused on and developed tech in their GPUs.

On a RT performance per CU basis, it’s worse than Turing. Enable path tracing and Mid range Turing, while having shit performances, is also in the realm of shut performances that a 7900XTX will see 9 fps at 3840x1600 FSR balanced.

It’s hard to find direct comparison with Turing because those users are often with older CPUs too, but it’s not even 3060 territory, somewhere in mid range Turing, for a LOT more CUs

They are doing this stupid thing on focusing on raster performance so that picks up the slack of their RT shortcomings. Whereas what they need to do is an Nvidia, and that's what they seem to not what to do. Remember the 20 series? That was Nvidia leaving raster mostly untouched from the 10 series cards but building AI and RT tech into their GPUs. AMD needs to do the same.

Yeah

Their engineering decision for hybrid RT/rasterization pipeline to save silicon area and complexity to get MORE rasterization made sense. But they also never really got the advantage there either by huge margins. Nvidia has reportedly ~25% of silicon dedicated to RT and ML and they still managed to trade blows within a few % in rasterization too on a worse node (ampere). Now a 4080’s 379mm^2 is a few % difference with AMD flagship that has 529mm^2 total

So yeah, that solution is hitting a wall soon. Intel is more of a threat by catching up in RT rapidly (on paper, their drivers don’t make sense with path tracing games).

 

[RoboFu]

Technically I like the concept of amds approach. One core that does everything having RT built into every core. Eventually that will pay off but they are 2 years behind.

 

[winjer]

AMD and NVidia have different ways of doing ray tracing.
NVidia is using a shallow BVH with 3 levels, resulting in lower granularity for boxes. But NVidia can do a lot more raytriangle tests.
So Nvidia wastes little time creatimg and traversing the BVH, but then has to cast more rays.
AMD is doing a deep BVH with 8-9 levels, having greater granularity and requiring casting fewer rays.
But this has the problem of wasting a lot of time creating and traversing the BVH. And is very dependent on cache size and latency.
On RDNA2 and 3 this is mostly done on the L2 cache. One of the biggest reasons for the increase in performance in RT for RDNA3, is that it has a bigger L2 cache, with lower latency.
This improved the RT cores occupancy by a lot, compared to RDNA2.

 

[Honey Bunny]

And AI upscaling. In my tests FSR just wrecks the image compared to both native and DLSS.

I watched the DF video on this recently and while there were a couple of serious issues it was impressively close to DLSS considering its software based

 

[OverHeat]

Will go team red once they release they something that will outperform Nvidia…competition is good and at the moment they are on the losing side but time will tell if there solutions is a good bet

 

[MikeM]

Maximum? Bold claim when the 4080 and 4090 manhandle both 7900xt and xtx in RT.

My 7900xt can do RT decent but its game dependent. I want to buy CP2077 for science to check out this overdrive mode. Maybe I could run it well at 1080p? Maybe…

 

[nightmare-slain]

It's marketing bullshit. Not hating on AMD they make some good cards but this is bullshit. Nvidia 4000 cards wipe the floor with AMD cards. I think AMD are roughly a generation behind Nvidia.

They might give you the max performance but only compared to other AMD gpus and at certain settings

Will go team red once they release they something that will outperform Nvidia…competition is good and at the moment they are on the losing side but time will tell if there solutions is a good bet

My first GPU was an AMD one and I loved it. I'd happily go back but I need to see something that out performs a Nvidia card. I was seriously considering getting the 7900XT but then I saw the 4000 cards. I think the 7900XTX is technically faster than a 4080 in rasterization by a few % but Nvidia makes up for it by having better raytracing and DLSS 3. And the price difference at the time between those cards was only £150

 

[8BiTw0LF]

 

[OverHeat]

My last Radeon card

 

[nightmare-slain]

My last Radeon card

fuck sake. when was that from? early 00's?

my first GPU was the R9 290

 

[OverHeat]

fuck sake. when was that from? early 00's?

my first GPU was the R9 290

Yeah early 2000 9800pro the GOAT

ATI Radeon 9800 PRO Specs

ATI R350, 380 MHz, 8 Pixel Shaders, 4 Vertex Shaders, 8 TMUs, 8 ROPs, 128 MB DDR2, 340 MHz, 256 bit

www.techpowerup.com

 

[nightmare-slain]

Yeah early 2000 9800pro the GOAT

I did have a PC in 2000 but it was a shitty prebuilt supermarket thing. I remember my dad taking me to buy it. That's crazy to think about now I did try play some games on it.... there was Flight Simulator game that took about 15-20 minutes to load and there was a motorbike game i played all the time but I can't remember the name of it. The poor thing wasn't built for gaming. I eventually blew it up trying to plug my guitar amp into it trying to record myself. totally fried the motherboard.

 

[OverHeat]

I did have a PC in 2000 but it was a shitty prebuilt supermarket thing. I remember my dad taking me to buy it. That's crazy to think about now I did try play some games on it.... there was Flight Simulator game that took about 15-20 minutes to load and there was a motorbike game i played all the time but I can't remember the name of it. The poor thing wasn't built for gaming. I eventually blew it up trying to plug my guitar amp into it trying to record myself. totally fried the motherboard.

Motocross madness?

 

[nightmare-slain]

Motocross madness?

that's it!! i played that all the damn time. not sure why i couldn't remember the name lol.

 

[OverHeat]

This is when I switch to team green.

 

[Three]

AMD have showcased this video showing that the 7900 series cards offer "maximum RT performance"

Ironically they show cyberpunk using medium rt settings in it, So is medium the new max?

This video seems like a misfire, in that they should be extolling the virtues they have to hand, i.e. vram and price to raster performance, rather than solely focusing on something their competitors do better.

What say you gaf?

Maximum RT performance is probably a clever and disingenuous way of saying getting some level of RT but with good/max performance (fps). Not maximum RT settings.

 

[nightmare-slain]

This is when I switch to team green.

I didn't have any of those GPUs but looking at them it seems so crazy how much GPUs have changed. from simple cards with a tiny little fan stuck on it to shit like this

 

[MiguelItUp]

I wish AMD would take a deep breath and step back from these kind of things, lol. There are great things about their new GPUs, but trying to flex on RT and Nvidia just ain't it. Especially when there's plenty more that could be done, and Nvidia is doing what they're doing very well.

I just REALLY want Nvidia to get some GREAT competition, because I feel like they've gotten a little too full of themselves in a variety of ways, and they need to be grounded. AMD has come pretty close, but then they do things like this where people can look at it and go, "I don't know about that...."

 

[DonkeyPunchJr]

I wish AMD would take a deep breath and step back from these kind of things, lol. There are great things about their new GPUs, but trying to flex on RT and Nvidia just ain't it. Especially when there's plenty more that could be done, and Nvidia is doing what they're doing very well.

I just REALLY want Nvidia to get some GREAT competition, because I feel like they've gotten a little too full of themselves in a variety of ways, and they need to be grounded. AMD has come pretty close, but then they do things like this where people can look at it and go, "I don't know about that...."

Their marketing is terrible. Last week it was “sure Nvidia might be faster now, but we have more VRAM and that might be important later on”. Now it’s “hey guys we can do medium RT settings!”

 

[hlm666]

Maybe reviewers will start to include more RT enabled games in their reviews now that AMD themselves seem to think it's important.

 

[rsouzadk]

As much as i like amd, their gpus right now even with the jump in performance are far from a good buy as rdna2 were. AMD just shit themselves princing it like it is now, but i have to give credits to the nvidia shit pricing themselves too.

This whole generation (apart from the amazing tech, like path tracing, dlss3, etc), seems like a complete scam just because pricing.

 

[DaGwaphics]

Well, they can match Nvidia RT performance from the 3000s series with the newest parts. Maximum 2020 RT.

 

[MiguelItUp]

Their marketing is terrible. Last week it was “sure Nvidia might be faster now, but we have more VRAM and that might be important later on”. Now it’s “hey guys we can do medium RT settings!”

Yeaaaaah, on one hand I respect them for trying, but also, we're not stupid.

 

[JackMcGunns]

Medium ray-tracing and fsr set to performance = 67fps on Cyberpunk
Seems really low, no?
Don’t know what this card is usually compared with though.

67 average framerate with no frame generation?

 

[JackMcGunns]

AMD manage to get their best card to more or less match Nvidia last gen best. If anything, AMD is closing the gap.

This goes for FSR too, I never thought it would have been that good and well received. No doubt FSR 3 will close the gap even further.

Looking at the bigger picture, it's kind of sad people consider AMD a failure without looking at their improvement.

How's the performance/dollar between the 7900 XTX vs 4080 and 4090?

AMD 7900 XTX = $1000
nVidia 4080 RTX = $1200
nVidia 4090 RTX = $1600 (Some retailers asking $1800 and $2000)

Quick math shows a 20% gain in price for only a 16% gain in performance and a 60% gain in price for the 4090 base, for a 55% performance gain, unless you paid 1800 or 2000, now you're looking at 80% and up to 100% price hike for 55% performance.... hmm.

 

[Fredrik]

67 average framerate with no frame generation?

With RT set to medium, I think that’s without reflections, and FSR set to performance means aggressive AI upscaling

 

[JackMcGunns]

With RT set to medium, I think that’s without reflections, and FSR set to performance means aggressive AI upscaling

Where did you read those details?

 

[Fredrik]

Where did you read those details?

There is a text at the bottom of the video with the details.

 

[poppabk]

I wish AMD would take a deep breath and step back from these kind of things, lol. There are great things about their new GPUs, but trying to flex on RT and Nvidia just ain't it. Especially when there's plenty more that could be done, and Nvidia is doing what they're doing very well.

I just REALLY want Nvidia to get some GREAT competition, because I feel like they've gotten a little too full of themselves in a variety of ways, and they need to be grounded. AMD has come pretty close, but then they do things like this where people can look at it and go, "I don't know about that...."

I don't think they are trying to flex on anyone, they are just showing that their cards can also do RT, and that you can get decent framerates (albeit with performance on FSR2 which never looks as nice for me as in these videos, quality is the only setting I use). They can't give up mindshare completely on the only thing that can really stress a modern GPU currently.

 

[OmegaSupreme]

Maximum for them.

 

[01011001]

doesn't event the Intel A770 run Cyberpunk in RT Overdrive at higher framerates than the 7900XTX?

 

[MikeM]

This is when I switch to team green.

Man reminds me of my first ever gaming pc upgrade- BFG 6600GT