arkhamguy123
Member
It’s astounding to me media molecule was left standing after this
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Graphical Fidelity I Expect This Gen
- Thread starter ResetEraVetVIP
- Start date
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
they already had their layoffs last year iirc but yeah, someone over at SIE must be banging someone higher up at Media Molecule. They took 9 years to release dreams which flopped and have done nothing since.
AeonGaidenRaiden
Member
We are only 3 years into this gen, we got at least another 3 years to go before PS6.
arkhamguy123
Member
I’d unironically believe that at this point lol
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
probably 4-5 years yeah, but with games taking forever to make, i wonder if laying off devs at your biggest most talented studios is going to impact their games for the remainder of this gen.
I hope its the gaas cancellations and all the people laid off are mp devs. If thats the case then we might get Horizon 3 earlier than 2027 which would be fantastic. Same goes for ND who also started dev on their next game in 2022. They are making two games though so not sure how this impacts them. insomniac is also making venom 2025 and wolverine 2026, but they werent making any gaas games so its going to undoubtedly cause delays.
I guess we will see this E3 if ND, GG and SSM show up with some next gen looking games.
Represent.
Represent(ative) of bad opinions
Denis Villeneuve: ‘Movies Have Been Corrupted by Television’ and a ‘Danger in Hollywood’ Is Thinking About ‘Release Dates, Not Quality’
- Denis Villenuve in an interview today.
If he were a game developer he would ABSOLUTELY be a huge graphics whore - And his games would look fucking incredible. With amazing art AND tech.
God I wish we had more devs in this medium with the mindset of Villeneuve.
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
new page, new water gifs. apologies to 100 posts per page users.
Its surprises me that ND had their own version of the waves tech and they built this whole thing just for this one area. Seattle in the game has no beaches that do this. Absolutely mad.
The reflections or rather refractions in Horizon are simply beautiful. its funny, Avatar uses RT reflections and yet GG was able to do more with SSR reflections.
Its surprises me that ND had their own version of the waves tech and they built this whole thing just for this one area. Seattle in the game has no beaches that do this. Absolutely mad.
The reflections or rather refractions in Horizon are simply beautiful. its funny, Avatar uses RT reflections and yet GG was able to do more with SSR reflections.
Represent.
Represent(ative) of bad opinions
To add on to my Villenueve quote above,
I think he's absolutely right.
Most of my favourite films of all time have been memorable experiences. I don't come out there thinking wow that was a great line of diologue. It helps, but truly memorable cinema has been all about the image and sound. Which add to the ... experience.
The Revenant, The Raid 1 & 2, Fury Road
^
My top 3 movies of the last decade. All memorable for their experiences. We need game devs with vision. I'd love to see what someone like him did in this medium.
I think he's absolutely right.
Most of my favourite films of all time have been memorable experiences. I don't come out there thinking wow that was a great line of diologue. It helps, but truly memorable cinema has been all about the image and sound. Which add to the ... experience.
The Revenant, The Raid 1 & 2, Fury Road
^
My top 3 movies of the last decade. All memorable for their experiences. We need game devs with vision. I'd love to see what someone like him did in this medium.
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
hes wrong about dialogue. Just yesterday Nolan was talking about the 'You either die a hero or live long enough to see a villain" line haunting him since TDK came out because he didnt write or understand it, but thats the one that gets quoted the most.
Arnold's I'll be back line is just as iconic as any setpiece in Terminator 1.
I do agree that cinema is a visual medium and they need to deliver on pushing action and that cinematic flair cheaper tv shows just cant. Nolan and Villenvue have both made careers out of pushing that theater experience, and they are no different than Rockstar and Naughty Dog who realize that pushing the graphics bar is just as important to deliver a great gaming experience.
I think both dialogue and visuals go hand in hand just like how gameplay and graphics go hand in hand. Avatar and Alan Wake 2 were the best looking games last year but they sucked in the gameplay department, and honestly just made them tedious to play.
samoilaaa
Member
i disagree , i love one of his movies (sicario) for the dialog and the dark gritty characters not because the movie looks good
Eiknarf
Member
Yup
They are NOT rushing a PS6 when they’re not even rushing games.
The space/time between consoles will be longer
AeonGaidenRaiden
Member
I mean I'm all for great visuals but if no dialogue, then no deep story. Otherwise, we get a beautiful game, boring as hell like Crysis. Same goes for movies, I've seen plenty of them that made me fall asleep in the cinema but had amazing visuals.
Dialogue can absolutely take a movie to another level. You may not think that exactly when you hear the line, but you will probably remember the good ones without even trying.
I'm your huckleberry.
You tell'em I'm coming and hells coming with me.
We could list hundreds of movie quotes people could pick the movie from just one the line.
Frankly my dear I don't give a damn.
I havn't seen this guys 2nd part to dune yet but I can't remember any notable dialogue from part 1 and it felt pretty soulless. 300 was more narrated than dialogue driven and again people are probably going to remember a couple of lines from that. I will agree that porn should stay away from dialogue though
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
So she was the one who created the fake trailer that they didnt even come close to achieving?
But yeah, this is awful news. And proves that its not just some gaas mp devs like
James Sawyer Ford
was thinking. We are going to see the ripple effects of this for years to come. Sony shouldve doubled down and cultivated their talent, and come out of these uncertain times with a stronger, more experienced and grateful workforce. Instead they threw these devs under the bus and this will cost them months if not years in delays.
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Balducci30
Member
I think a lot of people are misinterpreting him. A movie is told in pictures more than dialogue - the more you can tell visually the better. Almost like how a great photograph can tell a story in a frame - a movie follows the same rules ideally. The entire concept of a movie is that it’s moving pictures. It’s not totally analogous to other mediums in poetry the words would be the most important thing. Games are interactive - they’re based on gameplay so in a game the gameplay/interactivity would be the most important thing.
James Sawyer Ford
Gold Member
So she was the one who created the fake trailer that they didnt even come close to achieving?
But yeah, this is awful news. And proves that its not just some gaas mp devs like
I never said it was just MP devs?
And I agree these layoffs at the successful studios reek of “follow the leader” groupthink amongst the biggest companies right now. Everyone else is laying off, so we should too.
Sony’s margins dropped due to Bungie acquisition costs but the company is still profitable. Why not just cut everyone’s bonus temporarily instead? I know insomniac has a good profit sharing incentive system from a dev I know that used to work there
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arkhamguy123
Member
How does this game punk Spider-Man 2 so hardSome Ratchet and Clank Rift Apart on PC in 4K Ultrawide, DLSS and Raytracing with ReShade.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
GermanZepp
Member
GymWolf
Member
Because cg pixar graphic is way easier to achieve than photorealism.
But yeah, ratchet trounce sp2 so much that is not even funny.
GymWolf
Member
Remember people, they divided the game in 3 parts to give (wrong verb, can't remember the correct one) the game justice and have skyhigh production values, not because they want to dry tifa's tits more than your average italian politician.i really don’t like how low res and low Polly the asset quality feels in final fantasy rebirth. This is one of those games that look better in gifs and screenshots than they do on the big screen. I’m playing in graphics mode and while the lighting in the city is very good, the rest feels worse than hogwarts did in hogsmead. I will download that game again to compare but i just don’t like the blurry muddy look of the textures in this city.
Jesus modern square can't fuck off sooner enough...
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
I think their artists didn’t draw these low poly assets. I’m sure they are much higher res but for some fucking reason they appear this way. Could be a vram issue. Maybe they should’ve used ue5 nanite to reduce the vram footprint because the city is still very dense so clearly they are pushing more data, just not efficiently enough and it results in a very underwhelming 4k image.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Lol this is hilarious. its like they forgot shadows and AO.
TheRedRiders
Member
I could care less about lighting conditions when the faces look like plastic dolls, it lacks the micro-details and the more nuanced facial animations that HFW has as well.
GymWolf
Member
Texture work at its finest.Lol this is hilarious. its like they forgot shadows and AO.
Bojji
Member
It looks like average PS4 game, I bet they aren't using more than half of RAM on this.
There is NO EXCUSE for textures like that in big budget game, there were PS3 games with better assets. Lighting is also abysmal.
ckstine
Member
mein gottLol this is hilarious. its like they forgot shadows and AO.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
I think the vram is going into the draw distance. They are not hiding the draw distance with fog and the ground level detail is definitely higher than it is in last gen games. The city on the other hand could look way better.
Here are some comparisons because while the game looks very underwhelming, i think it is doing some things better when you put it side by side next to even HFW which is basically fogging up everything not directly in front of you.
Here are some comparisons because while the game looks very underwhelming, i think it is doing some things better when you put it side by side next to even HFW which is basically fogging up everything not directly in front of you.
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
I think what's so disappointing is that FF7 Remake looked awesome when it came out and now, with Rebirth being exclusive on next gen machines, there's nothing to show for it. Like, why couldn't they deliver something equally impressive for the hardware this time around? I guess you could say its all due to scale, which dwarfs the linear areas of Remake but still that was on Ps4 pro and this is PS5. This has been the same disappointing story all gen long though ..games i expected to look way better on more powerful hardware
Bojji
Member
Maybe they are using it but many models use pitiful number of polygons.
JCreasy
Member
So, it’s not a train wreck by any means.
Cut scenes are looking great. The character model fidelity feels like it got a huge upgrade, which is really impressive considering those elements are animated in real-time.
SlimySnake
mentioned ground detail, which crazy enough, does look amazing. I noticed it immediately, the way I noticed the dense geometry of the interior environments in Alan Wake 2. Is it a funny thing to priortize? Maybe. But I can appreciate the intense effort it took to get this right. I’m not turning the camera to stare at the in-game model of Cloud that traverses the environment. I’m looking for fiends to fight and leveling up the team. And the particle effects from all the magical elements are absolutely stunning. That visual feedback of power is what you want in a next-gen RPG.
If I stand back and soak in all the detail of Kalm, it’s impressive. It has the tonal vibe of a Disneyland biome. It resonates.
Maybe the lighting is sub-par. It hasn’t been a distraction for me. When specific beats need to look good, they actually look great!
But yeah, maybe they’ll move to Unreal Engine 5 for the final installment. But overall I think they nailed this for Rebirth.
I HAATED the NPC character models in Remake. Those were embarrassing. They’ve gotten an upgrade in Rebirth. I’m thankful for that.
Bojji
Member
In most of those games you disable depth of field and get the same effect. So looks like they didn't use it in Rebirth much.
I completed ER on PS5 and thought that this big ass tree had low res assets. PC version showed me otherwise when I disabled DOF:
Default
Disabled DOF:
Plus look at mountains in the distance ^
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Toots
Gold Member
Strong words, but understandable with context :
He must have read my post on the Dune thread talking about the Herzog itw and the need for transcendent images in society and took it a little bit too far. I can rein him in on that.
So Denis, if you're reading me now, im open for a co-director seat on part 3, let's do it for mankind
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
So, it’s not a train wreck by any means.
Cut scenes are looking great. The character model fidelity feels like it got a huge upgrade, which is really impressive considering those elements are animated in real-time.
I’m not turning the camera to stare at the in-game model of Cloud that traverses the environment. I’m looking for fiends to fight and leveling up the team. And the particle effects from all the magical elements are absolutely stunning. That visual feedback of power is what you want in a next-gen RPG.
If I stand back and soak in all the detail of Kalm, it’s impressive. It has the tonal vibe of a Disneyland biome. It resonates.
Maybe the lighting is sub-par. It hasn’t been a distraction for me. When specific beats need to look good, they actually look great!
But yeah, maybe they’ll move to Unreal Engine 5 for the final installment. But overall I think they nailed this for Rebirth.
I HAATED the NPC character models in Remake. Those were embarrassing. They’ve gotten an upgrade in Rebirth. I’m thankful for that.
I agree it can still look really nice at times
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
It’s fine yes but it could be better. The only problem is that competent and fine and serviceable for a legendary game like this is not good enough. Not as a PS5 exclusive. Not as a $70 game. And definitely not from Square Enix's A team. You need these big games to push the bar or you end up in a state of arrested development where even the biggest studios settle for serviceable and competent games and call it a day.
Their next game is going to come out on the PS6 in 2028. What if we get another minimal upgrade like this? I dont think anyone will be happy with serviceable in 2028 when you are spending $80 on a new game and $600 on a new console.
Lethal01
Member
People will continue to be fine with serviceable graphics if the game is worth it to them in other ways.
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i really don’t like how low res and low Polly the asset quality feels in final fantasy rebirth. This is one of those games that look better in gifs and screenshots than they do on the big screen. I’m playing in graphics mode and while the lighting in the city is very good, the rest feels worse than hogwarts did in hogsmead. I will download that game again to compare but i just don’t like the blurry muddy look of the textures in this city.
We are talking about a console that has only 13GB of RAM available to games. That's not enough when you are trying to draw highly detailed models on big dense areas. Not at least on an engine whit lots of problems on memory management.
To fit in memory budget they are using LOD 1, 2 or 3 at the initial level instead of using LOD 0 even on the close range. If they had a much more advanced streaming system to take full advantage of Ps5 SSD and I/O this wouldn't happen... Of course no one is making it, so that's why memory quantity and speed are so important when you pretend to increase detail and density at the same time.
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
That's just the thing though. Devs across the board have been too cheap and lazy tp upgrade their engines this gen. Remember, the big innovation this gen was the I/O and what that could do for streaming assets. Yeah, a big game like this ypu expect Square to have done better ...they did it for FF7 Remake last gen. Kalm in this game has a lot of geometry but the texture work is a clear drop from Remake, which I spemt the ladt two days playing trying to beat prior to Rebirth.
Also- wtf is up with the lighting transitions in this game? The gamma jumps around and its very jarring. What an amateurish mistake from Square ...they need to fix that crap.
Luipadre
Member
i really don’t like how low res and low Polly the asset quality feels in final fantasy rebirth. This is one of those games that look better in gifs and screenshots than they do on the big screen. I’m playing in graphics mode and while the lighting in the city is very good, the rest feels worse than hogwarts did in hogsmead. I will download that game again to compare but i just don’t like the blurry muddy look of the textures in this city.
The complete lack of AO is what kills the whole image for me. Image has 0 depth. FF16 had soooo good shadows and AO
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