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[MiguelItUp]

I think saying "stagnated" is a bit harsh. Visuals have improved because of improvements to lighting, shadows, effects, and more. Hell, just overall performance. Improved engines and RTX have definitely helped. But that was to be expected when the tech was discussed. Games can and have looked better, and it's thanks to those things. We weren't intended to have insane and extremely noticeable graphical upgrades. But improved graphical elements? Sure.

 

[Reizo Ryuu]

Completely false, texture work alone has vastly improved thanks to the higher base value of vram for the consoles.

 

[Johnny Concrete]

I don’t care about how big of a leap it is, but I still get wowed by game graphics very often.

Games are just fucking gorgeous nowadays.

 

[angrod14]

Tell me you didn't play Part II without telling me you didn't play Part II.

If we're talking strictly about graphics I think Demon Souls and Burning Shores are a little bit above; but if we assess overal presentation like art design, animations, etc. I think Part II is still king.

 

[Grildon Tundy]

There's a heated debate about Hellblade 2 vs Death Stranding 2 currently, both featuring realistic looking humans in realistic looking environments animated realistically with mocap on everything. I saw another one where the exact same car gets analyzed under slightly different lighting conditions in GT7 and Forza on the same track.

Reminds me of watching wine tasters.

Lmao I feel seen

 

[MayauMiao]

I say it barely made much impact unlike it did during the Playstation 1/Sega Saturn to Playstation 2/Dreamcast.

Unfortunately in some case:

 

[Sub_Level]

For me personally I’m fine with OG Xbox graphics. 360 is acceptable too. I dont need games to look much better than this.

 

[Raonak]

FACT: Graphics are no longer limited by specs, but by game budgets.

 

[iQuasarLV]

A lot of people hooing and cawing about unreleased games being proof that OP is absolutely crazy

I will wait for the innevitable thread in a few years about how AGAIN the trailers lied about what the released product eventually WAS NOT and the developers need to be held accountable for lying to us.

In other words keep your comments to actual realeased games and not trailers of supposed gameplay!

 

[HeWhoWalks]

not a hot take at all, theres a few outliers, but the vast majority of games this gen look worse than TLOU 2. A game from 2020.

From a technical aspect, The Remastered Part II, sure, thanks to updated textures and a few other minor enhancements. The PS4 version, however, was surpassed by a number of games (or had things about it that were bested)...

- Alan Wake 2 [PC] (better environments/lighting/reflections..... by far)
- Callisto Protocol (comparable character models, better environments)
- Cyberpunk 2077 [PC] (better environments/lighting/reflections, again, by far)
- Horizon: Forbidden West (better environments/lighting)
- Last Of Us: Pt I (better everything)
- Metro: Exodus Enhanced Edition [PC] (far better lighting thanks to realtime GI, better reflections)
- Spider-Man 2 (better hair on some characters, better reflections and LoD by far)
- Hellblade II will best it with character models (although not by much, considering it'll mainly be Senua's model) and environments.

That said, yes, that game still holds up well and the Remastered Version often times looks like a current gen game.

 

[March Climber]

Unfortunately in some case:

Is there a version of this video where the white values aren't blown out for SS? It looks like someone didn't adjust the game's settings at all and everything has a faded white haze, which is not how it looks in other videos.

If the video creator did it on purpose I feel like it was unnecessary.

 

[Zathalus]

On consoles certainly but DLSS and RT/PT on PC is making some big leaps in visuals, albeit requiring hefty processing power.

 

[MayauMiao]

Is there a version of this video where the white values aren't blown out for SS? It looks like someone didn't adjust the game's settings at all and everything has a faded white haze, which is not how it looks in other videos.

If the video creator did it on purpose I feel like it was unnecessary.

Here is another one claim to use max settings.

 

[T4keD0wN]

lol imo the worst 2 examples. especially avatar which looks like a ps3 game in some scenes. nah man.
alan wake 2 is fine but it's baked game. Just like tlou2 for the most part... and its shit on consoles

Pathtracing makes a big difference when it comes to the details, especially the foliage. It makes the whole thing pop to life, but youre right, when theres no foliage its pretty hard to tell the difference. (dont really care how its on consoles, i though we should look for the best case scenarios and not artificialy limited ones in which case the stagnation complaint doesnt make much sense, i would say to look at the loading times, no stagnation there)

Havent found a single spot in Avatar that doesnt look "industry leading" overall, i think its the closest a game has gotten to Crysis situation since 2007, but i havent scouted the whole map, i did take 5gb of screenshots. The enviroment there is next level, but its hard to tell from still images, the impressive part is the dynamic vegetation and lightning.

I am curious though, what do you think would be better examples?

 

[BennyBlanco]

*laughs in path traced cyberpunk*

Yea, this and raytraced Alan Wake 2 are mindblowing at times

 

[iQuasarLV]

Here is another one claim to use max settings.

I am a bit extreme here, buuuut that game reminds me of launch version of Hellgate:London. Its just a feeling while watching that gameplay. Maybe its the static environments and 1-2 enemies on screen at a time.

 

[Celcius]

Just compare Tekken 7 to Tekken 8.
Graphics are definitely still getting better and we've still got a long ways to go as well.

 

[Trogdor1123]

It's not as important as frame rate that's for sure.

Agreed, I’ll take increased frames every day and I suspect that costs less to implement.

 

[Shadowstar39]

All I can say is man are gamers spoiled today. People bitching about not having 120fps and 4k. I remember playing quake 3 on my aging voodoo 2 at 18-24fps at 800x600 resolution, and loving every minute of it.

That being said, we could have better graphics now, but people demanded frame rate and 4k. We were at 1080p (and sub) at 30fps last gen. When you push for native 4k you don't have power left for much better graphics. That's just how it is. Drop to 30fps and you can get more out of it. Drop to 1080p and you can get the jump but people want 4k so don't expect it anytime soon.

Tv makers pushed 4k too soon, imo. The hardware wasn't ready. Resolution doesn't have to raise anymore there is a point where its not really needed, so yeah maybe next gen we will get a bigger boost.

Another thing is it cost too much. Most of the games with cool new ideas are indy pc titles or Japanese games that focus on art style over tech.
I'll take a good fun game in ps1 era low-fi 3d over a boring gorgeous game any day.

 

[Schmendrick]

Good graphics have become cheap while great graphics continue to get more and more expensive. AAA games with higher budgets than the biggest Hollywood movies where every flop can sink the studio are to blame for the stagnation.

I don't like it but I can't fault a producer for not being willing to risk it all just to pander to the few enthusiast that really care.
Gotta thank the few developers that still want to push the envelope despite all that.

 

[Shadowstar39]

its because 60fps has become a important thing for consoles

No one wants to agree, but this right here is right. People bitched about having 60fps and 4k and guess what... games are made for that , the graphics takes a hit. Also series s isn't helping matters.

 

[FIREKNIGHT2029]

Hard disagree but to each his own.

 

[NightmareFarm]

Just compare Tekken 7 to Tekken 8.
Graphics are definitely still getting better and we've still got a long ways to go as well.

Not that big of a difference tbh. Tekken 8 doesn't really look significantly better than what could be done on an 8th gen console.

 

[acm2000]

do you want mega graphics and 30fps or upscaled 60fps? thats the price to pay

 

[bender]

For me personally I’m fine with OG Xbox graphics. 360 is acceptable too. I dont need games to look much better than this.

I've been saying for the longest time that I'm perfectly happy with older generations graphics, just with better resolutions and framerates. I do think we are quickly approaching that point naturally. because of the below statement:

FACT: Graphics are no longer limited by specs, but by game budgets.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

All the best games value interactivity over visual fidelity...THANK GOD.

 

[Toons]

What you’re actually seeing is a talent problem. Talented people are running away from the industry.

Yea because the industry and its consumers rarely reward the talent.

The graph is are great in a ton of the games.... but thats now been commodities to be an expectation and not something actually worthy of praise. I mean tlou2 is graphically incredible but for the longest time that was not the thing being talked about with that game. Same goes for many others.

The demands only keep piling up and so a bunch of releases become make or break or the studio costing more than blockbuster films.

Then the consumers ask why games keep getting remaster re-releases.

Some studios have figured this out. The elder ring style games dont put graphics above content and gameplay and they get rewarded for it. Graphics don't matter nearly as much as that other stuff.

 

[SmokedMeat]

I’m absolutely happy with the way games look today. All of this pushing for bigger and better everything is just going to drive this industry even further towards monetization, no risks, sequels, remasters, and fewer releases.

 

[SlimySnake]

Nah. We’ve seen plenty of noticeable improvements. In games set to release this year and the next, as well as games released last year.

 

[Pegasus Actual]

Do you understand the concept of diminishing returns?

People in general don't.

I'm sure there are others, but statistics, (micro)economics, and physics at like the high school/college 101 level come to mind as things that are absolutely essential in understanding the world around me, but that most people in general have zero clue about.

 

[FunkMiller]

What could it possibly be about a video games generation where one company puts out a weak ass white shit box, and the other decides it wants to throw everything out on PC, that would make it worse for graphical improvements?

 

[arkhamguy123]

Surely then all the games without a 60fps mode must advance visuals to the true next generation, like Gotham Knights.

Or like matrix demo and the UE5 ruins demo. Good try though

 

[arkhamguy123]

What could it possibly be about a video games generation where one company puts out a weak ass white shit box, and the other decides it wants to throw everything out on PC, that would make it worse for graphical improvements?

Also a very valid explanation

 

[Skifi28]

Or like matrix demo and the UE5 ruins demo. Good try though

So demos, not actual games, cool. If 60fps is holding visuals back, you'd think the 30fps only games would do something revolutionary, yet some of the most impressive games we've had so far have also been 60fps. Makes you think.

 

[Oddvintagechap]

Do you understand the concept of diminishing returns?

I don’t even think it’s that.

more complicated the assets, the more people are required to make it.

 

[arkhamguy123]

So demos, not actual games, cool. If 60fps is holding visuals back, you'd think the 30fps only games would do something revolutionary, yet some of the most impressive games we've had so far have also been 60fps. Makes you think.

? What’s the difference? It’s real time visuals running on PS5? You realize the game code doesn’t know it’s a mere demo right?

 

[ByWatterson]

I mean this is just objectively false.

 

[saintjules]

I think DS2 and GTAVI will really start things off.

 

[Tal Shiar Agent]

Even if that were true, why would it be a bad thing?

 

[TGO]

It could be worse, they could be going backwards like CG in the movie industry.
I'm gonna lay it out, the industry is not the same as 10 years ago while things have improved I believe only the long term Veterans actually push gameplay and graphics and ironically they don't usually push everyone's favourite 60fps unless they really wanted to from the get go.
The problem is games have gotten to the point of looking really good over a decade ago.
Now it's harder to see the improvements even though they're clearly there
Same game, a decade apart.

So yes it's diminished returns but only because we perceive it that way.

 

[Skifi28]

? What’s the difference? It’s real time visuals running on PS5? You realize the game code doesn’t know it’s a mere demo right?

It's real time visuals sure, but a game requires a ton of other system running in parallel than just the rendering. Making something that looks impressive is one thing, making an entire game out of it quite another. Graphics demos have historically been far more impressive than any other game running in the same generation of hardware. The matrix demo while looking impressive was already struggling to hold anywhere near 30fps, the moment there was any car collision fps would tank in the low 20s and that's with the very rudimentary AI in it. Imagine having tons of other gameplay systems running in parallel and proper AI that would be required of a full game sapping enen more CPU power. The Epic demo on the other hand was just a vertical slice of a character running through an environment, not the best of indications of what a full game would require.

Like I said before, as far as actual released games go, some of the most impressive ones have also had a 60fps mode while many of the 30fps ones have been meh so it doesn't appear like the framerate target is the issue like you originally implied.

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

Oh one of those threads from someone that doesn't get graphics.

I get why you would think that though. But its not true.

 

[Killer8]

We've reached the point where we can almost create anything we could dream up with extremely good quality. I mean just look at the latest Death Stranding 2 trailer. The limiting factors of what you put on screen are now more related to manpower and budgets. Visuals can still be pushed to an insane degree but it's now taking 5+ years and hundreds of millions of dollars to do it. I feel that we've reached an apex for pure visual quality and now we need to find ways of delivering those results faster and cheaper.

 

[The Dude]

I think they've gotten better but man I gotta be honest I think it's nuts how games like the batman arkham games were looking and feeling, ahead of their time imo and while I think some stuff looks much better I'm not sure we've leaped as far as when we hit games like that.

But I'm pretty happy with most of what we get currently I'd say.

 

[yamaci17]

On consoles certainly but DLSS and RT/PT on PC is making some big leaps in visuals, albeit requiring hefty processing power.

path tracing is possible even on 3070 if you target console like 30 fps experience (considering consoles would target 30 fps for visual leaps)

it involves heavy upscaling (1440p dlss balanced or quality depending on the scenario). but it works. and it looks okay (in terms of image stability). it just looks blurry due to 1440p output. 4k output would probably fare much better. but eh it is a 4 year old gpu being pushed to its limits



for me personally this has been the most visually astonishing game i've ever played despite the conditions and path tracing was %300 worth it for me. ray reconstruction is a true blessing

(lousy youtube compression does not do the game justice. it is just to show what kind of experience you can extract out of something like 3070 which is not really meant for path tracing to begin with)

i'm just a madman but im happy it works to this extend. if i target 60 fps i need to ditch all ray tracing altogether. it is a compromise. and I personally feel like path tracing makes the game look more grounded despite the comparisons. I tried disabling it and playing it that way but something felt off.

 

[The Dude]

path tracing is possible even on 3070 if you target console like 30 fps experience (considering consoles would target 30 fps for visual leaps)

it involves heavy upscaling (1440p dlss balanced or quality depending on the scenario). but it works. and it looks okay (in terms of image stability). it just looks blurry due to 1440p output. 4k output would probably fare much better. but eh it is a 4 year old gpu being pushed to its limits



for me personally this has been the most visually astonishing game i've ever played despite the conditions and path tracing was %300 worth it for me. ray reconstruction is a true blessing

(lousy youtube compression does not do the game justice. it is just to show what kind of experience you can extract out of something like 3070 which is not really meant for path tracing to begin with)

Yea I had it going on my rig, running a 4090 and it was pretty mind blowing.. Amazing game one of my favorites. It's nuts how it really is like video game twin peaks

 

[ResilientBanana]

The jump to 4k shit all over the graphics we wanted.

 

[Hoppa]

Graphics are fine where they are, 30fps is a rusty cobwebbed thing of the past and it truly belongs in a ancient civilizations museum

 

[Dorfdad]

4K is all that's needed for the next 5-7 years. 4K/60 /120 /144 would be perfect. Than you can add your raytracing and other features. 8k is a complete waste

 

[The Dude]

Graphics are fine where they are, 30fps is a rusty cobwebbed thing of the past and it truly belongs in a ancient civilizations museum

Yea it sorta blows my mind any game that is 30. 60 should easily be the standard, I like 120 personally but I would be more than content with 60 as the standard. I don't see a compelling reason that it shouldn't be either.