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[Pelta88]

He'll have a target on his head now for making that summary thread the other day.

They're hating Heis because he's made it impossible for them to go back to the old narratives?

 

[KingT731]

It's partially true. Sony is very aggressive with exclusivity. Microsoft has the money to compete in the same fashion for sure. However because they are the underdog in the console space, they often overpay for exclusivity and I would imagine Gamepass deals as well though there's no real numbers out there. That's just the nature of business. To get exclusivity on your smaller platform you are asking developers to forego revenue that could be had on a much larger platform. So yea, it's gonna cost you more.

This is partly the reason why Microsoft started reporting MAUs rather than console sales. If you can show that you have a significant enough population in your ECOSYSTEM, then who cares how many consoles you've sold? It's a narrative that will go through it's growing pains, but it's a narrative Microsoft actually has a chance to compete in. They already said they lost the console war. They won't out-console Sony or Nintendo. So they have to go with what their strengths are if they are going to exist in the short term.

They care when those MAUs include people who would be excluded due to exclusivity to a platform.

 

[Methos#1975]

Completely agree. They have squandered a lot of relationships that could have turned into acquisitions. I think BioWare, and starbreeze in particular where missed opportunities.


But hey Atleast Bethesda and double fine found their way ‘home’ so to speak.



Even bungie….. they could have let bungie make their new IPs….. still set up 343i to make halo games but Atleast with a little advisory guidance from bungie.

Mistwalker could have been their very own JRPG studio. Not sure just how much that would have helped their situation in Japan but Atleast they would have had first party JRPG, continuously.



Epic games….. after all the partnering with gears and the x360 being a bit of a poster child for unreal engine……. Suprised they bought the IP instead of thinking about buying the company that makes the IP and the technology.



Going forward I just hope all the studio they do own are turning out some quality games. At some point maybe we get lucky and MS realises that if they just support their devs in make banging exclusives they will give people a reason to want an Xbox and subscribe to gamepass.


I don’t think the acquisitions will stop after this….. whether it goes through or not. Let’s just hope they make the right choices internally and that leads to great games. Maybe in a post starfield world they really do turn a corner and they just get back to the basics. Make great games. Compete aggressively as the underdog should…. Utilise some of that financial power…. And have a little vision.


Man I should be in charge! I could get them out of this rut!

I'll add Bizarre Creations to the list, how the hell MS managed to screw that up is utterly beyond me even now a decade later.

DICE also to a degree, while not solely exclusive to the Xbox, thet were close with them during the OG Xbox period with Rallisport and Midtown Madness. Xbox has really missed some opportunities it had pretty delivered to it on a silver platter.

 

[MasterCornholio]

They're hating Heis because he's made it impossible for them to go back to the old narratives?

He deserves a medal for this. Some are going to try to make things very difficult for him here.

But it's worth it having a summary of all that was revealed during the trial.

 

[Nydius]

So we will know if Activision extends or not before the FTC and CAT result?

We should know the preliminary injunction from the FTC results before the deadline, CAT doesn’t even begin their hearings until after, IIRC.

Judge Corley said she was cognizant of the hard timeline ahead and would do her best to get a ruling out before the deal deadline date.

 

[Jigsaah]

They care when those MAUs include people who would be excluded due to exclusivity to a platform.

True, but that would be on a game by game basis. Also, I'm not really referring to day and date gamepass stuff. That doesn't work for many big publishers and devs.

But let's say for Xbox and PC users of Xbox's ecosystem. That number is obviously greater than just their console install base alone. They release everything on PC as well for the most part. However, they still have to compete with the likes of Steam, but from what I understand, Steam doesn't really do exclusive deals and the Xbox Store leaves a lot to be desired in terms of popularity and function.

Nevertheless, it's still a boon to the perceived benefits.

 

[bitbydeath]

He deserves a medal for this. Some are going to try to make things very difficult for him here.

But it's worth it having a summary of all that was revealed during the trial.

I made a comment in here during the FTC how the narrative in this thread was different to all the evidence threads being posted out of here, i’m glad Heisenberg007 collated them all.

It was strange to watch.

 

[ToadMan]

Judge Corley said she was cognizant of the hard timeline ahead and would do her best to get a ruling out before the deal deadline date.

Really? Where did she say this? Its in the court transcript somewhere? Have a link?

 

[DeepEnigma]

We should know the preliminary injunction from the FTC results before the deadline, CAT doesn’t even begin their hearings until after, IIRC.

Judge Corley said she was cognizant of the hard timeline ahead and would do her best to get a ruling out before the deal deadline date.

Only thing she said was that it won't take 2-3 months. Never heard her say, "before the deal deadline."

 

[Warablo]

When Xbox has to change its revenue split with CoD, you know things are getting out of hand.

 

[Heisenberg007]

He'll have a target on his head now for making that summary thread the other day.

They're hating Heis because he's made it impossible for them to go back to the old narratives?

He deserves a medal for this. Some are going to try to make things very difficult for him here.

But it's worth it having a summary of all that was revealed during the trial.

It's happening everywhere. He really ruined some people's holiday weekend

https://www.neogaf.com/threads/%E2%80%9Cxbox-fans-are-paid%E2%80%9D-says-former-world-of-warcraft-designer.1658408/post-268143696

I made a comment in here during the FTC how the narrative in this thread was different to all the evidence threads being posted out of here, i’m glad Heisenberg007 collated them all.

It was strange to watch.

It's really funny that I'm being attacked from all sides now I really had no idea that I'd trigger so many by creating a genuinely helpful thread. I'm enjoying it, though, and happy that you guys have my back!

Here are some posts to enjoy

... so, a 23-year-old internal memo combined with the word "evangelise" used in the context of a the xCloud service and we're at "Phil Spencer ADMITS he's PAYING for XBOX FANS!". You're promoting your own thread more than anyone is promoting xCloud, so what is Microsoft paying for, exactly?

I imagine you'll reply with a version of "I never said the exact words: 'Phil admits he's paying for Xbox fans.'". This is because you're actively promoting a narrative while trying to keep your hands clean. The irony of this in context is so dense that Matthew McConaughey could use it to fucking time travel.

I have to admit. I love when a smug poster like him gets burned like this.

You forgot to link to your circle jerk thread.

But congrats on doing literally what he said you would do

The melon himself? Get outta here!

 

[DeepEnigma]

It's really funny that I'm being attacked from all sides now I really had no idea that I'd trigger so many by creating a genuinely helpful thread. I'm enjoying it, though, and happy that you guys have my back!

Here are some posts to enjoy

That's what insecurity over your favorite brand looks like. Cultish levels of cuntitive dissonance.

 

[FlyyGOD]

When Xbox has to change its revenue split with CoD, you know things are getting out of hand.

Yup when Microsoft has to do a 80/20 split or have COD taken off platform and Ghostwire Tokyo, Deathloop and possibility of Starfield going PS5 exclusive Phil said enough is enough and Thanos snapped.

 

[Aguero9320]

He deserves a medal for this. Some are going to try to make things very difficult for him here.

But it's worth it having a summary of all that was revealed during the trial.

I must be missing something here. I read that thread (well, the OP at least) expecting to be annoyed, but it seemed informative and more balanced than I was expecting.

I didn’t see anything objectionable in it - either from the writer or the content? But then I’m not all wrapped up in the Microsoft is evil narrative. There didn’t seem to be any particularly egregious bombshells in there to me, or anything that Microsoft would care to be upset about being in the public domain?

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

Organic growth only matters to fanboys. None of these companies care nothing about you only the bottom line. Nobody cares when Sony buys silent hill or Street Fighter 5 exclusivity though.

Make up your mind..does it matter or doesn't it?

And these companies care about me and you... well, they care about the money. And we in turn, should care in what we are investing our money into. Its a simple arrangement really, you pay for a product, the least you should expect is quality. That whole these companies don't care about you argument is simple-minded. Of course they do, they care about my money. It's why the best way to communicate with them..is with, you guessed it... your money.

And yes, no one cares when Sony does that because guess what? MS could have done it too... or do you really think that Sony could outbid MS? And honestly that is such a dumb thing to say, isn't SF6 on the Xbox right now?

 

[Heisenberg007]

When Xbox has to change its revenue split with CoD, you know things are getting out of hand.

Yup when Microsoft has to do a 80/20 split or have COD taken off platform and Ghostwire Tokyo, Deathloop and possibility of Starfield going PS5 exclusive Phil said enough is enough and Thanos snapped.

FYI - Activision was already charging Sony more than 70%. Redacted documents show 80/20 or 90/10 (it was hard to read). So around Gen 9 launch, they asked Xbox to do the same.

It's not like they are charging extra from Xbox. They are now charging Xbox the same price that they were charging PlayStation.

 

[Pelta88]

Heisenberg007

 

[Dick Jones]

Which doesn't mean much in this situation.

Can't you share something that will have an actual impact?

It means no ABK/MS in Middle Earth. Duh!

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

Yup when Microsoft has to do a 80/20 split or have COD taken off platform and Ghostwire Tokyo, Deathloop and possibility of Starfield going PS5 exclusive Phil said enough is enough and Thanos snapped.

Typical and expected levels of ignorance.

How do you think marketing deals or getting this on PS first works? You all think its some sort of money-hat thing. In most cases, its something as simple as negotiating on royalties. Sony can be getting as little as 20% off COD or even less too. Because they didn't whine about it doesn't mean its not happening there. Do you think third parties with a very strong and popular IP don't attempt to leverage their IPs?

Wouldn't you?

 

[Calverz]

That's what insecurity over your favorite brand looks like. Cultish levels of cuntitive dissonance.

Ahahahaha

Are you serious? You can’t be serious?? Literally see cultish behaviour from a few names who appear time and again in this forum spreading FUD, Mis information, conspiracy theories and whatever other garbage they think will push their anti Xbox agenda.

 

[FlyyGOD]

Typical and expected levels of ignorance.

How do you think marketing deals or getting this on PS first works? You all think its some sort of money-hat thing. In most cases, its something as simple as negotiating on royalties. Sony can be getting as little as 20% off COD or even less too. Because they didn't whine about it doesn't mean its not happening there. Do you think third parties with a very strong and popular IP don't attempt to leverage their IPs?

Wouldn't you?

Then Microsoft used its leverage and bought the publisher . Wouldn't you?

 

[Solidus_T]

FYI - Activision was already charging Sony more than 70%. Redacted documents show 80/20 or 90/10 (it was hard to read). So around Gen 9 launch, they asked Xbox to do the same.

It's not like they are charging extra from Xbox. They are now charging Xbox the same price that they were charging PlayStation.

Selective outrage, just like with timed exclusivity deals

 

[sainraja]

Sony buying insomniac , Naughty Dog and Bungie is organic growth?

Naughty dog and Insomniac worked almost exclusively with Sony before being acquired, so yes, they are "organic". Bungie is the only exception but even you have to realize the timing of it was after the whole "acquisition" war was started via yours truly → Microsoft.

Also, saying Sony has focused on acquiring studios organically does not mean there aren't instances where they "deviated" from doing so.

 

[Heisenberg007]

I must be missing something here. I read that thread (well, the OP at least) expecting to be annoyed, but it seemed informative and more balanced than I was expecting.

I didn’t see anything objectionable in it - either from the writer or the content? But then I’m not all wrapped up in the Microsoft is evil narrative. There didn’t seem to be any particularly egregious bombshells in there to me, or anything that Microsoft would care to be upset about being in the public domain?

I tried my best to make it as balanced as I could, and I think it is. Microsoft's section had the most information because, well, it was FTC vs. Microsoft. Other parties were all secondary. Some people still seem angry at me and that thread though.

And I think that information is something that Microsoft will definitely not like to be in the public domain. They'd rather have it removed. It exposes them and goes against the image they have built very carefully in the last 7-8 years

 

[DeepEnigma]

Ahahahaha

Are you serious? You can’t be serious?? Literally see cultish behaviour from a few names who appear time and again in this forum spreading FUD, Mis information, conspiracy theories and whatever other garbage they think will push their anti Xbox agenda.

Every bit of criticism is "anti-Xbox agenda."

They have done and said enough the past several weeks to earn said criticism.

Fucking cope.

 

[Kilau]

Did any of the documents regarding Sony’s attempts at Starfield get released? I would be amazed if they thought they get even a year of exclusivity, never mind permanently.

 

[SublimeCorruptor]

It's kind of ridiculous to me how some seriously don't understand what organic growth really is. PlayStation worked with Housemarque for years, dating back to the PS3 days, helping with their tech and development... they eventually acquired them. Same with Insomniac, Naughty Dog, Sucker Punch, Guerilla, even Bungie since the announcement of PS4 Sony and Bungie have worked closely together, Bungie even helped design the DualSense.

MS acquiring Ninja Theory...where's the history? Where's the prior relationship? Activision overall is in the same boat.

Double Fine, Playground Games, those are perfect examples of organic growth. When there's a history of development and resources provided to those teams for years until the studios are ready to be acquired, that's organic growth

I get the point but you should look up what organic growth actually means in business.

 

[Topher]

Did any of the documents regarding Sony’s attempts at Starfield get released? I would be amazed if they thought they get even a year of exclusivity, never mind permanently.

I don't think Starfield was ever specifically mentioned at all.

 

[Heisenberg007]

Did any of the documents regarding Sony’s attempts at Starfield get released? I would be amazed if they thought they get even a year of exclusivity, never mind permanently.

No. Just one vague-ish statement by Phil Spencer that "Microsoft heard that Sony may potentially get Starfield's timed exclusivity." Who knows if his "source" was the same rumor that we all "heard."

 

[Calverz]

Every bit of criticism is "anti-Xbox agenda."

They have done and said enough the past several weeks to earn said criticism.

Fucking cope.

Its pretty well known there is a group of you here who are anti xbox. Don't try and hide it dude lol.

 

[Kilau]

I don't think Starfield was ever specifically mentioned at all.

No. Just one vague-ish statement by Phil Spencer that "Microsoft heard that Sony may potentially get Starfield's timed exclusivity." Who knows if his "source" was the same rumor that we all "heard."

Sounds an awful lot like FUD.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Its pretty well known there is a group of you here who are anti xbox. Don't try and hide it dude lol.

"Well known" to the xbox cult circles. Oh no! The horror!

 

[DeaDPo0L84]

Ahahahaha

Are you serious? You can’t be serious?? Literally see cultish behaviour from a few names who appear time and again in this forum spreading FUD, Mis information, conspiracy theories and whatever other garbage they think will push their anti Xbox agenda.

This is the videogame equivalant of how people argue politics. "That person has a different opinion from mine, they must be Hitler!".

Basically if you argue like this nobody should even entertain the idea of having a civil conversation with you. You're simply a fanboy willing to look over absolutely every evident truth so you don't have to feel insecure about your favorite plastic toy.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Watching the green rats going after you has actually been helpful in keeping me informed on who they are. So you've really done a double public service here. If the green rats were smarter they would have stayed out of there but they really can't help themselves lol

they need to earn that paycheck.

 

[FlyyGOD]

Selective outrage, just like with timed exclusivity deals

Totally wrong Sony was doing 70/30 split and Activision to recoup on that made Microsoft pay 80/20 or have COD taken off platform.

 

[Heisenberg007]

Ahahahaha

Are you serious? You can’t be serious?? Literally see cultish behaviour from a few names who appear time and again in this forum spreading FUD, Mis information, conspiracy theories and whatever other garbage they think will push their anti Xbox agenda.

I think you should identify the FUD, misinformation, and conspiracy theories that people have been spreading.

Only saying it, without any receipts, does not add credibility to your claim at all.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Totally wrong Sony was doing 70/30 split and Activision to recoup on that made Microsoft pay 80/20 or have COD taken off platform.

Now this is what you call conspiracy theory.

"It's all Sony's fault."

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

Then Microsoft used its leverage and bought the publisher . Wouldn't you?

Microsoft sure used something, but it was not leverage.

And if you are really asking me, no.. I wouldn't. I can think of far better and more productive ways MS could have spent The $8B they used for Bethesda and the $67B they want to spend for Activision. That you cant though could explain why ou are even saying what you are saying.

Here's a thought though, Do you think that Xbox, could have got Starfield as a year exclusive and also available on gamepass for $500M? Do you think they can get COD timed exclusive for 3 years for $1.5B?

Now what would you say if I told you that if this Activision deal doesn't go through...it would cost MS $3B?

Hey look, I just got both Starfield and COD exclusive to Xbox and on gamepass for $2B...

 

[MasterCornholio]

I must be missing something here. I read that thread (well, the OP at least) expecting to be annoyed, but it seemed informative and more balanced than I was expecting.

I didn’t see anything objectionable in it - either from the writer or the content? But then I’m not all wrapped up in the Microsoft is evil narrative. There didn’t seem to be any particularly egregious bombshells in there to me, or anything that Microsoft would care to be upset about being in the public domain?

Seems some were mad at him for doing that. But he really didn't do anything wrong IMO.

 

[Aguero9320]

I tried my best to make it as balanced as I could, and I think it is. Microsoft's section had the most information because, well, it was FTC vs. Microsoft. Other parties were all secondary. Some people still seem angry at me and that thread though.

And I think that information is something that Microsoft will definitely not like to be in the public domain. They'd rather have it removed. It exposes them and goes against the image they have built very carefully in the last 7-8 years

Definitely came across as balanced, appreciated the read.

I guess I think Microsoft won’t care because I wouldn’t. It shouldn’t be a surprise to anyone that they are doing these deals to strengthen Xbox, and in the current market exclusives work (better than I would like personally). They’re in this to be as successful as possible, and obviously would love to be market leader…

Again though, was a great post - don’t understand why anyone would be mad at you for it.

 

[BlueLyria]

Its pretty well known there is a group of you here who are anti xbox. Don't try and hide it dude lol.

Is this anti Xbox group among us right now?

 

[GHG]

Are you serious? You can’t be serious?? Literally see cultish behaviour from a few names who appear time and again in this forum spreading FUD, Mis information, conspiracy theories and whatever other garbage they think will push their anti Xbox agenda.

If you think that is indeed the case then it should be pretty trivial to tear apart without needing to resort to personal attacks, stalking people around the forum and character assassination attempts.

But alas, this is the behaviour you've now been reduced to due to all the facts being summarised and laid bare for all to see. It's a shame.

Unless someone is directly associated with Microsoft there's really no need to be insecure and defensive about what's been revealed over the last few weeks. Some of the behaviour in that thread and elsewhere towards Heisenberg007 and the associated information is highly questionable.

 

[Warablo]

Microsoft sure used something, but it was not leverage.

And if you are really asking me, no.. I wouldn't. I can think of far better and more productive ways MS could have spent The $8B they used for Bethesda and the $67B they want to spend for Activision. That you cant though could explain why ou are even saying what you are saying.

Here's a thought though, Do you think that Xbox, could have got Starfield as a year exclusive and also available on gamepass for $500M? Do you think they can get COD timed exclusive for 3 years for $1.5B?

Now what would you say if I told you that if this Activision deal doesn't go through...it would cost MS $3B?

Hey look, I just got both Starfield and COD exclusive to Xbox and on gamepass for $2B...

Given that Sony makes like 15 billion off CoD, I doubt Xbox could buy timed exclusivity for 1.5 billion. I don't think 500M would even cut it for Starfield either.

It really is a losing battle with timed exclusivity for Xbox right now. They hardly gain anything (marketshare, promos) while throwing a big bag a cash down the toilet.

 

[FlyyGOD]

Now this is what you call conspiracy theory.

"It's all Sony's fault."

It was said in FTC trial.

 

[Topher]

It was said in FTC trial.

The 80/20 split was reveal, but I don't think anyone said what Sony's split was.

 

[FlyyGOD]

Microsoft sure used something, but it was not leverage.

And if you are really asking me, no.. I wouldn't. I can think of far better and more productive ways MS could have spent The $8B they used for Bethesda and the $67B they want to spend for Activision. That you cant though could explain why ou are even saying what you are saying.

Here's a thought though, Do you think that Xbox, could have got Starfield as a year exclusive and also available on gamepass for $500M? Do you think they can get COD timed exclusive for 3 years for $1.5B?

Now what would you say if I told you that if this Activision deal doesn't go through...it would cost MS $3B?

Hey look, I just got both Starfield and COD exclusive to Xbox and on gamepass for $2B...

Or better yet they could own all the ip's and make more money in the long run.

 

[Clintizzle]

Given that Sony makes like 15 billion off CoD, I doubt Xbox could buy timed exclusivity for 1.5 billion. I don't think 500M would even cut it for Starfield either.

It really is a losing battle with timed exclusivity for Xbox right now. They hardly gain anything (marketshare, promos) while throwing a big bag a cash down the toilet.

Pretty much. The prevailing narrative from the anti-merger crowd here is that the PS3 was also in this situation with the Xbox 360 and Sony came back by releasing good games that they made themselves. No mention of Xbox exclusives being released on Playstation and also the amazing launch of the Xbox One.

 

[M1987]

Or better yet they could own all the ip's and make more money in the long run.

Why would you want them to buy their way to success instead of using the studios they have to make games? this is just stupid

 

[Kilau]

The 80/20 split was reveal, but I don't think anyone said what Sony's split was.

We know it’s discounted but we don’t know what it is exactly.

 

[jroc74]

Typical and expected levels of ignorance.

How do you think marketing deals or getting this on PS first works? You all think its some sort of money-hat thing. In most cases, its something as simple as negotiating on royalties. Sony can be getting as little as 20% off COD or even less too. Because they didn't whine about it doesn't mean its not happening there. Do you think third parties with a very strong and popular IP don't attempt to leverage their IPs?

Wouldn't you?

When I read that amazing thread by Heisenberg007 and saw Zenimax was actively shopping timed exclusive deals for Death Loop and GWT...that was a huge eye opener...Sony likely accepted an offer and worked out a deal for the these timed exclusives.

Actively trying to get deals is a wee bit different vs being offered deals and accepting them.

I compared it to the Spider-Man deal that MS...turned down...and Activision literally laughed at Disney and hit them with the good luck meme.

It's becoming clearer that MS has likely turned down deals that Sony accepted. That's the mega ton in that thread for me. MS decided long ago they wanna compete differently...especially if they are literally turning down deals. Or getting outbid. A 2 trillion dollar company getting outbid...

Sony accepting timed exclusive deals wasn't the cause of the acquisition, that's just an excuse.