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[Men_in_Boxes]

Somewhere during the second half of the XBox 360 generation a lot of people soured on the XBox brand. MS became known for pumping out Halo, Gears, Forza, and Fable. They created two large studios and "locked" them to franchises that had become long in the tooth (The Coalition and 343). PlayStation became known as the company that got out of the way of it's developers. A lot of gamers appreciated that direction from Sony.

Fast forward to June 11th. Sony reveals their PS5 by showcasing...the 9th Ratchet and Clank game, the 8th Gran Turismo game, a Demons Souls remake, a hurried Spider Man sequel, and a Horizon sequel (not hurried, thank God). There's poorly kept secrets that a new God of War is underway as well as another Uncharted studio in San Diego. It seems the bulk of Sony's first party developers are now tasked with creating sequels.

Microsoft on the other hand has completely rebooted Halo, given The Coalition the green light on a new IP, funded Rare to make new IP in Sea of Thieves and EverWild. They created a studio in The Initiative to create "new and innovative game experiences". They're letting Playground make a well rested Fable game. InXile and Obsidian are making new AAA RPGs. They're the home of Tim Schaefer who embodies creativity.

Now before anyone says "But MS is still making X franchise and Sony is making new franchises over here..." while true, that's missing my point.

Doesn't it feel that Sony is now the home of "safe established franchises" and Microsoft is letting their developers do new, creative stuff? Am I crazy or have these two juggernauts completely swapped over the last 5-10 years?

EDIT: I should have explained better. I meant to frame this conversation in the context of the next gen. I agree with people who say Sony supported interesting games through the duration of the PS4s life.

 

[Kuranghi]

No, yes and no.

 

[Entroyp]

No not really. You’re seeing what you want to see.

 

[Unknown?]

Lol no. They had tons of new ips this gen.

 

[Thugnificient]

343 is still pumping out Halo.
The Coalition is still pumping out Gears.
Forza isn't going anywhere. At least there are rumors of Fable being developed by Playground Games.

So, nah.

 

[McCarth]

Might be a bit early to praise MS' first party offerings, but they certainly do have a big opportunity this coming gen to really step it up and deliver.

Here's hoping they let their devs stick to it all gen.

 

[IncognitoPanda]

They've never really been comparable. Sony has been doing new IP and sequels for a long long time now. The difference is MS is catching up. But Sony really hasn't changed much.

Btw, Ghost of Tsushima just came out, and death stranding came out last year.

I will say that I am more excited to see what MS' output will be, though that's solely based on much of their output is a bit of a wild card. But we don't really know what MS' output will be yet

 

[FranXico]

Now before anyone says "But MS is still making X franchise and Sony is making new franchises over here..." while true, that's missing my point.

You're funny.

No, what you are seeing is MS catching up to Sony studios quality by buying talent en masse (which also has the side effect of removing third party developers from Sony platforms).

Both companies have always had safe IPs, and both have always had new IPs. Still, even during this gen, Sony took more risks with their first party.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

343 is still pumping out Halo.
The Coalition is still pumping out Gears.
Forza isn't going anywhere. At least there are rumors of Fable being developed by Playground Games.

So, nah.

There's a difference between Sony pumping out another Spiderman two years after the last one and Microsoft rebooting Halo by giving 343 five years on Halo Infinite. A pretty big difference, in my opinion. Btw, Halo Infinite might look like dog shit in a few days, but I'll always root for publishers to give studios more time and reimagining IP.

You may be right about more Gears coming from The Coalition. Personally, I want that franchise put in Carbonite and chucked into space. But according to job postings, they may be working on new IP. That's refreshing to see compared to where they were at in 2015.

 

[Neo Blaster]

 

[BadBurger]

You're funny.

No, what you are seeing is MS catching up to Sony studios quality by buying talent en masse (which also has the side effect of removing third party developers from Sony platforms).

Both companies have always had safe IPs, and both have always had new IPs. Still, even during this gen, Sony took more risks with their first party.

I think the next gen is going to be a battle between exclusives, even though it's looking like Sony will come out sprinting. Microsoft bought many studios with what I guess is an eye on tackling their deficit in exclusives against Sony, but they're also still focused on Game Pass.

I think by late 2021 we will have different landscape.

 

[Aion002]

Yes because I am playing Ghost of Tsushima (a highly rated new ip) and Dreams (a "new" type of game) on my Xbox One, they got released this year, exclusively on MS Systems!!

Also, you can't forget about the Xbox VR, the only VR available on consoles! Fucking dope!

Not like Sony.... Blergh! WTF did they released this year? I can't even remember... bleeding something... the ps4 was completely abandoned!

Also, congrats to MS for funding a game like Death Stranding man... No way Sony would fund a game about making deliveries! MS really pushes forward gaming, while Sony keeps playing safe!

 

[Kenneth Haight]

No

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

You're funny.

No, what you are seeing is MS catching up to Sony studios quality by buying talent en masse (which also has the side effect of removing third party developers from Sony platforms).

Both companies have always had safe IPs, and both have always had new IPs. Still, even during this gen, Sony took more risks with their first party.

I don't care about studio quality, per say. This isn't about studio quality.

This is about Sony sticking their talent on long in the tooth IP and Microsoft sticking their talent on more interesting projects.

I have no qualms if someone says "Naughty Dog is super talented. Look at Uncharted 4 and TLoU2". It doesn't matter to me if that talent is making Uncharted 7 or TLoU3 as I'm well over those franchises.

 

[FranXico]

I think the next gen is going to be a battle between exclusives, even though it's looking like Sony will come out sprinting. Microsoft bought many studios with what I guess is an eye on tackling their deficit in exclusives against Sony, but they're also still focused on Game Pass.

I think by late 2021 we will have different landscape.

The first party content is primarily intended for GamePass, indeed. Big third parties are not as keen on releasing their games day and date on GamePass.

MS needs their own "Netflix Originals" to keep subscribers engaged.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Yes because I am playing Ghost of Tsushima (a highly rated new ip) and Dreams (a "new" type of game) on my Xbox One, they got released this year, exclusively on MS Systems!!

Also, you can't forget about the Xbox VR, the only VR available on consoles! Fucking dope!

Not like Sony.... Blergh! WTF did they released this year? I can't even remember... bleeding something... the ps4 was completely abandoned!

Also, congrats to MS for funding a game like Death Stranding man... No way Sony would fund a game about making deliveries! MS really pushes forward gaming, while Sony keeps playing safe!

I agree.

MS and the XBox brand have been a trainwreck this gen. Sony producing Death Stranding was brilliant. Same with Dreams. I'll even give them (lesser) credit for funding Ghost of Tsushima because it's a new IP.

But I'm framing this in relation to the next generation. The first two years it seems like the majority of Sony's first party studios will release relatively safe franchise games. Microsoft looks to be doing the opposite.

I can't be the only one seeing this?

 

[30yearsofhurt]

Concern trolling at it's finest.

 

[Bryank75]

They just launched a new IP...it's called Ghost of Tsushima, Dreams was a brand new IP earlier this year....a very risky idea.
Death Stranding and Days Gone were also new IP's just last year. Spider-man was a new game based on an established IP...

Horizon and Bloodborne...both new IP's.

What are you even talking about?

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Concern trolling at it's finest.

It's honestly not trolling. We can disagree with our perceptions of things without resorting to these kind of (lame) attacks.

I proposed a legitimate question and all I got back were gifs and "No". I'm not seeing any evidence showing my misunderstanding which might be telling.

 

[Stuart360]

Never had a problem with sequels to be honest, if a game is good then its good, sequel or not. Sony to be fair, did show quite a few new games at their show. I dont have a problem with WHAT they showed (except too many cartoony games for me), but rather as a showing of next gen visuals not held back by current gen, it was lacking for me.

 

[JonnyMP3]

The biggest difference between MS and Sony when it comes to games and franchises is how they both grow their IPs. Halo at one point was probably the World's biggest game franchise at one point in the 00s. Until COD overtook it and the MS seemed to follow the Activision model and decided to milk the ever loving shit out of the Franchise in an attempt to regain the crown.
People can correct me if I'm wrong but that's never been Sony's way. They're not chasing the glory to be "The biggest and best selling new franchise ever!" but each game has been lovingly crafted to deliver something special to the end user.
I think Sony understood that through the PS3's life cycle as it slowly caught up to the 360's life time sales and at last I checked, actually surpassed 360's sold. And there was only one reason and always was one reason for the that... Games.
MS needs to be creative and create newer IPs because Sony has started about 5-6 brand new IP'S this gen and have rebooted about the same amount too.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Let's wait for MS to reveal their games before making these kinds of statements. Sony has put out plenty of original stuff every single generation. There's no reason to assume they will stop with PS5 just because their focus for the initial reveal was headline-grabbing sequels of existing major franchises.

 

[Entroyp]

There's a difference between Sony pumping out another Spiderman two years after the last one and Microsoft rebooting Halo by giving 343 five years on Halo Infinite. A pretty big difference, in my opinion. Btw, Halo Infinite might look like dog shit in a few days, but I'll always root for publishers to give studios more time and reimagining IP.

You may be right about more Gears coming from The Coalition. Personally, I want that franchise put in Carbonite and chucked into space. But according to job postings, they may be working on new IP. That's refreshing to see compared to where they were at in 2015.

I don’t get your statement. The GoW reboot took around 5 or more years to make, it payed off. Horizon, a new IP, was in development for around 4-5 years. Sony gave Sucker Punch at least 4 years time to create a new IP and it payed off. The Last of Us 2 was in development for at least 5 years.

And your argument is that Sony is pumping out games because there’s a new spider man sequel this year? which is not a full blown sequel, and made by a studio well know to make games really fast?

Sony learned to give their studios creative freedom and enough time more than a decade ago. MS just realized that strategy pays off a couple of years ago.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

They just launched a new IP...it's called Ghost of Tsushima, Dreams was a brand new IP earlier this year....a very risky idea.
Death Stranding and Days Gone were also new IP's just last year. Spider-man was a new game based on an established IP...

Horizon and Bloodborne...both new IP's.

What are you even talking about?

Yup.

Again, Dreams, Ghost of Tsushima, and Death Stranding are Sony at their best for me.

But I'm framing this from the perspective of the next generation and I'm not seeing the Sony who supported Dreams, Ghost of Tsushima, or Death Stranding yet.

I saw too many safe (stale), franchise games from Sony's first party at their PS5 event. If exciting Sony isn't going to show up until year 3 of the PS5, I think it's something to discuss.

 

[MrS]

But I'm framing this from the perspective of the next generation and I'm not seeing the Sony who supported Dreams, Ghost of Tsushima, or Death Stranding yet.

Ghost of Tshushima hasn't even been out a week yet.

Lets see what MS presents before you crown them as the home of creative games in the industry. Will you say they're playing too safe when they make sequels for Halo/Forza/Gears/Fable?

 

[MasterCornholio]

I played alot of new IPs from Sony this gen. I really can't say that I did the same with Microsoft.

With that said people are going to have to wait a while before Microsoft starts to deliver with their new studios.

 

[Unknown?]

How do you mention Halo being rebooted but not give credit for God of War being rebooted?

 

[Neo Blaster]

I don't care about studio quality, per say. This isn't about studio quality.

This is about Sony sticking their talent on long in the tooth IP and Microsoft sticking their talent on more interesting projects.

I have no qualms if someone says "Naughty Dog is super talented. Look at Uncharted 4 and TLoU2". It doesn't matter to me if that talent is making Uncharted 7 or TLoU3 as I'm well over those franchises.

Says the guy who praises the one company milking Halo/Gears/Forza to such an extent it became a meme.

 

[Bryank75]

Yup.

Again, Dreams, Ghost of Tsushima, and Death Stranding are Sony at their best for me.

But I'm framing this from the perspective of the next generation and I'm not seeing the Sony who supported Dreams, Ghost of Tsushima, or Death Stranding yet.

I saw too many safe (stale), franchise games from Sony's first party at their PS5 event. If exciting Sony isn't going to show up until year 3 of the PS5, I think it's something to discuss.

I think they are trying to carry the momentum of this generation forward through the IP's they're known for but I don't think new IP's are 3 years away.
Horizon 2 will only be the second game in that franchise anyway.

Also I think you'll see more collaboration with Marvel / Disney..... so maybe not new IP's but fresh games using established IP's.

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

Not really. Sony has always "played it safe" with established franchises while quietly funding weird ones to see if they spark. Almost all of them fail to spark, but Sony keeps trying.

Microsoft is bringing PC-centric business models (GaaS, subscriptions instead of ownership, etc) over to console, which isn't a bad idea because that's essentially what Xbox is, PC-lite for the console crowd. It earned the Xbox a toe-hold and it earned the 360 a ton of loyalty. Microsoft just bought a lot of stuff like they usually do. We'll see if it pans out this time.

Sony (and moreso Nintendo now, actually) spent a lot of effort courting small devs, japanese devs, and indie devs early on. This snowballed to turn the PS4 as the de facto third party console (in terms of available titles) since a lot of stuff does not come out for Xbox One. Sony and Xbox are small-time players on their own systems when you take a step back.

 

[Aion002]

I agree.

MS and the XBox brand have been a trainwreck this gen. Sony producing Death Stranding was brilliant. Same with Dreams. I'll even give them (lesser) credit for funding Ghost of Tsushima because it's a new IP.

But I'm framing this in relation to the next generation. The first two years it seems like the majority of Sony's first party studios will release relatively safe franchise games. Microsoft looks to be doing the opposite.

I can't be the only one seeing this?

PS5 Sony published/made/marketing games announced so far that I cared:

Astro's Playroom (gimmick)
Destruction AllStars (new take on destruction derby maybe?)
Kena: Bridge of Spirits
Returnal

Those 4 games seems to be Sony IP or that Sony has some deal on it.... Now... That was on the PS5 announcement... On the Xbox announcement they showed Hellblade 2 and Halo? I think... That's it.


So... Yeah... This week MS can show lots of things... But so far... Nope.

 

[JonnyMP3]

Yup.

Again, Dreams, Ghost of Tsushima, and Death Stranding are Sony at their best for me.

But I'm framing this from the perspective of the next generation and I'm not seeing the Sony who supported Dreams, Ghost of Tsushima, or Death Stranding yet.

I saw too many safe (stale), franchise games from Sony's first party at their PS5 event. If exciting Sony isn't going to show up until year 3 of the PS5, I think it's something to discuss.

Despite the dodgy numberings though... Aren't Halo and Gears on their actual 7th or 8th use of their franchise IP?
And if you add all the Forza's together... That's about 8-9 reiterations of the same franchise with both F:MS and F:H.

Yeah this thread makes no sense...

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Ghost of Tshushima hasn't even been out a week yet.

It's still a new IP (+1) that Sony gave Sucker Punch 6 years to make (+1), but it also looks extremely derivative of modern open world action RPGs (-1).

Still a +1 for Sony in my book.

But I meant in terms of Sony's outlook on PS5, not PS4.

 

[Bruno_Arrais85]

How do you mention Halo being rebooted but not give credit for God of War being rebooted?

Don't waste your time

 

[Thirty7ven]

I think you want this to be true. Sorry that it isn’t and you don’t make a good case at all.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

You're on a roll with these threads aren't you OP

 

[LordCBH]

This is a poor take, IMO. Sony has largely shown that their teams have the freedom to create the projects they desire, otherwise we wouldn’t have gotten Dreams, GoT, Horizon, what have you. Hell we wouldn’t have gotten the first Last of Us if they just wanted them to continually make what has sold well already.

Complain about a new ratchet game all you want, but we haven’t had a new main entry since 2009. Everything since has been quick spin offs or a reboot that looks like it’s a one off that will never be mentioned again.

Edit: adding to it, the complaints of a new god of war make zero sense. The series was essentially rebooted after 3 and Ascension to the point where it’s not even the same genre (both action obviously, but the differences are night and day), and, like Infinite, was in development for a long time. You’re mad if you think Microsoft won’t fast track a sequel to Infinite from the studio who’s name literally came from Halo. If I finite does well.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

PS5 Sony published/made/marketing games announced so far that I cared:

Astro's Playroom (gimmick)
Destruction AllStars (new take on destruction derby maybe?)
Kena: Bridge of Spirits
Returnal

Those 4 games seems to be Sony IP or that Sony has some deal on it.... Now... That was on the PS5 announcement... On the Xbox announcement they showed Hellblade 2 and Halo? I think... That's it.


So... Yeah... This week MS can show lots of things... But so far... Nope.

I agree with this, but the amount of investment in those properties, from Sony, is miniscule compared to Spider Man Morales, Gran Turismo 7, Ratchet and Clank RA, Demons Souls, and Horizon Forbidden West.

Perhaps I shouldn't be including Horizon FW in here because I actually think the game makes Sony look fine.

 

[REE Machine]

Problem is sony kept making quality games also whilst rebooting franchises and making new ip's, MS didnt have quality and their pillar franchises became stale

 

[NullZ3r0]

That isn't all they flipped on. Its amazing how many things that were off limits when MS did it back in 2013 are acceptable now.

 

[Darklor01]

Somewhere during the second half of the XBox 360 generation a lot of people soured on the XBox brand. MS became known for pumping out Halo, Gears, Forza, and Fable. They created two large studios and "locked" them to franchises that had become long in the tooth (The Coalition and 343). PlayStation became known as the company that got out of the way of it's developers. A lot of gamers appreciated that direction from Sony.

Fast forward to June 11th. Sony reveals their PS5 by showcasing...the 9th Ratchet and Clank game, the 8th Gran Turismo game, a Demons Souls remake, a hurried Spider Man sequel, and a Horizon sequel (not hurried, thank God). There's poorly kept secrets that a new God of War is underway as well as another Uncharted studio in San Diego. It seems the bulk of Sony's first party developers are now tasked with creating sequels.

Microsoft on the other hand has completely rebooted Halo, given The Coalition the green light on a new IP, funded Rare to make new IP in Sea of Thieves and EverWild. They created a studio in The Initiative to create "new and innovative game experiences". They're letting Playground make a well rested Fable game. InXile and Obsidian are making new AAA RPGs. They're the home of Tim Schaefer who embodies creativity.

Now before anyone says "But MS is still making X franchise and Sony is making new franchises over here..." while true, that's missing my point.

Doesn't it feel that Sony is now the home of "safe established franchises" and Microsoft is letting their developers do new, creative stuff? Am I crazy or have these two juggernauts completely swapped over the last 5-10 years?

EDIT: I should have explained better. I meant to frame this conversation in the context of the next gen. I agree with people who say Sony supported interesting games at the end of the PS4s life.

I watched the last games presentation from Sony. Most of the games I saw there were new IPs, so I'm not sure I can agree with your comment. Beyond that, any successful franchise will get sequels, and it would be silly to think that a studio with a successful IP that can make sequels wouldn't do so. That's just the same as movies. Some franchies may have also reached their end. I've read at least one case where a studio with a long standing franchise is looking to create a new IP next for next gen.

 

[MrS]

We don't want to see the Sony who supported Dreams. The market has rejected Dreams. On to the next idea.

 

[Neo Blaster]

This is the second thread I see this guy make trying to downplay what PlayStation does, must be the MS event getting closer...

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

How do you mention Halo being rebooted but not give credit for God of War being rebooted?

Again, this is in context of the next generation.

I think Sony performed relatively well for this generation in terms of funding ambitious and creative projects. This is about the kick off to the PS5 though.

 

[Zathalus]

Ghost of Tsushima, Dreams, Death Stranding, Days Gone, Spider-Man, and Horizon Zero Dawn ate all brand new IPs in the past 3 years to go along side the sequels. Sony has hardly been playing it safe.

 

[mejin]

I think Sony is less about quantity and more focused on big projects now. That's the difference.

This gen we had big projects: Bloodborne, Horizon, Days Gone, Dreams, Spider, Ghost. And they even finished The Last Guardian.

Less AA output, but quality new ips to complement their worlwide renown ips. They can still do better there is only console now, portable is dead.

 

[Entroyp]

I don't care about studio quality, per say. This isn't about studio quality.

This is about Sony sticking their talent on long in the tooth IP and Microsoft sticking their talent on more interesting projects.

I have no qualms if someone says "Naughty Dog is super talented. Look at Uncharted 4 and TLoU2". It doesn't matter to me if that talent is making Uncharted 7 or TLoU3 as I'm well over those franchises.

What interesting projects? Something Like dreams? Or VR? The Last Guardian/SoTC?

Name those interesting projects because I can’t find any.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

I watched the last games presentation from Sony. Most of the games I saw there were new IPs, so I'm not sure I can agree with your comment. Beyond that, any successful franchise will get sequels, and it would be silly to think that a studio with a successful IP that can make sequels wouldn't do so. That's just the same as movies. Some franchies may have also reached their end. I've read at least one case where a studio with a long standing franchise is looking to create a new IP next for next gen.

It's about the bulk of resources from Sony's first party studios.

There was a lot of new IP at the PS5 reveal. The majority of that new IP was from 3rd party studios and/or small indie studios.

Sony seems interested in heavily investing in safe sequels and minimally investing in more creative projects.

 

[RoadHazard]

Hm, no? MS has more potential now than they have in many years, but they haven't proven anything yet. Sony keeps putting out amazing exclusives, in old and new franchises.

So no, it doesn't feel like that at all to me.

 

[Unknown?]

Again, this is in context of the next generation.

I think Sony performed relatively well for this generation in terms of funding ambitious and creative projects. This is about the kick off to the PS5 though.

Okay so we're just talking like first year then? Because they aren't going to keep rebooting Halo, they're going to milk that for sure.