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[SleepDoctor]

Its the best by default. Not saying its bad at all. It great to have options. Less cash grab remakes for unwarranted games.

I don't think its a console seller but it definitely helps with the launch when there's not a huge lineup of games to play. Also makes it easier for those who need the extra cash to trade in the predecessor.

Most sony warriors saying it doesn't matter or whatever now, are the same who were praising the bc everywhere when Ps1 - Ps4 full bc was rumored. So not even worth replying to their bs posts.

 

[GriffinCorp]

Speak for yourself. I do care and BC from Microsoft should be praised for good reason.

Absolutely, I would love to be able to play all my older PS/PS2 games on the next gen PS5. Once again Sony doesn't care. I still have my PS3 hooked up so I can jump back into those games quickly enough. I was hopeful for Sony to have the past 3 or 4 years to look at how Microsoft was handling BC and all the praise they have received. I guess that is just my dream for Sony. At the start of this gen they released a couple great PS2 games and that dried up quickly, I think what helped kill it was the added trophy support.

 

[KingdomHeartsFan]

If you don't want games lost to history then universal BC that isn't affected by licensing issues is the best solution.

 

[SleepDoctor]

Absolutely, I would love to be able to play all my older PS/PS2 games on the next gen PS5. Once again Sony doesn't care. I still have my PS3 hooked up so I can jump back into those games quickly enough. I was hopeful for Sony to have the past 3 or 4 years to look at how Microsoft was handling BC and all the praise they have received. I guess that is just my dream for Sony. At the start of this gen they released a couple great PS2 games and that dried up quickly, I think what helped kill it was the added trophy support.

I wouldn't completely write it off as impossible tho. Remember the Xbox one got bc later on in its life cycle. If we're lucky Sony can do the same eventually. Although for me, all I need is 4k/60fps Bloodborne and I good to go.

 

[CatLady]

Absolutely, I would love to be able to play all my older PS/PS2 games on the next gen PS5. Once again Sony doesn't care. I still have my PS3 hooked up so I can jump back into those games quickly enough. I was hopeful for Sony to have the past 3 or 4 years to look at how Microsoft was handling BC and all the praise they have received. I guess that is just my dream for Sony. At the start of this gen they released a couple great PS2 games and that dried up quickly, I think what helped kill it was the added trophy support.

If trophy support is the problem they ought to just scrap it. I'm pretty sure Xbox does support achievements. I seem to recall getting 1 or 2 in BC playthroughs, but most of the BC games I play, I already have most/all the achievements. It wouldn't be a big deal if it wasn't supported as long as I can play the previous generation games I love.

 

[The_Mike]

I absolutely luv MS approach to BC/Smart delivery.
Sony needs to take notes.

Sony doesn't have to do anything. If Sony says bc is great, their fans will say it's great. If Sony says it's not then their fanbase won't care for it.

 

[GriffinCorp]

If trophy support is the problem they ought to just scrap it. I'm pretty sure Xbox does support achievements. I seem to recall getting 1 or 2 in BC playthroughs, but most of the BC games I play, I already have most/all the achievements. It wouldn't be a big deal if it wasn't supported as long as I can play the previous generation games I love.

I agree. Just drop them if it meant more classic BC games to PS4/PS5. I understand the whole Cell processor mess and that being a huge problem but to have any BC support would mean a lot to some of us gamers.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

I’ll be happy to see examples of Sony’s BC solution in action. We’ve seen XsX running Gears enhanced, let’s see God of War or HZD enhanced on PS5

 

[diffusionx]

Microsoft has understood how important BC is going back to the 1980s with their PC operating systems, so it was actually weird to see them half-ass it with 360 and introduce it late with the One.

Even though the One sucked compared to PS4, and was more expensive, had it launched with solid BC, it might have done a lot better than it did.

 

[The_Mike]

I’ll be happy to see examples of Sony’s BC solution in action. We’ve seen XsX running Gears enhanced, let’s see God of War or HZD enhanced on PS5

Why would Sony do that when they can sell a remaster on PS5?

 

[Dr.Morris79]

Sure, ditch PS3 if emulation is so hard to include but Sony could at least offer BC for PS1 and PS2. Otherwise it just feels cheap in regards to their competitor.

Pretty much. The Ps2 offerings on the Playstation 4 have been utterly piss poor by anyones standard.

 

[Dr.Morris79]

BC is a nice extra feature that isn't nearly as important as some make it out to be.

I call bullshit. There is a bigger call for BC now than there has ever been.

 

[M1chl]

Microsoft has understood how important BC is going back to the 1980s with their PC operating systems, so it was actually weird to see them half-ass it with 360 and introduce it late with the One.

Even though the One sucked compared to PS4, and was more expensive, had it launched with solid BC, it might have done a lot better than it did.

I don't fully understand to this day, why it was not ready at launch, because custom part in silicon was obviously there. It was for decompressing X360 textures.

 

[Psykodad]

I call bullshit. There is a bigger call for BC now than there has ever been.

Amongst who?
A part of the core gamers, who use it in platform wars.

This discussion happens every gen.

 

[Gamerguy84]

Lets all hope Sony and Nintendo dont do that.

Other industries of entertainment dont operate that way. Forward is the direction. New movies and music are constantly coming out.

BC should stay as a side dish not the main course. If thats all you have to offer I understand you have to push that narrative.

 

[quest]

Amongst who?
A part of the core gamers, who use it in platform wars.

This discussion happens every gen.

Anyone who purchased digital games and does not want them to become worthless next generation. Plenty of us got dicked over ps3(ps1 games there was no excuse not to work) and some 360 digital purchases this generation.

 

[Psykodad]

Anyone who purchased digital games and does not want them to become worthless next generation. Plenty of us got dicked over ps3(ps1 games there was no excuse not to work) and some 360 digital purchases this generation.

Yeah, and despite you getting dicked over, PS4 went on to be the second best selling console in history.

The average Joe is just gonna think it's a pity that a new console isn’t going to play their old games, but they'll move on anyway.
And I seriously doubt there is a majority who will replay 10 year old games every week.

BC is a nice extra at best.

 

[JLB]

I always compare it to movies.

Like what movie fan in the right mind wouldnt appreciate the classics and only want new releases?

Looks at all your collection, would you really want to whip out your VHS player if you wanted to watch them again, or would you rather see them better than ever on your new Blu ray/UHD player?

Game preservation and playing games with more clarity/detail/framerate is more important than every other next gen feature to me.

Even a videogame example makes sense.
See, Im playing The Witcher 3 Blood and Wine DLC like 3 years after its release. Imagine if rather than starting playing now, id decided to start on 2021. Its ridiculous that id need to connect my old console just to play it.

 

[Hostile_18]

Even a videogame example makes sense.
See, Im playing The Witcher 3 Blood and Wine DLC like 3 years after its release. Imagine if rather than starting playing now, id decided to start on 2021. Its ridiculous that id need to connect my old console just to play it.

Players are happy, game makers are getting continuous revenue (they dont have to worry about production costs with a digital offering).

It's all there for the taking!

I'd love to buy and play the Silent Hill/Soul Reaver games etc upscaled to 4k with instant loading .

 

[MilkyJoe]

Amongst who?
A part of the core gamers, who use it in platform wars.

This discussion happens every gen.

Remember when SNES mini came out and they were impossible to find?

 

[Norse]

Just started Fable Anniversary edition yesterday on my 1X. Never finished the game originally so I'm having a blast.

One other thing about bc, I bet more games would work, but license and copyright legal crap keeps them from being bc.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Sure, ditch PS3 if emulation is so hard to include but Sony could at least offer BC for PS1 and PS2. Otherwise it just feels cheap in regards to their competitor.

Why make PS1 and PS2 (and even PS3) emulation when they got PS Now? That's where the old games are is someone wants to play them.

 

[Psykodad]

Remember when SNES mini came out and they were impossible to find?

And what did it sell to date? Maybe a couple million, sold to people who barely use it.
Can't imagine it being anything other than a luxury gadget.

I'm not even arguing that BC is a bad thing, I'm just saying it isn't an important aspect for consoles (no matter the platform).
It's something that's just there if it's there.
Even Tflops matter more.

 

[Mr Hyde]

Why make PS1 and PS2 (and even PS3) emulation when they got PS Now? That's where the old games are is someone wants to play them.

PS Now is crap and lacks a huge part of the PSX - PS2 library. I don't want to shell out money for a sub par experience. I want native BC so I can play my collection of games I've amassed over the years. I'm tired of having to hook up old machines just to play some classics. PS5 should be able to handle PS1 and 2 without any compromises. Sony is just cheaping out here.

 

[Deto]

I call bullshit. There is a bigger call for BC now than there has ever been.

in 2013 nobody cared when they bought an xbox

Things change?

So now SSD matters more than TF

you: "sony fanboy"

 

[StreetsofBeige]

in 2013 nobody cared when they bought an xbox

Things change?

So now SSD matters more than TF

you: "sony fanboy"

Reason why people care about BC now is because they got tons of digital games and want access to play them. Similar to a PC where if you upgrade parts, your HDD still has all your games.

In previous gen, most people bought discs except for XBL/PSN $10 downloadable games, and most gamers probably sold/traded their discs so they really don't have many games left to want carrying over.

For me, I have around 5 disc based games and all the rest are digital. Hey, I want these games to carry over.

Also, console makers can't make the excuse of "it's different architecture". Consoles now are basically PCs. No Cell, no 360 Power PC set up etc... Should be a clean and easy transition.

If PC game makers can make a game run across a million configs, surely then can handle a game working on two different console gens.

 

[Psykodad]

Reason why people care about BC now is because they got tons of digital games and want access to play them. Similar to a PC where if you upgrade parts, your HDD still has all your games.

In previous gen, most people bought discs except for XBL/PSN $10 downloadable games, and most gamers probably sold/traded their discs so they really don't have many games left to want carrying over.

For me, I have around 5 disc based games and all the rest are digital. Hey, I want these games to carry over.

Also, console makers can't make the excuse of "it's different architecture". Consoles now are basically PCs. No Cell, no 360 Power PC set up etc... Should be a clean and easy transition.

If PC game makers can make a game run across a million configs, surely then can handle a game working on two different console gens.

Why don't you just stick to PC then?

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Why don't you just stick to PC then?

And try to play games on a laptop with a Radeon Vega Mobile gpu?

Some of the game I play aren't even on PC. Last time NHL was on PC was 10 years ago.

 

[Psykodad]

And try to play games on a laptop with a Radeon Vega Mobile gpu?

Some of the game I play aren't even on PC. Last time NHL was on PC was 10 years ago.

Maybe it's time to upgrade your PC then. Think about all that money you'll save because of BC.

 

[Shin]

Well as we have seen before, BC is nice in the beginning, but overall not as essential to consumers as people make it. As long as customers have access to their digital libraries, they will be fine.

That's the same thing, to have your library available is to be backwards compatible.
I'm not the only one that skipped this generation, for those players that want to purchase titles that were released on current gen it's a godsend to have those titles work on future generations.
It allows for flexibility and I can jump in whenever I feel like without feeling the need that I must purchase a console now or I won't be able to enjoy the game - it's a nice choice for consumers to have.

 

[NahaNago]

I think that Sony should just make a retro console that plays all of their old games

 

[Deeper Underground]

That's the same thing, to have your library available is to be backwards compatible.
I'm not the only one that skipped this generation, for those players that want to purchase titles that were released on current gen it's a godsend to have those titles work on future generations.
It allows for flexibility and I can jump in whenever I feel like without feeling the need that I must purchase a console now or I won't be able to enjoy the game - it's a nice choice for consumers to have.

Well that’s what I mean. Yes it’s “BC”, but it’s also forward compatibility since this is the first generation where digital sales and services played a major part. When people say BC, they are mainly referring to PS1-3 or Xbox - Xbox One.

 

[Dr.Morris79]

Maybe it's time to upgrade your PC then. Think about all that money you'll save because of BC.

Why be a complete prick over people wanting to conserve their librarys? Or BC in general, it's a brilliant addition.

It's odd logic you'd even consider arguing over such a thing. Whatever floats your boat though.

 

[Gt111]

The "back compat doesn't matter" crowd seems to ignore the fact that some of these older games can be "new" to millions of new players. My kids and I have played a bunch of "old" back compat games via Game Pass and they are often just as good, if not better than many current titles. Game Pass makes back compat much greater than "replaying my library."

This. I’m playing blue dragon for the first time. And it’s going great. Never got a 360 so the game is like new for me. And got to experience this on backwards compatibility feature.

 

[DaMonsta]

As a person who welcomes the all digital future, Microsoft’s policy makes me feel very secure in spending money in their store. I can imagine a future where I pass my Xbox account and hundreds of digital games to my grandkids, in the same way my grandfather passed on his old coleco vision and games to me.

Only problem then the hardware was old and tired/barely working and he only had a few games. With Microsoft’s policy both of those issues will be solved.

Probably only spending gaming money in the Microsoft store going forward, unless there’s a game I just have to play elsewhere

 

[Psykodad]

Why be a complete prick over people wanting to conserve their librarys? Or BC in general, it's a brilliant addition.

It's odd logic you'd even consider arguing over such a thing. Whatever floats your boat though.

Where did I trash BC?
I said it's a nice feature to have.

 

[FeldMonster]

I don't fully understand to this day, why it was not ready at launch, because custom part in silicon was obviously there. It was for decompressing X360 textures.

Because gamers threw a hissy fit over the "scary" digital future that has come to pass anyways, forcing MS to have to backtrack on most of what they planned, such as digitally sharing games with your friends. Backwards compatibility would have available much sooner, but the engineers had to re-write the code to make it function without Kinect and without internet connection and still function properly. Re-writing the OS probably absorbed the entire backwards compatibility team.

 

[SLB1904]

Lol the bc myth again. As soon new gen starts rolling over you guys will jump the ship like every other generation without looking back

 

[Dr.Morris79]

Where did I trash BC?
I said it's a nice feature to have.

Oh, so you're being antagonistic for the sake of it, right'o.

 

[Psykodad]

Oh, so you're being antagonistic for the sake of it, right'o.

No, all I said was that it's a feature that can be missed and after that I was responding to responses.

 

[VlaudTheImpaler]

Yeah, and despite you getting dicked over, PS4 went on to be the second best selling console in history.

The average Joe is just gonna think it's a pity that a new console isn’t going to play their old games, but they'll move on anyway.
And I seriously doubt there is a majority who will replay 10 year old games every week.

BC is a nice extra at best.

My son is just getting old enough for me to start introducing him to some games. Thanks to BC he can get to play all the same games I did, that are appropriate for his age, but have an even better experience due to the enhancements brought by both PC and Xbox BC. He can start from the beginning of some of these long running franchises and I don't have to re-buy anything. I can't stand this one and done age of consumption. If people don't see video games as an investment beyond themselves or for the future then I don't know what to tell you. But it seems wasteful and shortsighted to me. I can now pass down all this history and these experiences that I've worked so hard to invest in to my children. That is far more than just a nice "extra" to me.

 

[Psykodad]

My son is just getting old enough for me to start introducing him to some games. Thanks to BC he can get to play all the same games I did, that are appropriate for his age, but have an even better experience due to the enhancements brought by both PC and Xbox BC. He can start from the beginning of some of these long running franchises and I don't have to re-buy anything. I can't stand this one and done age of consumption. If people don't see video games as an investment beyond themselves or for the future then I don't know what to tell you. But it seems wasteful and shortsighted to me. I can now pass down all this history and these experiences that I've worked so hard to invest in to my children. That is far more than just a nice "extra" to me.

I keep my old consoles, so my son, me or anyone else can always play older games.

BC isn't an essential feature and no idea how people somehow twist it in me saying it's a bad thing.

 

[TLZ]

Software emulation is possible, actually. Some pretty smart folks have been making major strides at getting it to work on PC (and jailbroken PS4s) for free.
I'd say the PS5 probably is more than capable.

Sony just cheaped out of investing time and money on it.

Yea. Check this PC build by ETA Prime. It's a bit weaker than the PS5, but it does excellent PS3 emulation. @6.36.




So if Sony put the effort, it's more than doable.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Yeah, and despite you getting dicked over, PS4 went on to be the second best selling console in history.

The average Joe is just gonna think it's a pity that a new console isn’t going to play their old games, but they'll move on anyway.
And I seriously doubt there is a majority who will replay 10 year old games every week.

BC is a nice extra at best.

People's attitudes change.

If console gamers were still all buying discs, trading them back, and didn't have internal and external HDDs filled to the brim with digital games, then ya BC probably isn't that important. Most gamers wouldn't have amassed a library of games on them to play on a new console anyway.

But most people now do, and they want to carry them over.

BC is important. That's why both MS and Sony are gunning for current BC as a minimum. The difference is MS is way ahead.

If BC wasn't important, both companies would just cut off support and force gamers to buy next gen only games only, or rebuy an existing game and reinstall it, since their current file wouldn't work.

I keep my old consoles, so my son, me or anyone else can always play older games.

BC isn't an essential feature and no idea how people somehow twist it in me saying it's a bad thing.

And that assumes every gamer is like you stockpiling old consoles. I don't. I get rid of my old consoles and only have one system at a time.

 

[VlaudTheImpaler]

I keep my old consoles, so my son, me or anyone else can always play older games.

BC isn't an essential feature and no idea how people somehow twist it in me saying it's a bad thing.

It's much easier to keep just one or two pieces of hardware rather than trying to figure out how to hook up all the old boxes to modern screens... Not everyone is a console or hardware collector. And even if I where, I wouldn't want to put that valuable and now fragile stuff out with my kids to abuse... Plus, they wouldn't have the same benefits of BC with better resolution, frame rates and even HDR in the case of MS.

No one is saying that you are saying it's a bad thing. But it's clear to anyone reading your posts that you are trying to downplay the feature...

 

[M1chl]

Because gamers threw a hissy fit over the "scary" digital future that has come to pass anyways, forcing MS to have to backtrack on most of what they planned, such as digitally sharing games with your friends. Backwards compatibility would have available much sooner, but the engineers had to re-write the code to make it function without Kinect and without internet connection and still function properly. Re-writing the OS probably absorbed the entire backwards compatibility team.

Well to be honest, this is separate part of OS. It's definitely not bound to DRM. Since objective programming exist, I don't see this to be an issue, if they would have it ready on launch, they would tell about it on reveal.

 

[Psykodad]

It's much easier to keep just one or two pieces of hardware rather than trying to figure out how to hook up all the old boxes to modern screens... Not everyone is a console or hardware collector. And even if I where, I wouldn't want to put that valuable and now fragile stuff out with my kids to abuse... Plus, they wouldn't have the same benefits of BC with better resolution, frame rates and even HDR in the case of MS.

No one is saying that you are saying it's a bad thing. But it's clear to anyone reading your posts that you are trying to downplay the feature...

Compared to talking up the feature? I'm just on the other end of the spectrum when talking about the importance of BC.

Ultimately, I'm indifferent to it's existence.

 

[ClearMind]

People's attitudes change.

They sure do.

When Sony had cross-play the whole last gen with PC and Xbox refused cross-play nobody gave a shit.
When Microsoft started demanding cross-play from Sony suddenly Sony was the devil for not giving in.

When Sony had BC the whole last gen nobody gave a shit about it either.
Same when both of them had no BC for over half of this generation.
Now Sony is once again the devil.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

They sure do.

When Sony had cross-play the whole last gen with PC and Xbox refused cross-play nobody gave a shit.
When Microsoft started demanding cross-play from Sony suddenly Sony was the devil for not giving in.

When Sony had BC the whole last gen nobody gave a shit about it either.
Same when both of them had no BC for over half of this generation.
Now Sony is once again the devil.

Didnt Sony remove BC from the PS3?

 

[StreetsofBeige]

They sure do.

When Sony had cross-play the whole last gen with PC and Xbox refused cross-play nobody gave a shit.
When Microsoft started demanding cross-play from Sony suddenly Sony was the devil for not giving in.

When Sony had BC the whole last gen nobody gave a shit about it either.
Same when both of them had no BC for over half of this generation.
Now Sony is once again the devil.

Big difference (as I said above) is that current gen gamers have tons of digital games and internal and external drives with tons of games. Some people probably have 100 installed and don't want to give them up.

In older generations, the vast majority of games were bought on disc and sold/traded back. PS2 didn't even have downloadable games. So what you get is gamers willing to move on to buying next gen games as they have hardly any last gen games to carry over. And for the hadful they still have, some will trade them in when getting a new console.

With a digital library, people have more games, HDD with tons more and there is zero value because you cant trade them in.