Wat, I need a link for that. How do you go from F-Zero to FFXV, lol.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
NPD - FFXV experienced the best console launch month in franchise history
ViewtifulJC
Banned
F zero
More like
F ff15 yay lmao
More like
F ff15 yay lmao
Wasn't as bad as I remembered but here you go. http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=227442761&postcount=14
Blackleg-sanji1
Banned
That's so random lol
I loved the action combat system and would really like to see more of that. The open world stuff unless it's more akin to Witcher 3 in regards to the sidequests I don't know if I would want it.
While I agree with those who say that 6M probably covered the entire troubled production, S-E management wasnt oblivious to the fact that Tabata was inheriting a mess.
The first 7 years of pre-production and intermitant development on VsXIII were sunk costs from years ago. What Tabata spent during his 3 years on the project is going to matter more, as those are more indicative of what an untroubled production on a future FF title would cost.
The first 7 years of pre-production and intermitant development on VsXIII were sunk costs from years ago. What Tabata spent during his 3 years on the project is going to matter more, as those are more indicative of what an untroubled production on a future FF title would cost.
The lack of stella left deep and painful scars. They only wish that the games fans feel the same pain
Only on Neogaf.
encephalon
Member
I guess "open world" is the future of the series.
Materia wasn't in every single FF after VII despite it being successful. X was linear while XII had a lot most vast and open locations. Most FF games are usually radically different outside of the usual series staples so I don't understand why everyone thinks all the games from now are going to be open world.
CrispyBoar
Banned
With a lot of buyer's remorse.
encephalon
Member
Yet FFVIII and FFIX very much followed the same format as FFVII. Materia is a minor detail. The games that followed FFVII largely followed the same format, with a heavy emphasis on story. The latter was especially true of FFX. FFXII was a departure from that game, sure, but it still had a hell of a lot more story content than FFXV.
Now that a game with almost no emphasis on story has been successful, what will future games look like?
I don't really see your point tbh? XIII was successful yet we didn't get two incredibly linear mainline titles after that, we got XIV, a mmo, and XV, an open world game. I don't see how one games success instantly determines how the next game will be.
Plus XV already has a unique history that I don't think a lot of FF games can even compare to so we don't know if the story issues are from the open world, it's long history of rewrites if rumors are to believed, or it simple just being told badly which still could have happened if it was linear.
Er, i think he will make the games SE will allow him to make.
Materia is a minor detail? Are you kidding me? How about you play the game without using materia and see how far you go? Hell, if draw & junction in 8 was a minor detail as well then maybe people would stop complaining about it.
For the bolded: FF is always have a heavy emphasis on story - even FF I & 3 with their Chaos time loop and World of darkness shenanigans. FFXV place emphasis on the relationship Noctis and his bro and weave that into
his sacrifice at the end.
encephalon
Member
XIII sold a lot of copies but was met with a lot of criticism that Square was very conscious of and attempted to address in XIII-2.
I would think the story definitely could have been better for being open world, but we can't pretend that open world isn't going to affect how future stories are told.
"Materia" isn't an approach to game design. I don't think you know what I mean by "heavy emphasis on story" if you think FFI has one.
Urm... then what do you think is game design? Because skills and abilities progression is a key aspect of any RPG game design.
encephalon
Member
Every Final Fantasy has had skills and ability progression. Materia is just one iteration.
Yes FFI have an emphasis on story. It could have been any collect the 4 mcguffins and slay the big bad but instead they decided to add the Chaos - Garland time loop in. For a game that was release 30 years ago, it have an emphasis on the story and was praised for it.
And how does that exclude it from - as you say it- 'game' design? Or the fact that a key aspect of a RPG is radically different for one game to the next is a 'minor detail'?
All they need to do is remember that FFXIII sold a ton too and XV is quite a different experience, gameplay wise and narrative wise.
Heck just look at the juggernaut FF7. FF8 introduce a new skill/stat progression system, level scaling enemy, re-work limit breaks to the point of game breaking and a story that involve you combining 3 different 'time' in a place to create a timeless void as if that is something that's suppose to make sense.
Astral Dog
Member
XIII-2 and Lighting Returns? They might not be mainline but were the only console games we were getting for 7 years.
for the rest,being open world fits with the FF formula so much,they will stick to that while adding stronger narrative elements.
FF XV is simply not comparable to the rest of the series thanks to its troubled development,countless rewrites and cut content
Edit: damn i only read the first paragraph
encephalon
Member
If that's what you think would fall under "heavy emphasis," then nearly all games have a "heavy emphasis" on story and there is no need for us to discuss anything because any story content at all will guarantee that FFXVI has a "heavy emphasis" on story in your book.
Materia wasn't a broad design choice made to chase a certain market. It's one skill system among many in a series where skills systems have changed from title to title, from the very beginning. FFXV's open world design is an experiment to appeal the broader western market. It succeeded and we can probably expect future games to remain open world in order to continue to appeal to that market. Skill systems like Materia will probably continue to change from title to title, though.
Did you miss the part where I said that FFI was release 30 years ago? Do you really think the standard of story telling in video game is the same as it was in 1987? Even If you want to disregard that, How about FF2, 4, 5, 6 that you conveniently left out? Don't they're all have heavy emphasis on their story? So that's leave only 1 and 3 as a non-heavy story title, it's still doesn't detract from the point that, success or failure, SE have been focusing heavily the majority of their FF stories - I can't believe that I have to type this out.
You keep saying how Square is going to chase the popular market with FFXVI when you ignore how FFVIII have drastic changes from FFVII - their break out hit. So what was the mass appeal that FF7 that they keep the same with FF8? The graphic and art style is drastically different, the skill system isn't the same, the party isn't similar, the story isn't similar. The world isn't the same. The few things things that they have in common is the 3D graphic, the world map and the attack command.
Vincent Grayson
Member
Shit, I played the first FF game back in 1990. For as sparse as its story seems today, that shit blew my mind back then. Time loops and crazy plots hatched by badass evil monsters to save themselves? It's crazy. And there was plenty of lore and story elsewhere in the world too.
It was definitely a big step up from the other RPGs of various flavors I played back then.
This thread is the gift that keep on giving!
Regarding story, I am confused to why it so important now. Based upon many, many GAF responses in the past, 'FFs have always had 'bad' stories'. So why should XV be any different in their eyes? It seems like a cheap way to bash a game. I love FFVIII to death but I can argue that it has more uneven world development and story plots than XV does.
encephalon
Member
I don't even really know where to begin. You don't seem to have any sense of perspective and view every single change made in the series, no matter how small, as monumental. If you can't see that FFVII and VIII are very similar, I don't know what to tell you. They're both JRPGs that feature the same ATB battle system. They are both structurally similar, if not identical. They both heavily rely upon FMV cutscenes and share the same dramatic increase in story volume relative to the rest of the series. These elements are fundamental. Characters and plot are expected to change throughout the series. FFVII introduced a vastly different, more modern aesthetic. FFVIII may seem different, but in fact, within the context of the rest of the series VIII's equally modern if not futuristic world was very much in line with what VII brought to the series.
I don't think we can really continue this, so I'm going to have to agree to disagree. We'll see what happens when Square announces FFXVI.
I will say, however, that I actually do view FFII as a very important title in the series in terms of storytelling. Not only was it a major step up from FFI, but also introduced the evil empire and resistance group that would be revisited again and again throughout the series.
I'd like to see you try.
Just off the top of my head... -Spoilered just in case -
The entire Centra civilization, Odin's Tower, The Lunar Cry, why monsters are on the Moon, Adel, Other Sorceress, Ultimecia's desire to go back to Adel's youth, the Future itself, Ultimecia's motivation (more expanding upon her speech at the end of disc 1), the Sorceresses in the TC, the Deepsea Ruins, the Great Hyde, the GFs...
So much to be explored there and very little to no information to work with (outside of conversations and the Information section).
So much to be explored there and very little to no information to work with (outside of conversations and the Information section).
Again I love VIII to death but I want to learn more about the world soooo bad. Aside from the Great Astral War and Solheim, I feel we know more about Eos at this point than VIII's world, and there is still DLC coming that could provide more.
Damn it, now I want VIII-2 even more!
Outside of my own personal biases, I feel like VIII was more deserving off a remake than VII because of a lot this stuff. VII has been expanded on so much (although how good they handled it was debatable) but there's a lot of things that just aren't explained in VIII well or at all. I also think a remake would help would have helped with the lack of character development for the party members that weren't Squall and Rinoa.
Also I want a scene of
Laguna telling Squall about Raine and that he's his father dammit. >:c
encephalon
Member
FFVIII definitely has many things that are left mysterious or vague. We don't know a lot about the past. I think FFXV would be in a lot better state if that was its problem. FFVIII has a largely logical sequence of events. One thing happens, then the next thing happens building off of what has happened in the game thus far. This doesn't happen very often in FFXV.
The purpose of the speech is something like, oh, I don't know, "I could stand in the middle of 5th avenue and shoot somebody and [you would still cheer for me]*"
*Because I bring the promise of elevating Galbadia to a powerful, imperial state much like Esthar was in the past.
Can you explain what you mean? I'm hard pressed to find a game with higher production values than ffxv. If you're talking about polish, that's another thing but if ffxv doesn't have high production values then I don't know what does.
TechnicPuppet
Nothing! I said nothing!
It's a shame that the Xbox version doing well probably won't change anything. Most Japanese games won't be released on the system and when the next one is and it doesn't sell well it'll be the same story of Xbox owners only being interested in shooters and sports games.
How can a following for these types of games be built when so few are released.
How can a following for these types of games be built when so few are released.
So, if SE listened to FFXIII's negative feedback for future titles, who says they won't do the same after FFXV even though it sold a lot?
Unknown One
Member
Pretty much. FFXV open world is among the best, technically. I can't wait for a PC version. I would actually build a new rig just for it.
encephalon
Member
FFXV seems fairly popular in spite of its flaws. People value to the open nature of the game.