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[too much eslim]

Custom doesn't mean something is better or worse. You add or take one feature away from the standard chip it's automatically customed.

 

[too much eslim]

I have seen it said that because VRS and Mesh Shaders were developed by AMD and Microsoft jointly for RDNA 2, Sony wasn't able to get both on their GPU.
Could explain why it is missing.
Whether Sony has gone and done their own version I guess we will find out at a later date.

They were asked during the road to PS5 in March. We are essentially 2 weeks away. AMD event was the time to announce such features.

 

[Valued Gamer]

They were asked during the road to PS5 in March. We are essentially 2 weeks away. AMD event was the time to announce such features.

I'm not positive that the PS5 will have either, as there is both a hardware and API component to both of them, and as Sony didn't play a role in either ends of that for RDNA, It could of made it hard for them to get it.
But you never know. Sony arnt dummies.

 

[too much eslim]

I'm not positive that the PS5 will have either, as there is both a hardware and API component to both of them, and as Sony didn't play a role in either ends of that for RDNA, It could of made it hard for them to get it.
But you never know. Sony arnt dummies.

I don't think not having such a feature makes them dumb. Them not waiting for all the features allowed their teams to be ahead in development. None if this tech stuff matter to the masses. Right now without knowing any information you would think Sony had the most powerful console because of the wo w factor most of their games produced. MS havent shown any in-game graphics of their first party games. The one they actually did show created the Craig meme. Power isn't needed to be a good gaming machine. Plus most PS fans are ok with 30 fps, so Sony is in excellent shape to dominate again.

 

[Valued Gamer]

I don't think not having such a feature makes them dumb. Them not waiting for all the features allowed their teams to be ahead in development. None if this tech stuff matter to the masses. Right now without knowing any information you would think Sony had the most powerful console because of the wo w factor most of their games produced. MS havent shown any in-game graphics of their first party games. The one they actually did show created the Craig meme. Power isn't needed to be a good gaming machine. Plus most PS fans are ok with 30 fps, so Sony is in excellent shape to dominate again.

I'm rooting for MS this gen, not because I don't like Sony, but I always want the underdog to do well.
Sony will smash it this gen, they will sell a heap of consoles, make some amazing games, and should make some good money.
But, MS has really gone all out this gen. They have made the most powerful console. They have put everything they have into it's extensions, such as ML, VRS, Mesh Shaders, SFS etc. These extensions will give the XSX a long life when devs work out how to leverage them, especially considering these are also available on PC GPUs as well.
MS also put out the most powerful console at the same price as the PS5.
With all this, plus MS buying Zenimax and all the other studios, creating Game pass, Xcloud, the best back compat in the industry, amongst others, MS has gone all out to redeem themselves, and I hope it pays off for them.
A healthy Sony, and a healthy MS makes the players the winner.

 

[Gamerguy84]

I'm rooting for MS this gen, not because I don't like Sony, but I always want the underdog to do well.
Sony will smash it this gen, they will sell a heap of consoles, make some amazing games, and should make some good money.
But, MS has really gone all out this gen. They have made the most powerful console. They have put everything they have into it's extensions, such as ML, VRS, Mesh Shaders, SFS etc. These extensions will give the XSX a long life when devs work out how to leverage them, especially considering these are also available on PC GPUs as well.
MS also put out the most powerful console at the same price as the PS5.
With all this, plus MS buying Zenimax and all the other studios, creating Game pass, Xcloud, the best back compat in the industry, amongst others, MS has gone all out to redeem themselves, and I hope it pays off for them.
A healthy Sony, and a healthy MS makes the players the winner.

Bro MS is not the underdog lol. If they want they will just buy gaming. Everything.

Sony may be the leader between them but MS is not the underdog here.

 

[too much eslim]

Bro MS is not the underdog lol. If they want they will just buy gaming. Everything.

Sony may be the leader between them but MS is not the underdog here.

MS just can't buy everyone. Playstation is the more global and bigger brand.

 

[Valued Gamer]

Bro MS is not the underdog lol. If they want they will just buy gaming. Everything.

Sony may be the leader between them but MS is not the underdog here.

Hearts and minds. Hearts and minds.

 

[RaySoft]

I'm not positive that the PS5 will have either, as there is both a hardware and API component to both of them, and as Sony didn't play a role in either ends of that for RDNA, It could of made it hard for them to get it.
But you never know. Sony arnt dummies.

Isn't "VRS" just a MS term that's part of the software API that is DX12U? If I'm not mistaken the VRS software uses the hardware mesh shaders to acheive what they do.
PS5 has primitive shaders, so not completely the same as the mesh variant in the Series X|S SoC.
If I'm not mistaken the mesh shaders are "easier" to use, i.e. don't require the same amount of input compared to the primitives the PS5 has.
On the flipside the primitives are more versatile since you can be more "specific" with them?

I'm not sure, but there are bound to be some experts here on the matter that could shed some light on this?

 

[Codeblew]

You're still trying to compare 2 entirely different parts of the rendering pipeline.

Don't be dense. He is explaining how the two pipelines are different.

 

[Eternal21]

I'm rooting for MS this gen, not because I don't like Sony, but I always want the underdog to do well.

I view Sony as an underdog, given the amount of cash Microsoft is sitting on.

 

[duhmetree]

Founds this exchange.....

 

[SatansReverence]

Don't be dense. He is explaining how the two pipelines are different.

And thus comparing them is apples to oranges like I said.

 

[Codeblew]

And thus comparing them is apples to oranges like I said.

SMH

 

[John Wick]

Bro MS is not the underdog lol. If they want they will just buy gaming. Everything.

Sony may be the leader between them but MS is not the underdog here.

Yes your right! MS has sooo much money they can become the leader in any field?
Except what happened to Windows phone? Or Bing search?

 

[John Wick]

I don't even know why MS are claiming to have full RDNA2 features? Do they have the Infinity Cache on the Series X/S????

 

[DynamiteCop!]

I'm getting really sick of the SDF who has absolutely no credible information of any kind running to conspiracy theory YouTube videos from nobodies, pulling up Reddit crap from nobodies, and dragging in Twitter nonsense from nobodies. They use this nonsense as some kind of counter against official information from not only the direct console manufacture themselves, but also the creators of the architecture and chips. It's getting nauseating.

No one cares about your 3k subscriber YouTube cronies, no one cares about your Reddit thread echo chambers, no one cares about your 700 follower Twitter feeds that get 18 likes. Get real information or get out, this shouldn't even be a thing anymore.

As of right now Microsoft has the only consoles which have full RDNA 2 hardware functions and feature sets, not a point of debate, and they have stated they are the only ones who do. That's not a claim which is made lightly unless they know they are. As for Sony; we have no idea what they actually have implemented in terms of custom alternatives, but patents sure as hell mean less than nothing because about 1/10th of them ever get used, and there's no evidence to suggest they have these hardware/software feature or alternatives to them.

 

[Tmack]

People are crazy thinking that mere couple weeks away from release, Sony will enter in any type of technical brag argument about specific hw details.

They will simple let their games speak for them.

 

[alabtrosMyster]

Founds this exchange.....

Who is this paul he is referring to in the last tweet?

 

[DForce]

Who is this paul he is referring to in the last tweet?

RedGamingTech.

 

[M_A_C]

RedGamingTech.

And what did he say?

 

[DForce]

And what did he say?

 

[El Pistolero]

I view Sony as an underdog, given the amount of cash Microsoft is sitting on.

Poor MS, obliged to ask for donations to continue their valiant race against the Japanese-Fuck-You-Dorphins omnipotent villain. I wish them a Rocky-like ascension.

The level of delusion here, vis-a-vis one of the most predatorial and anti-competitive companies on the planet, which has just dropped 7.5 Billions to deprive its direct rival of the output of a whole publisher, and has manifested its desire to sign even more cheques to acquire more players...

 

[megreotsugua]

My last post. The idea that a geometry engine is a geometry engine that you describe above is the same as stating that a shader is a shader.

There are multiple approaches to achieve this with very different data-paths. Sony has a new GE that - if the available information is correct - can do both advanced culling and prioritisation - with those priorities applied in all parts of the downstream pipeline to minimise GPU workloads. This cannot be done that way with any other GPU in the market.

I find it very interesting with such a different approach and we have already seen an amount of geometry on the screen in for example Demon's Souls that we have not seen before.

Let's wait for benchmarks but it is pretty rich to make assumptions that this is not beneficial for the platform based on what Mark Cerny, ND, Bluepoint, Guerrilla etc has achieved in the past. Developers seem very happy with the solution.

Very insightful.

The confusion I guess stems from Sony naming it Geometry Engine which is already an established name that refers to something else.

 

[Elias]

Delusion at it's finest. Meanwhile, the performance gains granted by vrs on MS games such as Gears 5, Gears Tactics, and the Wolfenstein series.

 

[duhmetree]

And what did he say?

From what I've gathered...

A custom 'next-gen geometry engine' (NGGE) which allows variable mesh shading and works/processes differently than RDNA2 Mesh Shading.

These names can make things very confusing. This 'next gen geometry engine' (NGGE) was the alleged RDNA3 aspect.

This is why people, like me, want Sony to clarify with what's going on under the hood. We do not know how Sony is Ray Tracing or what Mesh Shader process is being used.

 

[duhmetree]

And what did he say?

This is not Red Gaming Tech but it's essentially the same story.

timestamped



who knows... only 2 weeks away

 

[Three Jackdaws]

This is not Red Gaming Tech but it's essentially the same story.

timestamped



who knows... only 2 weeks away

He got that information from Paul (RedGamingTech).

 

[M_A_C]

This is not Red Gaming Tech but it's essentially the same story.

timestamped



who knows... only 2 weeks away

I’m a fan of Moore’s Law and for got he said that. Just listening to his newest podcast right now and this is interesting, he says he has multi sources stating that the velocity architecture of the Xbox is not even close to PS5:

Timestamped

 

[longdi]

I’m a fan of Moore’s Law and for got he said that. Just listening to his newest podcast right now and this is interesting, he says he has multi sources stating that the velocity architecture of the Xbox is not even close to PS5:

Timestamped

MLID is a known click baiting bullshitter.

Imo we can only watch RTG and NXGamer, amongst the more popular YT
Paul from RTG is proven.
NXGamer doesnt do rumor mongering, but he does effort in analysing pixels etc.

 

[duhmetree]

MLID is a known click baiting bullshitter.

Imo we can only watch RTG and NXGamer, amongst the more popular YT
Paul from RTG is proven.
NXGamer doesnt do rumor mongering, but he does effort in analysing pixels etc.

timestamped; with same message




"PS5's custom Geometry Engine is more advanced than RDNA2..."
"RDNA3 is influenced by the PS5"

 

[rnlval]

Also, kitty's reaction to the presser of yesterday...



People fall for marketing talk far too easily.

FYI, PC's Vega 56/60 includes ROPS being connected to multi-megabytes of L2 cache and Rapid Pack Math. RX Vega M GH may have Vega ROPS with L2 cache improvements.

 

[II_JumPeR_I]

i am a gamer, I play them all (PlayStation, Xbox, Switch and PC) because of my many diverse friends

........but damn It if people think things will change this generation!

Fortnite, Call of Duty and Grand Theft Auto will be the money makers again in this generation and people will buy them on PlayStation just like they did on PS4 which ended off in a bang

People can and will also buy this games on Xbox. Xbox sadly is still recovering from the bad late 360 years and first half lifecycle of XboxOne.

Lets wait and see how things will go this new gen... i doubt it will be like current gen.
Especially when Bethesda games become Xbox exclusive, which undoubtly will happen.

 

[rnlval]

You miss the whole point.

All the buzzwords used are about one thing and one thing only: How can we reduce the number of calculations to create a frame with minimum fidelity loss?

VRS downgrades the shading rate for parts of the 3D space that matters less for how the frame looks (e.g. periphery, obscured objects etc).

What Matt refers to is what Mark Cerny stated in 'Road to Ps5'. If you have an advanced enough GE you can a) cull all geometries that are obscured in the frame and b) annotate priorities to the areas of the geometries that are seen (e.g. highest priority to the middle of the frame, higher priority to objects closer to the view-point compared to those further away). Then you can apply primitive shaders the most to the highest priority areas, less to lower priority areas/objects and not at all to culled objects.

The result is identical - significant reduction in # of calculations with minimal visual fidelity loss. What is most efficient? I do not know but based on the rumour mill, the front loading of the whole pipeline like this seems like tomorrow's technology and not yesterday's which you imply.

FYI, VRS can be applied at the pixel shading workload, not just geometry/vertex related workload.

Anyway, Vega's primitive shader potential uses i.e. note the multi-resolution rendering.

Vega's primitive shaders are not compliant with DirectX12 Ultimate's Mesh Shader and Variable Shading Rate. AMD lost to NVIDIA's future direction.

 

[Jboemios]

Not sure if you know this, but Matt Hargett is a former principle software engineer on the PS5. I'm guessing he knows what he's talking about...

I hope he is not an insider like that farce Glee guy that PS fanboys championed

 

[DForce]

I hope he is not an insider like that farce Glee guy that PS fanboys championed

Klee was an anonymous person

Matt is a confirmed ex-Sony employee.

 

[rnlval]

Isn't "VRS" just a MS term that's part of the software API that is DX12U? If I'm not mistaken the VRS software uses the hardware mesh shaders to acheive what they do.
PS5 has primitive shaders, so not completely the same as the mesh variant in the Series X|S SoC.
If I'm not mistaken the mesh shaders are "easier" to use, i.e. don't require the same amount of input compared to the primitives the PS5 has.
On the flipside the primitives are more versatile since you can be more "specific" with them?

I'm not sure, but there are bound to be some experts here on the matter that could shed some light on this?

Variable Shading Rate Tier 1 can be used without Mesh shaders e.g. Intel Ice Lake and Tiger Lake IGP.

Variable Shading Rate Tier 2 usually comes with Mesh Shader Tier 1 e.g. Turing and Ampere. RX 6000 series and XS X/S supports DirectX12 Ultimate compliance.

New in DirectX— Feature Level 12_2 - DirectX Developer Blog

What’s a feature level? If you’re a game developer who has spent any amount of time with computer hardware, or perhaps a computer game which simulates working with it, you will know that graphics cards are not all the same. There’s differentiation.

devblogs.microsoft.com

Q: Which hardware platforms will support feature level 12_2?
A: We’re absolutely pleased to inform that:

• Feature level 12_2 is supported on NVIDIA GeForce RTX and NVIDIA Quadro RTX GPUs.
• AMD’s upcoming RDNA 2 architecture based GPUs will include full feature level 12_2 support.
• Intel’s roadmap includes discrete GPUs that will empower developers to take full advantage of Feature Level 12_2.

Feature Level 12_2 needs the following specs
Shader Model: 6.5
Raytracing: Tier 1.1
Variable shading rate: Tier 2
Mesh shader: Tier 1
Sampler feedback: Tier 0.9
...
etc

 

[anothertech]

Toldja

It's RDNA3

VRS2

 

[Lort]

Redtechgaming walking back his claims here....

He DOSENT claim ps5 has any RDNA3 or infinity cache. And yet we have so many saying he said it therefor its true

lols more pure custom bs.

 

[oldergamer]

Toldja

It's RDNA3

VRS2

Bullshit

 

[Panajev2001a]

FYI, VRS can be applied at the pixel shading workload, not just geometry/vertex related workload.

Anyway, Vega's primitive shader potential uses i.e. note the multi-resolution rendering.

Vega's primitive shaders are not compliant with DirectX12 Ultimate's Mesh Shader and Variable Shading Rate. AMD lost to NVIDIA's future direction.

At a different granularity PS4 Pro already supports multi resolution render targets (very useful to implement foveatish rendering for PS4 VR titles).

 

[oldergamer]

Red gaming is full of shit. I dont know why anyone would take them as a official source out of any reason but desperation

Xbox is full rdna 2 compliant and ps5 isnt. People are focusing on vrs but its a lot more then that.

 

[El Pistolero]

Red gaming is full of shit. I dont know why anyone would take them as a official source out of any reason but desperation

Xbox is full rdna 2 compliant and ps5 isnt. People are focusing on vrs but its a lot more then that.

Go on, Oh Wise one!

 

[DForce]

Redtechgaming walking back his claims here....

He DOSENT claim ps5 has any RDNA3 or infinity cache. And yet we have so many saying he said it therefor its true

lols more pure custom bs.

You have selective reading.

He has said from the beginning that both Xbox and PS5 will have some features of RDNA 3.

Both PS4 Pro and Xbox One X had features of later architecture.

You guys are so easy to discredit anything that's related to the PS5.

 

[DForce]

Red gaming is full of shit. I dont know why anyone would take them as a official source out of any reason but desperation

Xbox is full rdna 2 compliant and ps5 isnt. People are focusing on vrs but its a lot more then that.

He has shown to have inside info.

You? Nothing thus far. RGT has been right on a lot of things, which means he has creditable.

 

[Black_Stride]

Founds this exchange.....

Joined July 2019. - Just in time to console war.
No Avatar.
No Credentials.
Wants clout but wont say why.

Yeah im totally gonna trust that person.

 

[smart_brazileiro]

We cool now, kids?

 

[devilNprada]

I

Custom doesn't mean something is better or worse.

Yes it does

 

[Jokerevo]

OK but why does HI look so shit?

 

[sinnergy]

I

Yes it does

It doesn’t .