Lanrutcon
Member
Hyperbole. Turns out it really wasn't.
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Female Smash player was sexually molested at EVO: Offender banned from comp play 1 yr
- Thread starter CO_Andy
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Hyperbole. Turns out it really wasn't.
ElBoxyBrown
Banned
Not just the internet. His career over here in the US is done.
How dare you, I'm absolutely blaming the person who did the despicable thing and think alcohol is no excuse. If no alcohol was there, could he use it as an excuse? No he couldn't. Removing excuses is a good thing.
Oh, and gross people aren't inherently sexual predators. They're just gross. I don't think they help anything.
I wasn't aware of how convention and hotel deals works. Now I know. I had it explained to me.
And I was saying you could just have the same people on security checking for weapons also be breathalysing people to minimise the rambunctious out-of-control people that may slip in.
TheSpoiler
Member
A few problems with stopping people who are drinking from coming in.
Drinking is not comparable to weapons. A drunk person is not a weapon. They can be a douchebag, but that does not remove them from the equation of the event. Like, just because they are drunk does not excuse their actions in any way shape or form. Thus, going back to it being his fault, not the drinks.
Drinking is a huge thing for hotels. That's how they make their money. Even attempting to stop drunk people from coming in would deter attendees from drinking and cut into their profits.
Depending on the layout, it may not be feasible to even set that up. More than one entrance, connection from the hotel right into the hall, etc. And then you have the issue of stepping on the toes of the hotel, angering their guests on their property.
Many TOs can barely afford a form of security or helpers. The money for a breath test is better spent on that.
TOs would need to put on every single ticket or invite that being over a limit is not allowed, otherwise they'd be in a whole lot of trouble.I don't even think hotels would give them that range or allow them to state that on their packages.
Testing suspicious people is grounds for bad PR. C'mon. You know that'll be abused.
People are going to find ways to drink inside the hall. A breath test coming in isn't going to stop them from drinking after they cross the point and getting drunk there.
And lastly, let's say the event is over. Drinks outside at a local bar or the hotel itself, and then some shit goes down. What good did that test do when the event is over? Or when it's the next day?
It's a flimsy bandaid. That's why we need to focus on real fixes and not outlandish methods that ignore the real problems.
There's always an excuse for any crime. You can't remove all excuses. You shouldn't even try to, because it's not even logically feasible. You work within reality and try to create a better society/community and enforce punishments. Like, I know what you are trying to do, but you are wasting your time looking at unrealistic solutions to things that aren't really the problem.
finalflame
Member
I've lived in 3 major american cities and have yet to encounter any kind of 'alcohol-free' zone, other than maybe ordinances which disallow constructing bars near schools.
So you decide to ban/restrict alcohol at an event with a bunch of young people who, regardless of what you try to do, will want to party and get crazy. The only thing that ends up happening is people either a) find creative ways to sneak in alcohol, or b) bring in much harder drugs which are easier to conceal and cause much rowdier behavior.
Yes it does? Why else are there alcohol free zones in some countries? Being intoxiated also means that people change and many of them cannot control themselves anymore.
Most tournament are ran at a loss so things like security probably aren't feasible.
The begging/bargaining thing is a common reaction to getting caught doing something that will have consequences.
While community plays a part of it your early life and personality likely play an effect as well. I think something like that would require a study.
The begging/bargaining thing is a common reaction to getting caught doing something that will have consequences.
While community plays a part of it your early life and personality likely play an effect as well. I think something like that would require a study.
What the hell
Someone who is rowdy and acting anti-social will likely get removed from the convention, I don't see getting rid of that problem beforehand from evidently drunk people would be a problem.
Cut into hotel profits? Sorry, don't care.
They already confiscate weapons, they likely already remove rowdy people, they likely already do ID checks at over-18s events. Adding one more thing to the equation isn't going to break the system.
And testing suspicious people will be "abused"? What? Will the security guard rig the breath tester to always be over the limit?
So just don't try because some people will manage to find a way to get it in anyway?
And my nearest city, Sydney, does alcohol-free zones. Australia does have a binge drinking, alcohol violence problem after all.
Sixfortyfive
He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
Oh, so this is a culture clash.
I was about to make some kind of snide comment about how someone advocating for "alcohol-free zones" at a huge Las Vegas (e)sporting event of all things has to be living on some other planet.
Seductivpancakes
Member
It's weird people are trying to pin some of the blame on the boyfriend.
ScientificPizza
Banned
...what are you doing
I'm glad that the sponsor took such a fast and decisive action. It really sets a precedent that this shit should not be tolerated at all.
I wouldn't say it's a culture clash. I'm also Australian, and while there are definitely alcohol free zones, it's not like they're this incredibly prevalent thing. They're more for public areas, like drinking in the street or in parks or something. Sydney has more restrictive laws, but even they are very new and pretty controversial
finalflame
Member
We tried. It was called the Prohibition, and it failed miserably. Time and time again trying to outlaw or limit alcohol consumption has proved fruitless; people like drinking.
Further proving the point: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-now-theyre-dealing-with-something-far-worse/
The issue at hand is not alcohol, it's that the asshole who did this is a molester/shit human, and that the couple allowed a drunk stranger to sleep in their room (which obviously does not put them at fault, but is a dumb idea nonetheless). Moral policing by restricting alcohol consumption just won't work. The best idea, really, is to just hammer safety precautions into everyone's mind so as to avoid any future situations like this as much as possible. There will be no catch-all solution that will absolutely eradicate situations like this altogether.
When you can't remove a problem, you try to minimise it as best as possible. Without the alcohol, what would his excuse been? "I couldn't help myself", or "She came onto me"? He wouldn't be able to garner the "oh he wasn't himself" sympathy pat from half the community then.
But on creating a better society, I think minimising problems is a good way to do that. I don't see minimising excuses to crimes as being infeasible.
Masked Man
I said wow
lol At people like K9 trying to defend/justify Hyuga's actions. Good on VGBC for dropping his ass. Hope Vicky's doing okay. :/
BibiMaghoo
Member
"I'm not a bad person!"
Said the wanabe rapist...
Fuck him.
Said the wanabe rapist...
Fuck him.
TheSpoiler
Member
Of course. People acting out should be taken out of the convention. But being drunk is different things to different people. Some people like me just get sleepy. Others become more talkative. The guy in the OP got shitty. You aren't fixing the problem by turning away drunk people. Like I said, that money and effort is better spent having people that can help others. Like with the other problem that arose at CEO, where the girl found someone to help her and walk her to her room. TOs and conventions already run on shoestrings and low manpower, they need to be used appropriately.
You may not care about profits, but that's the cold reality of the situation. Just like you may not enjoy drunk people at a concert fucking it up for the rest of the people around them, the hosts love the profits and that's how they continue to function. So, within the boundaries of reality, you can either "not care" or find ways to work with it.
And as for the abused part, all it takes is one shitty guard to test a group of minorities over and over for it to become an issue.
That's not even tackling the rest of what I've said. The legalities, how it doesn't stop people from after-event happenings (like, here), etc. I implore you to keep grounded so we can talk about real solutions.
People giving sympathy to him are going to find a way to do so regardless. You even said it yourself "she was coming onto me". That's a super common excuse against women in situations like this. In fact, the drunk excuse isn't even as airtight as his supporters think it is because at least the "she came on to me" turns into a he-said-she-said event, with people usually trusting the person who's a male because he's famous and plays a game they like.
We can definitely minimize these problems, but thinking about things in a rational manner rather than escaping to things outside the boundaries of what could be isn't going to help. Instead of banning drunk people, we need more security, more helpers, more safe zones, public enforcements like this, and more community members speaking out.
Those things can happen across the board, and you don't have to wait for the logistics of an event to align properly (because not all of them are created equal, both in scale and in funding)
Awesome. US is great in the sex crime legislation. In my country the government actively hides the criminal so that nobody can know who he is. It's so fucked up.
May this piece of shit suffer till he dies.
Majukun
Member
turned up they were right of not wanting him to wonder THAT drunk around Vegas..too bad this happened
of course i don't know this hyuga guy,and he might be lying and just trying to cover himself up,but indeed both the people involved and himself recognize his "alterated mind" state
there isn't really that much to say,just remember guys,never get THAT drunk?alchohol is fine and all,but i personally never drink enough to lost total control.
of course i don't know this hyuga guy,and he might be lying and just trying to cover himself up,but indeed both the people involved and himself recognize his "alterated mind" state
there isn't really that much to say,just remember guys,never get THAT drunk?alchohol is fine and all,but i personally never drink enough to lost total control.
While the playerbase is unfortunately divided, all of the organisers seem to be handling this pretty well. I think the scene actually comes out looking pretty good in this.
Yeah, this is probably a culture clash in action. Alcohol-free zones has been a thing where I live since before I was born. Most events, like New Years fireworks and the such, are alcohol-free as well. You can do it in your own home if you can see the fireworks, but being down on the street and drinking during events like that is a no-no.
But it's not about reducing people drinking, it's about reducing people drinking in environments where their behaviour can then effect others.
You can say what you want but it's working for my country. In general, it's not super duper effective, but since introducing plenty of restrictions alcohol-related violence has decreased in Sydney by about 40%. Ignore the lockout law specific stuff in the article, the point is that everything together is working.
Don't blame alcohol pls. This guy was a ticking rapist timebomb.
This is disgusting, fuck outta here with the victim blaming.
BibiMaghoo
Member
So much. Quite concerning the number of people that use a drink as an excuse or justification to molest someone in their sleep. I've been hammered plenty, and never felt the need to be a rapist.
People suggesting it's mitigating actually worry me, because that means they think it a possible normal outcome from being drunk, and that makes them fucked in the head, frankly.
Majukun
Member
as i said,i don't know the guy,i don't follow EVO or smashbros, all the people involved recognised that he was so drunk that they didn't feel he would have been safe to go around the vegas hotel in that state.
when you are that drunk,your morals and sense of control go bye-bye
even the behavior during the whole fact (being caught but then re-doing the same exact shit a second time), seems to indicate that he was no able to reason at all,since a calculating person would not attempt a crime in the same place a second time 5 minutes later
of course if this guy has precedents or something like this the situation changes,but as i said,i'm totally oblivious of the smash community
UnemployedVillain
Member
This. I always cringe entering threads that involve alcohol, because it always seems like so many people are here just lump the blame on it, or get all holier-than-thou about not drinking, and stuff like that
But your way of talking about "reality" is to be reactive, not preemptive, Reactive means incidents still happen, preemptive means they don't.
And I think people not getting sexually assaulted by idiots who think they can drink then use that as an excuse to do what they wanted to do is a much higher priority than any kind of profit stuff. I don't care about their profits.Within the bounds of reality, Vikki got sexual assaulted.
Oh my god, stop with this "people are going to do this anyway" attitude. It's defeatist. He-said-she-said doesn't stop that there are witnesses and text messages with him pleading. She said is a lot stronger in this situation. Besides, he was at the very start of his career. He ruined it before it began. His fanbase is piddly small.
How dare I what? You are clearly attempting to spread the blame. To you it's not just Hyuga's fault- It's the 'geek community' for influencing his behavior and not doing enough to prevent it. That's a Truly irresponsible charge to levy, when you have absolutely no idea what the source of his depravity.
Secondly, alcohol ISNT an excuse, there is no excuse... Therefore, there is no excuse to remove. He did what he did because the victim was vulnerable and he's a sick person. Not because he was drunk. They do the same things when they are sober, then they blame something else (usually the victim)
Finally, simply because people are entertained by things YOU find "gross", doesn't make them more or less likely to violate someone. As such, banning would do absolutely NOTHING, to prevent people from commiting these heinous acts. Outside of taking advantage of people, predators generally have the same interests as the rest of the public. A panel on 'weather' is just as likely to have a molester in it. You arent suggesting solutions. You are merely projecting your distaste of certain forms of entertainment.
People do it for all sorts of crimes but I've always hated the argument. Just because you forget to lock your front door one day doesn't mean you deserve to get burgled
This is not true. Plenty of people here already can state at how they drank till passing out yet never felt the urge to molest anyone. I did a lot of stupid stuff but never molest or try to punch someone or anything that affects other people even being so fucking drunk that I didn't know where I was.
If getting drunk push you to molest someone, maybe that thought was really inside you after all, IMO.
Oh goodness. The fact that this stuff keeps happening within the geek community is a problem, the fact that people in the geek community will defend him is a problem, the whole geek community did not molest Vikki. Only Hyuga did.
Alcohol isn't an excuse, but it can be used as an excuse. Get it? Here's a guy who only got 6 months jail and registered on the sex offender list because "he never did it before!" while likely drunk at a party. There's no excuse, but other people can make excuses for him (including himself) to cushion punishment.
As for the gross stuff, I've voiced my distaste for over-18s events at all-ages anime conventions before in OT. It's a view I hold. They attract gross people.
No, you're wrong. I've been insanely drunk many, many times and this has never happened with me. Not even with girlfriends. It's fucked up, and it's not just down to alcohol, you have to be that kind of person.
trugs26
Member
I really hate the argument of "it never happens to me so if others do it must be wrong!". It's such a narrow way of looking at things.
Succinct Verbosity
Member
Oh he was just drunk. I guess that makes it ok.
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I really hate the argument of "one person did it, so everyone must do it!". It's such a narrow way of looking at things.
Majukun
Member
and those people's expereinces with alchohol are different from other people expereinces with it,what are the odds.It's not like the effects of alcohol are this mysterious argument that we know little about.It has different effects on different people,like anything depending on chemistry inside an human body.
The second part is debatable but possible (i have already said that alcohol also lowers your inhibitions),but even if that was the case,does that make the guy a time-bomb rapist,like someone called him?
Personally i don't think so..everyone has a bad thought a day...sometimes i wanna punch a guy so hard to knock him out,but my mind tells me it's wrong..does that make me a time-bomb assailant (don't know if that's the right word,sorry,i'm not a native english speaker)?
And to be upfront..my stance is not about "forgiving" the guy or treating the whole thing as if it's not a crime,because it is and it's his fault and his fault alone that he got THAT out of his mind..it's about depicting this guy as a monster for something he did when he clearly was not himself (at least from the report of the victims)
as strange it is to say,you are not the entire world
Final Spark
Member
Hope he is banned from all future events. Drunk or not that shit is unacceptable.
TheSpoiler
Member
Okay, at this point, I don't know what you are arguing. I've time and time again laid out my points, and you sidestep them in favor of saying things like "she was assaulted in reality".
No shit. But I'm proposing real solutions. Your breath test solution wouldn't have even stopped this shit from happening. It was outside the event, and it's not like peopel won't go out and drink after the event is over. And while your solution is preventive (even if we were to consider it from a logistics standpoint), it's still less impactful than anything I've proposed. Congrats.
You continue to not read what I write, propose ludicrous solutions that will either rarely be implemented or have no bearing on how this would have even helped the women in this event, and put words in my mouth. It's incredibly insulting and, as you can see with other people you've chatted with, pushing things off the rails of real discussion.
I'm not interested in talking with you anymore because you aren't really adding much to this conversation. Have a good one.
Do you not know what molestation is or did you not read the op?
oh shut up. The only person to blame here is the guy that did the act.
TheSpoiler
Member
Him, Noel, etc. need to not only be banned, but have their sponsorship drop them. Being a professional player should be like a "normal" job in some regards. If you fuck up, you get fired. End of story.
The sponsorship thing is such a huge draw for people right now, so threatening to take it away and making it known that none of them are okay with this would do wonders.
Lanrutcon
Member
Do you not know what a title is or did you not read my post?
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