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[geordiemp]

Yeah, essentially we agree on this. I just wanted to address that I never implied VRS was in itself a technique exclusive to only one platform or one type of GPU or one type of architecture. Just that foveated rendering and VRS are similar/analogous techniques being applied differently in two different aspects.

That's all I wanted to touch on there. VRS as a technique, even if it goes by a different name with another vendor/company, isn't something conceptually exclusive to any one platform holder. So perhaps it's there in some form under a different name on PS5 GPU. Honestly, a deeper dive on the GPU architecture at some point would be much appreciated, but I don't know when Sony is planning to do that. I know MS has one planned for August, if Sony has a similar deeper dive planned I hope it's announced as a future event that take place before September.



He did say this, but if you read the Eurogamer article (and probably a few other articles, but I haven't re-read any of those), they refer to these as Primitive Shaders. I assume Sony gave them the info for that article to print. At first I though Primitive Shaders was another name for Mesh Shaders, maybe Sony's own name. But there's RDNA/Navi graphics shots out there which list Primitive Shaders themselves.

This also extends to the Geometry Engine; again I thought at first it was Sony's own wording for a certain standardized RDNA hardware feature, but AMD uses that term themselves for a component of RDNA/Navi.



I think some form of VRS has probably been added here, it would make the most logical sense. More official clarification would be nice.

The confusing thing is sony keep using the same names for stuff, its confusing and why people skipped what was said, including me.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

PSVR is a single screen headset. It does not have a screen per eye.

Ok, then if they're aiming for 240fps, then the next PSVR2 is dual screens set. The eye trackers will benefit from VRS.

Sony Patents VR Headset That Combats Simulation Sickness With Eye-Tracking And More

A new patent from Sony suggests the company’s next PlayStation VR (PSVR) headset will take the fight to simulation sickness. The patent was originally filed in early 2017 (six months after the original PSVR’s release) and published last week. It describes a system for fighting what it describes

uploadvr.com

 

[Bo_Hazem]

Listen to Cerny again carefully, he calls the geometry engine NEW in ps5 for custom RDN2 and mentions SYNTHESISE GEOMETRY ON THE FLY AS A BRAND NEW CAPABILITY, so unless Cerny is lieing ...TIMESTAMPED.



Cerny said

= Mesh shaders

= probably Sonys name for VRS

Its funny how he mentions all these features but he just says what it does without a fancy name lol

Move along, nothing to see here unless the brand new cerny refers to synthesise geometry on the fly is more than RDNA2, we dont know yet

They'll not open the video, even when it's timestamped, and will not read your post, and will resume their FUD campaign.

 

[Dodkrake]

Sony also patented lower resolution around what your looking at for VR, they both have given it different names. Cerny called it smoothly lowering level of detail (SLLD lol, same shit). VRS is DX12 name patented for Dx12.

Do Nvidia also call it VRS lol ?

Don't know, honestly.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Wow. So DF claims PS5 has no VRS. And Sony must have showed 20 games at the event a few days ago. Not even the big games like Horizon 2 or GT has it.

 

[sendit]

I am expecting them to be the same. Last gen 4k60, current gen games 4K30 RT or 1600p60



What do you mean high fidelity = both are same resolution, and if you think Xsx will stream high detail assets from the SSD better than Ps5 I think you have not been reading much.

Higher form of AA, ambient occlusion, particle effects, etc....Resolution isn’t the only thing that relates to graphical fidelity. Destiny 2 isn’t designed to take advantage of increased I/O. Much of what will be loaded will already by in the RAM. The fact is, XSX has more raw grunt than the PS5.

This really isn’t debatable...we just need to see the end result. And like I pointed out, the difference between PS5 and XSX is much less in comparison to the PS4Pro and X1X. With that said, visually they may not look any different at all unless placed under a microscope.

 

[pyrocro]

Think VRS is good for racing games where there is lots of sky and edges of screen when moving fast, as devs can render those at a lower quality and get away with it.

Which bits of the below screen would you render at lower quality ? And why bother, its native 4k anyway.

I agree racing games should be a really good use case tons of motion.
According to the document, you can change the shading rate on a per draw call basis which presents many more opportunities that I can show in the image below.



for example the turtle's eyes
If you look at the eye on our left some details are noticeable but the other eye is pretty much a solid color and any shading occurring under that glow will never get seen.
There are also lots of dark areas in the image which conventionally may be shaded.

Having as little as 5 extra FPS to play with means less Vsync waiting, which helps free up other parts of your system that may have more overhead to do more of what they are doing
5 extra FPS may equal something seemingly unrelated but have a dramatic effect on other parts of the game.
it all about distributing the power where it's needed ~ only.

Conceptually VRS it's trying to achieve the same thing 2d dirty bit rending technique back in the day achieved of only putting the power when it's needed.

 

[Andodalf]

Wow. So DF claims PS5 has no VRS. And Sony must have showed 20 games at the event a few days ago. Not even the big games like Horizon 2 or GT has it.

They do not claim it has no VRS, they just say they didn’t notice it in any of the gameplay from the event People were hoping for some additional confirmation of it, but the reveal event had no such confirmation. That’s all. We’re in the exact same place as before the event.

 

[sendit]

Wow. So DF claims PS5 has no VRS. And Sony must have showed 20 games at the event a few days ago. Not even the big games like Horizon 2 or GT has it.

People. This post is a great example on how rumors are spread. The individual in this case just simply doesn’t understand the verbiage used.

 

[MarcCppDev]

I thought it was already stated that VRS is a Direct X feature so it obviously won’t show up on PS5.

PS5’s equivalent for those features is the geometry engine.

Equivalent for geo engine is mesh shaders ... Sony doesnt seem to have an implementation equivalent to VRS right now

 

[BGs]

Ok, then if they're aiming for 240fps, then the next PSVR2 is dual screens set. The eye trackers will benefit from VRS.

Sony Patents VR Headset That Combats Simulation Sickness With Eye-Tracking And More

A new patent from Sony suggests the company’s next PlayStation VR (PSVR) headset will take the fight to simulation sickness. The patent was originally filed in early 2017 (six months after the original PSVR’s release) and published last week. It describes a system for fighting what it describes

uploadvr.com

The important thing is not the number of screens. It is the number of total pixels. It is late, if you want (if you need it) tomorrow I will synthesize it less.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

The important thing is not the number of screens. It is the number of total pixels. It is late, if you want (if you need it) tomorrow I will synthesize it less.

Take your time brother, anytime you feel like explaining it, give copy here and post it in the speculation thread as most people are eager to know about the tech. Have a good night!

 

[alabtrosMyster]

I don't know if I'm exactly understanding the doubt.

HZ is one thing and frames are another. And they don't always go hand in hand. But for this there is synchronization. In the case of having two screens of 120Hz each, in perfect synchronization you should be able to calculate 120FPS on each screen. If those FPS are calculated by a single GPU, that GPU should be able to calculate 240FPS in total.

I don't know if that was the question to be solved or if I haven't understood it correctly?

Well, we were talking about Hz (that's what I was referring to), the angle I took was that even if I have two 60hz displays they are still 60hz (whatever Hz).

 

[Bo_Hazem]

Well, we were talking about Hz (that's what I was referring to), the angle I took was that even if I have two 60hz displays they are still 60hz (whatever Hz).

Maybe you didn't understand me or I didn't make it clear: You make like 120 to have a 60 experience overall, or 240fps for 120fps for each eye. It doesn't add up, you just split the budget.

 

[ethomaz]

I'm really curious about what is VRS evidence?
I will try to check some nVidia games running to see if I can catch the difference.

 

[DForce]

Wow. So DF claims PS5 has no VRS. And Sony must have showed 20 games at the event a few days ago. Not even the big games like Horizon 2 or GT has it.

If it hits Native 4K, then why would it need it unless it's suffering from performance issues?

 

[Xplainin]

I don't know if I want to talk publicly about some of this stuff yet, but I've had some stuff mentioned my way similar to this. The reason I don't want to go too much into it is because it'll open up a giant can of worms and probably get people questioning things like "is it RDNA1 or RDNA2", even though they tend to forget that both systems are custom RDNA2.

With that said, we never got a full listing of what the standardized RDNA2 features are across all platforms, either, and the one thing that sticks to Sony like a sore spot in this regard opening up the questioning is the fact their GPU is a 40 CU unit (with four units disabled); we know for various reasons 40 CUs was the maximum AMD could do for RDNA1. At the same time, we know they have RDNA2 cards and mobile APUs with much less than 40 CUs, so is that particularly a sore sticking point to PS5 in all honesty?

@Die Namek Ability Current-gen systems could do a lot of the things next-gen consoles can, albeit if the devs rolled out their own software implementations/solutions, which costed general resources to do.

Also meant there was no standardization as each dev would have their own take, and trying to do some of the things that are basically "free" (or very low cost) on the next-gen systems would've eaten up TONS of resources on the current-gen platforms due to lack of dedicated hardware.



IIRC isn't the GE based mainly around Primitive Shading? Here's a quote from the Eurogamer article:



So you might be right in that it's an equivalent to mesh shading, but the question is how much of it is actually based on mesh shading versus primitive shading, which was introduced with the first RDNA iteration. The specification of primitive shaders right in the article itself would suggest the GE is moreso built around AMD's Primitive Shaders, which are compiler-controlled.

It might be possible Sony've taken a few features from mesh shaders into the GE, however.



I get that but, at the same time...there's a reason AMD invested in VRS in the first place. If it was less efficient than another method they would not have wasted the time. And the Sony software engineer...well, to some degree they are going to try putting a good spin on any features of the system they worked on even if it by chance doesn't support a feature here and there. Same way we'd probably see a MS engineer downplay cache scrubbers if they don't have that in their hardware.

Also a feature being standard doesn't mean it's inferior to a non-standardized solution. The fact there isn't any outright confirmation of VRS support would possibly indicate something else that, again, I'd rather not go down that road because it opens up a giant can of worms and I feel we've mostly moved past that with these next-gen tech discussions. But maybe it's there and they haven't confirmed it yet. In a way by highlighting the GE in that post it feels a way to potentially focus on why the feature may not be present (if it in fact isn't present).

We'll know sooner or later, in any case.

My personal view, for what it's worth, is that Sony were most likely intending to launch in 2019. The tech at the time was RDNA 1, and thats what they ran with. The 36 CU limit also played into alllowing easier hardware based BC. Then they made a decision to hang off and swapped to the same base but RDNA 2.
Their GPU is a custom one that has different options than XSX does.
They have AMD primitive shader, and GE. They added Ray Tracing cores, and the die shrink allowed them to crank the GPU frequency to 2.23.
Just because RDNA 2 has certain abilities, doesnt mean it comes across as a given. Each company will ask for what they want, and pay AMD for it.
Sony went with AMD smartshift, but MS didnt.
With the PS4, Sony added more ROPs and ACEs, MS didnt.

While both PS5 and XSX have Ray Tracing, they dont do it exactly the same, as it is also API dependent.
I think that Sony haven't ran with VRS, because they would have said so by now.
People are pointing to the 6 year old Sony patent, but the fact is a 6 year old patent is nothing like the VRS 2.0 that MS is running with now. If Sony was balls deep into VRS using their own solution, I would have expected a newer parent showing up to date tech to rival VRS 2.0.
Sony would have been well aware of VRS, and maybe they didnt value it. Maybe They think they have a better way to do it.
I dont know. I am saying what I am only due to what Sony have said up to date.
They may well come out tomorrow and say the PS5 has VRS, and settle it.

 

[Xplainin]

I'm really curious about what is VRS evidence?
I will try to check some nVidia games running to see if I can catch the difference.

I would have thought that the only way to tell if VRS has been used would be to see a version of the game without VRS and one without VRS to compare. How would they know what was originally shaded and what wasnt?

 

[truthseeker]

Geometry engine term has been around for a while, Sony call it that, do you think Ps5 is RDNA1 lol at 2.23 Ghz ?

Whats in Ps5 geometry engine version RDNA2, do you know, I dont, but it is not RDNA1 version for sure or the GCN version of geormtry engine, Its just a name.

Mesh shaders is what MS likes to call the version for DX12, everyone likes their own pet names, how sweet.

DNA2 is a node, it has more perf per watt and a new set of logic to choose from, both MS and Sony have CUSTOM RDNA2 and likely chosen maybe a few % different silicon blocks from the AMD menu.

Cerny did talk about culling early in his talk, and again mentioned in above tweets, maybe Ps5 does it different ?

I never said that PS5 is RDNA1.
Secondly Geometry Engine isn't NEW. Its NEW to PS5 and to XSX. Not new to RDNA 2.
Geometry Engine isn't some sony term. Its an actual graphics engine.
Its like saying compute shader or pixel shader is just a sony term.

Geometry Engine is in PS5 and XSX and is on the PC cards.
Its the foundation and backbone of RDNA 1 architecture. You almost literally can't take it out because you literally have to completely change the arch.
Its not something that you could or want to remove. Its like saying I want to remove async compute.

Now about primitive shader vs mesh shader. They are doing things fundamentally different but overlap in some things.

"The way geometry is handled has however become complex over the years. The mesh shaders of Turing represent the way forward for improving efficiency, and reducing bandwidth and memory requirements. Navi seems to be somewhere in the middle with its primitive shaders which were dysfunctional in Vega. " from /r/AMD

Here is an in-depth analysis of primitive shader vs mesh shader

Primitive Shader: AMD's Patent Deep Dive

Primitive shader was mentioned in The Road to PS5 video, many suspected it was just another term for Mesh Shader, some said they are different concepts and thus PS5 would not support mesh shader. AMD's own marketing did not help clear the confusion, so I decided to take a look at their patent...

www.resetera.com

 

[Vasto]

VRS should help games achieve 60 FPS. If the system is struggling to maintain 30 FPS then there you have it.

 

[thelastword]

VRS sacrifices image quality for fps. Not needed at the presentation for a new console when everyone will be looking at the images with a magnifying glasses.

I mean based on VRS presentation, good VRS should be hard to notice, but we know so far based on what we've seen from Gears Tactics there is obvious detail degradation...….It could be Sony's Geometry Engine is so good that DF just cant notice any detail loss or artefacting, which would again lend to the superior implementation and customized solution for VRS.....

On the flip, VRS or the geometry engine is not mandatory to make a PS5 game...….As we've read in the article Sony is not going to force you to use it. However if PlayStation Studios can hit their goals of 4K 30fps or 4K 60fps with RT and they don't see a need for VRS optimizations yet or really delving too deep into it at this early stage, I don't see the problem. Their games are hitting their mark just fine without it.....

Yet the most puzzling thing is that XBOX fans are now so keen on pushing the VRS angle as a gamechanger for next gen, when it will be a standard feature on all upcoming hardware.....Stranger still is that Phil and his fans are always boasting about having the most power and even before showing that raw power in any game ore presentation, they are tooting an optimization feature that lowers detail and geometry to boost framerate...…..That is completely contrary to "the most powerful console rhetoric", 12TF and all that power trip hype......Something is wrong when boasting about the best in visuals and power is somehow taking a back burner to VRS...….I would love to see that raw brute power put it's talk to the metal over better customized hardware and speed as opposed to people boosting optimization features so early......It's the first set of games to show next gen, let them go raw and see that power....

Listen to Cerny again carefully, he calls the geometry engine NEW in ps5 for custom RDN2 and mentions SYNTHESISE GEOMETRY ON THE FLY AS A BRAND NEW CAPABILITY, so unless Cerny is lieing ...TIMESTAMPED.



Cerny said

= Mesh shaders

= probably Sonys name for VRS

Its funny how he mentions all these features but he just says what it does without a fancy name lol

Move along, nothing to see here unless the brand new cerny refers to synthesise geometry on the fly is more than RDNA2, we dont know yet

Yes, we've been over that many times. The geometry engine is just more advanced customized hardware for VRS. Similar to how customized the primitive discard accelerator, DCC and ID buffer was on PS4 PRO....Geometry engine just includes all of that technology and improves it a million fold for PS5....

 

[Dolomite]

What is VRS?

 

[ethomaz]

I would have thought that the only way to tell if VRS has been used would be to see a version of the game without VRS and one without VRS to compare. How would they know what was originally shaded and what wasnt?

I mean the imagem quality is decreased with VRS but I agree with you how to spot VRS without have seen the game without it.

It is really weird DF talk about “evidence”.

What they believe to be “evidence” of VRS can be any other thing causing IQ degradation.

 

[Rikkori]

People need to go play

Wolfenstein TNC



and Civ 6

Variable Rate Shading: a scalpel in a world of sledgehammers - DirectX Developer Blog

One of the sides in the picture below is 14% faster when rendered on the same hardware, thanks to a new graphics feature available only on DirectX 12. Can you spot a difference in rendering quality? Neither can we. Which is why we’re very excited to announce that DirectX 12 is the first...

devblogs.microsoft.com

before saying how VRS isn't a huge deal.

 

[bumleforce]

but but..... the ssd

 

[thelastword]

People need to go play

Wolfenstein TNC



and Civ 6

Variable Rate Shading: a scalpel in a world of sledgehammers - DirectX Developer Blog

One of the sides in the picture below is 14% faster when rendered on the same hardware, thanks to a new graphics feature available only on DirectX 12. Can you spot a difference in rendering quality? Neither can we. Which is why we’re very excited to announce that DirectX 12 is the first...

devblogs.microsoft.com

before saying how VRS isn't a huge deal.

Nobody is saying VRS is not good tech, Yet, how is not using VRS a bad thing in any case, especially if the dev is hitting it's targets without it?

Also, if VRS is cleverly done and is able to mask detail we do not see or that are not in focus, how is DF concluding PS5 games are not using VRS? Where is the evidence, how are they determining that? Which brings me to my main contention with DF, they are supposed to be an evidence based technical outlet, yet there is more speculation going on most of the time without even a visual cue or an inkling of corroboration or even a lead. It's a bit unsettling...

 

[Kerotan]

They'll not open the video, even when it's timestamped, and will not read your post, and will resume their FUD campaign.

They really should.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

PC version of Godfall has inferior graphics and struggling with 15-30fps most of the time at what's shown as only 1080p, receiving extreme dislikes from the PC community:





PS5's version shows more stable 60fps at native 4K with better lighting and graphics:




Don't embarrass yourselves, guys, wait for the real H2H.

 

[Jaguar Victory]

I'm really curious about what is VRS evidence?
I will try to check some nVidia games running to see if I can catch the difference.

VRS evidence would be where you can spot sections of the frame in a lower resolution. Or lower quality.

 

[AllBizness]

If it hits Native 4K, then why would it need it unless it's suffering from performance issues?

This! VRS is supposed to help if you're dropping frames. No need to deploy VRS and get lower image quality if you're not having performance issues.

 

[Pandor]

uhm, Sackboy was 1512p

also, even if both would run at 4k, the GPU advantage of the SX will then be able to be used for better effects etc.

what? Is this real? I thought it looked like a Currentgen game, so easily 4K@60fps possible. How is it not even 4K? This can’t be right lol

 

[longdi]

Im sure PS5 will have VRS, Mark Sony championed checkerboard for PS4Pro, every savings count in a constrain console systems.
Hell even a Titan RTX benefits from VRS.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

Im sure PS5 will have VRS, Mark Sony championed checkerboard for PS4Pro, every savings count in a constrain console systems.
Hell even a Titan RTX benefits from VRS.

Man, what's with those Phil Spencer gender-mix with you and IntentionalPun It's kinda creepy.

 

[JustP_Gaming]

First, it was no hardware accelerated ray tracing.

Guilty, until proven innocent.

RT on a character is a far cry from RT through out an entire game. Still watching this with one eye open.

 

[sendit]

RT on a character is a far cry from RT through out an entire game. Still watching this with one eye open.

FUD: PS5 has no hardware accelerated ray tracing because 'verbiage' from what Cerny stated.
Goal: Sony's PS5 event shows games using ray tracing

FUD: PS5 isn't RDNA2
Goal: Sony and AMD's CEO say PS5 is RDNA2.

FUD: SSD is just for faster load times.
Goal: Insomniac shows a glimpse of what can be done with increased I/O with Ratchet and Clank Rift Apart. Warping to entirely different worlds in mere seconds.

FUD: PS5 is a 1440p+4K upscaling machine.
Goal: Sony's PS5 event shows most games running at native 4K

 

[pyrocro]

PC version of Godfall has inferior graphics and struggling with 15-30fps most of the time at what's shown as only 1080p, receiving extreme dislikes from the PC community:





PS5's version shows more stable 60fps at native 4K with better lighting and graphics:




Don't embarrass yourselves, guys, wait for the real H2H.

?
why are you doing this, it's like your rabid with dementia.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

?
why are you doing this, it's like your rabid with dementia.

Are all xbox fans good with personal insults and bad with discussions and debating? Can you treat someone like you're talking to him/her face to face and avoid those degrading posts? Please?

DF complained about Godfall PS5's version, let's see them now give a blind eye to the inferior PC version.

 

[Kagey K]

FUD: PS5 has no hardware accelerated ray tracing because 'verbiage' from what Cerny stated.
Goal: Sony's PS5 event shows games using ray tracing

FUD: PS5 isn't RDNA2
Goal: Sony and AMD's CEO say PS5 is RDNA2.

FUD: SSD is just for faster load times.
Goal: Insomniac shows a glimpse of what can be done with increased I/O with Ratchet and Clank Rift Apart. Warping to entirely different worlds in mere seconds.

FUD: PS5 is a 1440p+4K upscaling machine.
Goal: Sony's PS5 event shows most games running at native 4K

Fud: Believing this can only happen on PS5.

Since it’s exclusive we will never be able to prove this as an example, but there will be other games to show it.

 

[Ar¢tos]

Ratchet & Clank CGI, pre-rendered Hollywood movie, 2016

Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart screenshot running on PS5 in real-time

The game is even superior and sharper!

Imagine if Traveller's Tales devs were good enough to make Lego games look like the Lego movies?
I doubt it will ever happen

(judging by the difference between the Lego Ninjago movie and the game).

 

[Panajev2001a]

FUD: PS5 has no hardware accelerated ray tracing because 'verbiage' from what Cerny stated.
Goal: Sony's PS5 event shows games using ray tracing

FUD: PS5 isn't RDNA2
Goal: Sony and AMD's CEO say PS5 is RDNA2.

FUD: SSD is just for faster load times.
Goal: Insomniac shows a glimpse of what can be done with increased I/O with Ratchet and Clank Rift Apart. Warping to entirely different worlds in mere seconds.

FUD: PS5 is a 1440p+4K upscaling machine.
Goal: Sony's PS5 event shows most games running at native 4K

Not only this, now we are putting it down because the entire game is not 100% raytraced as if other HW was moving this kind of games to full RT (beside the most beastly PC’s being able to only do that with something as complex as Quake II with tons of denoising and this is a demo nVIDIA worked on to enhance it directly) .

 

[Elog]

He did say this, but if you read the Eurogamer article (and probably a few other articles, but I haven't re-read any of those), they refer to these as Primitive Shaders. I assume Sony gave them the info for that article to print. At first I though Primitive Shaders was another name for Mesh Shaders, maybe Sony's own name. But there's RDNA/Navi graphics shots out there which list Primitive Shaders themselves.

This also extends to the Geometry Engine; again I thought at first it was Sony's own wording for a certain standardized RDNA hardware feature, but AMD uses that term themselves for a component of RDNA/Navi.

I think some form of VRS has probably been added here, it would make the most logical sense. More official clarification would be nice.

I still think you are on to something and you have kind of convinced me that Sony might not have put a lot of emphasis on VRS as it is normally viewed/implemented. I am far less certain this has to do with the timing of the console, but rather a design choice though. This is my logic - which goes back to my previous post.

In the GPU space for PC we have all seen the charts that determine success in the PC space: FPS at 1080p, FPS at 1440p and FPS at 4K across titles at various graphical settings. Within your cost bracket you need to be competitive to survive. Cost = mm2 of silicon.

VRS is a hardware feature that sacrifices some (not much, but some) graphical fidelity to increase FPS by having criteria per draw/ screen space and/or triangle (roughly speaking) and apply different amount of shading work based on these criteria. In other words, small reduction in IQ to get a substantial productivity increase in shading per mm2 of silicon. This makes an awful lot of sense in a PC context for the reasons outlined above.

If you have a design target of 4K/30FPS - that I can see Cerny have - that you have just loaded with a significantly higher VRAM budget than what any PC platform can achieve (i.e. more textures and higher resolution per texture) you want to ensure to maintain that IQ you have just invested in. What Matt at least in my mind eluded to, is that Cerny seems to have created priorities per triangle/ primitive on the geometry side. If you then use those priorities to guide which primitive shaders to use you basically have a VRS solution without VRS if that makes sense? Then you have full control of your IQ and as long as the API to set priorities on the geometry side is straightforward that gives very good control for the designer.

Maybe I am wrong (this is a speculation thread after all!) but the solution above would align with Cerny's speech and Matt's twitter comments and still give VRS capabilities but just without the standardised VRS solution (and this would also explain the lack of 'standard' VRS talk regarding the GPU). If this is correct we should assume a slighter larger than normal allocation of mm2 of silicon to both geometry and primitive shaders on the PS5 GPU.

 

[sendit]

Fud: Believing this can only happen on PS5.

Since it’s exclusive we will never be able to prove this as an example, but there will be other games to show it.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

Ratchet & Clank CGI, pre-rendered Hollywood movie, 2016 PS4 Pro

Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart screenshot running on PS5 in real-time

The game is even superior and sharper!

EDIT: The first one was PS4 Pro, this is the movie:

For all the guys still checking this post, I've found the best looking screenshot possible of the movie and put it in the original post for comparison between PS4 Pro vs PS5 vs Movie. Most of the movie screenshots look like shit, and I've filtered the search for only 4K on google and popped out that PS4 Pro screenshot as the movie. Here are the rest:

Screenshots - Ratchet & Clank (2016) - Movie - Ratchet Galaxy

ratchet-galaxy.com

Sorry for the confusion.

 

[Fulcizombie]

The ps5 is a weak console and, just like the Xbox one, this will become evident with each day passing. Everything will be crystal clear when the first DF comparison videos arrive.

 

[Kagey K]

I assume you admit I’m correct then.

 

[pyrocro]

Are all xbox fans good with personal insults and bad with discussions and debating? Can you treat someone like you're talking to him/her face to face and avoid those degrading posts? Please?

DF complained about Godfall PS5's version, let's see them now give a blind eye to the inferior PC version.

hmm here you are calling everyone an xbox fan(rabid).

where does it say the PC version in inferior(source plz)?
Lets see.

 

[Bonsaibäumchen]

Indon't get how DF can claim to see something or the lack of it by viewing a recorded video. Especially if we talk about a hardware/software technique with the purpose to stop drawing/calculate Concealed/covered/ofscreen geometry.

Can anyone please elaborate how you can judge by watching these gameplay videos if this tech is beeing used or not?

 

[Explosive Zombie]

Indon't get how DF can claim to see something or the lack of it by viewing a recorded video. Especially if we talk about a hardware/software technique with the purpose to stop drawing/calculate Concealed/covered/ofscreen geometry.

Can anyone please elaborate how you can judge by watching these gameplay videos if this tech is beeing used or not?

You can't, DF just wants to stir the pot, which they've done.

 

[martino]

Indon't get how DF can claim to see something or the lack of it by viewing a recorded video. Especially if we talk about a hardware/software technique with the purpose to stop drawing/calculate Concealed/covered/ofscreen geometry.

Can anyone please elaborate how you can judge by watching these gameplay videos if this tech is beeing used or not?

because VRS is not about geometry.

 

[geordiemp]

Not only this, now we are putting it down because the entire game is not 100% raytraced as if other HW was moving this kind of games to full RT (beside the most beastly PC’s being able to only do that with something as complex as Quake II with tons of denoising and this is a demo nVIDIA worked on to enhance it directly) .

We saw a full ray tracede game on XSX, Minecraft at 1080p. Be afraid.