Support NeoGAF

[MaulerX]

People are really becoming emotional. Let's not forget that before the release of the console there was speculation that there was no BC at all or that only 100 games would run and crap like that. PS5 BC is not trash, it's exactly what ps4 BC should look like, playing pretty much all PS4 games the same or better. Personally I didn't even expect games could be PS5 aware so they can double framerates as easily as they do with a small patch. Microsoft going above and beyond with their solution should not be confused with a different approach being bad. What seems the most interesting to me is that months after the new consoles, there are still new games releasing with no native versions.

It's all relative to the competition and expectations that were already set from last gen.

It's simply not enough that your BC solution is to run games exactly as they were. Last gen the expectation was set that BC would not be enough and thus Enhanced BC would be the expectation going forward.

If regular BC was the the benchmark then yes, the PS5 solution is decent. If you don't care about enhancements then great. But when compared to the competition it's not great at all. Maybe the word "trash" was too strong but it's close to it.

 

[The Hamburglar]

Dear god another last gen game in BC mode being the barometer for next gen.

It’s getting embarrassing now the straws the clowns are grasping over this to carry on the pathetic console war, while having the balls to complain about others.

 

[Topher]

Dear god another last gen game in BC mode being the barometer for next gen.

Apparently last gen game in BC mode is considered "vindication" by some.

yeah....I dunno

 

[elliot5]

Any chance the technical issues are the chance to sell the game twice instead of a free upgrade? Why give native 4k at 60fps for free now when you can charge for it in 6 months and recoup a little more development costs?

I don't really know the "new" THQ's business practice, but SquareEnix did this with FF7REMAKE so I wouldn't be surprised at this point.

Same for xbox series. Why isn't it 120 fps like the other BC games?

I'm pretty sure they've said there would be free upgrades, and if they haven't I don't think they have the clout to pull a move like that. Square has always charged for ports, but FF7R:I is free for those who purchased it.

Back compat games don't just magically run at 120 fps. The dev has to make an option or unlock that framerate and it looks like there's one resolution setting and it can't run 4k120 for this game. I cant tell if this a serious question..

 

[lh032]

Which isn't running at 4K60 FPS. What's your point?

does it matter when it looks that good?

 

[01011001]

Any chance the technical issues are the chance to sell the game twice instead of a free upgrade? Why give native 4k at 60fps for free now when you can charge for it in 6 months and recoup a little more development costs?

I don't really know the "new" THQ's business practice, but SquareEnix did this with FF7REMAKE so I wouldn't be surprised at this point.

Same for xbox series. Why isn't it 120 fps like the other BC games?

why isn't it 60fps on Series S? the answer to all the questions you asked is... they are a small team and didn't optimize very well for every system. the Series S being only 30fps is the most solid proof of that imaginable... when the inferior One X has a 1080p60 mode with Jaguar CPU cores...

 

[Ezquimacore]

so the series x is better than the ps5... everyone knows that

 

[GHG]

Dear god another last gen game in BC mode being the barometer for next gen.

It’s getting embarrassing now the straws the clowns are grasping over this to carry on the pathetic console war, while having the balls to complain about others.

The question is what are people going to cling to when all these "new" cross-gen games dry up? Going in to next year pretty much all the games will be next gen only and all this chest pumping about BC becomes largely forgotten.

Honestly if people want to play old games in their best light possible then they shouldn't be on console. I can't believe I've seen people chest pumping over 120hz running at 900p of all things. It's embarrassing.

so the series x is better than the ps5... everyone knows that

Ok Meirl.

 

[too much eslim]

I’m not sure what the argument is. The Series X is clearly the most capable BC console. Problem is, I didn’t buy a PS5 to play PS4 games.

Yes you did. Every new generation games are cross generation. With each company making games BC it makes it easier for smaller developers to focus their efforts on the larger install bases and in theory the newe consoles will have increased performance.

 

[[Sigma]]

This is a nothing burger. So much drama over this.

 

[IntentionalPun]

XSX BC is pretty cool.. honestly PS5 has great BC too.

Some of y'all need to chill.

 

[Hayabusabruh]

Dude the salt!! Like actual Mortan. Salt! oh yeah? Well let me find my Ratchet and Clank pics. Wtf. Lol

 

[SenjutsuSage]

I was interested in this game, but then I watched some gameplay and was put right off it. It seemed somehow really ... generic.

I mean, is it just me, or does this just look crap?

No, it looks amazing. For a game made by 20 people????

 

[IntentionalPun]

Game itself looks pretty bad from a gameplay standpoint; something really off about the action.

 

[skit_data]

Watch Sony get the native PS5 version a PS+ release sometime during the year, similar to Wreckfest

I am allowed to dream, ain’t I?

 

[SenjutsuSage]

Game itself looks pretty bad from a gameplay standpoint; something really off about the action.

It looks good to me. Their combat positioning and whether they're blocking or not seems to matter. Appears you need to not really just button mash, but watch carefully what opponents are doing, and get your quick shots in.

 

[Optimus Lime]

It is incredible how angry these threads make people.

Imagine the kind of world we'd live in if you guys got as angry over homelessness or school funding as you do over which console plays backwards compatible software the best.

 

[GHG]

It is incredible how angry these threads make people.

Imagine the kind of world we'd live in if you guys got as angry over homelessness or school funding as you do over which console plays backwards compatible software the best.

People do though.

 

[Optimus Lime]

People do though.

How is it possible that this gif is STILL so fucking funny.

 

[GHG]

How is it possible that this gif is STILL so fucking funny.

Everything about it is perfect, the camera even zooms out at just the right moment.

 

[Optimus Lime]

Everything about it is perfect, the camera even zooms out at just the right moment.

It's the look on her face, too. She's screaming as though she's watching nuclear armageddon happening before her eyes, rather than her preferred candidate not winning an election.

I mean, there is footage of people witnessing 9/11 happening who conduct themselves with more dignity and rationality.

 

[IntentionalPun]

It looks good to me. Their combat positioning and whether they're blocking or not seems to matter. Appears you need to not really just button mash, but watch carefully what opponents are doing, and get your quick shots in.

I'll wait for reviews; sometimes hard to tell from videos.

 

[Blond]

I don't care if it makes me look like an arsehole, I bought a ps5 for a next gen gaming experience so I'm not touching that until its atleast 4K/30-60 dynamic.

Then wait for the PS5 version? Lol this is a PS4 game

 

[StreetsofBeige]

No, it looks amazing. For a game made by 20 people????

To counter THQ.

If you don't want people ragging on a small scale studio, then don't sell Biomutant for $60, or have $120 deluxe editions and $400 diorama picture editions.

 

[AJUMP23]

To counter THQ.

If you don't want people ragging on a small scale studio, then don't sell Biomutant for $60, or have $120 deluxe editions and $400 diorama picture editions.

How about not labeling people with a broad cloth of incompetence because your expectations weren’t met.

 

[Kilau]

I’m less surprised that the PS5 BC mode is gimped than I am that the Pro and One X versions have the same target.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

How about not labeling people with a broad cloth of incompetence because your expectations weren’t met.

True.

Another thing THQ could have done on Twitter.

Ignore it.

 

[captainraincoat]

Sony didn’t focus on bc because they want to sell you the remastered versions a few years later at $70

 

[SenjutsuSage]

I'll wait for reviews; sometimes hard to tell from videos.

Shit.. I don't trust any review to help me decide whether a game is worth my money or not. I usually just know by reading up on it and seeing it in action. I usually am curious to see which reviews agree with me after I've had my fill or beat the game.

 

[IntentionalPun]

Shit.. I don't trust any review to help me decide whether a game is worth my money or not. I usually just know by reading up on it and seeing it in action. I usually am curious to see which reviews agree with me after I've had my fill or beat the game.

I mean like user reviews; fuck pro reviews lol

 

[MonarchJT]

The question is what are people going to cling to when all these "new" cross-gen games dry up? Going in to next year pretty much all the games will be next gen only and all this chest pumping about BC becomes largely forgotten.

Honestly if people want to play old games in their best light possible then they shouldn't be on console. I can't believe I've seen people chest pumping over 120hz running at 900p of all things. It's embarrassing.



Ok Meirl.

why? seen both console specs is very very likely multiplats next gen games will run little better on the sx too going forward. Many people have been swayed by games developed on undercooked devkits

 

[b0uncyfr0]

I dunno about this game for $60. I could see it as $40, but 60 is a stretch. Nothing in that gameplay looked new or inventive. The storyline is also very vague atm. Be wary.

 

[Neo_game]

So the BC tools on the PS5 aren't as great as the BC tools as the Series X


Tools matter, but only when it favors your preferred narrative

I think it is not just the tools. These cross gen should not be using anymore than 10gb games and the SX has 25% BW advantage. Though next gen might favor PS5.

 

[N1tr0sOx1d3]

Using a game that runs at 30fps in its default mode and all marketing material

Yeah I can’t wait to play it . My money is ready

 

[skit_data]

So the BC tools on the PS5 aren't as great as the BC tools as the Series X


Tools matter, but only when it favors your preferred narrative

This has less to do with tools and more the approach to BC.

I don’t expect the situation to change much when it comes to PS5 BC, these kind of things will happen with PS4 games that have yet to recieve a dedicated PS5 version of the game. Xbox approach to BC has some real strengths compared to Playstations.

Some people still seem to expect major changes due to tools maturing on the Xbox side. That’s the difference.

 

[Pull n Pray]

So in order for PS5 to match the Xbox, you're saying they have to bring a Current Gen patch? Or is this something that is most likely not going to be resolved?

No one really knows. They were pretty vague.

 

[Pull n Pray]

At this point its safe to say PS5's BC solution is trash. There's no debating that now.

It's actually the best BC solution PlayStation has ever had on a console. It just looks inadequate when compared to Microsoft's BC.

 

[Pull n Pray]

Watch Sony get the native PS5 version a PS+ release sometime during the year, similar to Wreckfest

I am allowed to dream, ain’t I?

And Series X will probably never get a true next gen port of the as they will probably figure that the current solution is good enough. So maybe that will be a benefit of Sony's approach in the future.

 

[skit_data]

And Series X will probably never get a true next gen port of the as they will probably figure that the current solution is good enough. So maybe that will be a benefit of Sony's approach in the future.

Nah, Xbox will probably get a next gen version at the same time but the gains from having better BC will be to it’s detriment by then because owners of the X1 version consider the gain too small to buy the game

Huh...coming to think about it I wonder if this was something Sony thought about when designing their BC approach. It could be a win for both developers and Sony to cash in on both lastgen and nextgen versions of big games, similar to how people bought both versions of GTA V and Skyrim

 

[Garani]

And probably has 20 times the budget, and manpower for that matter.

Anyway i dont get where the hype for this game has come ftrom the last month or so, its got 6/10 written all over it. Even the people who have played it have tried to warn people.

FUD? Warring? Or just are you upset that there is a new game coming out in a couple of weeks?

 

[MonarchJT]

FUD? Warring? Or just are you upset that there is a new game coming out in a couple of weeks?

is just defensive because of the shitty version ...this thread isnt about games that are coming out in a couple of weeks ..is about a new specific game...biomutant

 

[vkbest]

A lot here havent done some research...
XboxOne games can be released either with the old XDK and with a Gen9aware Profile or with the new GDK.
A developer will be able to have specific gen9 configurations even if its just a Xbone game in BC mode.

PS5 is in most cases locked to the PS4 pro profile. Sonys BC solution just isnt as robust as the Microsoft BC solution.
Years of work and care pays off.

Cant blame the small devs here and its cool to see how honest they are.

Then why the switch for 60fps in TLOU2 is only appearing on PS5? It’s clear for me they can detect if the game is running on PS5 and configure the game. I think those games are running on old SDK and can’t detect if it’s running on PS5, probably even don’t activate boost mode.

 

[DavidGzz]

Some devs making a big mistake with 1440p/30fps instead of 1080p/60fps on Series S. It’s a pain in the arse.

Yep, really turning me off from getting a Series S as a more portable unit down the road.

 

[Kagey K]

FUD? Warring? Or just are you upset that there is a new game coming out in a couple of weeks?

This game comes out this week. There a r e no shortages of games to play for anyone.

He's right about the budget and manpower when comparing the game this thread is about to the game ppl trying to make it about.

 

[captainraincoat]

The ps5 wreckfest patch isn’t actually much of an upgrade outside of bumping it up to 4K and making it 24 players….the series x was already 4K and they just patched it to run at 60fps and will most likely add in the extra player count very soon

i actually found the ps5 version to have bad lag issues since they did the update so maybe they pushed it too far??

 

[DarkMage619]

Huh...coming to think about it I wonder if this was something Sony thought about when designing their BC approach. It could be a win for both developers and Sony to cash in on both lastgen and nextgen versions of big games, similar to how people bought both versions of GTA V and Skyrim

Is that a win for the gamer though? I have bought GTA V and Skyrim on the 360. Those versions didn't work on X1 and I had to buy them again. Lost my saves too. I don't care about developers and mega corps getting more money. I care about value and savings that benefit me. You want my money? Make a compelling product. Having to repurchase games I already own sucks.

 

[Dolomite]

Neither titles impress me graphically so this is as accurate as it funny

 

[Garani]

This game comes out this week. There a r e no shortages of games to play for anyone.

He's right about the budget and manpower when comparing the game this thread is about to the game ppl trying to make it about.

I am not debating about the man power between developers, and I am not comparing Biomutant to R&C: it would be stupid, at best.

But I see your point: by his reply I assumed that he was giving 6/10 to R&C (hence my reply) but probably meant Biomutant. If it's the later I would have to give my apologies to Stuart360

 

[skit_data]

Is that a win for the gamer though? I have bought GTA V and Skyrim on the 360. Those versions didn't work on X1 and I had to buy them again. Lost my saves too. I don't care about developers and mega corps getting more money. I care about value and savings that benefit me. You want my money? Make a compelling product. Having to repurchase games I already own sucks.

I think it depends on what you value, and I’m not saying there is any definitive answer of what’s strictly right and wrong.

I know that I would value waiting for a proper next gen version and then buy it rather than playing a game in BC, because it will retain a slight edge longer throughout the generation.

This will make the developer able to recoup production costs over a longer stretch of time for less work by selling a dedicated next gen version and possibly enables them to make new great games.

 

[Kagey K]

I am not debating about the man power between developers, and I am not comparing Biomutant to R&C: it would be stupid, at best.

But I see your point: by his reply I assumed that he was giving 6/10 to R&C (hence my reply) but probably meant Biomutant. If it's the later I would have to give my apologies to Stuart360

I read it as he thought Biomutant has 6/10 all over it.

(I personally think it's going to end up in the mid 70s)