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VG247: "If Xbox can't beat PS5 this holiday, I'm not sure it ever will"

kingfey

Banned
It won't but I don't know why he thought it would 👀 most of the ps5 versions of games are selling 2-1 and sometimes 3-1.
People think having more users on 1 platform will boost game sales. You need the audience for those games first.

For example, xbox is bad place for japanese games, and playstation would win. Ps4/ps5 are on japan at 10/1 rate for xbox. western games in the US would be different. Xbox might win, and playstation might win.

At the end of the day, its the userbase taste is what makes the most sales.
 

kingfey

Banned
Blah, blah, blah... why don't you start a blog post and rant to your heart's delight because it's pretty clear you can't see the wood for the trees and are unable to stick to the point.
Season 5 Nbc GIF by The Office
 

RPS37

Member
My favorite game I’ve played on my XSX for a while is Psychonauts 2 and that shit ain’t even console exclusive.
 

kingfey

Banned
It's $20 for the VIP pass, then you have the car pass, welcome pack and other crap I didn't care for.

Do you think you can stop crying now, or do you work for Playground Games or something?
Are you honestly this much whiny? Just asking.

It seems you either deflect the point, or just try to downplay it.

Forza Horizon might have 4.5m players for example, but a good chunk of those will be playing via GamePass for peanuts. That's why it's so heavy with microtransactions. I imagine Halo will be the same.
Expensive VIP pass whatever.

And I am playing Forza on GamePass so quit whining and acting all triggered....
Milwaukee Bucks Thumbs Up GIF by ESPN


one more thing, its 5.6m users now. that is day2 actual release.
 
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Lognor

Banned
It's $20 for the VIP pass, then you have the car pass, welcome pack and other crap I didn't care for.

Do you think you can stop crying now, or do you work for Playground Games or something?
I know about the vip pass but have no idea what the hell you're talking about in terms of a car pads or welcome pass. What the hell are you talking about?

And you're blaming game pass because of these alleged microtransactions? That's laughable. Gran turismo sport, which was NOT on game pass, was LOADED with microtransactions. The dev was adding them a year after release! Lol!

Or what about drive club, which also was NOT on game pass? That one had more microtransactions than any other racing game!

So two other racing games that had a shit ton of microtransactions and were not on game pass. So clearly you cannot blame game pass for these alleged microtransactions in fh5.
 

kingfey

Banned
I know about the vip pass but have no idea what the hell you're talking about in terms of a car pads or welcome pass. What the hell are you talking about?

And you're blaming game pass because of these alleged microtransactions? That's laughable. Gran turismo sport, which was NOT on game pass, was LOADED with microtransactions. The dev was adding them a year after release! Lol!

Or what about drive club, which also was NOT on game pass? That one had more microtransactions than any other racing game!

So two other racing games that had a shit ton of microtransactions and were not on game pass. So clearly you cannot blame game pass for these alleged microtransactions in fh5.
To me that is someone who never played the game at all, and wants to be smart.

I tried pointing something to him, sadly he doesnt get it all.
 

FrankWza

Member
My favorite game I’ve played on my XSX for a while is Psychonauts 2 and that shit ain’t even console exclusive.
It gets treated as one for some reason.
What does that mean, "it gets treated as an exclusive"? Doesn't horizon zero dawn get treated as an exclusive and that's on pc? Same with gow. Same with uncharted 4. Lol
Sorry RPS37 RPS37 I have to quote this fully because he had to dive into confrontation mode without reading. No wonder there’s a big purple L next to his name.
 

kingfey

Banned
What does that mean, "it gets treated as an exclusive"? Doesn't horizon zero dawn get treated as an exclusive and that's on pc? Same with gow. Same with uncharted 4. Lol
Console exclusive. That is the new term now.

Playstation has 2 timed xbox games, which doesnt get it, until 1 year later.

Psychonauts 2 is like minecraft dungeon. That game is anomaly, due to the crowd funding.
 

Hezekiah

Banned
Are you honestly this much whiny? Just asking.

It seems you either deflect the point, or just try to downplay it.



Milwaukee Bucks Thumbs Up GIF by ESPN


one more thing, its 5.6m users now. that is day2 actual release.
You're talking about deflection when you've just derailed the thread talking Steam and what Microsoft's apparent startegy is for the next however many years 😁.

And then bigged-up Bethesda for their prowess in terms of graphics and stability - some of the ugliest and buggiest games in the industry. I'm not sure you've ever actually played a Bethesda game 😂😂.

5.6m users - yes I'm one of them. I'll have to keep in mind that it's 'users' now - sales are just for Sony and Nintendo lol.
 

Hezekiah

Banned
I know about the vip pass but have no idea what the hell you're talking about in terms of a car pads or welcome pass. What the hell are you talking about?

And you're blaming game pass because of these alleged microtransactions? That's laughable. Gran turismo sport, which was NOT on game pass, was LOADED with microtransactions. The dev was adding them a year after release! Lol!

Or what about drive club, which also was NOT on game pass? That one had more microtransactions than any other racing game!

So two other racing games that had a shit ton of microtransactions and were not on game pass. So clearly you cannot blame game pass for these alleged microtransactions in fh5.
Never played GT Sport or DriveClub - probably why I didn't mention them....

gHmAsRT.jpg
DefQRRr.jpg
7MoHbgp.jpg
 

kingfey

Banned
You're talking about deflection when you've just derailed the thread talking Steam and what Microsoft's apparent startegy is for the next however many years 😁.
Welcome back again.
what would you like to do zooey deschanel GIF

Want to keep deflecting the points?

i guess it didnt take that long for you to come with it.
And then bigged-up Bethesda for their prowess in terms of graphics and stability - some of the ugliest and buggiest games in the industry. I'm not sure you've ever actually played a Bethesda game 😂😂.

5.6m users - yes I'm one of them. I'll have to keep in mind that it's 'users' now - sales are just for Sony and Nintendo lol.
I guess paying for gamepass doesnt translate to sales then. My bad.

but a good chunk of those will be playing via GamePass for peanuts
I forgot gamepass was peanut. Thank you for teaching me.
 
How can Microsoft outsell Sony when the PS5 seemingly has better supply and more consistent drops? Both consoles are both going to sell out anyway, so I feel it’s about who can get more consoles out there in people’s hands. Also, Halo and Forza are cool and all, but we did have those before. Halo still seems popular, but what’s different now that could cause those titles to pass PS5 sales?
 

kingfey

Banned
I wholeheartedly agree and been saying the same thing for the longest.
Isnt the hardware being sold out?

Pc provides another option. It doesn't eat hardware sales at all.

People like to tell themselves that these thing affects the consoles, when in reality helps them.

If it weren't for pc, no way fh5 would have 5.5m on day2.

All it does, is allow people to double dip. Buy the game on pc and other console.

People will regardless buy the consoles and pc people will buy their pc. Both can coexist.

Outside of this forum, no one really cares. People buy these consoles, because the grow up with.

You are saying they need to buy 1k PC gaming, compare to 500$ console, which can last you 8 years.

Hell. People bought God of war, fh4, halo, and horizon zero down, despite buying the game on the console.
 
Isnt the hardware being sold out?

Pc provides another option. It doesn't eat hardware sales at all.

People like to tell themselves that these thing affects the consoles, when in reality helps them.

If it weren't for pc, no way fh5 would have 5.5m on day2.

All it does, is allow people to double dip. Buy the game on pc and other console.

People will regardless buy the consoles and pc people will buy their pc. Both can coexist.

Outside of this forum, no one really cares. People buy these consoles, because the grow up with.

You are saying they need to buy 1k PC gaming, compare to 500$ console, which can last you 8 years.

Hell. People bought God of war, fh4, halo, and horizon zero down, despite buying the game on the console.
Valid points, but I think double dippers are a minority. The hardware is being sold out mostly likely because there is such a limited supply and you have millions upon millions of people wanting to upgrade to current generation consoles.

Yeah, not everyone is going to buy a $1000 PC, but if they are struggling to find a PS5 or XSX, they might decide to if they want to play games in a timely manner. If those unique and exclusive games on consoles end up on PC day one with the best performance and graphic fidelity, I feel that will make the consoles less appealing and unique. Xbox games on PC seemingly even affected XBOX One hardware sales.

Based on what happened with Microsoft, Sony could share a similar fate. Lots of people are playing Forza Horizon 5 on PC. There goes some XBOX hardware sales right there. We’ll see what happens when the consoles are in more supply though because I could be totally wrong.
 
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MonarchJT

Banned
You're talking about deflection when you've just derailed the thread talking Steam and what Microsoft's apparent startegy is for the next however many years 😁.

And then bigged-up Bethesda for their prowess in terms of graphics and stability - some of the ugliest and buggiest games in the industry. I'm not sure you've ever actually played a Bethesda game 😂😂.

5.6m users - yes I'm one of them. I'll have to keep in mind that it's 'users' now - sales are just for Sony and Nintendo lol.
the ignorance shown in your posts should be taken as an example of what not to write when it comes to subscription services. We all know your hatred vs Ms and everything Xbox, but sometimes it's better to let it go and not comment instead of grappling with back and forth that put us in a bad light and show the real reason why we do it.
 
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DenchDeckard

Moderated wildly
The thing is. Why is it about sales?

I already think the Xbox has PlayStation beat this holiday with Forza alone, and that’s what I care about. Games I will play!

does that mean Sony didn’t have a really strong first 6 months to the year with the incredible Returnal and decent Ratchet? Nah fam. It just means my ps5 can be in stand by mode until horizon launches and I can enjoy some forza and halo goodness. Then we hitting quick resume on those bad boys and getting some Aloy love in Feb.

Then it’s all over once Elden ring hits.
 

Bodomism

Banned
You're talking about deflection when you've just derailed the thread talking Steam and what Microsoft's apparent startegy is for the next however many years 😁.

And then bigged-up Bethesda for their prowess in terms of graphics and stability - some of the ugliest and buggiest games in the industry. I'm not sure you've ever actually played a Bethesda game 😂😂.

5.6m users - yes I'm one of them. I'll have to keep in mind that it's 'users' now - sales are just for Sony and Nintendo lol.
FH5 is going to surpass GTS players very soon

Also you cannot put Sony and Nintendo sales together since Nintendo copies were sold mostly at the full price and not at discounted sales and bundle sales like Sony.
 
The writer admitting they used a click bait title for hype is the only problem I observed here.

I never really cared to ‘console war’ since my household usually has all the consoles + pc(does now) since my pops used to game and buy as much as possible in the 90s so I tend to ignore that stuff and never partake in it(though it is funny reading the back and forth lol)

I enjoyed my ps5, switch, series x, and pc this year and my backlog is crazy for each of them ✌️
 
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Snake29

RSI Employee of the Year
They're both niche games. Not many people care about closed circuit racing sims anymore. While I haven't played GT Sport, I've heard some bad things about it. Seems like the devs on GT Sport had their heads up their ass. You have to race with etiquette and watch these ridiculous videos telling you how to drive properly before you can play the fucking game. Such pretentious bullshit for a fucking video game. At least in Forza you don't have to deal with that shit so that gets the win automatically.

Racing on closed circuits is generally more satisfying. Just because Horizon is popular doesn't mean people don't play these games. Heck most eSports racing titles including GTS are closed circuit racing games. Horizon is just a arcade game not realistic, it's for everyone, but closed racing games not.

The way you describe it, looks like you've never every played a GT game. You can get licenses in-game by doing driving skills exercises. This has been the case for years, but you can also play the game without it, only you will unlock a lot with it. So you have heard something from "someone" while you have no idea what it is about. Forza 7 is totally not better than GT Sports and is way more popular.
 
While it may seem unlikely, don't forget that this is the same mentality/line of thinking people had with the release of the PS3. No company is immune to screw ups.
 

phil_t98

#SonyToo
That's what they will be working on now.

Forza Horizon might have 4.5m players for example, but a good chunk of those will be playing via GamePass for peanuts. That's why it's so heavy with microtransactions. I imagine Halo will be the same.

FH5 had 1.5 million players befor launch day and if you work out the figures that more than likely covers Dev costs. That’s befor anybody who bought the standard edition played it or befor any game pass money is fractured in.
 

Hobbygaming

has been asked to post in 'Grounded' mode.
Who the hell cares about HW sales when you make exactly 0 dollars off of console sales? In the past manufacturers even lost money on every console sold.

The goal is to push as much software as possible. That's why MS and Sony put their games on PC - and why Gaf members don't run multi billion corporations.
This is only true for the beginning of the console generation. PS5 is most likely already profitable the PS4 was profitable too early on
 

Hobbygaming

has been asked to post in 'Grounded' mode.
Last numbers we got for Spider-Man: Miles Morales was 6.5M. There are 5M people playing FH5 right now. FH5 could pass 6.5M by Monday, especially with the holiday tomorrow.
If that 5 million are sales then it's impressive but something tells me that a racing game (even a very good one) will not put up numbers better than a game in the universe of one of the most popular superhero franchises
 

phil_t98

#SonyToo
If that 5 million are sales then it's impressive but something tells me that a racing game (even a very good one) will not put up numbers better than a game in the universe of one of the most popular superhero franchises

Microsoft’s model is different so sales count doesn’t work anymore. Game pass + sales is how they are making money. We know that there is at least 1.5 mill ultimate edition owners which has more than likely covered development costs. We dont know how many day 1 sales the standard edition got, I know steam sales were quite high and we dont know game pass numbers, what we do know is 5.5 mill players in the first few days and Spider-Man MM sold 6.5 in a year. I still not played Spider-Man MM so will be one extra sale off me.
 

Hobbygaming

has been asked to post in 'Grounded' mode.
Microsoft’s model is different so sales count doesn’t work anymore. Game pass + sales is how they are making money. We know that there is at least 1.5 mill ultimate edition owners which has more than likely covered development costs. We dont know how many day 1 sales the standard edition got, I know steam sales were quite high and we dont know game pass numbers, what we do know is 5.5 mill players in the first few days and Spider-Man MM sold 6.5 in a year. I still not played Spider-Man MM so will be one extra sale off me.
I don't find player numbers as impressive but it's still good. I think Miles Morales will see a huge boost this Christmas too. It's already back in the top 10 sales chart
 
If that 5 million are sales then it's impressive but something tells me that a racing game (even a very good one) will not put up numbers better than a game in the universe of one of the most popular superhero franchises
GT Sport sold something like 10m copies. And it wasn't even a good GT according to a lot of people (I personally enjoyed it a lot).
 

phil_t98

#SonyToo
I don't find player numbers as impressive but it's still good. I think Miles Morales will see a huge boost this Christmas too. It's already back in the top 10 sales chart

yeah it probibly will as its one of the more familiar and impressive PS5 games. Also FH5 will be huge this Christmas , am sure there will be bundles with the game and game pass is surely gonna grow this game a lot. I reckon at least 7 million players by Christmas for th… we are not even out of the first week of launch and numbers are high
 

M1chl

Currently Gif and Meme Champion
I think there is a huge fallacy in premise of this article, since "winning" means something different to Sony and MS. When Sony would "win", when they would sold the most consoles/games. MS would "win" when there would be surge with new GP subs. So I don't think this works.

I think it's way more important what content companies put out. And for me personally MS has been on roll in second half of the year and Sony was on the roll in fist half of the year. So again "winning" is....you are winning, you who reads this. You got to play the great games, there is no bigger win in the gaming industry, than to have great games to play.
 
This is only true for the beginning of the console generation. PS5 is most likely already profitable the PS4 was profitable too early on
PS5 is definitely not profitable yet. The first 10 million consoles or so were sold at a loss. There's also a massive R&D cost that preceeded the release of the PS5. It's gonna take a couple years until the hardware is actually profitable.
 

phil_t98

#SonyToo
I think there is a huge fallacy in premise of this article, since "winning" means something different to Sony and MS. When Sony would "win", when they would sold the most consoles/games. MS would "win" when there would be surge with new GP subs. So I don't think this works.

I think it's way more important what content companies put out. And for me personally MS has been on roll in second half of the year and Sony was on the roll in fist half of the year. So again "winning" is....you are winning, you who reads this. You got to play the great games, there is no bigger win in the gaming industry, than to have great games to play.

I expect Sony to do really well first half of the year to as they got some huge games coming out will also be helped by the games being cross gen to in terms of sales and that ain’t a criticism . Not sure what both companies have coming this time next year
 
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Snake29

RSI Employee of the Year
Looks like were now shifted to "the game has now 4 million players" as a comparison with PS5 sales.
PS5 is definitely not profitable yet. The first 10 million consoles or so were sold at a loss. There's also a massive R&D cost that preceeded the release of the PS5. It's gonna take a couple years until the hardware is actually profitable.

 

Rest

All these years later I still chuckle at what a fucking moron that guy is.
Beat Playstation in what, a nonexistent console war? If Microsoft is making a profit on Xbox, Xbox is already winning.
 

cormack12

Gold Member
There's a reason why almost every website down to local newspapers want you to subscribe to read articles these days. It's cause times are hard. It's a hopeless business model since who in their right mind would subsribe to something just to read one article, but I know why it's like that. Giving away content for free doesn't pay bills.

It's easier with patreon since it's a site that established itself on a very specific business model, and it caters very well to an audience interested in video content.

And there is another reason for a decline in written quality. People want videos, so the youtubers ate a huge portion of the cake. Being a good journalist isn't necessarily grounds for being good at making videos, and keeping up with changing market demands can be brutal.

I mean, just look at your own magazine examples. Gossip rags and garbage like that are the things that sell best, and it's pretty much the print equivalent of click bait.

I wish things were different. I've worked in media long enough to enjoy the glory days and lament the crash.

I know all too well what it's like to invest time and effort into creating quality content only to see it get no attention next to article 984 about random game going gold. It doesn't feel worth it anymore, I'll tell you that.

The content you miss is gone for a reason. Most likely it just didn't generate enough revenue to make the work worth it.


Yes, of course it is. Not my point. My point is that they wouldn't make that choice if their audience didn't teach them, time and time again, that that's the shit that sells.

I don't dispute 'print is dead' - people do watch videos but that doesnt mean traditional or alternative mediums are defunct. Podcasts generally have a more serious and reportative tone for example when compared to their video counterparts/peers. The audience for each is different. If it was as simple as video works then channels like Ginx or startups like GTV would command an audience as well.

If you look a Readly itself, it isn't just celeb, soaps or scandal. A lot of the hobby mags have moved there, and even Edge is/was available iirc. Technically the model of ads in print exists, just not in paper.

Screenshot-2021-06-22-at-14.27.42.png


I also agree that the predominant market for online news or games news is clickbait or controversy. But sites like 'i', The Guardian and The Independent still exist while the tabloids do as well. The audience is still there so I disagree with you on that. Take a look at something like the paleblood hunt pdf for Bloodborne. There's no reason why teardowns of this quality and nature can't drive legitimate publications (abridged obviously). Your content will drive your audience, which is why Jim Sterling is losing subscribers. If you are targeting the worst and cheapest audience then you can't complain when that's what you attract.

I get what you're saying about creators having a hard path to upsell quality content when compared against low brow mainstream media and controversy but isn't that the underpinning theme of 'art' or creatives in general. How do people in indie startups keep going when they see something like the abomination of the GTA Remaster selling millions?

I think we fundamentally disagree on the audience still existing to be lucrative. I think the audience exists but the current delivery mechanisms don't work. The audience for clickbait is bigger, less lucrative and involves lowering standards and pushing the ego's of the writers rather than serving the needs of the audience. For example, Edge continues to run with a circulation of 13,500 in the UK. In around 2010, circulation was double that at approximately 25,000. They have leveraged brokers like magazinedirect, pocketmags and Readly to increase their digital readership and retained their standards (you could argue their review scores are clickbait I guess lol). If enough big and prominent voices came together to develop a platform that put standards ahead of trends and went back to original/exclusive content it would take off. Most of what is consumed is low tier speculation or assertions based on fairy dust - patreon etc. are confirmation platforms in that their audiences subscribe to validate their own opinions via personalities rather than have actual articles driven by general interest.

I assert that there is still a strong demand for written articles (not bound to the usual 600-800 word limit), albeit probably less lucrative than chasing click revenue, but can still be a vehicle for traditional advertising (centre spreads, page ads etc) but the industry has largely abandoned this market, despite it now being more affluent and having grown up with it. We're left to eat what we're served. And it tastes like shit.
 

Jadsey

Member
The winner of holiday sales will be the manufacturer who can get the most consoles in the stores.

MS or Sony could both have no new games releasing for six months...if they can get units on shelves, they will sell.
 
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