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[adamsapple]

The Village demo was WIP, like I said before there could be any number of things that show it the way it does.

We can't use 1 example to determine how VRR does or doesn't work when we have a million other to refer to.

Again, we have 4 generations of games on Xbox and countless games on PC to show that it works without needing specific updates/patches.

 

[01011001]

The Village demo was WIP, like I said before there could be any number of things that show it the way it does.

We can't use 1 example to determine how VRR does or doesn't work when we have a million other to refer to.

Again, we have 4 generations of games on Xbox and countless games on PC to show that it works without needing specific updates/patches.

and again, I'm telling you that this clearly shows that there can be instances on the developer's side that make VRR not work.
I recorded my 60hz vs 120hz Watch Dogs stuff, just gonna cut it together real quick and upload in a few minutes

that clearly shows VRR not working in 60hz, but working without issue in 120hz
this could mean that the 120hz mode overrides maybe the vsync that Ubisoft uses in Watch_Dogs Legion, and maybe stuff like that makes it so that VRR simply will not work with that game.

 

[adamsapple]

and again, I'm telling you that this clearly shows that there can be instances on the developer's side that make VRR not work.

Yeah, if it's a bug/issue or not the expected behavior. The observable and expected behavior just about everywhere is that it should just straight up work out of the box. No modifications required.

The whole point you started with is that getting VRR to work requires active input from a developer, which isn't true. If it *DOESN'T* work, that's a bug or an issue. i-e not how it's supposed to be.

 

[01011001]

Yeah, if it's a bug/issue or not the expected behavior. The observable and expected behavior just about everywhere is that it should just straight up work out of the box. No modifications required.

The whole point you started with is that getting VRR to work requires active input from a developer, which isn't true. If it *DOESN'T* work, that's a bug or an issue. i-e not how it's supposed to be.

it not working is an issue dev side. meaning the devs NEED to make sure it works, which is functionally identical to "requiring active input"

here's Watch Dogs working at 120hz but not at 60hz... god damn it is annoying playing a game with 1 hand lol and having to constantly press that damn button on the remote to bring up the VRR display xD

 

[adamsapple]

it not working is an issue dev side. meaning the devs NEED to make sure it works, which is functionally identical to "requiring active input"

here's Watch Dogs working at 120hz but not at 60hz... god damn it is annoying playing a game with 1 hand lol and having to constantly press that damn button on the remote to bring up the VRR display xD

Man there's only one micro second of the 120hz showing a drop from 119 to 115/7 lol. You didn't replicate the exact same scenario, car density etc in both.

And this game also has extremely rare drops in the 60hz mode owing to how decently it runs, it's more likely you didn't encounter any drops than it is that your displays VRR didn't work properly.

Watch Dogs Legion 60fps Mode PS5 vs Xbox Series X|S Frame Rate Comparison Stats

Sheet1 Platforms,PS5,Xbox Series X,Xbox Series S Frame Amounts Game Frames,22923,22916,22929 Video Frames,22930,22930,22930 Frame Tearing Statistics Total Torn Frames,167,523,67 Lowest Torn Line,450,2107,695 Frame Height,2160,2160,1080 Frame Time Statistics Mean Frame Time,16.67ms,16.68ms,16.67m...

docs.google.com

We're literally arguing over a point for which no solid evidence exists online.

I'll say the same thing I asked another user a page or two ago, if you can find one reputable online source that says this, please share.

I'd love to read it.

 

[01011001]

Man there's only one micro second of the 120hz showing a drop from 119 to 115/7 lol. You didn't replicate the exact same scenario, car density etc in both.

And this game also has extremely rare drops in the 60hz mode owing to how decently it runs, it's more likely you didn't encounter any drops than it is that your displays VRR didn't work properly.

Watch Dogs Legion 60fps Mode PS5 vs Xbox Series X|S Frame Rate Comparison Stats

Sheet1 Platforms,PS5,Xbox Series X,Xbox Series S Frame Amounts Game Frames,22923,22916,22929 Video Frames,22930,22930,22930 Frame Tearing Statistics Total Torn Frames,167,523,67 Lowest Torn Line,450,2107,695 Frame Height,2160,2160,1080 Frame Time Statistics Mean Frame Time,16.67ms,16.68ms,16.67m...

docs.google.com

We're literally arguing over a point for which no solid evidence exists online.

I'll say the same thing I asked another user a page or two ago, if you can find one reputable online source that says this, please share.

I'd love to read it.

if you actually are now arguing that my RE8 video was not solid evidence then you are intellectually dishonest quite honestly.

also, I have shown only a few seconds of the 120hz mode because that should be enough
the game is constantly dropping frames, but ok, I'll make a perfect 1 to 1 comparison. and if you are then still coming at me with "not solid evidence" then noone should ever take you seriously in any argument here ever again

edit: done. currently uploading. I'm this time filming for longer in both modes. being 100% stationary and moving the camera around. 120hz clearly adjusts, 60hz clearly stutters and doesn't adjust whatsoever

 

[DenchDeckard]

Can we spend some of this effort going back and forth and instead harness that energy to try and get some form of answer out of Sony on where the fuck VRR is?

I dunno, asking them directly, or hitting up influencer “reporters” to actually ask some questions and apply pressure. It’s a bit of a piss take now, and I’d rather just have it available so we can all enjoy it and move on with our lives.

 

[01011001]

adamsapple



there it is. 120hz clearly showing the refresh adjust constantly. NOT A SINGLE drop down to 58hz or anything on the 60hz setting.
I am 100% stationary. simply moving the camera back and forth. the red smoke in front of me is clearly the main cause of framerate drops here because it's bascially 1 big transparency right in front of me + multiple NPCs standing there

and like I noted in the video, I couldn't give a shit setting my Xbox back to english, but Variable Aktualisierungsrate = Variable Refresh Rate

 

[omegasc]

Resident Evil (7 and 8) are games where you have the option to fix frame rate to 30 or 60, plus "variable". The demo was probably set to fixed 60. Do that with the final game on PC and you'll get the same result I believe.
Edit: What I am trying to say is that as long as there's nothing in code or bugs that prevent VRR to work, it should not need a patch. Not the other way around, where devs need to patch in support for it.

 

[Arioco]

I'm a bit surprised this thread shows a "news" tag. Shouldn't it be "rumor"? As far as I know we don't have and official word from SONY on this update yet, so we don't actually know for sure if it's really coming in spring 2022. If at least this feature was present in the beta we would know they're working on it, but it's not the case, so everything we can say is just pure speculation at this moment, isn't it?

 

[adamsapple]

Edit: What I am trying to say is that as long as there's nothing in code or bugs that prevent VRR to work, it should not need a patch. Not the other way around, where devs need to patch in support for it.

Exactly.

While I appreciate 01010101's effort by posting off screen videos, it's simply not true that games need specific code o "use" VRR, which is a/ a hardware feature b/ set on OS level, not a per-game level. Any 1,2 cases where it doesn't work as expected out of thousands is an outlier, not the expected.

I'm a bit surprised this thread shows a "news" tag. Shouldn't it be "rumor"? As far as I know we don't have and official word from SONY on this update yet, so we don't actually know for sure if it's really coming in spring 2022. If at least this feature was present in the beta we would know they working on it, but it's not the case, so everything we can say is just pure speculation at this moment, isn't it?

Good point, insider rumors aren't exactly news.

But I guess since the Bravia TV's now have confirmed VRR updates, it's some kind of news.

 

[Arioco]

But I guess since the Bravia TV's now have confirmed VRR updates, it's some kind of news.

I wish it was news, please don't get me wrong, that would make a lot of people happy and I epyñuld be happy for them, it's just that I'm not sure that it really is news at this point. Rumors and speculations said that we would get that feature by the end of December and we know how that turned out. I mean, if we don't have actual "news" on VRR is just because SONY has decided to remain silent, which is really annoying, since PS5 was advertised as "VRR compatible" and a year a a half after it launched we still have no official word.

 

[BreakOut]

It’s happening.gif

 

[01011001]

Exactly.

While I appreciate 01010101's effort by posting off screen videos, it's simply not true that games need specific code o "use" VRR, which is a/ a hardware feature b/ set on OS level, not a per-game level. Any 1,2 cases where it doesn't work as expected out of thousands is an outlier, not the expected.

and I'm telling you that it's functionally identical. developers need to make sure it works, which is honestly even worse than them simply having to tick a box.

developers usuall don't give a shit making sure shit works

 

[FrankWza]

Why is everyone talking about Xbox in a PS5 thread?

Because these guys

 

[adamsapple]

Because these guys

Don't be mean Frank, we're just talking about VRR and it's general application irrespective of which console it's on now

 

[Nankatsu]

What about older tvs? Any chance they get updated?

Proud owner of 55XF9005 here, it comes with 120hz but No VRR feature enabled.

I'm asking this because older 2018 Samsung TVS got updated via firmware to get VRR enabled, as far as I know.

So if Sony wants, they could make this happen.

 

[01011001]

What about older tvs? Any chance they get updated?

Proud owwer of 55XF9005 here, it comes with 120hz but No VRR feature enabled.

I'm asking this because older 2018 Samsung TVS got updated via firmware to get VRR enabled, as far as I know.

So if Sony wants, they could make this happen.

Samsung enabled this in HDMI 2.0 TVs by using freesync. I doubt sony will license that simply to update their old HDMI 2.0 TVs.
but I think that you can technically enable HDMI VRR in 2.0 ports too, but that would require their panels being compatible

 

[Nankatsu]

Samsung enabled this in HDMI 2.0 TVs by using freesync. I doubt sony will license that simply to update their old HDMI 2.0 TVs.
but I think that you can technically enable HDMI VRR in 2.0 ports too, but that would require their panels being compatible

 

[twilo99]

the game is smooh as butter with VRR on PC, i've played at least 100 hrs. no judders, no tears

Yeah, same here.. runs very well

 

[ethomaz]

Resident Evil (7 and 8) are games where you have the option to fix frame rate to 30 or 60, plus "variable". The demo was probably set to fixed 60. Do that with the final game on PC and you'll get the same result I believe.
Edit: What I am trying to say is that as long as there's nothing in code or bugs that prevent VRR to work, it should not need a patch. Not the other way around, where devs need to patch in support for it.

That just shows devs have the ability to enable/disable VRR.
Something somes can’t accept here.

 

[adamsapple]

That just shows devs have the ability to enable/disable VRR.
Something somes can’t accept here.

That's not what the post you quoted says at all lol. How did you even come to that conclusion ...

If it's off, or not working, it's a bug/issue. Not the developer choosing to turn it off. What possible reason would a developer even have to turn it off in the first place lol.

 

[Arioco]

Samsung enabled this in HDMI 2.0 TVs by using freesync. I doubt sony will license that simply to update their old HDMI 2.0 TVs.
but I think that you can technically enable HDMI VRR in 2.0 ports too, but that would require their panels being compatible

Yes, of course you can, my Samsung Qled (2018 model) supports both Freesync and HDMI Forum VRR. It didn't when it launched, but Samsung added support via firmware update a few month later. As far as I know all Samsung Qled from 2018 support VRR and none of them have HDMI 2.1 ports, so apparently back then manufactures could implement some HDMI 2.1 features in their HDMI 2.0 compatible devices.

 

[ethomaz]

Yes, of course you can, my Samsung Qled (2018 model) supports both Freesync and HDMI Forum VRR. It didn't when it launched, but Samsung added support via firmware update a few month later. As far as I know all Samsung Qled from 2018 support VRR and none of them have HDMI 2.1 ports, so apparently back then manufactures could implement some HDMI 2.1 features in their HDMI 2.0 compatible devices.

HDMI 2.1 is not requirement for VRR… you can have it with HDMI 2.0 or lower ports.

Actually FreeSync works with HDMI 1.4 (limited to 75Hz max) that is basically the same VESA Adaptive Sync used in HDMI’s VRR.

The think is HDMI is a standard and HDMI forum just at begin wanted to make VRR a requirement to receive the HDMI 2.1 certificate but late they changed to option feature like it was in previous HDMI versions.

So today VRR is an optional feature to any HDMI port version.

 

[Dust-by-Monday]

That just shows devs have the ability to enable/disable VRR.
Something somes can’t accept here.

That's incorrect.

Basically what they're saying is, you can cap the frame rate to 30 or 60, or if you choose variable, it just caps the frame rate to your max refresh rate of your display (if you're using vsync) or completely uncapped if you're not using vsync. VRR is something you need to enable or disable in your driver, no games have the ability to enable or disable it. It's a system-wide setting.

 

[SoloKingRobert]

Yes, but A80J has better PQ.

Did you use a magnifying glass?

 

[VanCityGamer]

Did you use a magnifying glass?

No need to be like that. It’s not a major difference, but is noticeable. I could clearly see a difference.

 

[Lognor]

Did you use a magnifying glass?

No I have eyes

 

[DeepEnigma]

No I have eyes

 

[DJ12]

Samsung enabled this in HDMI 2.0 TVs by using freesync. I doubt sony will license that simply to update their old HDMI 2.0 TVs.
but I think that you can technically enable HDMI VRR in 2.0 ports too, but that would require their panels being compatible

Clues in the name.

FREEsync

AMD don't charge for it.

 

[adamsapple]

Clues in the name.

FREEsync

AMD don't charge for it.

Then there's even less reason for Sony not allowing it on PS5, especially after it's inclusion on One X was received well over PS4 Pro not having anything similar.

Both new consoles have AMD GPUs already anyway.

 

[DJ12]

Then there's even less reason for Sony not allowing it on PS5, especially after it's inclusion on One X was received well over PS4 Pro not having anything similar.

Both new consoles have AMD GPUs already anyway.

The TV needs to have the required hardware already available, maybe Sony don't in their older TVs.

If they do then sure they should add it and stop being dicks about it

 

[01011001]

Then there's even less reason for Sony not allowing it on PS5, especially after it's inclusion on One X was received well over PS4 Pro not having anything similar.

Both new consoles have AMD GPUs already anyway.

there is a reason tho....their shitty TVs don't support it so it will never be supported. HDMI VRR or nothing is what it's gonna be

if the PS5 was made by LG or Samsung we would have had HDMI VRR and Freesync support at launch lol

 

[sankt-Antonio]

there is a reason tho....their shitty TVs don't support it so it will never be supported. HDMI VRR or nothing is what it's gonna be

if the PS5 was made by LG or Samsung we would have had HDMI VRR and Freesync support at launch lol

They updated their TVs last week , with what looks like a very good integration - at least on the Oled front.

 

[Itzsfo0]

I'm not arguing against it, I'm saying it's not the second coming of christ. You should know that first hand (considering the TV you're using where you're sacrificing everything to tick a box that says VRR) but yet you make it out to be some magical feature that has no equal. Couldn't be further from the truth, especially for living room use where TV's are concerned. If it worked perfectly then I'd have nothing negative to say about it, but it doesn't, it comes with caveats and it ends up being somewhat of a "pick your poison" kind of situation. If you wanted proper VRR then firstly you wouldn't have waited until 2020 to get on board and secondly you'd be doing so on the platform that does it justice due to the freedom on offer.

Anyway, time will not be kind to your rampant VRR love affair since people will be able to see for themselves, as always.

Personally could careless. VRR via Freesync I have on my Xbox Series X (my setup is simple):

1. 2021 Neo QD-LED (Samsung

I'm not arguing against it, I'm saying it's not the second coming of christ. You should know that first hand (considering the TV you're using where you're sacrificing everything to tick a box that says VRR) but yet you make it out to be some magical feature that has no equal. Couldn't be further from the truth, especially for living room use where TV's are concerned. If it worked perfectly then I'd have nothing negative to say about it, but it doesn't, it comes with caveats and it ends up being somewhat of a "pick your poison" kind of situation. If you wanted proper VRR then firstly you wouldn't have waited until 2020 to get on board and secondly you'd be doing so on the platform that does it justice due to the freedom on offer.

Anyway, time will not be kind to your rampant VRR love affair since people will be able to see for themselves, as always.

My setup is simple.

1. 2021 Samsung QN90A (QD-QLED) has everything besides Dolby vision. ALLM, Game mode optimizer, VRR via Freesync (Freesync Premium Pro) HDR1000, HDMI 2.1, BFI, etc. It has next to even LG C1s OLED one of the lowest input lag even outside of game mode. Also being a non OLED it has a much higher onscreen brightness (nearly 1600 nits peak brght).

As for console I use the Xbox Series X. With a recent 2TB SSD Seagate expansion (ontop of the 1TB internal). So 3TB total an then a simple subscription to Gamepass. I DL game, update...an then this specific TV was built in relationship w Microsoft directly (collab between Samsung n microsoft) to allow the TV to adjust the Series x on the fly. HDR settings, 1440p support, VRR (via Freesync not HDMI) and it.works for many games...i really dont even care about 120hz support despite it bein highly touted for this gen. I just want to see even 1440p [or native 4k w scaling n features like.DLSS) with 60FPs locked (in performance modes) with HDR and VRR enabled which reduces screen tearing. I have seen 4k w scaling(1800p or w/e) /60 fps/HDR/VRR or 1440p/60fps/HDR/VRR. Some.kinks to.work out but mostly works on almost.almost all titles...even DF has showcased this for s majority of titles (AC Valhalla, backwards compat w many current titles like No Mans Sky, Metro, etc)

So it may not be some groundbreaking be all end all feature but it does work an from what Ive seen so far I havr no complaints. Then again what I know is limited. I like the features like quick resume, game mode optimizer, VRR Premium Pro via Freesync an 1440p support that Series X has had for awhile. Hell even last gen One X had VRR (i think isnt there 2 options like Forum VRR an Freesync Premium Pro.

All i know is ps5 supports VRR via HDMI but for whatever reason hasnt enabled the feature which I assume is bc their Bravia line of XR televisions (both OLED an LED) have yet to begin rolling out the features for these Tvs.

 

[NewYork214]

My Bravia x90h just received an update to enhance VRR performance

 

[Xdrive05]

My Bravia x90h just received an update to enhance VRR performance

Mine too, earlier this week. Makes it way more viable as a PC gaming monitor if you run your games so hard that they dip under 120 or under 60. No longer does 55fps mean the TV treats it like a jittery 30fps.You see every frame that gets sent to the TV at the time it gets sent.

Sony fam, don't sleep on VRR. It changes everything. PS5 needs this. All gaming systems need this.

 

[Urban]

Mine too, earlier this week. Makes it way more viable as a PC gaming monitor if you run your games so hard that they dip under 120 or under 60. No longer does 55fps mean the TV treats it like a jittery 30fps.You see every frame that gets sent to the TV at the time it gets sent.

Sony fam, don't sleep on VRR. It changes everything. PS5 needs this. All gaming systems need this.

I have the x900h too but the VRR solution is pretty bad because you loose so much on it

 

[RoadHazard]

Is it spring yet?

 

[adamsapple]

Is it spring yet?

Technically, yes. Spring is March to May.

 

[Dr Bass]

Technically, yes. Spring is March to May.

Spring is March 20th to June 20th. We are still in Winter.

And yes I know about “meteorological”seasons, but since they have nothing to do with equinoxes and solstices it all seems pretty nonsense to me. I mean, why go by actual physical and measurable positions of the sun and our orbit when I can just say “ehh it’s March, it’s now Spring”? Hint: the previous sentence is a bit o’ sarcasm.

I’ll go by the science vs. the people working the local news stations.

Edit: I see that you adamsapple posted the thoughtful emoji on this, but I think you were either being nice or trying to avoid a silly argument. There wasn’t much thoughtful about it, and I don’t even know why I was possessed to make such a dumb ass reply at the time. There was no need for me to post that when, yes, some people like to use the meteorological definition of seasons. I just looked like a douche, straight up. I apologize.

 

[twilo99]

Does VRR actaully take any computational power at all? I mean does it draw resources from the CPU/GPU

 

[RydarGaf]

Does VRR actaully take any computational power at all? I mean does it draw resources from the CPU/GPU

No!

 

[GHG]

Personally could careless. VRR via Freesync I have on my Xbox Series X (my setup is simple):

1. 2021 Neo QD-LED (Samsung

My setup is simple.

1. 2021 Samsung QN90A (QD-QLED) has everything besides Dolby vision. ALLM, Game mode optimizer, VRR via Freesync (Freesync Premium Pro) HDR1000, HDMI 2.1, BFI, etc. It has next to even LG C1s OLED one of the lowest input lag even outside of game mode. Also being a non OLED it has a much higher onscreen brightness (nearly 1600 nits peak brght).

As for console I use the Xbox Series X. With a recent 2TB SSD Seagate expansion (ontop of the 1TB internal). So 3TB total an then a simple subscription to Gamepass. I DL game, update...an then this specific TV was built in relationship w Microsoft directly (collab between Samsung n microsoft) to allow the TV to adjust the Series x on the fly. HDR settings, 1440p support, VRR (via Freesync not HDMI) and it.works for many games...i really dont even care about 120hz support despite it bein highly touted for this gen. I just want to see even 1440p [or native 4k w scaling n features like.DLSS) with 60FPs locked (in performance modes) with HDR and VRR enabled which reduces screen tearing. I have seen 4k w scaling(1800p or w/e) /60 fps/HDR/VRR or 1440p/60fps/HDR/VRR. Some.kinks to.work out but mostly works on almost.almost all titles...even DF has showcased this for s majority of titles (AC Valhalla, backwards compat w many current titles like No Mans Sky, Metro, etc)

So it may not be some groundbreaking be all end all feature but it does work an from what Ive seen so far I havr no complaints. Then again what I know is limited. I like the features like quick resume, game mode optimizer, VRR Premium Pro via Freesync an 1440p support that Series X has had for awhile. Hell even last gen One X had VRR (i think isnt there 2 options like Forum VRR an Freesync Premium Pro.

All i know is ps5 supports VRR via HDMI but for whatever reason hasnt enabled the feature which I assume is bc their Bravia line of XR televisions (both OLED an LED) have yet to begin rolling out the features for these Tvs.

You know it's desperate times when the shill/alt sleeper accounts come out to play.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Mine too, earlier this week. Makes it way more viable as a PC gaming monitor if you run your games so hard that they dip under 120 or under 60. No longer does 55fps mean the TV treats it like a jittery 30fps.You see every frame that gets sent to the TV at the time it gets sent.

Sony fam, don't sleep on VRR. It changes everything. PS5 needs this. All gaming systems need this.

this will be every ps5 owner once it gets the feature! So glad you are seeing the benefit.

listen to this poster…..i Can’t wait for the ps5 to get this feature and Riky to be redeemed.

 

[scydrex]

I have the x900h too but the VRR solution is pretty bad because you loose so much on it

Have you tried it? Have a x900h too...

 

[ethomaz]

Does VRR actaully take any computational power at all? I mean does it draw resources from the CPU/GPU

The VRR signal needs to be generated in the output device and after the input device needs to decode and make the screen refresh following the received instructions.

So yes for minimal that it seems it still uses processing tasks… nothing works without a processor doing the job.

Said that the output device performance cost is irrelevant because the GPU already has the data (the amount of frames being rendered) so it just need to put the data in the HDMI signal that is basically nothing for even a low-end modern GPU.

The hard work is on input device… there it needs a bit more processing power to the point that monitors/TVs with lower spec processors can’t have any type of Adaptive Sync.

That can be the reason the old Sony TVs have issues with VRR while the new modes does it perfectly.

 

[Chronos24]

Not to burst anyone's bubble of hope here for VRR to come in the next firmware update I'm in the latest Beta and there is no VRR feature in sight. I've checked everywhere and if anyone wants to take a 2nd look be my guest but I do not see anything as far as VRR goes as a feature being added in the next update.

 

[omegasc]

Not to burst anyone's bubble of hope here for VRR to come in the next firmware update I'm in the latest Beta and there is no VRR feature in sight. I've checked everywhere and if anyone wants to take a 2nd look be my guest but I do not see anything as far as VRR goes as a feature being added in the next update.

yup, "we" know about that
there is ALLM but no VRR yet. It's been a while since the last beta update as well.
BUT... VRR is not really something that needs beta testing. Voice commands are definitely a better fit, so it might be a question of focus.
I can't remember if there were any fw updates that had features not in the beta, though.

 

[adamsapple]

Edit: I see that you adamsapple posted the thoughtful emoji on this, but I think you were either being nice or trying to avoid a silly argument. There wasn’t much thoughtful about it, and I don’t even know why I was possessed to make such a dumb ass reply at the time. There was no need for me to post that when, yes, some people like to use the meteorological definition of seasons. I just looked like a douche, straight up. I apologize.

No I legit didn't know that info.

And if I were to guess, the rumor leakers probably don't