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Jim Ryan: "[Microsoft is] a tech giant with a long history of dominating industries, the choices gamers have today will disappear"
- Thread starter Eddie-Griffin
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Ass of Can Whooping
Member
Zenimax aren't part of XGS either. It means nothing. If Sony decides they want Bungie exclusives they can do so
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Kiraly
Member
Yet they can't stop crying Call of Duty might in the far off future go exclusive after years of saying to just buy the console if you want to play a certain game.
Snake29
RSI Employee of the Year
Well it's true and you know it.
So you want to claim, that if there is a clause in buyout contract that guarantees Bungie's independence in terms of target platforms for their games, Sony can just willy-nilly break it and force Bungie to make exclusive games?
Outside of pissing off Bungie employees that would be probably not legal and I have no doubts that buyout contract is prepared for demands like that.
ZeniMax did not request permission to publish all their games multiplatform, so that's really irrelevant to this conversation. I used "Bungie is not part of PlayStation Studios" to provide a reasoning why Bungie's purchase is different to past purchases of Sony and to give a reason why people should not use "Destiny is still multiplat" as a example of "Good guy Sony." Because it looks like it was not because Sony wanted to have Bungie multiplatform, but it was concession to get Bungie in a first place.
ZeniMax is technically separate company because they have organisational structure as a separate publisher and hence Microsoft does not need to fire anybody. Also, giving Matt Booty (chief of XGS) another 8 studios to manage would be stupid.
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Bernkastel
Ask me about my fanboy energy!
Thats a lot of projection from someone who is so concerned about discussing Xbox that he barely mentions his own platform.
Ass of Can Whooping
Member
No, i'm claiming there is no made up clause like that. Sony purchased 100% of the shares. The employees have no say beyond them protesting
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SLB1904
Banned
Why would bungie employees get pissed for work less and get paid the same?
pasterpl
Member
They cannot. It seems that the deal signed included concessions from Sony allowing bungie to do whatever they want in terms of platforms they develop for.
https://www.ign.com/articles/playstation-sony-buys-bungie
No such concessions were mentioned with Zenimax as deal was signed.
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Good thing to know that if you are buying someone and there are terms of buyout, you can just ignore all of them as soon as the deal goes through...
Bernkastel
Ask me about my fanboy energy!
wow. 8+8+6 pages of Xbox
only 7 pages of your own platform
And we get accused of console warring from these people
Ass of Can Whooping
Member
A PR statement is not a legal consession between Sony and Bungie
Like what?
You clearly don't know the history of Square. Square had financial trouble in the 2000s and Sony bought stock to help Square out of financial trouble and on purpose left Square with the ability to create games on competing platforms with no controlling interest. This was the PS2 era:
https://www.ign.com/articles/2001/10/08/sony-buys-stake-in-square-2
It could have easily afforded it and bought out the company. Near when PS4 released Sony sold it again in good faith and Square Enix remains independent to this day 22 years later.
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Ass of Can Whooping
Member
Good thing to know that if you are buying someone and there are terms of buyout, you can just ignore all of them as soon as the deal goes through...
This isn't about ignoring legal clauses. This is about these clauses you've made up in your heads not existing in the first place.
Reading is hard I know
Shubh_C63
Member
I remember CEO of bungie saying that Destiny titles will remain self published and they can chose where to put their games on. Sony was to help on the media/movies side of things. I really think Bungie twisted Sony's arm with that 3.6B deal and got the best deal ever at their terms.
Bitmap Frogs
Mr. Community
Buying actiblizzard with money from quasi monopolistic business like windows or ms office is not putting up a fight - it’s breaking the market by making sure no one can compete.
"Back when the deal was announced, both Bungie and PlayStation made it clear that the studio will remain fully independent and that its games will be available outside of the PlayStation family of consoles."
I'm sure there is nothing in buyout contract to secure this line, right? It was said just...because. But whatever. Since there is probably that rumored Marathon reboot coming soon we will know it Bungie's future is "independent"
Gee, I wonder why is Sony allowing Bungie to have their games everywhere and them not being part of PS studios, while every other purchase is part of PS Studios and is making games only for PlayStation...
...gee I wonder why...
I know that SonyGAF is desperately trying to painting Sony as a "good guys" to prove something against Microsoft, but using Bungie is really not that great of a argument.
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Ass of Can Whooping
Member
Do you think Pete Parson is going to sue Sony 10 years down the line when he steps down and no longer has anything to do with Bungie?
He's an employee. He gave up his autonomy when he sold all his shares. The only deal he has with Sony is one on good faith
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Gavon West
Spread's Cheeks for Intrusive Ads
This guy! Lol. "Nice try tho". Like you said something...
Bungie was the one made sure their games stayed multi. Not Sony.
And you only have to look at how Sony does 3verything in it's power to make sure 3rd party games don't go to GP or even touch Xbox for extended periods of time. They've been doing it for decades!
And, you're right. Sony hasn't tried to purchase publishers because they can't afford to. But we know hypothetically, if they could, it wouldn't even be a second thought. I'd bet the farm on it and so would you. Yet, here you are, posing.... Gimme a break breh....
John Wick
Member
This is a joke post. Sega screwed themselves by making stupid decisions and getting caught with their pants down with the PSX. Sony made an amazing console. Sony came into the market to get one over Nintendo not Sega. Nntendo were equally responsible for the demise of Sega. You also forgot Sega had their own established IP. Sony didn't!
Gavon West
Spread's Cheeks for Intrusive Ads
I can't use an educated, hypothetical scenario but, you can use the Simpson's?? How does that work?
pasterpl
Member
But buying bungie with money from pricing cartels revenues is okay?
PaintTinJr
Member
Are you aware that the entire sub-genre runs on a PlayStation London made multi-platform engine called PhyreEngine, which was made freely available to all developers publishing on PlayStation? Without evil PlayStation building from the ground up as a multi-platform engine to support all platforms, Souls games wouldn't exist as is and wouldn't have been easily ported for the free money on 360/PC back in the day.
If you are going to criticise PlayStation at least pick something where they didn't empower the developer(From) to make many games and then ate the original losses for the exclusive souls games they funded on top of the losses of the free middleware they provided and supported.
kapshin
Member
Lol don't remember this one that's funny.
John Wick
Member
Are you still crying?
After discussing it with Ken Kutragi and Kaz they assure me they only entered the console market to get one over Nintendo. So you can rest easy on that one.
How come you don't blame Nintendo? Who had many exclusives tied down in 16bit era onwards? Didn't Nintendo take marketshare from Sega?
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
Whichever way this goes, I'm looking forward to the years of craziness it brings. It's going to be the next historical thing that's brought up for generations to come.
Everyone just focusing on cod and it's so much more.
Everyone just focusing on cod and it's so much more.
John Wick
Member
What makes you think Sony can't afford to buy publishers?
How could Nvidia afford to buy Arm for 40-50 billion?
Maybe Sony don't need to buy publishers and can get away with buying devs only? We know MS can't because we've seen their output......
You do realise Sony can get Bungie to put a team together to just make an exclusive for PS?
John Wick
Member
Also don't forget during the period Sony entered the console market Nintendo stopped trading. They basically shut up shop. They didn't want Sega losing market share. It's pathetic how Sega diehards conveniently forget Nintendo.
John Wick
Member
ABK and Zenimax are studios. Well done you
3liteDragon
Member
You gotta watch Hoeg’s breakdown, Bungie didn’t do anything to sweeten the deal for their employees. It’s a win-win for Sony, they value them at $3.6B & the remaining $1.2B will be paid out to key employees in different forms (depending on how the employee chooses to use it) on the condition of CONTINUED EMPLOYMENT for 2-3 more years. Using purchase price as retention is a common tactic in M&As & that’s exactly what Sony did with Bungie.
Bethesda Will Continue To Publish Its Own Games - Pete Hines
"The key point is we’re still Bethesda," says Bethesda's VP of PR and marketing.
These guys are also self-publishing, just under MS supervision now like how Bungie is under Sony, nothing new here. Parent company (MS/Sony) gets the final say in key decisions & let their subsidiaries run “independently.”
SSfox
Member
Microsoft pays $50 million for exclusive GTA IV downloadable content
Grand Theft Auto IV downloadable content is only coming to the 360, but that …
arstechnica.com
Microsoft Spent An Insane Amount of Money for Rise of the Tomb Raider Exclusivity
After almost six years since its release, an ex-employee reveals how much Microsoft spent on Rise of the Tomb Raider's exclusivity.
gamerant.com
Tomb Raider: Underworld getting 'exclusive' DLC on Xbox 360
Xbox 360 players planning to lace up in Lara Croft's skin-tight boots this November can look forward to a double helping of new content even after the final credits roll by. Eidos announced that it has inked a deal with Microsoft to release two additional chapters to Tomb Raider: Underworld...
www.engadget.com
The only reason MS don't do as much this type of deals today is cause they don't have a bigger install console base, no devs would accept to lock their game exclusive for Xbox and lose half or more their playerbase that is on Playstation, in Tomb Raider case it almost killed the franchise as the sales tanked hard when it was Xbox exclusive (i mean first game was 65% PS4 sales, CD should have anticipated that). So now since Phil can't get those type of exclusives, they just go on buying entire publishers to lock their games from releasing on Playstation, even if it means huge losses and benefits and the playerbase of an IP will be cut by half. Phil can keep acting like a good nice guy and lure the naives weebs and fanboys but the truth is all they (MS) want and their end game has always been the same: Monopoly.
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John Wick
Member
How do you know that?
I don't think they would as they don't need to. They have a working 1st class studios system delivering quality games on a regular basis.
They will buy developers but don't have a desperate need to buy a publisher which they could easily buy someone like Ubisoft or Embracer etc.
John Wick
Member
Boom!Microsoft pays $50 million for exclusive GTA IV downloadable content
Grand Theft Auto IV downloadable content is only coming to the 360, but that …
Microsoft Spent An Insane Amount of Money for Rise of the Tomb Raider Exclusivity
After almost six years since its release, an ex-employee reveals how much Microsoft spent on Rise of the Tomb Raider's exclusivity.
Tomb Raider: Underworld getting 'exclusive' DLC on Xbox 360
Xbox 360 players planning to lace up in Lara Croft's skin-tight boots this November can look forward to a double helping of new content even after the final credits roll by. Eidos announced that it has inked a deal with Microsoft to release two additional chapters to Tomb Raider: Underworld...
The only reason MS don't do as much this type of deals today is cause they don't have a bigger install console base, no devs would accept to lock their game exclusive for Xbox and lose half or more their playerbase that is on Playstation, in Tomb Raider case it almost killed the franchise as the sales tanked hard when it was Xbox exclusive (i mean first game was 65% PS4 sales, CD should have anticipated that). So now since Phil can't get those type of exclusives, they just go on buying entire publishers to lock their games from releasing on Playstation, even if it means huge losses and benefits and the playerbase of an IP will be cut by half. Phil can keep acting like a good nice guy and lure the naives weebs and fanboys but the truth is all they (MS) want and their end game has always been the same: Monopoly.
The way some of you talk, one would never think a publisher is a collective of studios.
“they will buy multiple developers piecemeal but will never be bad enough to buy multiple developers in one transaction”
Tell me, what was the desperate need when they bid aggressively for Leyou - a publisher - in 2020?
John Wick
Member
It's about getting the best deal you can before the acquisition goes through and getting as many concessions as possible.All very unseemly. Usually you try and hide the fact that you are shitting yourself
I’m not totally sure what they are so scared of - it doesn’t seem that big a deal to me (not talking financially obviously) but Sony certainly seem majorly rattled by it.
Would you rather have it where MS get ABK and can do whatever they want with COD or where they have to keep it on PS for next 5-10 years?
John Wick
Member
Hey were you sat in on the bidding process for Leyou? Looks like your wrong because clearly they weren't aggressive enough.
Badlucktroll
Member
I don’t think there will ever be an Xbox monopoly. No matter what Microsoft buys. They’ll end up having to write it off like the Nokia merger.
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They certainly don’t have anywhere near the amount of cash Tencent can splash.
At least you’re not disputing the Leyou bid. You acknowledge they’re a publisher, right? and this then invalidates your previous claim?
Bitmap Frogs
Mr. Community
No, of course not.
But size matters… actiblizzard is a huge multiplat developer, bungle runs destiny. Removing actiblizzard from the pool immediatly makes everyone else’s experience worse.
All very unseemly. Usually you try and hide the fact that you are shitting yourself
I’m not totally sure what they are so scared of - it doesn’t seem that big a deal to me (not talking financially obviously) but Sony certainly seem majorly rattled by it.
Day one Gamepass, I’d say.
Sony started the gen with the stated goal of further increasing their marketshare over and above the 2:1 domination of last gen. A much bigger and more compelling Gamepass could become a much bigger console seller for Xbox.
MS is never going to sell as many consoles as Sony, but even significantly narrowing that gap is not something Ryan is willing to envisage.
Tiago Rodrigues
Member
Am i the only one that feels like that Sony and MS and other big companies are going quiet in acquisitions in 2022 to be ready for more acquisitions once this deal happens / gets rejected?
I feel like this is going to be a mess after the MS / Activision stuff is sorted out.
They didn't stay quiet for a year without having acquisitions ready to possibly happen after this one.
I feel like this is going to be a mess after the MS / Activision stuff is sorted out.
They didn't stay quiet for a year without having acquisitions ready to possibly happen after this one.
Kiraly
Member
And what does Sony want strangling entire genres of games by continuously targeting flagbearers by paying for them to be kept off other platforms to make sure they never have a chance of succeeding on them? Hmmmm. Hopefully Microsoft lock a lot more games to their own platform much like Sony does because evidently that is not an issue, after all the player base can just buy the platform if they want to play the games.Microsoft pays $50 million for exclusive GTA IV downloadable content
Grand Theft Auto IV downloadable content is only coming to the 360, but that …
Microsoft Spent An Insane Amount of Money for Rise of the Tomb Raider Exclusivity
After almost six years since its release, an ex-employee reveals how much Microsoft spent on Rise of the Tomb Raider's exclusivity.
Tomb Raider: Underworld getting 'exclusive' DLC on Xbox 360
Xbox 360 players planning to lace up in Lara Croft's skin-tight boots this November can look forward to a double helping of new content even after the final credits roll by. Eidos announced that it has inked a deal with Microsoft to release two additional chapters to Tomb Raider: Underworld...
The only reason MS don't do as much this type of deals today is cause they don't have a bigger install console base, no devs would accept to lock their game exclusive for Xbox and lose half or more their playerbase that is on Playstation, in Tomb Raider case it almost killed the franchise as the sales tanked hard when it was Xbox exclusive (i mean first game was 65% PS4 sales, CD should have anticipated that). So now since Phil can't get those type of exclusives, they just go on buying entire publishers to lock their games from releasing on Playstation, even if it means huge losses and benefits and the playerbase of an IP will be cut by half. Phil can keep acting like a good nice guy and lure the naives weebs and fanboys but the truth is all they (MS) want and their end game has always been the same: Monopoly.
RoadHazard
Gold Member
He's definitely not wrong. That is what MS does.
John Wick
Member
Did you sneak off from fellating Phil and Nadella and came on here? Or did they give you permission?
rickybooby87
Member
I have never seen this level of hype for market consolidation/less choice. It’s almost like Sony hurt some of you badly last gen and you never fully recovered.
So, Sony acquires Take Two Interactive, are you okay with that? No? Didn’t think so. Once this deal is approved, it’ll trigger further consolidations. Buying a single studio and cultivating it into a powerhouse developer is a night and day difference.
So, Sony acquires Take Two Interactive, are you okay with that? No? Didn’t think so. Once this deal is approved, it’ll trigger further consolidations. Buying a single studio and cultivating it into a powerhouse developer is a night and day difference.
Bernkastel
Ask me about my fanboy energy!
Unless Bungie made being multiplat part of the acquisition deal.
Well if they signed such an agreement, then they signed that contract with the intent to see this happen and legally binding them to be multiplat. Pete Parsons was not the sole owner of Bungie, he only became CEO in 2016. Even Marty O'Donell owned part of Bungie, Harold Ryan left in 2016 and I am pretty sure Jason Jones owned a part of it.
The agreement to buy Bungie was made with its owners and if they violated the contract, the ownership of Bungie will go back to its previous owners.
AncientOrigin
Member
They could hire some people from Path of Exile or Ex Diablo workers.but the mechanics of the game how it should be Is already clear they could build from there or have different ideas.Sony didn’t cared for these Typ of games.This is what I criticize Sony for they should have bought BioWare or studios like that who make Strategy games puzzle games other Typ of games to have lots of variety in their own games.Even games they made amazing they abandoned them like Motorstorm arcade racer.This is Sony’s weak point the more variety of games you made yourself the better for your platform for yourself you also stay independent.
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