-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Phil Spencer: announcement this week
- Thread starter spons
- Start date
leizzra
Member
In a way there is and isn't lack of software on PS5. Obviously we have a lot of games launching every year, with some less (like 2022) and some more (2023). Then from Sony itself it's less, last year it was only SM2 (I'm not counting Horizon because it's VR and not adding DLC's). Previous years it was mostly two titles at best (if we count Returnal and Ratchet as big AAA). In 2020 we had four big AAA games form Sony (PS4 and PS5). It still better then MS but that's not the point. I think Sony has a lot to do in regards to that. I'm not saying to buy a lot of studios, but 2-3 additional ones would be nice. Also invest more in additional teams in other 1st party studios, save only few GaaS games and start to make smaller games as well.
Agree but there is a lack of variety. Frankly speaking, as much as I love Sony 1st party studios games (they are the games I play the most and do trophies for them) I'd remember times when Sony made also FPS, slashers, arcade racing games, platformers, etc.
In the end I think that he made a shortcut in his statement and should be more precise.
You are right it's not significant, more like one-two titles less now (talking about AAA or AAA-ish games for single player). And they had more variation in that period.
Sure, they had less studios that's why when I wrote about exclusives I said 1st and 3rd party, because that why they had so many. And some of them (not all though) were free for them. But this was of course different times. Probably this is the reason why people think differently though. This and maybe the fact that Sony was publishing and co-publishing a lot games back then, far more then now.
Well one doesn't mean that you need to be, especially to a person that you don't know and you don't know the reasons why he is saying this. For me John cares about the industry and consoles. When I see people saying things like - it's good that Sony is releasing their games on PC's - I don't think they do. But it's another topic
.In the end I'm saying that his not totally wrong about saying that Sony isn't doing enough for their system. Even what you wrote about VR2 - is it an advantage to have? Yes. Is Sony taking a good care of that? I think not. I bet we can argue here for long time and with long posts but do we have time for this?
As I said I think that John worked for his respect. It doesn't mean that I approve everything that he says (like when he was prising Gears 5 for characters rendering and I thought - but that's what older Sony 1st party games already did a few years back).
Mibu no ookami
Member
In a way there is and isn't lack of software on PS5. Obviously we have a lot of games launching every year, with some less (like 2022) and some more (2023). Then from Sony itself it's less, last year it was only SM2 (I'm not counting Horizon because it's VR and not adding DLC's). Previous years it was mostly two titles at best (if we count Returnal and Ratchet as big AAA). In 2020 we had four big AAA games form Sony (PS4 and PS5). It still better then MS but that's not the point. I think Sony has a lot to do in regards to that. I'm not saying to buy a lot of studios, but 2-3 additional ones would be nice. Also invest more in additional teams in other 1st party studios, save only few GaaS games and start to make smaller games as well.
Agree but there is a lack of variety. Frankly speaking, as much as I love Sony 1st party studios games (they are the games I play the most and do trophies for them) I'd remember times when Sony made also FPS, slashers, arcade racing games, platformers, etc.
In the end I think that he made a shortcut in his statement and should be more precise.
You are right it's not significant, more like one-two titles less now (talking about AAA or AAA-ish games for single player). And they had more variation in that period.
Sure, they had less studios that's why when I wrote about exclusives I said 1st and 3rd party, because that why they had so many. And some of them (not all though) were free for them. But this was of course different times. Probably this is the reason why people think differently though. This and maybe the fact that Sony was publishing and co-publishing a lot games back then, far more then now.
Well one doesn't mean that you need to be, especially to a person that you don't know and you don't know the reasons why he is saying this. For me John cares about the industry and consoles. When I see people saying things like - it's good that Sony is releasing their games on PC's - I don't think they do. But it's another topic
In the end I'm saying that his not totally wrong about saying that Sony isn't doing enough for their system. Even what you wrote about VR2 - is it an advantage to have? Yes. Is Sony taking a good care of that? I think not. I bet we can argue here for long time and with long posts but do we have time for this?
There has never been a larger gaming backlog than there is now, especially with enhanced BC. Putting out too many games just means those games don't sell as well.
How many major fighting games did we/are we getting an an 18 month period? 2020 is end of cycle, how are you comparing 2020 to 2024? Sony doesn't need to buy a studio to work with them. They helped release and promote Kena, Sifu, Deathloop, Stray, Ghostwire Tokyo... all these games that you aren't giving them credit for. The irony is most of these games you're referring to from back in the day, they didn't make themselves either.
They do have a diversity problem, but they're actively working on that as well. There are some genres where it doesn't make a ton of sense to invest in. There is a deluge of arcade racing games on PlayStation 5 right now.
You can tell with DF that they hem, haw, and sigh over the fact that Sony is dominating the industry. Watch the video. The motives are clear and so is the track record.
As for PSVR2, I think you need to realize that you have an objective for a project but it doesn't always pan out. The PSVR2 is way too expensive right now for mass adoption and sony can't afford to reduce the price right now, which means less adoption and support. Eventually when they're able to, sony will drop the price of it and key games will sell and others will come to support it as well or we'll jump to psvr3 on ps6. For sony VR is an investment. They dropped the ball on motion gaming even though they were ahead of Nintendo. They're going to make sure they're part of the VR conversation and eventually you'll probably see something like playstation home.
Horseganador
Member
GHG
Gold Member
Kenneth Haight
Gold Member
DJ12
Member
Can they not keep a lid on this shit until tomorrow, its like Microsoft is just a shit show right now.
Last edited:
ArcaneNLSC
Member
to be fair he probably got chatgpt to write it for him
DJ12
Member
Yeah that's probs why it's out of character then rofl
MonkeyClaw36
Member
leizzra
Member
Backlog can be a problem for us gamers (my pile of shame is growing every year
) but I don't think it's a problem for Publishers and the market. People buy games even when they have many titles that they haven't finished. I don't think it's a problem. And the backlog will be growing because the industry is moving forward. I have many games from PSX that I'd like to play now .Are you writing this to show me there are many fighting games now? I'm not sure why are you writing this and I'd like to know, because it seams irrelevant.
How it's different? Those studios were making games anyways, most of them were for PS4 only Demon's Souls were PS5 exclusive. Also the transition from one gen to another is quite smooth now, that's why nothing changes actually. The hardware is more or less the same, the pipeline didn't change much (not like going to PBR or to HD). SSD is something but it's still not utilised in the way it should, so I don't see here a reason not to compere.
To be fair though - I think that we can have similar year from Sony when the launch of their future games will align. And it seams that it can be in 2025 or 2026.
Agree that they don't have to buy the studio but there is a difference between 1st party, 2nd party (I know that technically it doesn't exist, I'll explain it in a bit) and 3rd party production and quality it produces. Sony is known for their quality and this is only made by 1st party studios. They can work closely with 3rd party devs to the point where you could say that it's a 2nd party game (like The Order, games made by Bluepoint or Insomniac before acquisition). Those games are very much tied to PlayStation (well they are literally because Sony owns the IP's). 3rd party games aren't as much, especially the ones form publishers like Bethesda. Those are mostly (but not always) a publishing deals. That's why I don't give them credit for that. For me it's a filler in their catalogue. This year there will be only fillers (which I don't mind if I'll have games like FFVII Rebirth or I hope Stellar Blade).
Well yes, many games form back in the day (I assume you are referring to PSX and PS2 era) weren't made by Sony and I stated that. Some of them were in cooperation ("2nd party") and were the start for future co-development and acquisitions.
I'm not sure are they doing this actively but maybe the problem is that I'm looking at quality, and many of those games are looking/are like indie games. But then again it's my individual problem - I don't have anything against indie games, it's just with so little time for playing games I prefer to buy different games. I also agree that there are genres that aren't too popular now or at least it may seam that way. There are times when a game launches and it becomes a hit because there weren't any competition. I think it's more a problem of proper evaluation and management of resources. I think that Sony could better use their "top quality" mark
.I'm not sure with that. PSVR2 is expensive yet it's not, if we take into account the quality it provides. The problem is in support by Sony. For VR newcomers there are many older titles and it seams to be ok. But for the rest there isn't much. But this is also a problem of VR in general. It needs more games like Half-Life Alyx or even Horizon Call of the Mountain. This is where Sony could improve the situation by making or paying for making high quality VR games.
Mibu no ookami
Member
Backlog can be a problem for us gamers (my pile of shame is growing every year
It's a huge problem, because gamers are less likely to buy games brand new if they have a back catalog. This means they end up waiting for discounts, which leads to lower operating income and profit. This is why PC games are so cheap, because you have back catalog for decades. In most console generations, you basically had to start all over. PS1 to PS3 was really the first time you saw a ton of sustained BC and that resulted in a really expensive PS3.
It's what we call an example. There is a deluge of fighting games on the market, which has limited their ability to sell at a higher level. They all reached a ceiling and kind of stopped there.
It's not as smooth as you're making it out to be, especially as costs, size, and scope expand. Demon's Souls was largely done before the pandemic really hit and it was also a remake that didn't require all the stages of planning of a full game from scratch.
If you listen to the interviews with these studios, they always talk about the technical help they receive from Sony...
Sony isn't going to pour 100 million into an arcade racing game when there are a ton of arcade racing games on PS5 already. That money would be better spent elsewhere.I'm not sure are they doing this actively but maybe the problem is that I'm looking at quality, and many of those games are looking/are like indie games. But then again it's my individual problem - I don't have anything against indie games, it's just with so little time for playing games I prefer to buy different games. I also agree that there are genres that aren't too popular now or at least it may seam that way. There are times when a game launches and it becomes a hit because there weren't any competition. I think it's more a problem of proper evaluation and management of resources. I think that Sony could better use their "top quality" mark
The cost of PSVR2 is over 1000 dollars because you need the PS5. The Quest 3 is half that price and for those that pair it with PC, there is a larger userbase than the PS5 userbase.
That is going to keep it in the enthusiast market until the PS5 userbase is larger, the price is lower, and there is more software. Sony isn't going to fund more VR games that won't sell and further impact its margins. This is a side project for them. They're dipping their toe in VR, they're not jumping in naked.
Badlucktroll
Member
leizzra
Member
Still I'm not sure, do you have any data for that?
I don't see a problem with that when I'm looking at what people buy and when. For me it's similar to what was from PS3 era (I don't know how it looked earlier). When there is a new hot game people are buying it even when they have a huge backlog. It's more likely for games with smaller marketing or not great opinions/reviews. Now I don't know "what kids buy this days" but I bet that they are getting bored quite fast
. I don't say you're not right, I'm just not seeing that whit big releases and people talk about backlogs for many years. Last year was trickier because there where many large games though.
Oh you don't have to be this way.
I'm not into fighting games this days but I know that there were at least few titles. Still I'm not sure how it's related to Sony's 1st party output.
Well maybe it's not, I'm just referring to my own experience of working in the industry also through the pandemic. Also growing sizes and costs are also into them. There were talks for years that games are getting to big and Sony still didn't reacted properly. For now it's more like we are still going the same direction only the cost of games went up (and it's still not enough). We can blame the whole industry or world economics but this doesn't change a thing. Sony is part of it and it's a part of the problems, they need to react to that.
Now it'll be a first time for years (form beginning?) that Playstation may not release a big 1st party title. We've been criticising MS for that but now Sony made a misstep (maybe it's because of GaaS strategy, maybe some other decisions).
I know how it looks, trust me. I was also in cooperation with Sony.
Agree on that and I haven't said that they need to make an arcade racing game. Still I think it would sell well though (if it was Motorstorm or Driveclub) because it would be Sony's 1st party game.
I think we are a bit off the topic of the discussion (not the topic itself, the thing about John's statement).
AGRacing
Member
He gave up right before they announced they’re finally engaging the Xbox One secret sauce 2nd layered GPU. To walk away right before the realization of the ultimate plan is very sad.
Mibu no ookami
Member
Still I'm not sure, do you have any data for that?
I don't see a problem with that when I'm looking at what people buy and when. For me it's similar to what was from PS3 era (I don't know how it looked earlier). When there is a new hot game people are buying it even when they have a huge backlog. It's more likely for games with smaller marketing or not great opinions/reviews. Now I don't know "what kids buy this days" but I bet that they are getting bored quite fast
I don't say you're not right, I'm just not seeing that whit big releases and people talk about backlogs for many years. Last year was trickier because there where many large games though.
Decrease in software sales growth that is plaguing the entire industry...
You have a comprehension problem. Sony and all publishers have to way getting into specific genres that are already quite crowded. Fighting games was an example.
Why don't Sony make big blockbuster RPGs like they did with Arc the Lad and Legend of Dragoon? Because you have to have a studio which is essentially in the RPG business and it's boom or bust. Sony was all about RPGs until the PS3 and they realized it is more financially stable to have 3rd parties work on RPGs.
Same reason Sony likely canceled a PC version of Dreams, because supporting the game on an ongoing basis was probably more expensive than just sitting back and collecting royalty revenue from Roblox sales on PlayStation, which costs them nothing.
Yeah, you have a serious comprehension issue. They didn't say they weren't releasing a big first party game. They just said it no games from existing franchises were going to receive a major release, which isn't new, but please continue to feed into your agenda.
MonkeyClaw36
Member
Fits his personality. This imbecile bought 3 xbox One's to boost sales, parked outside of Best Buy to see if anyone bought an Xbox.....
He's 10 years old mentally. You also hear it in the way he speaks that he's not the brightest star in the sky.
He's a simpleton with a mass following.
Last edited:
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Topher
Gold Member
Hey Bill Gates, how big is Pentiment?
SteadyEvo
Member
Is the issue these games being released on PS or these being the 1st of many?
Never understood the appeal of Sea of thieves and put a few hours into high fi rush. Neither did much for me.
I’ll care when I can play Infinite and Forza on PS. If they’re going 3rd party go all in. This drip feed of “smaller” titles means nothing.
EverydayBeast
thinks Halo Infinite is a new graphical benchmark
Phil’s word isn’t the gospel but I think he’s important to the Xbox brand and has a real relationship with fans.
DJ12
Member
The look of shock and disgust on Ronaldo's face, and the quick to to see if he had a boner too.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
mistermediax
I agree that John is probably the most informed of the DF crew. But my biggest issue is what does the PS5 software library have to do with the reader's question on Microsofts multiplatform decision and ensuing outrage from Xbox fans? It's entirely completely unrelated. This generation especially he has developed an automatic response to any criticism toward MS and that is to weave Sony into the conversation somehow. His SonyToo deflection rant was totally off topic requiring Rich multiple times to try steering the conversation back on topic. But John cannot help himself. I knew even before starting the video he would find a way to bring Sony into the conversation and he didn't dissappoint.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
The years of people online calling him a Sony fanboy really hurt him. He now overcompensates.
Last edited:
Bernardougf
Gold Member
They have to calm the waters..m did you see people returning their xbox and burning ambassadors accounts just for a rumor ?? If they comeout tomorrow and announce halo , gears and starfield for Ps5 is going to be mass suicides of
rats.
JohnnyFootball
GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
I like John, but I do get tired of his hard-on for CRT's. I mean they are amazing, but they are not THAT much better than high quality IPS and IMO are virtually indistinguishable from OLEDs. Not to mention, he has the best CRT ever made, the Sony FW900, which costs several $1000 to find.
i recently played on a CRT and yes, the advantages are obvious, but LEDs have closed the gap considerably, with 240 Hz OLEDs being so damn close, it shouldn't even be discussed anymore.
JohnnyFootball
GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
He bends the knee to Xbots. Im still bitter at him for bowing out of talking about Dolby Atmos lag issues on Xbox Series X. That issue inspired me to go back to a dedicated receiver and using DTS:X instead of soundbar using eARC.
Mibu no ookami
Member
LOL, just caught this piece of shit John Linneman saying that the Series S was a smart idea and that it makes more sense than the PS5 Digital which is just a worse version of the PS5 Standard... and that the Series S beat the PS5 Digital on price. First they're both digital only and at launch, they were only separated by a small margin that wasn't worth it. Whether someone decided to get the PS5 Digital or Standard is immaterial at that point. If Sony felt more pressure they would have released more digital sku, but they didn't.
This guy can't get any dumber and more biased.
This guy can't get any dumber and more biased.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Yeah, he's now officially on the take. Or just that damned mentally challenged.
bUt a pRo iS a bAd iDeA - him too, derp
Last edited:
Ashamam
Member
To be fair he has changed position on that. But the reasons for changing position should have been glaringly obvious to someone like him from the outset. Also the case for Richard and Alex. UE5 clearly struggles on consoles, or at least the titles they had looked at do.
Just seemed bizarre that an outlet that celebrates graphical presentation wouldn’t see the need for a console that could correct some obvious reported (by them no less) of this generation. Made it hard not to wonder is it because the other guys don’t have one?
Oliver was the only one from the outset saying hell yeah I’m up for that.
Also giving a free pass to Starfield at 30fps was bizarre to me. The whole its CPU heavy argument goes straight through to the keeper with zero analysis. Not one question why an engine that could do 60 on Jaguar couldn’t do 60 on modern console CPU’s. What exactly is Starfield doing CPU wise that Skeyrim didn’t? At least talk about it. Enquiring minds would like to know!
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
More load screens?
digoutyoursoul
Member
“Every screen is an Xbox”
500 bucks for the most powerful screen
500 bucks for the most powerful screen
Last edited:
Nydius
Member
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Ah yes, more hubris and self labeling to paint that they rule the gaming world ambitions in their lame marketing speak.
Like how people used to call video games at one time 'Nintendo,' even if it was not a Nintendo system, they want that notoriety. And will cringe PR speak as if it is so.
Last edited:
ZehDon
Member
I'll never understand their desire to do this to themselves. If people just aren't buying Xboxes, they can explain that behind numerous factors - entrenched market leader, cost of living, cost of entry, brand awareness, and so on. But, if "every screen is an Xbox"... then instead of 50% of gamers not playing Xbox, 99% of screen users aren't playing Xbox. And that seems oh-so-much-worse to me.
Last edited:
bitbydeath
Gold Member
Last edited:
Negotiator101
Member
That's a stretch even for youNot giving up on hardware because all hardware is an Xbox.
bitbydeath
Gold Member
I’m often not serious, this was one of those.That's a stretch even for you
Mibu no ookami
Member
When to John change his position on Pro consoles?
What new information did he take in that wasn't available before? Or did he realize that it was a shit take and that he'd have to deal with people calling him out for that for years?
Giving a pass to Starfield or calling it one of the top 5 games ever ala Jaffe... are clues to the extent these influencers will go.
panda-zebra
Banned
sarah xbox really got me in the feels this valentine's...
No screen is an island,
Entire of itself;
Every panel is a piece of the installbase,
A part of the main.
If Hi-Fi RUSH washes up on PSN,
Game Pass is the less,
As well as if Halo were:
As well as if achievements of thy friend's
Or of thine own were.
Any exclusive's death induces spin,
Because I am involved in the console wars.
And therefore never send to know for whom the bell-ends troll;
When everybody plays we all win.
No screen is an island,
Entire of itself;
Every panel is a piece of the installbase,
A part of the main.
If Hi-Fi RUSH washes up on PSN,
Game Pass is the less,
As well as if Halo were:
As well as if achievements of thy friend's
Or of thine own were.
Any exclusive's death induces spin,
Because I am involved in the console wars.
And therefore never send to know for whom the bell-ends troll;
When everybody plays we all win.
ChorizoPicozo
Member
listening to the shills is going to be even worse. But fortunately the shitshow will not be over
Similar threads
- Locked
- Locked
- Locked