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Boy refuses to live as male; parents seek help of therapists, opt for delayed puberty

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http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/10/1...-young-transgender-patients-raises-questions/

A lesbian couple in California who say their 11-year-old son Tommy who wants to be a girl named Tammy are giving their child hormone blockers that delay the onset of puberty -- so that he can have more time that he can have more time to decide if he wants to change his gender.
The couple’s supporters say the Hormone Blocking Therapy has only minor side effects and is appropriate for a child who is unsure of his gender. "This is definitely a changing landscape for transgender youth," said Joel Baum, director of education and training for Gender Spectrum, a California-based non-profit group. "This is about giving kids and their families the opportunity to make the right decision."

But critics of the treatment say 11-year-olds are not old enough to make life-altering decisions about changing their gender, and parents should not be encouraging them. They say it’s too soon to tell what the side effects of the treatments may be, and they say Tommy’s parents, Pauline Moreno and Debra Lobel, are irresponsible for seeking them and allowing them to be administered.
"This is child abuse. It's like performing liposuction on an anorexic child," said Dr. Paul McHugh, professor of psychiatry at Johns Hopkins University.
"It is a disorder of the mind. Not a disorder of the body. Dealing with it in this way is not dealing with the problem that truly exists.
“We shouldn't be mucking around with nature. We can’t assume what the outcome will be," McHugh said.
Dr. Manny Alvarez, senior managing health editor of FoxNews.com, said the hormone blockers also may pose a medical risk. "I think that it’s highly inappropriate to be interfering with natural hormonal growth patterns,” Alvarez said. “There are significant potential problems necessary for growth and development.
"Potential long-term effects can include other abnormalities of hormones, vascular complications and even potential cancer. I think that if this child – as he finishes his puberty and teenage years – decides to undergo a transgender procedure – then there are proper channels to do so.
“But to do it at the age of 11 -- to me -- could be potentially dangerous to the health of this child," he said.
Tommy's parents, Moreno and Lobel, say they support their child and feel this is the best way for him to find an answer to a question he’s been asking all his life. They say Tommy – whom they now call Tammy – began taking GnRH inhibitors over the summer so that he will remain a prepubescent boy until he turns 14 or 15. They say they want to give him more time to explore the female gender identity that he associates with.
Thomas began saying he was a girl when he was 3 years old, his parents said in an interview with the Daily Mail. He was learning sign language due to a speech impediment, and one of the first things he told his mothers was, “I am a girl.” They say they thought he was confused or mistaken, and signed back, 'No. No. Thomas is a boy."
But Thomas insisted, they said. He shook his head “no” and repeated what he had signed.
They said Thomas threatened to mutilate his genitals when he was 7, and psychiatrists diagnosed a gender identity disorder.
One year later, he began transitioning to Tammy.
After much deliberation with family and therapists, the child began taking hormone blockers a few months ago. The medication, which must be changed once a year, was implanted in the boy’s upper left arm.
Tommy will continue this treatment until he turns 14 or 15, at which point he will be taken off the blockers and pursue the gender he feels is the right one. He will then either start his puberty cycle as a boy – or begin making the full transition to a girl.
"There's an increase of children who are telling their parents that they are a different gender. We're trying to understand why there's an increase," said Diane Ehrensaft, a developmental and clinical psychologist and author of the book, "Gender-Born. Gender-Made," who says the trend may be due to a more open society.
But while chemicals are giving children like Tommy more time to decide which side of the fence they belong on, some critics say that some children who question their identity at a very young age might change their mind when they start adolescence.
"Most transgender patients will say that they knew at 6 years old. But what we don't know is how many others had those thoughts and feelings that went away once they hit puberty," said Dr. Jeffrey Spiegel, a professor at Boston University and a plastic surgeon who specializes in facial feminization operations for transgender men.
"While it may be a good therapy for those who've committed to transgender, it may not be good for those who might have changed their mind once they hit puberty and beyond."
Walt Heyer, whose book "Paper Genders" details his own experience transitioning from a man to a woman and back again, agreed. "The blockers should NOT be introduced to a child," Heyer said. "If they are going to make a transition, they should wait to do so when they reach 18 to 20 years old. When you start the therapy at that age you are not dealing with the fact that the mind is not fully developed."
Heyer also cited a Dutch study that said 61 percent of individuals who desire a gender change are found to have secondary psychiatric disorders, such as depression or dissociative disorder, which he suffered from.
Other critics asked whether Tommy’s same-sex parents may be unknowingly influencing his questions about his gender.
“Undue influence on the child simply has to be ruled out,” said psychiatrist Keith Ablow, a Fox News contributor. “It's the psychologically correct thing to do, the ethical thing to do and the moral thing to do."
"Obviously, when two females adopt a male child, then assert that the child is not actually male, but is, instead, actually a female -- like both of them. Everyone in the family should be psychologically evaluated in a comprehensive way before a step like gender reassignment is considered,” said Ablow.

I'll just leave this here.

EDIT: CNN article (from toxicadam) - http://www.cnn.com/2011/09/27/health/transgender-kids/index.html
 
what

can't he decide his own gender without hormone blockers? did other transgenders use hormone blockers to decide their own gender?

i'm confused :(
 

Stet

Banned
“Undue influence on the child simply has to be ruled out,” said psychiatrist Keith Ablow, a Fox News contributor. “It's the psychologically correct thing to do, the ethical thing to do and the moral thing to do. Obviously, when two females adopt a male child, then assert that the child is not actually male, but is, instead, actually a female -- like both of them."

Can't outdumb Fox News.
 

jaxword

Member
Cosmetic surgery on children is wrong.

However, I'm not sure this is that, if their intent is legitimate and they truly do want him to be able to decide his gender in the future, as the article suggests.

Which means it was good intentions, but bad execution, hence the sensationalist feedback.
 
Reminds me of this study we learned about in my Human Sexuality class where someone tried to raise a boy as a girl by giving him girl clothes and toys. I think the boy ended up just ripping them off and doing regular boy stuff.
 

Hilbert

Deep into his 30th decade
Mr.Awesome said:
I would say so, but I cannot actually see anyone defending this. Right, GAF?

I am rather fascinated by the concept. But I can't imagine doing this to a person.
 

Stumpokapow

listen to the mad man
Provided the lede of the story is true and the parents are providing the child hormone blockers on their own as part of making a philosophical point, that's problematic.

Providing that the rest of the story is true--no, not the part where they randomly quote a Doctor who doesn't believe in transgendered people; the part where they suggest that Tommy has been seeing doctors for years about gender identity problems and that this might be part of a doctor-overseen regimen--I'm less bothered. I don't know the kid. I'm not a psychiatrist. If experts in the field come to a consensus that this is an appropriate therapeutic regimen, I'm not as bothered.
 

Stet

Banned
Stumpokapow said:
I don't know the kid. I'm not a psychiatrist. If experts in the field come to a consensus that this is an appropriate therapeutic regimen, I'm not as bothered.

Yeah, this isn't just lesbians giving a kid hormone blockers, this is parents giving a kid hormone blockers because he tried to mutilate his own genitals and wants to be a female, and they want him to be able to decide decisively before he goes through puberty and suffers emotional damage as a result.
 

sangreal

Member
Sounds like a pretty serious case, more than your typical girl who grows up a tomboy (or the reverse). He is under the care of Doctors who seem to approve of this treatment, so I would defer to them.
 

Ferrio

Banned
Stabby McSter said:
what

can't he decide his own gender without hormone blockers? did other transgenders use hormone blockers to decide their own gender?

i'm confused :(

If you block the hormones, then if they decide to go female they'll pull it off a lot more successfulyl. A lot of trans people had wished they were on blockers before they hit puberty, as it would of made their transition easier.
 
Stumpokapow said:
Provided the lede of the story is true and the parents are providing the child hormone blockers on their own as part of making a philosophical point, that's problematic.

Providing that the rest of the story is true--no, not the part where they randomly quote a Doctor who doesn't believe in transgendered people; the part where they suggest that Tommy has been seeing doctors for years about gender identity problems and that this might be part of a doctor-overseen regimen--I'm less bothered. I don't know the kid. I'm not a psychiatrist. If experts in the field come to a consensus that this is an appropriate therapeutic regimen, I'm not as bothered.

I'll just go this route to .
Though somewhat related to this(or at least the perceived notion of this story) but not directed at this: I hate these new age parents who use their children as ways to prove their inane beliefs or make a point.
 

Ferrio

Banned
Overall this sounds like Foxnews trying to put dirt on homosexual parents (which seems to be working looking at this thread). The doctors support it (and looks like for good reason), so it's not just some quack parents.
 

The Technomancer

card-carrying scientician
Sounds like typical "we're going to try and do what we feel is the 'right thing' without actually fully understanding the possible consequences"

Just going to prove yet again that that line of thought is in no way limited to backwards old conservatives.
 

Stet

Banned
I'm having a hard time believing everyone is reading the OP. It spells out pretty obviously what's going on here, and it's not as deplorable as the headline or the editorialized content makes it out to be.
 

FoneBone

Member
Stumpokapow said:
Providing that the rest of the story is true--no, not the part where they randomly quote a Doctor who doesn't believe in transgendered people; the part where they suggest that Tommy has been seeing doctors for years about gender identity problems and that this might be part of a doctor-overseen regimen--I'm less bothered. I don't know the kid. I'm not a psychiatrist. If experts in the field come to a consensus that this is an appropriate therapeutic regimen, I'm not as bothered.
This... some of you didn't read anything other than the thread title, clearly. Not that that's surprising.
 
jaxword said:
Cosmetic surgery on children is wrong.

However, I'm not sure this is actually that...if their intent is legitimate and they truly do want him to be able to decide his gender in the future.

Whic means it was good intentions, but bad execution.

He's a male.

They are indirectly influencing him towards sex change therapy.
 

Ferrio

Banned
Stet said:
I'm having a hard time believing everyone is reading the OP. It spells out pretty obviously what's going on here, and it's not as deplorable as the headline or the editorialized content makes it out to be.

Ya, guess everyone is missing the "Multilate his genitals" part. Kid hads an issue, the parents+doctors are trying to resolve them.
 

sangreal

Member
bengraven said:
Basically.

You get one nutty couple and suddenly all lesbians are crazy and not allowed to raise boys.

This couple tried to raise him as a boy though. Does the article need more bolding?
 
Mr.Awesome said:
I would say so, but I cannot actually see anyone defending this. Right, GAF?

I'm not defending it, but it's certainly not child abuse as some are claiming. Read the article properly, he's sought professional help for years and it genuinely sounds like a case where this is the best course of action based on his past actions.

So while the knee-jerk reaction is to shout child abuse, there's a lot more to it than that.
 
D

Deleted member 81567

Unconfirmed Member
The couple is too open-minded. Some things we should just leave up to nature.
 

Gaborn

Member
Stumpokapow said:
Provided the lede of the story is true and the parents are providing the child hormone blockers on their own as part of making a philosophical point, that's problematic.

Providing that the rest of the story is true--no, not the part where they randomly quote a Doctor who doesn't believe in transgendered people; the part where they suggest that Tommy has been seeing doctors for years about gender identity problems and that this might be part of a doctor-overseen regimen--I'm less bothered. I don't know the kid. I'm not a psychiatrist. If experts in the field come to a consensus that this is an appropriate therapeutic regimen, I'm not as bothered.

Yeah, if it's the child's decision (and realistically I bet it is, you can make a child do a lot of things but if a child didn't want THIS I'm pretty sure they'd make it known) this is a good thing. I've posted a thread before about a recommendation from the Endocrine Society that said that earlier decisions on this issue make the transition easier if you're going to do it.
 

jon bones

hot hot hanuman-on-man action
TheNatural said:
That's fucked up and they should go to jail for child abuse.

yes!

also, this is fucking awful PR in terms of gay relations or whatever you want to call it. people are going to use these two women (who clearly should not be rearing a child but not b/c they're lesbians) as proof of how stupid gay people are (and not proof of how stupid most people are - which is the real truth)
 
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