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[Flabagast]

The only thing Cyberpunk has going for it is, well, the Cyberpunk setting and RT. Everything else has been done before and much better. Its RPG elements are fine, but not exactly groundbreaking.There's absolutely nothing special about its open world and how you interact with it, if anything it's basic, at best. The developers built hype by showing very specific and polished footage and then promising that 90% of the game that wasn't shown was just as good and exciting. We all know how that turned out.

I really don't see what kind of metric hype generated is, especially if the end product was a colossal disappointment in every possible way. Are we celebrating scamming people now?

No the game has a lot going for it but it has already been explained too many times to rehash it here.


I’ll just say something of the open world though. In terms of details, verticality and sheer complexity of the lay out it is unprecedented. In some places in the open (not in buildings) you have several layers above and under you, all accessible. Sometimes you have three to four roads / bridges one on top of the other, all with cars riding on it. The sense of scale is really something else that I have not experienced in any other urban game to that degree.

Just a question though, especially regarding what you are saying about quests (several of which being on par if not better than the bloody baron) : have you played/finished the game ?

 

[CartoonsNCereal]

The Witcher 3 made Cyberpunk look like the devs weren't even trying. It had tons of sidequests that put the main quests of other games to shame. Can you really say the same about Cyberpunk?

It tries to be an open world game so it will be compared to other open world games, is it so strange? Its open world is an ebarassment compared to GTA V that came out in 2013 and you will find many videos where it doesn't compare favourably to even GTA IV from 2008. Yes, it has more RPG elements than those games, but that doesn't excuse all the faults of a game releasing in 2020.

Oh i can understand it, its just stupid is all. And how a simple person would assess it lol

Cyberpunk has been labeled as an rpg in every demonstration that has been put out. this is a fact. Have you not really kept up with it? They made very clear to label it as such. And the design structure is similar to that of the witcher 3. Which wasnt a surprise to me, i wanted and expected that. Others didnt expect that because...they cant piece together the dev to game ratio.

So the comparison to GTA is retarded, and something i would do when i didnt know much about gaming. You can say the same about the NPC interaction in the witcher 3, that it wasnt as advanced as GTA IV either. But people knew, because it was high fantasy, to not compare it. Thats how simple people are being abput this lol they see swords and a high fantasy setting then they know not to compare it to GTA. But my god if they see a gun and car...its time to compare to GTA. Simpleton shit.

And once again CDPR said NUMEROUS TIMES this is an RPG. Do I really need to bring up timestamps and videos, or can we put that to rest?

And as far as quests, yes the sidequests and gigs were STILL better than many other open world rpgs before it overall quests, especially bethesda...do i need to list examples, or will you admit you bypassed those and assumed they would be garbage lol because there is plenty of fantastic side content, are you insane?

Cdpr is above average on this shit by default. You acting as if they suddenly woupd go full ubisoft on this is bizarre to me.

 

[Arun1910]

Wow, you must be fun at parties.

Work hard, play hard.

Not work adequately and make a montage of things I've failed at that I can then sell to people

 

[CartoonsNCereal]

No the game has a lot going for it but it has already been explained too many times to rehash it here.


I’ll just say something of the open world though. In terms of details, verticality and sheer complexity of the lay out it is unprecedented. In some places in the open (not in buildings) you have several layers above and under you, all accessible. Sometimes you have three to four roads / bridges one on top of the other, all with cars riding on it. The sense of scale is really something else that I have not experienced in any other urban game to that degree.

Just a question though, especially regarding what you are saying about quests (several of which being on par if not better than the bloody baron) : have you played/finished the game ?

Yeah, i was wondering this too, he's talking like someone basing the opinions on heresay badnwagonism rather than actually playing it.

CDPR didnt fuck up like that...they kinda make better quests than most devs in their sleep, and that existed here in cyberpunk. You'd have to not really played much of the game to think otherwise, because we can go there and list the writing for various side quests and compare it to other games...we gotta go there?

 

[SafeOrAlone]

I'm liking this hot dog and chicken stuff.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

Somehow fund in the code leak dump from earlier this week

Thread: https://boards.4channel.org/v/thread/558412007

CDPR had the steepest drop from great to one of the shittiest studios ever.

 

[Skifi28]

I’ll just say something of the open world though. In terms of details, verticality and sheer complexity of the lay out it is unprecedented. In some places in the open (not in buildings) you have several layers above and under you, all accessible. Sometimes you have three to four roads / bridges one on top of the other, all with cars riding on it. The sense of scale is really something else that I have not experienced in any other urban game to that degree.

It certainly looks impressive from afar, but it all breaks down once you're there experiencing the terrible AI of drivers/pedestrians. Like an illussion being shattered.

Just a question though, especially regarding what you are saying about quests (several of which being on par if not better than the bloody baron) : have you played/finished the game ?

Played 20 hours, couldn't bear it any longer. I'm sure there are things I haven't done yet, but if I need to invest 50 hours just to get to the good parts, I think the issue is on their side. Most of the game's side content is being spammed on your phone about repetitive gigs. In Witcher 3 all you had to do was explore a little and you'd find a ton of interesting and unique side quests without even having to touch the main story, can't say I felt the same here. It's like an entirely different team made the game.

 

[Majukun]

Work hard, play hard.

Not work adequately and make a montage of things I've failed at that I can then sell to people

dude, bugs are a consequence of developing, you can't avoid them.

so the developers collecting the videos on them and doing a montage during development is nothing out of the ordinary nor is disrespectful, it's just them having fun.

of course the idea is that the bugs get ironed out before the game is shipped.

useless to say some bugs survived, but subject of the video are the most outrageous ones that didn't end up in the final game (at least from what i remember of day one cyberpunk), so i don't really see the issue, especially since we have no idea when the footage in it was taken..you can see some test room in it so we can assume it's pretty old and not part of the final round of pre-release testing

 

[Terenty]

Lol at people trying to spin CP2077 into a good game. Some low standards there

 

[brian0057]

And once again CDPR said NUMEROUS TIMES this is an RPG. Do I really need to bring up timestamps and videos, or can we put that to rest?

I mean, CD Project said a lot of things that weren't true.
And the official Cyberpunk 2077 Twitter account changed its description from RPG to Action/Adventure I think almost 5 months prior to launch.

Calling Cyberpunk (and The Witcher 3, for that matter) an RPG is like calling Mario Kart a racing simulator.

 

[Flabagast]

It certainly looks impressive from afar, but it all breaks down once you're there experiencing the terrible AI of drivers/pedestrians. Like an illussion being shattered.

Played 20 hours, couldn't bear it any longer. I'm sure there are things I haven't done yet, but if I need to invest 50 hours just to get to the good parts, I think the issue is on their side. Most of the game's side content is being spammed on your phone about repetitive gigs. In Witcher 3 all you had to do was explore a little and you'd find a ton of interesting and unique side quests without even having to touch the main story, can't say I felt the same here. It's like an entirely different team made the game.

Well at least you forged your opinion from playing the game, not like many youtube gamers. But still, you experienced maybe only 25% of the content, and most of the best parts of the game are in the second half indeed so your opinion is not totally informed.

Regarding side quests, there are two things to know in order to approach them in the right maner:


1) The design of side quests and gigs differs in some important manner from The Witcher 3, and is much closer to the immersive sim design philosophy (think Dishonored or Deus Ex), ie : cutscenes/dialogues scenes represent only a small fraction of the narrative delivery. Like in those games, you've got to invest more prominently into the gameplay, by looking at your surroundings, searching for intel in the environment and in the mails/ shards, exploring around the main path.. to uncover much more than the initial pitch of the quest can lead you to believe. You have also many more "choices through gameplay", some small, some more important, but the end result can differ depending on if you found an hidden room, if you decided to shoot, infiltrate, or talk your way out etc and large chunks of a given quest can go unnoticed if you go too fast or do not pay close attention. That also means that it is much more easy to miss, and that seems to be the case with a lot of gamers.

Of course in Witcher 3, even if 90% of the narrative is delivered through the dialogue cutscenes, you still had some environmental storytelling and notes to piece together to uncover more of the story, but it is much more developed and open ended in Cyberpunk, even in gigs. Concerning the "choice through gameplay" thing , I only remember a few examples in the witcher (notably in a quest in the HoS expansion, where if you went to the house of a couple in the woods - unmarked on the map -, you discovered the truth about a canibal story that could easily be missed by just following the waypoint).


2) Side quests are even more so intertwined with the main story than in Witcher 3. That means that a huge lot of content is locked behind certain milestones on the main path, and this is why at first you have the impression that most of side content in the game consists of gigs and nothing else (but even some gigs are connected to the main story)


Overall, it's an exceptional game with a lot of side content of very high quality (better than in most games, just like the witcher 3 before it), but you have to invest yourself in it more than usual and pay attention to truly discover it. That's the beauty of cyberpunk.

 

[The Cockatrice]

I mean, CD Project said a lot of things that weren't true.
And the official Cyberpunk 2077 Twitter account changed its description from RPG to Action/Adventure I think almost 5 months prior to launch.

Calling Cyberpunk (and The Witcher 3, for that matter) an RPG is like calling Mario Kart a racing simulator.

Wow I never noticed this. That's fucking scummy and I loved CP2077.

 

[CuteFaceJay]

lol apparently these are videos made by developers months before release... mocking the bugs.
(some NSFW there)

LOL can't tell if retail build or leak of early build

 

[Bernd Lauert]

CDPR had the steepest drop from great to one of the shittiest studios ever.

Witcher 4 selling 20m copies confirmed

 

[tvdaXD]

There have been some disasters over the years, but nothing of this scale to my knowledge.

No Man's Sky, although they turned it around and are a good example nowadays. Fallout 76 was even buggier, but ran better on older consoles because it's still running on an ancient engine.

 

[Putonahappyface]

No Man's Sky, although they turned it around and are a good example nowadays. Fallout 76 was even buggier, but ran better on older consoles because it's still running on an ancient engine.

They were pretty bad, pretty sure not on the scale of CyberSpunkBubble though.

 

[The Cockatrice]

Now that they'll get banned in China hopefully Devotion can return to gog. kek.

 

[eyesabitdull]

I'm enjoying all of this.

 

[blastprocessor]

 

[Bo_Hazem]

Witcher 4 selling 20m copies confirmed

Would buy it anyway myself.

 

[CartoonsNCereal]

I mean, CD Project said a lot of things that weren't true.
And the official Cyberpunk 2077 Twitter account changed its description from RPG to Action/Adventure I think almost 5 months prior to launch.

Calling Cyberpunk (and The Witcher 3, for that matter) an RPG is like calling Mario Kart a racing simulator.

Yet the game is structured more like an RPG than it is a GTA title or anything of the sort. they likely did that for marketing, but the clear intebtion is evident throughout the game, and them explicitly telling you such throughout its development. Can you not think for yourself and determine this? Because clearly its more RPG than it is open world adventure in its design.

And I'd like to hear your reasoning as to why the witcher 3 isnt an RPG...do you consider skyrim or any elder scrolls games RPG's?

Combat isnt even the witcher 3's focus, nor can you progress profeciently without leveling etc, it actually has the components of an rpg that most people WISH or tried to MOD into other faux rpg's...so I'd love to hear your reasoning.

 

[brian0057]

do you consider skyrim or any elder scrolls games RPG's?

Up to Morrowind, with Daggerfall being the greatest RPG of all time.
It's just short of actually playing a D&D campaign.

And Kingdom Come: Deliverance is what The Elder Scrolls stopped being and what The Witcher 3 pretends to be: an RPG.

 

[CartoonsNCereal]

Up to Morrowind, with Daggerfall being the greatest RPG of all time.
It's just short of actually playing a D&D campaign.

And Kingdom Come: Deliverance is what The Elder Scrolls stopped being and what The Witcher 3 pretends to be: an RPG.

You still never told me why the witcher 3 isnt one.

Leveled locations, items, loot, quests, leveled quests, grinding, alchemy, crafting, money systems, leveled enemies, leveled weapons and armor isnt exactly the features of some basic action adventure game.

And you dug yourself into a hole by telling me morrowind is one, but the witcher 3 isn't. Bad move, i can play around with that argument all day.

 

[brian0057]

You still never told me why the witcher 3 isnt one.

Leveled locations, items, loot, quests, leveled quests, grinding, alchemy, crafting, money systems, leveled enemies, leveled weapons and armor isnt exactly the features of some basic action adventure game.

And you dug yourself into a hole by telling me morrowind is one, but the witcher 3 isn't. Bad move, i can play around with that argument all day.

"RPG" in videogames is a scale.
It goes from 0 to Daggerfall.

Witcher 3 falls right along side Fallout 4 and Skyrim on that scale (Hell, unlike Witcher, the other two at least allow you to create your own character).
Higher up on that scale are Morrowind, the original Mass Effect, and the entire Deus Ex series (and, dare I say, most immersive sims).
Daggerfall, of course, being the benchmark by which all others are compared.

Just having perks, side quests, and a basic proggresion system doesn't make you an RPG.
You can make all the choices in-game you want, Geralt is still Geralt.
In Morrowind, how much of an asshole you are can actually affect the world around you. You can even kill key NPC's and get this masterpiece of an image.

Saying The Witcher 3 is an RPG is like saying the Tomb Raider reboot or every Far Cry after 3 are RPGs.
They're action/adventure games with RPG elements.

 

[CartoonsNCereal]

"RPG" in videogames is a scale.
It goes from 0 to Daggerfall.

Witcher 3 falls right along side Fallout 4 and Skyrim on that scale (Hell, unlike Witcher, the other two at least allow you to create your own character).
Higher up on that scale are Morrowind, the original Mass Effect, and the entire Deus Ex series (and, dare I say, most immersive sims).
Daggerfall, of course, being the benchmark by which all others are compared.

Just having perks, side quests, and a basic proggresion system doesn't make you an RPG.
You can make all the choices in-game you want, Geralt is still Geralt.
In Morrowind, how much of an asshole you are can actually affect the world around you. You can even kill key NPC's and get this masterpiece of an image.

Saying The Witcher 3 is an RPG is like saying the Tomb Raider reboot or every Far Cry after 3 are RPGs.
They're action/adventure games with RPG elements.

this is your own asinine scale; saying a game isn't an rpg because you play as a set character is childish, and literally you're own made up thing.

the only metric you are using is the ability to do anything and create a character....

create a character alone doesn't out weigh the fact that skyrim and fallout 4 don't have level scaling for enemies, nor leveled quests. eliminating a NEED for progression within your character.

and no, tomb raider and Far Cry don't fall into that category either because they don't require you to DEVELOP your character to progress either. There is no NEED to grow as a character, grind, gain experience etc. those are the most crucial elements to any RPG, these are action games with set pieces, with action as the focus and no hard stops to your progress if you haven't reached a certain point in your development. (there's actually no reason why Deus ex is more of an RPG than the witcher 3 either...did you play the witcher 3 dude?)

it seems you are missing this crucial element to an RPG entirely. Witcher 3 has this. fallout 4 and skyrim do not, Mass effect barely does. It seems the only reason you putting mass effect ahead of the Witcher is because of create a character? (which you basically are always shepard, whats the difference lmao a new look?) that is ridiculous kid, childish/uncreative and lacks nuance.

you can't kill everyone in MOST rpg's, I guess mmo rpg's aren't rpg's either because you can't do as such...no, why? why are they classified as rpg's? because of the core focus: developing and leveling your character to progress in the world. that's essentially what an MMO is primarily about at it's bare bones, indicating the history of the idea surrounding and "RPG" is this very concept. it's far more important than just creating a character; as that character tends to just fall into the same cycle of choices anyway, geralt or nameless.

by your logic there only exists western RPG's lmao


what about Jrpg's?

Final Fantasy wasn't a thing was it for you?

chrono trigger?

legend of dragoon?

ni no kuni?

dragon quest?

Persona?

all set character where you cant kill everyone. and they certainly aren't action adventure, oh but guess what? they do have a NEED for character development in common to persist

you must be an all american white kid with your logic lol

 

[brian0057]

there's actually no reason why Deus ex is more of an RPG than the witcher 3 either

Player choice.
The one thing Deus Ex has that The Witcher 3 doesn't.

And not the "oh, we get to choose the ending" or "cool, more XP" kind of choices.
But in how you play the game and how it responds in return.
Not whatever the hell you said here:

There is no NEED to grow as a character, grind, gain experience etc. those are the most crucial elements to any RPG

In D&D parlance, Deus Ex is a much better DM than The Witcher 3.
JRPG's are railroaded campaigns but at least they have the mechanical aspect of an RPG.

EDIT:

P.S. I'm neither white nor American.

 

[CartoonsNCereal]

Player choice.
The one thing Deus Ex has that The Witcher 3 doesn't.

And not the "oh, we get to choose the ending" or "cool, more XP" kind of choices.
But in how you play the game and how it responds in return.
Not whatever the hell you said here:



In D&D parlance, Deus Ex is a much better DM than The Witcher 3.
JRPG's are railroaded campaigns but at least they have the mechanical aspect of an RPG.

EDIT:

P.S. I'm neither white nor American.

lol okay so what do you mean the "mechanical aspect"? Your pre-requisite for an rpg prior to this was merely how the world reacts to you, and creating a character...

all of which Jrpg's don't do. meaning universally, amongst DEVELOPERS, this wasn't a per-requisite to being an RPG. But by your logic, every final fantasy wasn't an RPG, or as much of one as fucking morrowind. Despite those titles existing prior to morrowind or daggerfall.

and since witcher 3 is largely narrative driven, you're choice tends to affect the narrative and exist within the narrative itself.

but if you only mean choices in gameplay that affect the world, well that's not necessarily an RPG thing...that exists in numerous action games, like half life 2, far cry, or bioshock etc. being able to approach a gameplay scenario in different ways isn't inherently a RPG thing at all, if that were the case MMO's aren't RPG's either in your mind. like I said prior. I think you just want certain titles to be RPG's, and namely focus on your ability to customize and do whatever it is you want lol....thats a limited view of what an RPG is, and only bethesda era shit.

you say you aren't a all american white kid, but you're concept regarding what makes an RPG an RPG are very western centralized. your main example of an RPG was a western game. you didn't even remember that Jrpg's existed when you made your assertion, lets be honest. otherwise, you would've covered your bases better.

and sorry kid, giving deus ex or fucking mass effect the title of RPG but saying the witcher 3 is an adventure game is a terrible take that literally I've seen no one but you make. are you so arrogant that you carrying this minority opinion on an island that no one agrees with, even developers, overrides everyone lol.

literally no one thinks this.

In D&D parlance, Deus Ex is a much better DM than The Witcher 3.
JRPG's are railroaded campaigns but at least they have the mechanical aspect of an RPG.

EDIT:

P.S. I'm neither white nor American.

what? Are you saying that you disagree with the idea that developing a character, strengthening them etc, isn't the old age fundamental of an RPG?

it's not choice, its not, killing anyone and how the world reacts, at an rpg's core....progression is what it's about. that's what RPG's all have in common. otherwise they aren't good RPG's.

your standard doesn't hold up, because Jrpg's don't give a fuck about the customization and world reaction philosophy; but guess what they do give a fuck about? development of the character throughout the game. My point is universal, yours is only western.

the witcher 3 does a FAR better job at this than any modern bethesda title. so it's bullshit to put it in that category, it also does it better than mass effect. Don't remember that feature in Deus Ex well enough to say.

How about you just admit that you prefer western sandbox rpg's and call it a day.

but instead you rather say "it's not an rpg UNLESS it's a western sandbox" lmao don't want to admit you only have taste for one type of RPG.