Griffon
Member
I hope you're right.
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Final Fantasy 7 Remake team wants to give players more freedom and new gameplay in the trilogy’s final part
- Thread starter Thick Thighs Save Lives
- Start date
- Game Dev
I hope you're right.
Efren is G.O.A.T.
Member
Can't wait for the follow-up of this year's GOTY!
Chuck Berry
Gold Member
Would love for part 3 to be a much more straight forward, linear affair similar to Remake
Making Rebirth a checklist open world turned out being an immediate turn off for me
Making Rebirth a checklist open world turned out being an immediate turn off for me
asdasdasdbb
Member
I thought about this... and while I could see it happening (mostly for scope reasons) I think the worlds might seem a bit barren without the World Intel.
asdasdasdbb
Member
They did that. On mobile. Nobody played the earlier chapters so they never finished it.
NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt
Gold Member
Too much money unfortunately
Pejo
Member
You mean Ever Crisis? I tried it, they butchered up the story and offered bite size segments with grind-heavy shitty multiplayer as the core experience after you whisp through the story beats. That's not what my post said at all.
LavitzSlambert
Member
Sushi_Combo
Member
I think they should focus on making the mini games actually fun.
begotten
Member
I really enjoyed Rebirth, but if Part 3 is similar in content and scale I'm just going to rush the main story and get it over with.
I appreciate what they did with this FF7 Project, the narrative honours and goes beyond the OG, but the more I look back at it I've had enough. FF7 being 3 games and 200 hours of my time is enough.
I appreciate what they did with this FF7 Project, the narrative honours and goes beyond the OG, but the more I look back at it I've had enough. FF7 being 3 games and 200 hours of my time is enough.
Madflavor
Gold Member
FFXVI - People bitched about not enough side content.
FFVII: Rebirth - People bitched about too much side content.
Jesus fucking Christ, did Kitase jump out of the TV, kick your teeth in, and make you do all the optional content? Good for them for giving us more bang for our buck by filling their $70 game with a ton of content, in this shitfest of an economy. Those of us who enjoy squeezing every drop of enjoyment out of a game can enjoy doing all the side activities, and those that don't may one day figure out they don't have to do them. I hope Part 3 goes more wild than Part 2, and Kitase himself personally rams side content down your throats.
FFVII: Rebirth - People bitched about too much side content.
Jesus fucking Christ, did Kitase jump out of the TV, kick your teeth in, and make you do all the optional content? Good for them for giving us more bang for our buck by filling their $70 game with a ton of content, in this shitfest of an economy. Those of us who enjoy squeezing every drop of enjoyment out of a game can enjoy doing all the side activities, and those that don't may one day figure out they don't have to do them. I hope Part 3 goes more wild than Part 2, and Kitase himself personally rams side content down your throats.
Touch fuzZy. get BizZay
Member
loved everything about the game except the dumb meta dramatic story parts (fun adventure story moments were awesome) and the graphical issues.
I STILL think about it.
Guys I'm sure the minigames weren't compulsory. Some of them were, like marching in Junon and some chocobo races, but not most of them, right? I platinumed the game so I did have to do all of them, and most of them were good, but you can skip frog and balancing and forfeit queen's blood tournaments if you want to...right? Am I crazy? You can skip most of them unless you're trying to get 100% completion
I STILL think about it.
Guys I'm sure the minigames weren't compulsory. Some of them were, like marching in Junon and some chocobo races, but not most of them, right? I platinumed the game so I did have to do all of them, and most of them were good, but you can skip frog and balancing and forfeit queen's blood tournaments if you want to...right? Am I crazy? You can skip most of them unless you're trying to get 100% completion
FUBARx89
Member
Cloud! I can't help but notice world Intel gathering has stalled as of late.
Go_Ly_Dow
Member
I hate Chadley and am for reducing his role, but also it wouldn't be a JRPG without some kind of annoying sidekick lol
Gambit2483
Member
Idk about that last part but yeah, agreed. I never understood why some people get upset about optional side content. It's there for those that want it and there to skip for those that don't. I personally love when games are content packed. It feels like I'm actually getting my money's worth.
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adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Madflavor
Gold Member
I think people have a bad mentality that they have to 100% a game, and therefore have to do all the side activities, even if it's burning them out. If you favorite part of a game like FFVII: Rebirth is the main story, then it should be perfectly fine to just stick to that path. Do whatever amount of side content you want and at your pace.
They designed Rebirth so you can go back and do side content whenever you want. You don't get locked out of anything. The game is incredibly friendly to people who don't want to do everything, that I find many of these complaints to be very unreasonable. The only complaint I can think of that feels warranted is the moments in the main story that force you to do mini games, and that there are too many. I think when people say too many, they're really talking about moments when the story pauses so you can throw boxes as Cait Sith or push vacuums. As long as mini games are optional/skippable, they can have as many as they want.
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Valt7786
Member
We have Cait Sith for that.
Go_Ly_Dow
Member
I found the Cait Sith segment annoying, but I like the character and the Scottish accent. Adds to the overall package of what FF7 a unqiue and fever dream type experience lol.
Thabass
Gold Member
I don't know the minigames made the game a lot more unique in my view. I don't think they need to make more (other than the snowboarding stuff, but that is tied to story anyway...).
I loved how they incorporated the mini-games in Rebirth, it made it feel more like a grand adventure to me. I do think they should tone down the number of MANDATORY ones, though, that got a little annoying at the end.
I loved how they incorporated the mini-games in Rebirth, it made it feel more like a grand adventure to me. I do think they should tone down the number of MANDATORY ones, though, that got a little annoying at the end.
wvnative
Member
This is the problem Square-Enix has had for over a decade, despite how you feel about every FF game, if you pay attention to each new game, it's always in direct response to criticism of the previous game, nobody is ever happy.
12 - too boring
13 - gets rid of all padding, focusing on thrilling combat and story, game is on-rails to get you just to the exciting bits "too linear"
15 - goes full open world with full action combat "game feels too unfocused"
7 Remake - Linear but with some side content for people who want it "too on-rails, no exploration"
16 - tries to just balance with open zones much larger than 7 Remake but without going full open world to maintain some focus "exploration feels fake"
7 Rebirth - Attempts to strike a balance between 15 and 16 kinda full AC open world but tried to make the checklist stuff more engaging than AC, tons of mini-games, game feels truly grand "game is too big and too much bloat"
what the fuck do you people want?
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tomato shrub
Member
already happened.... as a gacha mobile game
Shin-Ra
Junior Member
Zephyranthes
Member
I feel like this is misrepresenting the issue. The problem is not about quantity, but quality: FFXVI had plenty of side content, but most of it was bland and unrewarding. Rebirth does have much better side content overall, but some of the World Intel stuff is just busy work that could have been excised for a tighter experience, and some of the side quests could use a redesign (the chicken box and mushroom collecting quests in Gongaga, and the Nibel region protorelic quests come to mind).
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MagiusNecros
Gilgamesh Fan Annoyance
Maybe make the Summon system not shit?
Dr. Claus
Vincit qui se vincit
Good thing you could ignore or skip 90% of them. At most playing a mini game for 10-15 seconds.
Shake Your Rump
Gold Member
Due to padding out a single game into three full-priced releases?
Madflavor
Gold Member
FFXVI absolutely did not have enough side content, you can’t be serious with that. That game has both a quality and quantity issue.
Zephyranthes
Member
The base game has 76 side quests, 32 optional monster hunts, and 7 chronolith trials. Seems like plenty to me.
Synless
Member
The problem for me personally was not the amount, it was how fucking lame the extra content was. Rewards sucked ass, the missions were uninspired.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
FFXVI's issue wasn't that there wasn't enough side content, it was that 90% of the content was shitty fetch quest adjacent stuff and only in the final acts of the game do you get side quest that actually has narrative added to it.
MagiusNecros
Gilgamesh Fan Annoyance
I mean it's pretty much discount FFXIV. There is a reason the game has it's glaring flaws all over the place with it's sidequests.
Last time sidequests meant something in FF was probably 12? And FFXI was peak for having rewards and quests that mattered.
Funny enough the side content in Dragon Quest XI was leaps and bounds ahead of XVI.
Yoshichan
And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
FFVII Rebirth has amazing rewards in its side contents, very similar to FFXII.
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Madflavor
Gold Member
Ok let's actually break this down. The side content in FFXVI is split into 3 categories. Side Quests, Monster Hunts, Chronolith trials. Let's get into why the design around these features had issues:
Preliminary Notes
In order to unlock these three pieces of side content, you must progress the main story. The main story gameplay loops plays out like this:
- 1-2 hour dungeon, big boss battles, and high budget cutscenes.
- 4-5 hours of talking to NPC after NPC after NPC. Go somewhere on the map to kill something. Go back to talking to NPC after NPC after NPC. Speaking with NPCs has a low budget approach to camerawork. Every conversation uses the same camera angles and static animations from Clive and the NPC.
- 1-2 hour dungeon, big boss battles, and high budget cutscenes.
- 4-5 hours of talking to NPC after NPC after NPC. Go somewhere on the map to kill something. Go back to talking to NPC after NPC after NPC. Speaking with NPCs has a low budget approach to camerawork. Every conversation uses the same camera angles and static animations from Clive and the NPC.
- Rinse and repeat.
Side Quests
Given the repetitive nature of the gameplay loop with the story, especially with the sections in between the big action set pieces, the player will naturally want to mix things up by taking a break from the main story to do side content. One of these is Side Quests. The Side Quest design in this game is hot garbage. The story sections of the Side Quests play out the same way as the in between moments in the main story listed above. Clive statically stands in front of an NPC and they talk and talk and talk. Then you go kill something, come back, and get your reward. There is no variety or anything of substance to separate how Side Quests play out compared to those slower Main Story moments. So if the slow moments in the Main Story are boring you, and you have to mix things up, the Side Quests won't be cleansing the palette. On top of that, the rewards are terrible for 90% of the game, and not worth the player's time.
Monster Hunts
Eventually you start unlocking optional challenges called Monster Hunts. These involve going to the board, taking on a bounty, and then finding the monster on the map to kill it. These are fun. The big issue with these is the game drip feeds these hunts to you very slowly. If you need a break from the slow paced talking moments from the Main Story and Side Quests, Hunts can be a way to mix things up and give you some combat. But you're only give 2-3 at a time, which typically take 15-20 minutes total to complete. And then what? If you want to do more, you have to go back to progressing the thing that was boring you or burning you out, in order to unlock more hunts. So in short, the Hunts are good but they're not enough on their own to provide the player hours of enjoyment as they break from the story.
Chronolith Trials
I would actually call this a quantity issue. Like the Hunts, these are drip fed to you throughout the game, and the only way to unlock more is to progress the Main Story. Once you complete one, there's no real reason to redo it.
So if you want to break away from the Main Story, you have very little to do. Saying the game has "76 Side Quests and 32 Monster Hunts!" is a bad argument, because of the way these are slowly fed to you. If you want to do nothing but side content between the Time Skip and Titan, you only have a small handful of things to do, half of which are poor quality (Side Quests) and the other half are not enough quantity (Hunts and Trials). So what about just bopping around on the World Map then? The problem is there's very little to do there either, except for mindlessly killing monsters. There's no optional dungeons/caves to stumble upon, and the game doesn't have a deep and robust gear system, so it's not like you're going to be hunting for chests to find different gear and weapon sets. There's no mini games, and nothing to do in towns except shop.
The Side Content in FFXVI is fundamentally terrible in terms of quantity and quality.
sigmaZ
Gold Member
I think it's also bad design to have TOO much main content. There should be just enough more that people who are slightly motivated can 100 percent it. For people who want trophies and have something to prove, that's what challenges and hard mode etc are for.
